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Super Smash Bros. for Wii U POTD Thread 17: Smash 3DS Discussion @ OT PLS
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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The Captain
Member
We need a Wind Waker stage. Toon Link is currently homeless.
Spirit Train, Tomodachi Life, Rainbow Road, and Living Room all seem built for the handheld version.
Magicant could be in, but I'm afraid Earthbound might just get the "retro stage only" treatment along with F-Zero.
Pac-Maze is one of the most iconic locations in video games, but I doubt we'll see it on the Wii U when we already have Pac Land.
Wow, I never noticed that.
How odd that Sakurai would bring back one N64 stage.
Dr. Buni
Member
Not every character have a stage specifically for them, though. They could also bring the Pirate Ship back. That stage was fun.
It would be a shame to not have Magicant and Paper Mario in HD.
HeavyMetalLover91
Member
Agreed, I'm loving the 3DS version but it really wasn't the celebration of Nintendo's portable history I had hoped.
Some baffling choices as well. I adore Magicant but no Mother 3 stage, when that was the only portable entry in the series (although I guess Lucas RIP played a part in that)
I get that it was easier to use assets from 3DS games and there's nothing I could say I'm really disappointed in being there, it's more that I was hoping for a wider variety on the history side of things. Subcon from Melee to remember the Mario Advance series? Mario VS DK? Minish Cap? Link's Awakening?
I'm being picky though, it's just seeing what they've done with The Great Cave Offensive and Wrecking Crew makes me think what Balloon Fight could've been.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
People insist on bringing back Saffron, but they forgot how terrible the pit areas it has, especially for characters like Ness.
The Captain
Member
Yeah, but "Celda" represents a big part of the Zelda series. It needs a stage.
Pirate Ship is probably gone because of swimming. Or because we have a new Wind Waker stage.
Bridge of Eldin was the better stage.
Dr. Buni
Member
Swimming didn't stop us from getting Tortimer Island and the Paper Mario stage.
SatoAilDarko
Member
A lot of people wanted him in and Nintendo even noted it in their press release. The fact they went so crazy to have him be as close as possible to a fighter shows that they know the want for Ridley. It also shows Sakurai's craziness to keep him at scale to Samus. Nevermind Olimar/Alph or all the Koopalings being the same size. It's a dumb excuse.
Obviously there is no point going on about it but if they're developing DLC if people want a character strongly it's good to show support.
As for other DLC characters my number 1 after Ridley is Dixie and I think she's definitely in as DLC. All these rumors about her as well has how she was planned to be a partner character with Diddy. The fact that you can make her a partial clone makes her an excellent candidate. Donkey Kong (along with Metroid) needs a third rep.
I also feel Ray and Chibi-Robo should have reps but those aren't guys you sell as DLC. Hope they make it in next time.
My dream candidates are Wonder Red and Impa.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Bring back the missing vets first, then we can talk about newcomer DLCs.
I looked into the Online-Tourney-Mode and tried to understand its possibilities:
At first it is heavily inserted by Mario Kart 8's Tourney-Mode. You can creates "rooms" with different conditions. It looks like, there are many possible setting to choices from.
Of course, you can change the standard rules (Coin, Stock.Time-Limit, SD Punishment, etc.) and, i guess, also have Special Mode (If "Special Smash-up" is hinting at this).
For stages and items selections it looks like, you can only choose between preset options. This could work similar to Mario Kart 8, where you can choose betweeen different preset the items-selections like "Bombs only". I assume this, since there is a very limit search filter for stages and items and some rooms have the terms "Big Stages" and "Combo Items". But there could still be the possibility for customise item and stage options. Either there is a tag for it "Customise Selection" or "Big Stages" and "Combo Items". could only be optional labels. So that people can find the right rooms they are looking for.
Interestingly i'm not sure, how exactly the tourney mode will work. In Mario Kart 8 you play against other people in the room and win points for your ranking.
In SSB4 there can be different kind of tourney formats. The standard one is most victories, where you also can set an overall winning condition (e.g. winning 50 matches total). I also speculate for a point-system based on the ranking and losers out with x chances (to simulate a Losers-Bracket).
It is also noticeable, that unlike Mario Kart 8 you can set the number of matches. One of the search filters is "Battles" and on the video it is set on "Unlimited". I guess, you can preset the number of matches for each player. So every player can e.g. have ten battles in total and then can't participate in anymore battles. So after the time limit of the tourney runs out, the player with the most victories of ten matches wins the tourney. In Mario Kart 8 you can play "unlimited" and the winner will always the player, who simply participated in the most races.
