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Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition |OT4| Daigo Who?

X

xCobalt

Member
Karsticles said:
I'm super new to SSFIVAE, so tell me, when I focus attack something, what should I do after that with Guile? It seems like if I FA, Guile will attack after he is hit once. Can I combo off of that? Or should I always cancel my FA into a dash for a custom combo?
Click to expand...

To start with the basics, there are 3 levels of focus attack and they all have one hit of armor. During the start up of the focus attack or if it makes contact with the opponent, you can dash cancel it. Level 2 focus (indicated by a brief white flash) and level 3 focus (full charge) can crumple the opponent. Level 3 focus is unblockable. Level 1 focus can crumple on counter hit. The attacks you absorb during a focus will give you the same amount of damage in grey health, same stun and same meter as if it hit.

To answer your questions, if you're across the screen and focus absorb a fireball, you should just dash cancel it. This lets you build your ultra meter without losing any health or taking any chip damage. If you focus too much, make sure to take some time to regain your grey health. If you're up close and actually hit the opponent, make sure you dash cancel it because there is a lot of recovery frames. Overall, just make sure you dash cancel every time you focus. If you whiff the attack, your opponent can easily land a full combo.

Very few characters can actually pressure with level 1 focus attacks (check here for focus attack frame data). However, if you land a level 2 focus, even on block you have some frame advantage. Guile is +3 after a blocked level 2 focus attack so this sets up some frame traps for you.

Also, make sure you avoid doing level 3 focus on a stunned character. You are better off doing a jump in attack. This is because focus attacks count as two hits during combo scaling.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
xCobalt said:
To start with the basics, there are 3 levels of focus attack and they all have one hit of armor. During the start up of the focus attack or if it makes contact with the opponent, you can dash cancel it. Level 2 focus (indicated by a brief white flash) and level 3 focus (full charge) can crumple the opponent. Level 3 focus is unblockable. Level 1 focus can crumple on counter hit. The attacks you absorb during a focus will give you the same amount of damage in grey health, same stun and same meter as if it hit.

To answer your questions, if you're across the screen and focus absorb a fireball, you should just dash cancel it. This lets you build your ultra meter without losing any health or taking any chip damage. If you focus too much, make sure to take some time to regain your grey health. If you're up close and actually hit the opponent, make sure you dash cancel it because there is a lot of recovery frames. Overall, just make sure you dash cancel every time you focus. If you whiff the attack, your opponent can easily land a full combo.

Very few characters can actually pressure with level 1 focus attacks (check here for focus attack frame data). However, if you land a level 2 focus, even on block you have some frame advantage. Guile is +3 after a blocked level 2 focus attack so this sets up some frame traps for you.

Also, make sure you avoid doing level 3 focus on a stunned character. You are better off doing a jump in attack. This is because focus attacks count as two hits during combo scaling.
Click to expand...
Thanks, though you gave me walk speed frame data.

What about focus attacking something up close, though? How do I follow that up with Guile?
 
X

xCobalt

Member
Karsticles said:
Thanks, though you gave me walk speed frame data.

What about focus attacking something up close, though? How do I follow that up with Guile?
Click to expand...

Dash frame data is to the right. Are you seeing the whole page?

If you focus up close you have a few options. If you get a crumple, it's probably best to just go for a throw and have a setup after that. If you got meter to burn something simple like cr.mp into ex flashkick does decent damage. On block, I find it useful to dash and simply do nothing. This gives you a read on the opponent. The opponent will often do a reversal, crouch tech, throw you (in this case, they're stand teching) or nothing. If the situation comes up again, you have a better idea of what they're doing and you can punish accordingly.

This is only useful if you actually hit a focus attack. You won't be able to charge up a focus attack up close most of the time. People can simply mash jab, use an armor breaker or simply throw you.

There are also situations where you can punish an opponent if you focus absorb their attack, dash and throw. This is only useful if the opponent throws out a move with a lot of frames. Generally, these moves are fireballs, command normals, HP or HK. It requires a bit of reaction or prediction on your part.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
xCobalt said:
Dash frame data is to the right. Are you seeing the whole page?

