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Super Street Fighter 4 Arcade Edition |OT4| Daigo Who?

K

Kadey

Mrs. Harvey
I was going to say that if Daigo and Latiff/Poongy played again, the outcome would not be the same. I think Daigo going into his match with Poongy was too relaxed. He probably thought it would be a free ride but we all know what happened. From then, he was mindfucked for the rest of his duration in the tournament. Latiff took advantage of a Daigo who was probably still thinking of his matches being sent into losers and either gave his opponent too much respect at times or was too aggressive and got blown up by EX seimos.
 
M

MIMIC

Banned
BotoxAgent said:
i hate it when people use the comment "still a beginner" and turn out to be gdlk
Click to expand...

LOL, yeah, I find that really annoying, too. Sometimes during rematches, I change mine to "Still Training" and beat them :)

....and then I forget that the comment is still enabled and play some actual beginners with "still training" still on. lol
 
U

USD

Member
lol, I don't know why people have any serious hope of seeing those matches. PROTIP: You won't, unless you're in Shinjuku.
 
L

LProtag

Member
Trying to use some of the tips here. My win rate went from 4% to 11%, so maybe something is improving, haha.

Still having difficulty capitalizing on knockdowns. I've been able to get in a few 'meaty' Oroshis, but I can't get any mixup going. Still haven't nailed a Karakusa either, though I need to work on the input as I can't get it to come out in a fight.
 
O

Onion_Relish

Member
InsertNameHere said:
Trying to use some of the tips here. My win rate went from 4% to 11%, so maybe something is improving, haha.

Still having difficulty capitalizing on knockdowns. I've been able to get in a few 'meaty' Oroshis, but I can't get any mixup going. Still haven't nailed a Karakusa either, though I need to work on the input as I can't get it to come out in a fight.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I think you might be better off playing another stronger character first and then moving back to makoto. So much of Makoto's game is her Yomi and understanding the mentality of your opponent. It might sound blasphemous, but maybe you should play Yun first, a rushdown character who has a million tools to get in and do some damage. I think it will help you understand Makoto a lot better. There is definately something to be said for smashing your head against the wall, but i wouldnt recognize it with makoto.

Also, something that just came to mind. Go into training and set the dummy to CPU. That way you will get a lot of experience quickly. It won't be perfect, but it will give you a chance to do some real practicing.
 
L

LProtag

Member
Onion_Relish said:
Honestly, I think you might be better off playing another stronger character first and then moving back to makoto. So much of Makoto's game is her Yomi and understanding the mentality of your opponent. It might sound blasphemous, but maybe you should play Yun first, a rushdown character who has a million tools to get in and do some damage. I think it will help you understand Makoto a lot better. There is definately something to be said for smashing your head against the wall, but i wouldnt recognize it with makoto.

Also, something that just came to mind. Go into training and set the dummy to CPU. That way you will get a lot of experience quickly. It won't be perfect, but it will give you a chance to do some real practicing.
Click to expand...

True. I kinda like smashing my head against the wall. It might feel better once I actually break the wall.
 
L

Lost Fragment

Obsessed with 4chan
Makoto's a very strong character, but even people who know what they're doing have trouble being consistent with her unless they're super pro. So yeah, I agree that you might have a better time playing a different character until you get a better handle on the game as a whole.
 
L

LProtag

Member
I'm going to try out other characters now that my little 'honeymoon' period is over with the game. I'll see what I actually do.

Oh, also, does anyone know why my PP completely went to 0 after someone disconnected from a match we were in?
 
T

Threi

notag
InsertNameHere said:
True. I kinda like smashing my head against the wall. It might feel better once I actually break the wall.
Click to expand...
Pick a character you can win with, whether or not they are OP. Save yourself the trouble of trying to get over "walls".
 
S

Satyamdas

Banned
Threi said:
Pick a character you can win with, whether or not they are OP. Save yourself the trouble of trying to get over "walls".
Click to expand...
Why don't you follow your own advice, threi?

"Do as I say, not as I do?"
 
T

Threi

notag
Satyamdas said:
Why don't you follow your own advice, threi?
Click to expand...
I'm an idiot, maybe he's not? I am also aware of my ability as a SF player, but not getting into that again.

And for the record i didn't say "pickatoptier"
 
Z

zlatko

Banned
InsertNameHere said:
Weird. I certainly wasn't the one that disconnected and all of my (very few) PP went away.
Click to expand...

Don't even sweat it. You can go from 0-2000PP in one sitting from like a 5 hour session of ranked online once you are decent at the game. The point system is ass, but I like to keep it above 2KPP once I feel confident in my character so I get matched up with better players since it uses PP to find opponents.

As others mentioned Makoto isn't the hardest character in terms of execution, but it takes someone who is super good at reading opponents to open people up and get the most out of her. You won't get there until you know what every character is capable of, block strings, mix up options, and you still need your basics down.

Characters I always recommend for beginners are the ones that have the most simple footsie oriented game. Guile is such a character, but not all people feel confident in trying to learn a charge character at the start. They also don't feel Guile is interesting enough, because he doesn't have like 20 hit combos and is more of a character that just whittles you down bit by bit. However, you only have a sonic boom, a flash kick, and an air throw to worry about.

Non charge characters that are good to dip your toes in with are obviously Ryu and Ken.

Also, give the character trials a go. It's a good way to test your execution and how far you are coming along. In Vanilla I couldn't do El Fuerte's run stop fierce combo, or Abel's step kick combos, but after a lot of grinding in Super I was able to complete all the trials. Now I can do any 24 for any character without issues which reaffirms in my head my execution has come a long way. Trials may also help you find a character you feel comfortable execution wise right out the gate and you can maybe give them a focus to help level yourself up.
 