If there are even more conditions (you can't fight the same person twice, winner fights winners and losers fight losers or everybody fights everybody at least ones), we can have a Swiss-Style tournament or a League-Mode. With the "Unlimited" options we can just open a community room for everybody.
Still the big question is, how will the tourney work. Will we have a chat-room, where we can chose our opponents, talk to them or at least see, who is online. Can we get messages, if some one wants to fight us. There is a button with a time and the word "Next" in the menu. I amuse, you can set a time, when the everybody should be online? Or it is the "Official Tournament", which have nothing to do with the Tourney-Mode. In the European-Direct the section actually was called "Official Tournament" and not only Tournament. Also there is a bracket-icon on the button. I guess, there will be "Official Tournaments" at a set time. People can join them, if they are fast enough and are online at the preset time.
At first it is heavily inserted by Mario Kart 8's Tourney-Mode. You can creates "rooms" with different conditions. It looks like, there are many possible setting to choices from.
Of course, you can change the standard rules (Coin, Stock.Time-Limit, SD Punishment, etc.) and, i guess, also have Special Mode (If "Special Smash-up" is hinting at this).
For stages and items selections it looks like, you can only choose between preset options. This could work similar to Mario Kart 8, where you can choose betweeen different preset the items-selections like "Bombs only". I assume this, since there is a very limit search filter for stages and items and some rooms have the terms "Big Stages" and "Combo Items". But there could still be the possibility for customise item and stage options. Either there is a tag for it "Customise Selection" or "Big Stages" and "Combo Items". could only be optional labels. So that people can find the right rooms they are looking for.
Interestingly i'm not sure, how exactly the tourney mode will work. In Mario Kart 8 you play against other people in the room and win points for your ranking.
In SSB4 there can be different kind of tourney formats. The standard one is most victories, where you also can set an overall winning condition (e.g. winning 50 matches total). I also speculate for a point-system based on the ranking and losers out with x chances (to simulate a Losers-Bracket).
It is also noticeable, that unlike Mario Kart 8 you can set the number of matches. One of the search filters is "Battles" and on the video it is set on "Unlimited". I guess, you can preset the number of matches for each player. So every player can e.g. have ten battles in total and then can't participate in anymore battles. So after the time limit of the tourney runs out, the player with the most victories of ten matches wins the tourney. In Mario Kart 8 you can play "unlimited" and the winner will always the player, who simply participated in the most races.
If there are even more conditions (you can't fight the same person twice, winner fights winners and losers fight losers or everybody fights everybody at least ones), we can have a Swiss-Style tournament or a League-Mode. With the "Unlimited" options we can just open a community room for everybody.
Still the big question is, how will the tourney work. Will we have a chat-room, where we can chose our opponents, talk to them or at least see, who is online. Can we get messages, if some one wants to fight us. There is a button with a time and the word "Next" in the menu. I amuse, you can set a time, when the everybody should be online? Or it is the "Official Tournament", which have nothing to do with the Tourney-Mode. In the European-Direct the section actually was called "Official Tournament" and not only Tournament. Also there is a bracket-icon on the button. I guess, there will be "Official Tournaments" at a set time. People can join them, if they are fast enough and are online at the preset time.
Dr. Buni
Member
I don't want more vets as DLC, it is such a waste of opportunity. Ice Climbers aside, of course, but they aren't coming back because parity. I want new characters, not Wolf and Lucas.
I can only hope for Dixie now. She is the only character I really want. Though Chorus Kids, Chibi-Robo, Jill (lol she is never happening) and Wonder Red would be neat additions too.
I am/was a Ridley supporter, but after this direct, why even bother showing more support? Ridley playable is not happening.
I can only hope for Dixie now. She is the only character I really want. Though Chorus Kids, Chibi-Robo, Jill (lol she is never happening) and Wonder Red would be neat additions too.
I don't want anyone you are suggesting and want wolf and lucas. They are better character and seems like kind of a wasted oppertunity not to since you can with the power of dlc
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Vets make a good "testing grounds" for DLC.
Besides, only Lucas, Wolf, and IC are left. Might as well complete the cast. Pichu evolved into Pikachu and Roy is already in the game in two ways
Besides, only Lucas, Wolf, and IC are left. Might as well complete the cast. Pichu evolved into Pikachu and Roy is already in the game in two ways
Dr. Buni
Member
Good for you, hopefully what you want doesn't happen though
Bringing veterans back is so boring, specially veterans that aren't even 100% unique (only the Ice Climbers, aside from Mewtwo, are).
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Good for you, hopefully what you want doesn't happen though
Bringing veterans back is so boring, specially veterans that aren't even 100% unique (only the Ice Climbers, aside from Mewtwo, are).