If you focus up close you have a few options. If you get a crumple, it's probably best to just go for a throw and have a setup after that. If you got meter to burn something simple like cr.mp into ex flashkick does decent damage. On block, I find it useful to dash and simply do nothing. This gives you a read on the opponent. The opponent will often do a reversal, crouch tech, throw you (in this case, they're stand teching) or nothing. If the situation comes up again, you have a better idea of what they're doing and you can punish accordingly.

This is only useful if you actually hit a focus attack. You won't be able to charge up a focus attack up close most of the time. People can simply mash jab, use an armor breaker or simply throw you.

There are also situations where you can punish an opponent if you focus absorb their attack, dash and throw. This is only useful if the opponent throws out a move with a lot of frames. Generally, these moves are fireballs, command normals, HP or HK. It requires a bit of reaction or prediction on your part.
Click to expand...
I see the dash frame data, but you said you were posting focus attack frame data.

I was more wondering if Guile could combo off of his focus attack hit or something.
 
X

xCobalt

Member
Karsticles said:
I see the dash frame data, but you said you were posting focus attack frame data.

I was more wondering if Guile could combo off of his focus attack hit or something.
Click to expand...

My bad, I should have clarified that the page has focus attack dash frame data. You can't combo after a level 1 focus, there's just not enough hit stun.
 
H

Hinomura

Member
MMMmmmhhh.. had a dozen consecutive wins with two B/B+ players with me using Fei Long (and had half a dozen drinks)... mumble mumble (dat donald duck mumbling)...

I do love Akuma but he's such a pain if you miss something (or lag something) during a combo :D you get a couple pixels off enemy's life and he/she takes down half of your life lol

Note: I should try Fei Long with err... better players to understand my limits ;D
 
X

xCobalt

Member
What are you guys expecting for Ono's announcement at evo? A release date seems pretty likely but I'm thinking they're gonna new characters. Probably the remaining sf cast from sfxt. Maybe a release for xb1 and ps4?
 
N

number47

Member
Karsticles said:
Thanks, though you gave me walk speed frame data.

What about focus attacking something up close, though? How do I follow that up with Guile?
Click to expand...

st. hk to flash kick for a offensive knockdown.
something something sonic boom. to create distance without losing location.
random idea.
 
P

Passive Assassin

Member
J. M. Romeo said:
This may be a bit off-topic, but what the hell, I wanted to share. My third short film features the Daigo vs. Justin Wong as an integral part of the plot.

Well, maybe not integral. But you guys may like it.

http://youtu.be/i2XMl5jRch4

That's the teaser trailer I just cut. It's shot in Spanish but I'll be doing English subs as well. Besides that teaser there are a couple of more talky promos but if you want to see them you will find them. This is enough spam, I believe.

Also, that stick that appears is one I customized from a HRAP. I love pink bubbletops <3
Click to expand...

Pretty well cut.
 
K

KingPhizzle

Neo Member
Im super psyched for a possible super street fighter ae turbo i just feel bad about having to buy another stick.... speaking of which... has anyone heard anything about the future ps4 sticks
 
R

Rice-Eater

Member
xCobalt said:
What are you guys expecting for Ono's announcement at evo? A release date seems pretty likely but I'm thinking they're gonna new characters. Probably the remaining sf cast from sfxt. Maybe a release for xb1 and ps4?
Click to expand...

What I'm hoping for
-Full details of all the changes
-Date

What we will probably get
-Date
 
H

hypernima

Banned
Karsticles said:
Open to feedback, Hypernima.

Flash Kick has a weird hitbox.
Click to expand...

I was looking for this post.

The majority of the match I was testing you kinda.

I didn't put you in a real fireball war unfortunately. I feel you have just scratched the tip of Guile's normals. Stop sonic booming at the beginning of the match, it can be punished very easily and get you knocked down for free.

I know you like the zoning aspect, that's great, but imo Guile can also be a rushdown monster with the right pokes. Learn those and learn to keep the opponent on their toes more, not with your booms but with your normals. You were doing great vs my Cody, because you do not want Cody in your grill with frametraps. However, Juri can punish that and keep up with you in a well timed war. Watch for characters like those.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
hypernima said:
I was looking for this post.

