Lost Fragment
Obsessed with 4chan
Er yeah good luck trying to FADC the first hit of a DP on reaction to the block.
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Super Street Fighter 4 Æ |OT5| Waiting to go from Super to Ultra
- Thread starter Kadey
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Akuma is the only character in the game that can straight up bully everyone. Like, it doesn't matter how little health he has, he gets free mixup and pressure on everyone. These changes barely hurt him at all. The only difference is now you'll have to actually think before throwing out a sweep or jump back fireball instead of just "doing it because it's good".
There are only two characters with more invincibility than he has on his DP, and they can't hit confirm theirs. One of them (Seth) has even less health than Akuma! Why should he be allowed to get up for free? He already has the best teleport in the game!
There are only two characters with more invincibility than he has on his DP, and they can't hit confirm theirs. One of them (Seth) has even less health than Akuma! Why should he be allowed to get up for free? He already has the best teleport in the game!
Is it supposed to be hard? If you do wakeup dp, you're gonna attempt to fadc it no matter what. You're not reacting to anything. If it hits, you continue the combo and if it doesn't, you're gonna be safe.
Akuma players would do wakeup HP DP. If the first hit was blocked, they would cancel on the second hit and be safe. If it hit, they saved meter and let it rock for all 3 hits. Now they can't confirm it, since you can no longer FADC the second hit. Akuma's are going to be forced to spend the meter every time if they don't want to go all in on a guess. #toptierproblems
Yeah, I understand that...I just don't really see it as a big nerf compared to a few other people here are.
I'm guessing Akuma players will resort to light dp now? I don't think focus cancelling the first hit of fierce dp can lead to anything whereas light dp you can. You lose out on some invincibility frames but that should only matter when you're challenging other invincible moves.
That still hits overhead I'm pretty sure
Nah, you can block low.
Nope
notworksafe
Member
I wish ken's air tatsu still hit overhead.
not that stupid actually. Makes his mix up better. Give that back to him and then nerf his jump back fireball.
No that shit was fucking dumb. Akuma doesn't need high low mixups to complement his vortex game.
Lol. Armor breaking high with instant recovery that you can barely tell what side it will hit on and is inescapable due to OS's. Also it's a safe jump. Yeah, lets just add a frame or two more recovery to air fireball to keep the character balanced.
Lost Fragment
Obsessed with 4chan
Yes, yes we see the flow of Akuma players tears every patch and it's just sad what has happened to him throughout the lifetime of SFIV. From the strongest character in the game in vanilla who absolutely dominated the matchup against the second strongest character in Sagat, to only being top 5 in Super. Then while he was still top 5 in AE he had to contend with those rascals Yun and Yang who in all seriousness actually raped the shit out of him. Then he got nerfed again in 2012, yet somehow he is the best character again! (Because Yun and Yang got nerfed hard, the biggest buff Akuma has seen).
His vortex will still be intact, he'll still be top ten, such a hard life.
Miyukichi da gawd, JPN voice Cammy since Vanilla.
Rice-Eater
Member
You'll get way more damage out of FADC'ing HP SRK if you're execution is good enough. After FADC'ing the first hit you're +3 or +4, so you can do a couple of things like another SRK or cr. LP, st. HP, LK tatsu, SRK
Seth can confirm his DP on block though since a blocked DP will give him 2 grounded blocks before he flies up. Remember when Poongko won Shadowloo Showdown and finished 3rd at EVO back in 2011? Everybody was doing the DP until blocked, then FADC after the 2nd blocked hit into SPD mix up.
Lost Fragment
Obsessed with 4chan
You can certainly concentrate on buffing lower tiers instead of nerfing the upper tiers, which seems to be what they're doing based on the (supposed) changes, but "Buffs only! No nerfs ever!" is a really naive, black-and-white way of thinking and probably a good way to change the game for the worse.
But AE 2012 is already very well balanced, Akuma is strong but not unbeatable, right now. Balrog can beat akuma, Gen won evo, ect.
Considering the great balance they already have, to me it makes sense to leave top characters alone (or only slight buffs/fixes) and then buff low characters a lot.
Buffing the low characters a lot would make the current top characters not as dominant since there would be new characters able to compete for those positions.
In theory I agree; he's fairly balanced already but he does have a couple of things that keep him a bit too safe. I've been saying since they announced the update that they would take the SFxT route and (rightly) nerf the jump back fireball recovery to stop the scrubby keepaway (it won't much difference at higher levels). Oh and I'm pretty sure the fireball nerf is only on his jump back version, not the neutral or forward.