90% unique is still unique... the fuck since when is being unique measured?
Even if we "measure" uniqueness, that's still 90% playability that no one will be able to play because they are not there.
Vets make a good "testing grounds" for DLC.
Besides, only Lucas, Wolf, and IC are left. Might as well complete the cast. Pichu evolved into Pikachu and Roy is already in the game in two ways
Parrallax wpuld loose his shit if they brought Roy back.
This is the true megaton.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
They don't have to try them if they don't want the elements in the first place. Competitive Smash players probably aren't going to be able to play on any of these stages. Maybe the new DK stage. Plus, after playing the 3DS stages I don't need to play any of the stages with Bosses to know that I don't want them anymore. They completely take away from any fighting that happens and make the stage worse. At the very least they should have given the option to keep the layout of the stage but turn the bosses off.
MrSaturn99
Member
Ahahahahahaha
Red Arremer
Member
Well, it wasn't wrong in what it showed. It was just wrong in saying Ridley was playable.
EastOfEden
Member
Good for you, hopefully what you want doesn't happen though
Bringing veterans back is so boring, specially veterans that aren't even 100% unique (only the Ice Climbers, aside from Mewtwo, are).
Yeah, totally agree. I think Mewtwo's inclusion is cool, but no more vets please.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Wait, what shadow analysis?
Ooooh you mean last direct? Hahahahaha
Pfft, people only say that because they got their vet.
Ooooh you mean last direct? Hahahahaha
Pfft, people only say that because they got their vet.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I think Rainbow Cruise, Rumble Falls, Balloon Fight and Magicant are unlockable.
I have good reason to believe so.
Rainbow Cruise and Rumbe Falls have Smash Run music. With the confirmation of Luigi's Mansion and Temple, that means Rainbow Cruise and RF are the only two retro levels left with Smash Run music that isn't in Smash 4.
One thing for Balloon Fight that stuck out to me was the Masterpiece for the game. There would be no reason for this to exist without some major reference to Balloon Fight. I also believe the stage replaced Ice Climbers' stage, which was probably shared between the two games (there'd be no reason not to).
In the board game mode, Flying Man had a more detailed sprite. This wouldn't exist unless he was a part of the game, and Ness doesn't currently have a new level on the Wii U.
I also think we'll see a new Flat Zone, a new Flat Zone, Mute City, at least one more 64 level, and some kind of surprise Melee level that wasn't in Brawl. I just have a feeling (plus Captain Falcon and Game and Watch lack a new level in 4, GW lacks a stage period).
I have good reason to believe so.
Rainbow Cruise and Rumbe Falls have Smash Run music. With the confirmation of Luigi's Mansion and Temple, that means Rainbow Cruise and RF are the only two retro levels left with Smash Run music that isn't in Smash 4.
One thing for Balloon Fight that stuck out to me was the Masterpiece for the game. There would be no reason for this to exist without some major reference to Balloon Fight. I also believe the stage replaced Ice Climbers' stage, which was probably shared between the two games (there'd be no reason not to).
In the board game mode, Flying Man had a more detailed sprite. This wouldn't exist unless he was a part of the game, and Ness doesn't currently have a new level on the Wii U.
I also think we'll see a new Flat Zone, a new Flat Zone, Mute City, at least one more 64 level, and some kind of surprise Melee level that wasn't in Brawl. I just have a feeling (plus Captain Falcon and Game and Watch lack a new level in 4, GW lacks a stage period).
Spainkiller
the man who sold the world
The leaker I know WhatsApped me this morning.
"The Ridley boss showed in last night's Direct was pretty much the model I saw. Same goes for the Mewtwo reveal. Anyway, sorry, I assumed Ridley would be playable because of the quality of the model. Dixie and Chorus Men could be anything, I guess."
Well, there ya go.
But, anyway, Mewtwo, woohoo!
"The Ridley boss showed in last night's Direct was pretty much the model I saw. Same goes for the Mewtwo reveal. Anyway, sorry, I assumed Ridley would be playable because of the quality of the model. Dixie and Chorus Men could be anything, I guess."
Well, there ya go.
But, anyway, Mewtwo, woohoo!
Inferno313
Banned
Doing Bayonetta justice would probably require the game's rating being bumped to a teen at least. Don't see how you can have disappearing clothes and torture attacks in an E-10+ game.
Beelzebufo
Banned
Hey, I almost got Mario right! And yeah, that's really stupid haha. Should have gone with "Gear Head".
Thanks for the update! At the very least, I doubt Chorus Kids will be a stage boss, so that's encouraging haha.