The majority of the match I was testing you kinda.

I didn't put you in a real fireball war unfortunately. I feel you have just scratched the tip of Guile's normals. Stop sonic booming at the beginning of the match, it can be punished very easily and get you knocked down for free.

I know you like the zoning aspect, that's great, but imo Guile can also be a rushdown monster with the right pokes. Learn those and learn to keep the opponent on their toes more, not with your booms but with your normals. You were doing great vs my Cody, because you do not want Cody in your grill with frametraps. However, Juri can punish that and keep up with you in a well timed war. Watch for characters like those.
Click to expand...
Well, I need to be taught what to do against these characters. I don't even know what anyone in this game can do! Like, I didn't even know that Ryu's hurricane kick goes through projectiles. Is Sakura's tatsu punishable? It seems stupid good if not.

My problem with the rushdown is that I throw a kick out, it gets blocked...and then what? Nothing really cancels into anything else outside of combos for Guile (it seems), so I just end up at a frame disadvantage. I went for a good number of cross-up attacks, though. I'm watching Dieminion matches to better understand him.

No clue what to do against all that Juri crap, like her counters.

Edit: I feel like Dieminion can charge Sonic Booms just a little faster than I can. Is there a trick I don't know?
 
H

hypernima

Banned
Karsticles said:
Well, I need to be taught what to do against these characters. I don't even know what anyone in this game can do! Like, I didn't even know that Ryu's hurricane kick goes through projectiles. Is Sakura's tatsu punishable? It seems stupid good if not.

My problem with the rushdown is that I throw a kick out, it gets blocked...and then what? Nothing really cancels into anything else outside of combos for Guile (it seems), so I just end up at a frame disadvantage. I went for a good number of cross-up attacks, though. I'm watching Dieminion matches to better understand him.

No clue what to do against all that Juri crap, like her counters.

Edit: I feel like Dieminion can charge Sonic Booms just a little faster than I can. Is there a trick I don't know?
Click to expand...

Only Ryu's HK tatsu does. But it has to be timed right. I was using Sakura's Hk tatsu, which is very punishable.

For Guile rushdown you have to keep them guessing, is it going to be boom dash overhead, boom dash sweep, boom dash grab, or some other type of mixup.

He might be charge partitioning? I think it's possible in this game.
For Juri's counters you can't do shit but know your space. If she's close then don't do an SB If she's far then boom. When they get close it's more of a space them out so you can boom or go in for a combo type of thing.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
hypernima said:
Only Ryu's HK tatsu does. But it has to be timed right. I was using Sakura's Hk tatsu, which is very punishable.

For Guile rushdown you have to keep them guessing, is it going to be boom dash overhead, boom dash sweep, boom dash grab, or some other type of mixup.

He might be charge partitioning? I think it's possible in this game.
For Juri's counters you can't do shit but know your space. If she's close then don't do an SB If she's far then boom. When they get close it's more of a space them out so you can boom or go in for a combo type of thing.
Click to expand...
What should I punish Sakura's tatsu with?
 
C

cHaotix8

Member
Karsticles said:
What should I punish Sakura's tatsu with?
Click to expand...

You can't really punish any of Sakura's tatsu's, which is part of what makes her a good character. They get her in close, break armor, and have pretty decent hitboxes.

The most important thing about this Guile and this game in general, is your ability to antiair opponents. There are a lot of characters that can alter their jump trajectories and timing, so you need to know how to punish each and every jump accordingly.

Guile's typical gameplan is to throw a lp. sonic boom, then respond accordingly to how your opponent reacts. Sonic boom recovers fast, so if your opponent jumps on reaction to seeing it, you get to anti air them. If they jump, you can anti air with cr. HP, flash kick (if you do the sonic boom input, then go directly back to holding down+back, you should be able to have enough charge time to perform it if your opponent jumps), Jump HK air to air, Air throw, and a bunch of other moves based on spacing. If they get hit, you can hit them with a fierce or low move if you're close enough, walk forward, or just throw another sonic boom. If they block it and try to walk back, just throw another sonic boom and be content with chipping them while trying to maintain your position on the stage.
Guile doesn't want to be in the corner, so try to either press forward or hold your ground.