The sweep / ultra nerf could actually be the biggest nerf here, but not one that sounds unfair. It initially seems pointless and not a game changer at all but if true I guess what they are trying to do is nerf his footsies / defensive game, as the buffer into ultra is what stopped players from focus dashing in to punish; with that gone he'll be much more punishable and Akuma players will have to use it less liberally or use the low forward more... assuming that the low forward to ultra buffer remains. Hmm I wonder if that would be removed too; not sure how they intend to remove all these without a complete overhaul of the input system. If nothing else about the sweep has changed it's still one of the best sweeps in the game though.
Agree with most that he'll pretty much stay the same in terms of viability and tiers, depending on all the other buffs he won't be clearly in the top 3 but then the point of this update is to make sure no one character clearly is top. As chaotix said he won't be able to just bully anyone anymore, which is a good thing.
PS - Part of me really wants to go to the Akuma forums on SRK to see the reaction - am I a bad person?
RockTurtle
Member
even though Akuma gives me trouble, i still find him a hell of a lot easier than a good cammy/Sakura.
I am more confident facing Akumas since i know all it takes is a decent combo and 50% of his health is gone. plus a lot of his moves are punishable if you block them.
whereas someone like cammy/sakura can just spam their moves and have stupid fast recovery. i should NOT have no viable attack option when being corner pressured by a sakura spamming jabs and hurricane kicks. that shit is insane.
I am more confident facing Akumas since i know all it takes is a decent combo and 50% of his health is gone. plus a lot of his moves are punishable if you block them.
whereas someone like cammy/sakura can just spam their moves and have stupid fast recovery. i should NOT have no viable attack option when being corner pressured by a sakura spamming jabs and hurricane kicks. that shit is insane.
They nerfed that in 2012. If he does it now he's unsafe.
As a Dudley player, I don't have that much trouble with Akuma. But when I play another character that doesn't walk as fast, can't consistently punish sweep or telport (Cody, Ryu), the character's dominance begins to shine through.
kevo_huevo
Member
GGs last night direct_quote!
Man some nutty links were connecting with Honda last night
close Fierce > cr. jab xx hands xx super (i dont find that link reliable online at all)
cr. Fierce > far standing fierce (seriously, how the hell did that link)
sorry as well about lag, my gf is always streaming stuff, though the connection was fine with me for the most part.
man, i hate seth! fucking double dash to spd to start the round lol so ballsy
i think you were hitting the divekick sweetspot with yun on honda. it took me a while to adjust to mp headbutt as an anti air, since jab headbutt is so ingrained as the go-to anti air for me.
i really can't stand the honda matchup with seth so i switched to bipson because he has better footsie tools, but i dont even know if that matchup is better.
hit me up anytime for games and i'll respond (unless im occupied in a marvel set).
also, shoutouts on the cameo appearance from Imm0rt4l
Man some nutty links were connecting with Honda last night
close Fierce > cr. jab xx hands xx super (i dont find that link reliable online at all)
cr. Fierce > far standing fierce (seriously, how the hell did that link)
sorry as well about lag, my gf is always streaming stuff, though the connection was fine with me for the most part.
man, i hate seth! fucking double dash to spd to start the round lol so ballsy
i think you were hitting the divekick sweetspot with yun on honda. it took me a while to adjust to mp headbutt as an anti air, since jab headbutt is so ingrained as the go-to anti air for me.
i really can't stand the honda matchup with seth so i switched to bipson because he has better footsie tools, but i dont even know if that matchup is better.
hit me up anytime for games and i'll respond (unless im occupied in a marvel set).
also, shoutouts on the cameo appearance from Imm0rt4l
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Akuma should keep his sweep cancel Ultra, IMO.
When I explain things that way the whole "black/white" argument against buffs only, really falls apart quite quickly.
anyway, I do hope that Bison gets quarter circle Ultra 2 motion back from Super. I would also like his st. RH to be fixed, the whole 2 hitboxes, above and below the knee is lame. Bring that back to super status where it was 1 hitxbox and it did I think 120 damage. People focus through his normals all the time now, no need to weaken it.
better anti air normals or a faster teleport. If they don't want him AA people that's fine but he still needs a way out of those situations, a better teleport could provide that.
anyway, I do hope that Bison gets quarter circle Ultra 2 motion back from Super. I would also like his st. RH to be fixed, the whole 2 hitboxes, above and below the knee is lame. Bring that back to super status where it was 1 hitxbox and it did I think 120 damage. People focus through his normals all the time now, no need to weaken it.
better anti air normals or a faster teleport. If they don't want him AA people that's fine but he still needs a way out of those situations, a better teleport could provide that.
BotoxAgent
Member
fuck Akuma....nerf his walk speed while we're at it!! 
Isn't he the only character in the game who can cancel normals into his ultra outside of super jump cancelling with viper and ibuki?