Here's to hoping we get Dixie/Chorus Men!
Ah.
Well it's not like Zero Suit Samus is super tame, but i get your point, a shame.
Spainkiller
the man who sold the world
Funny how he misinterpreted the "unlock characters by owning both version" as "connect the two versions", but it's easy to see how he did so
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
I believe Dixie will be a Diddy clone DLC and Chorus Men will be some kind of stage hazard of a Rhythm Tengoku/Heaven/Paradise stage, also as DLC.
But thanks for clearing that up.
Spinosaurus
Member
Just hoping they weren't planned and ultimately cut. :<
Last night people were pointing out that pirate ship might be unlikely since the swimming mechanic was cut... but that seems to only be on 3DS, thanks to a picture released today.
Villager looks like he's swimming, not falling.
That, and delphino island is back. I'd say pirate ship has a high chance of coming back.
According to this pic, it seems that swimming is back in the Wii U version
Wow, beaten by seconds.
Neat.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
DLC still means there is a chance for Ridley to be playable. Going through the effort of making him as close to a playable character without actually making him playable would be a low blow.
Spainkiller
the man who sold the world
Why, because of the splashing water and Villager's raised hand?
Proves nothing; he's plummeting.
Plummeting or swimming, doesn't matter. Means the game accounts for different behavior in water (slow fall vs floating). If the game accounts for stages that have water near or around platforms (like wuhu/delphino) it means that pirate ship can work, too.
That, as far I as I can tell, is a new animation for villager, which means characters have new animations while in the water, which means water stages are OK. Same w/ the game and watch octopus pic.
The game handles water in some capacity, therefore, stages that have a ton of water are not ruled out, like great bay, pirate ship, etc.
Spainkiller
the man who sold the world
I'd love that to be true, especially as I love Pirate Ship as a level and would love to see it return, but I doubt Sakurai is going to allow a difference in mechanics between the two versions.
You said earlier that your source, who worked on the European localization, saw MOVING models of four characters. Everyone saw a moving model of Ridley in April. As for Mewtwo, it's extremely obvious that he's very early in development. They didn't even show a moving model of him in the trailer, yet one existed in September? So they have been working on Mewtwo from at least August to be released in possibly May?
Sorry, but your source is full of it. Nothing he has said has been proven right.
We already have climbing, which, afaik, isn't in 3DS.
Or are you going to try to tell me mario is falling?
Climbing/swimming being removed from 3DS makes sense as it's 2 less sets of animations the game needs to load up before each match.
You honestly don't think they have mewtwo up and running in a build right now? I bet he was a moving model WEEKS (if not days) after his creation. His animations might be rough/not final, which is why they didn't show him moving in the direct.
MrSaturn99
Member
actually he is falling you're just not looking at it carefully
Now? Maybe. I mean his model wasn't even in a pose. But in August? Spainkiller posted his info in September, so he possibly got the info earlier. I have a hard time believing they had three DLC characters they were working on in summer to be released nearly a year later before they had finished either version with a strict deadline. Not to mention the assumption that they would be unlocked via transfer was dead wrong.We already have climbing, which, afaik, isn't in 3DS.
Or are you going to try to tell me mario is falling?
You honestly don't think they have mewtwo up and running in a build right now? I bet he was a moving model WEEKS (if not days) after his creation. His animations might be rough/not final, which is why they didn't show him moving in the direct.
EastOfEden
Member
Nah, he's not "my vet". I was just saying I wasn't bummed out by Mewtwo's inclusion or anything. I don't really have one character that I would be devastated if they didn't return in 5.
Edit: Actually I would be bummed if Little Mac or Cap Falcon was cut, but I still wouldn't prioritise them over cool newcomers.
Spainkiller
the man who sold the world
That's an additional mechanic and changes nothing that is in the 3DS version.
Swimming would CHANGE the falling mechanic in water levels. Different thing.
Yes, he saw a moving model of Mewtwo.
That Nintendo aren't bringing him out till midway 2015 doesn't disprove that they've been working on him a long time. Maybe their still balancing him. Maybe they shelved him and brought him out after seeing the positive reactions to DLC. I don't know. I only know that I trust my source, that he has always been right in the past and that he has no reason to lie.
But again: feel free to believe whatever you want
When do you think they started on mewtwo? They could have started on him last year, for all we know. They could have started him last year, and then had to drop him and the other DLC for the final balance/bugfix crunch to get the game out the door. Now that the game is going gold soon, they can probably resume development on them. Who knows? We don't work there, we don't know what state the additional characters are in. Maybe he was intended to be in from day 1, but got cut last minute, and then abandoned until they had time to work on him for DLC. Same with the other 2. We don't know.