Guile has a moves that push him forward while still maintaining back charge, like back+lk and, used sparingly, back+hk. Use those to push yourself forward after throwing a sonic boom while still maintaining your back charge. This will allow you to throw another sonic boom if your opponent focuses, blocks the first one, or dashes.

Hope that helps. I'm not really I Guile main, but I've messed around with the character and fought him enough to understand his general gameplan.
 
X

xCobalt

Member
hypernima said:
Only Ryu's HK tatsu does. But it has to be timed right. I was using Sakura's Hk tatsu, which is very punishable.

For Guile rushdown you have to keep them guessing, is it going to be boom dash overhead, boom dash sweep, boom dash grab, or some other type of mixup.

He might be charge partitioning? I think it's possible in this game.
For Juri's counters you can't do shit but know your space. If she's close then don't do an SB If she's far then boom. When they get close it's more of a space them out so you can boom or go in for a combo type of thing.
Click to expand...

Sak's HK tatsu is -2 on block which isn't punishable at all by the majority of the cast. However, there really isn't a use for MK or HK tatsu.

I think Guile's rushdown is terrible and shouldn't even be considered unless you're at a life deficit and time is running out. It's a high risk, low reward situation. By putting yourself closer to the opponent, they'll have an easier time landing the knockdown against guile. That could be game over for the guile player.
 
T

Threi

notag
Guile's rushdown is underrated. He can apply pressure more consistently than DeeJay for example, who is supposed to be the "rushdown" Guile.

especially in the corner oh god
 
V

Venfayth

Member
Threi said:
Guile's rushdown is underrated. He can apply pressure more consistently than DeeJay for example, who is supposed to be the "rushdown" Guile.

especially in the corner oh god
Click to expand...

Supposed to be according to who? Internet people?

--

Karsticles: @juri

Juri can zone you and sit at full screen and take 0 chip. She's like Rose in that, if you don't have the life lead, you're not going to get it back unless you go to her or she makes some very silly mistakes. You can try to beat her fireball or store with an EX boom, but a good Juri shouldn't be surprised by it at full screen.

Some more info about her parries, as I don't think many people understand how the move works very well:

LP Parry - 3f startup, teleports Juri towards opponent
MP Parry - 3f startup, teleports Juri away from opponent
HP Parry - 3f startup, teleports Juri directly up into the air, Juri gets an air action as if she neutral jumped
EX Parry - 0f startup, teleports Juri the direction she is holding (forward, upforward, up, upback, back, or just up if no direction is selected), Juri gets an air action as if she neutral jumped [!!EVEN IF SHE TELEPORTS UP FORWARD OR UP BACK, SHE STILL GETS HER NEUTRAL JUMP NORMALS, WATCH OUT FOR J.HK] Also, only relevant for the Juri player, but if someone crosses you up and you EX parry it with an up-forward or an up-back, Juri will teleport in the OPPOSITE direction because of the way the game registers your inputs.

Parries that aren't EX will lose to meaty moves or <3f frame traps. Juri can wake up with EX parry to beat out meaty attacks such as fireballs and shoryukens and basically any move that doesn't break armor. Juri's parry is unique in that when it activates, she takes no damage from the attack (think like an armored attack such as a focus attack) but also takes no gray damage. She is also no longer an eligible target to be hit by the move that triggered her parry. If she is returned to a neutral state she is an eligible target again. This is only really important to people who can cover her wakeup with a meaty projectile and still have time to hit her with a normal (Dhalsim is the biggest culprit here). Dhalsim can do a meaty fireball (or ultra) + s.hp to knock her out of her parry even if it's EX.

Juri has a few frames at the end of her lp and mp parries that can be cancelled into a normal or special move, so you need to react quickly if you see her teleport near you. She can always be punished for a teleport as long as you're in range to do so.

EDIT:

--

Guile shouldn't really be doing boom into dash at all :X LP boom is like +10 on block and your forward dash is 19 frames :lol

Not saying it won't ever work, but getting into a habit of doing that would be pretty detrimental.
 
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