He should still be able to do it off his other normals like cr. mk and s. hk
Not sure I don't really play Akuma.
:edit:
Just tested it out and he can cancel it off of any of his normals. So Akuma has roughly 2 unsafe moves now.
Passive Assassin
Member
Anyone up for ae pc?
Passive Assassin
Member
Really wish I knew how to fight Blanka, I feel like every time I get matched up against a half decent Blanka player I'm guaranteed to lose.
All my best Ibuki tricks are nothing against his weirdness.
I hate that matchup. You have to play lame and punish all the bad balls.
Passive Assassin
Member
ggs karsius. your yun got better started doing fake divekicks and that corner pressure.
started doing fake divekicks and that corner pressure.ggs karsius. your yun got better
ggs
I don't even practice Yun anymore, I think the extra creativity may have been from the other characters I've been practicing instead.
I just need to learn how to get the hell out of Ibuki's lockdown/frametrap. The one time I tried to reversal, Yun's upkicks stright up whiffed, while you were still applying your pressure, which led to another hard knockdown into vortex :/
stn
Member
Akuma should still be good. But I think a few of his matchups MIGHT become harder:
Balrog - worse at turtling now
Fei-Long - uncertain on this one since his rekkas have been nerfed
Dee-Jay - harder to zone
Honda - harder to zone
Cammy - she was already hard to zone to begin with
Zangief/Hawk - could see this being 5.5-4.5 max now
I also think Chun-Li, Bison, and Ryu might become more difficult. Guess we'll see. His tier placement will go up and down depending on how these characters are balanced.
Balrog - worse at turtling now
Fei-Long - uncertain on this one since his rekkas have been nerfed
Dee-Jay - harder to zone
Honda - harder to zone
Cammy - she was already hard to zone to begin with
Zangief/Hawk - could see this being 5.5-4.5 max now
I also think Chun-Li, Bison, and Ryu might become more difficult. Guess we'll see. His tier placement will go up and down depending on how these characters are balanced.
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
I don't understand how anyone can do any trials past 17-18 for any character. I've tried forever and it just doesn't work for me with any character...
Professor Beef
Banned
Akuma still has an air fireball, now he just has to be smarter about chucking them. The matchup won't be as great as you fear.
At that point the trials become less about practicality and more about proof of concept.
The only ones I have trouble with are the ones with people who have mash moves like lightning leg kicks.
I can't do that
.Passive Assassin
Member
ggs
I don't even practice Yun anymore, I think the extra creativity may have been from the other characters I've been practicing instead.
I just need to learn how to get the hell out of Ibuki's lockdown/frametrap. The one time I tried to reversal, Yun's upkicks stright up whiffed, while you were still applying your pressure, which led to another hard knockdown into vortex :/
When I do s.forward into forward kicks, that is unsafe and not a block string. But I spaced it out far enough to not get punished. I still don't know why you aren't using your ex meter, since it'll push me to the corner faster and set up the pressure. Those random lunge punches didn't help either (lol my random neckbreakers). I think some of your divekicks were on point but I was able to beat them out with s.jab too. Once dat pressure is in, Ibuki is fucked.
kevo_huevo
Member
if coupled with a buff to u1, this can be an easy punish for air fireballs...it already is kind of easy to just throw out a fierce headbutt or ex buttslam, and maybe trade, but this would def force akuma to think twice about initiating offense.
i always thought this match was in favor of akuma 5.5-4.5, but this could draw it about even heading into Ultra.
RockTurtle
Member
vega/Bison have some relatively easy ones.
Really wish I knew how to fight Blanka, I feel like every time I get matched up against a half decent Blanka player I'm guaranteed to lose.
All my best Ibuki tricks are nothing against his weirdness.
If the blanka player is more than half screen away, just mash jab. More than likely, they're looking for an opportunity to do blanka ball. This also works at the beginning of the round where some Blankas do a short ball into throw. Jabs will stuff them completely.
When / what system?
Dudley too
You just mean dictator right? because claw has a bunch of tough links in his trials plus one where you have to go from a s. lp into ex fba or scarlet terror that gave me a lot of trouble.
I think him, c.viper and dhalsim probably gave me the most trouble in the challenges.
direct_quote
Member
Ya GGs. Even though I'm pretty sure the matchup vs Honda was in my favor for both Yun and Seth, that patience and damage output made it rather challenging (in addition to good anti-airs). I always seem to expect Mike Ross levels of jumping whenever I face Hondas.. I don't know the Honda vs Seth matchup too well but it basically feels like a blow up when Seth can stuff most of Honda's wake-options
P).But yah we'll have to play again when there's less lag, but you were hitting those combos even with lag so I'm screwed? >_>
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