There could be a million reasons why he wasn't shown animated/posed last night. Like I said, it's likely because he's not anywhere near up to sakurai's standards yet, so he doesn't want to show it off in motion because it's still a work in progress. As for why it's not posed? Showing it build from wireframe into a neutral standing position is a good way to illustrate to a viewer that he's currently in development. That's probably all there is to it.
Also, assumptions are allowed to be wrong. It's not like he stated that as fact.
I'm not saying I buy it/believe it either, but your evidence doesn't do anything to disprove it.
SuperBowser
Member
Not sure if people have discussed this direct in relation to the previous leaks yet. Some of my thoughts:
I remember the original ESRB leak was a cut and paste job of the CSS with a question mark over mewtwo - perhaps he knew more than we thought. I also remember the ''foul mouthed leaker" - everything he said has been true to date. The only other character he ever mentioned was chorus men (2d white men like game and watch).
I think Ridley is pretty much confirmed not playable this game. The old E3 direct was clear about this if you listened to what was said (IMO) but unfortunately people interpreted the footage in different ways. I went along with the hype too, but no more.
It's incredibly unlikely mewtwo will be the only additional DLC with an extra 3 months of development. I think it's fair to expect more stages, characters and possibly an extra mode if the whole team continue working on the game. I guess the obvious possibilities are Chorus men, Dixie and Impa to stay in keeping with rumours. I don't see Lucas and wolf coming back this game.
I remember the original ESRB leak was a cut and paste job of the CSS with a question mark over mewtwo - perhaps he knew more than we thought. I also remember the ''foul mouthed leaker" - everything he said has been true to date. The only other character he ever mentioned was chorus men (2d white men like game and watch).
I think Ridley is pretty much confirmed not playable this game. The old E3 direct was clear about this if you listened to what was said (IMO) but unfortunately people interpreted the footage in different ways. I went along with the hype too, but no more.
It's incredibly unlikely mewtwo will be the only additional DLC with an extra 3 months of development. I think it's fair to expect more stages, characters and possibly an extra mode if the whole team continue working on the game. I guess the obvious possibilities are Chorus men, Dixie and Impa to stay in keeping with rumours. I don't see Lucas and wolf coming back this game.
diddykong13
Member
Exactly, you also have to consider that it's not just getting the character running in the game that takes the time, it's the QA for it that takes up a lot of time - testing it on all stages, against all characters, in all modes and all sorts of other combinations... it's Nintendo, they're usually pretty thorough with the QA process.
It wouldn't surprise me if they have a version of Mewtwo in-game and running, but that maybe the final model/animations has only recently been decided (hence only getting a static one in the direct). They will likely have the character done by Christmas, then just test and bug-fix until release in Spring (along with potential other DLC fighters that they will likely release at the same time).
Things take time. Especially with Nintendo!
"Sakurai's standards"
75M IN SSB4
What you say makes sense. I just find it hard to believe that three characters were far enough along in summer that someone on a localization team saw them and was convinced they were playable, yet we only hear about one of them months later and are given zero footage. These characters were apparently so far along that the localization guy was convinced they would be released by November, yet we have only heard of one that won't be released until maybe May.
I just feel like there's more stacked up against Spainkiller's source than there is in support. Not to mention Ridley, Mewtwo, Dixie, and Chorus Men are they internet's go-to fighters in terms of desire and believability. If SK's source pulled a Gematsu and called out some random ass characters that no one saw coming and was right, then I'd be on board, but right now there's nothing that SK's source is saying that makes me believe him.
The only, ONLY leak that turned out to be true was the Vaanrose/Ninka/ESRB leak, which involved multiple sources basically saying the same thing. Yet SK's source is part of the European localization team and is the only person who has come out with this info, and no one has backed him up.
tirkaroKujo
Member
Final nail in the coffin I guess. I fully expect Mewtwo, Dixie, and Chorus Men to be our first wave of DLC characters, along with perhaps one more to round out the package. (Roy? Snake?)
Off tracks a little, but does anyone remember the All-Star leaker? He was the one doing the ESRB leaks on 4chan along with the MF leaker, and claimed that the remaining characters were Dixie, Mewtwo, and Chorus Men.(Actively denying that Ridley would be playable.) He even posted a supposed screenshot of Chorus Men, though people then seemed to have written this off as fake, for reasons I'm not sure of.
His "leaks" mostly got overshadowed by MF Leaker's false claims about Ridley, Mach Rider, and Impa, but it's funny that All-Star seems to be looking more legit right now. Anyone still have that screenshot?
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