Z

zlatko

Banned
SolarKnight said:
Speaking of trials, how the hell do you even do Dhalsim's? I just can't do pretty much any after the really really basic ones x___X
Click to expand...

Depends which. He has two versions of his normals as I'm guessing you are aware of right? If you're holding back you get the short version of his limbs. Another thing with his trials is Ultra 2 you can buffer the QCF motion on the ground, then hit up back and hit the 3 buttons to automatically do it when he leaves the ground.
 
E

Edgeward

Member
Some of them are vague. st mk to yoga flame is actually back+mk to yoga flame. FA to Shangri-la is FA dash forward qcf, up-forwards, qcf ultra that's how you get instant air ultra.

Shoutouts to Onion for teaching me the tricks.


Edit: Yo damn, Zlatko said the exact same things I was talking about. lol
 
O

Onion_Relish

Member
_dementia said:
Fuerte's RSF loop trail is the worst

Fierce Punch
Fierce Punch
Fierce Punch

Ono was trolling hardcore there.
Click to expand...

protip: use ex run on feurte's trial, it makes it so that you dont run the risk of being too far away on the third hit.

But yeah, guile 20, ibuki ultra cancel, makotos hyate cancel trial, rufus 23 there are quite a few trials that are way too hard for about 95% of the people who play the game. Ive already made my thoughts known about this in former threads, so i wont go on.

But yeah, even playing Ryu might be a good idea just to learn the basics and get the mechanics together. FADC's, ryu has both qcf and back as well as a Z motion, etc etc.
 
M

MIMIC

Banned
I just had the best kind of win. Someone joined my lobby and intentionally idled just to see how I play *rolleyes*. I figured he was doing this and I was about to boot him but then I changed my mind.

I intentionally pick Guile to throw him off. I beat my opponent with Guile (he's not particularly good; I'm on an 8-game winning streak against him. Just your average Ken). Now it's idler's turn.

I pick Fuerte (lol) and he picks Juri. He's pretty good but I get an aggressive, "will do just about anything to get that W" vibe from him. It goes to 3 rounds and I end up winning.

So after I beat Ken again, Mr. Idler picks YANG. LMAO. I had a sneaking suspicion he would pick one of the twins. So lame. So I'm keen to all of Yang's bullshit and I bait just about every wake-up kick. I destroy him in round 1.

Round 2 is more competitive (because I suck at teching, lol). He gets lucky (I get salty) and it goes to round 3.

I destroy him (after he does about a billion palms....God damn that move is too good). He hit me with only 2 of those palm moves and they were the ONLY hits he got in.

I get ready to boot him (for that lame counter-picking nonsense) but he saves me the trouble and leaves.

XBL.

(I just really hate counterpicking ^_^)
 
P

Professor Beef

Banned
MIMIC said:
Yang's command throw beats Zangief's Ultra.

WHAT THE FUCK
Click to expand...
DJi8O.jpg
 
A

Azure J

Member
Imm0rt4l said:
You just realizing this? The twins ex command grabs are throw invincible.
Click to expand...


I caught the worst end of this recently when my bro literally mashed out some shit, got the EX "lol im over here" grab when I went for a kara karakusa. Worst part was him starting some real troll shit after he discovered how good that was by starting palm spam or in one case crossing up with dive kick to command grab to dive kick to command grab to dive kick... etc.

Yun is too fucking much in this game. :lol

Also, playing with C. Viper stuff, holy shit this character's fun.
 
R

Rice-Eater

Member
black_vegeta said:
Since people are still on a Poongko high, here's a few sets with him against Ojisan Boy (Yang).

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm15072369

For those who don't have a NicoNico account, see below:

Go to this website: http://mmcafe.com/nico.html

Then copy this url (below) into the designated field, then click on "watch."

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm15072369
Click to expand...

I think this is the same thing, and the quality is much better to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7ZsxPv129Y
 
A

Azure J

Member
I'm still in that phase where everything makes me laugh though, even if I've had some salty moments here and there. I can't imagine what it must be like to play regularly and see Yun almost mindlessly lay waste to fucking everything.gif with a few up-kicks and shoulder leans into Gene-jin.
 
MarkMan

MarkMan

loves Arcade Sticks
Kadey said:
I was going to say that if Daigo and Latiff/Poongy played again, the outcome would not be the same. I think Daigo going into his match with Poongy was too relaxed. He probably thought it would be a free ride but we all know what happened. From then, he was mindfucked for the rest of his duration in the tournament. Latiff took advantage of a Daigo who was probably still thinking of his matches being sent into losers and either gave his opponent too much respect at times or was too aggressive and got blown up by EX seimos.
Click to expand...

Daigo was definitely having a hard time adjusting... As everyone knows, in Japan most top players play in the arcade or on Xbox 360/XBL. Imagine having to play on arcade/XBL then for less than a month... trying to adjust to PlayStation 3 timing for certain things and playing on an ASUS VH236H.

When the pressure was on, it got to him. He went back to playing like he was in the arcade/on XBL.

If you guys notice, at ReveLAtions (Xbox 360), Daigo had no complaints. But at NCR (PS3), you may notice he dropped a TON of combos and while you guys might have not heard about it, he kept telling me there was a difference and he can feel timing differences on PS3. It was his first time playing MVC3 and AE on PS3 at NCR.

So he was determined to try and practice on PS3 after that. Which is cool and all, but you can't practice for a month on PS3 and expect your 8-9 months stint on arcade/Xbox Live to just go away from your muscle memory. It's unfortunate but I know Daigo wasn't the only one who was affected by this.

Anywho, that's neither here nor there. I just wanted to quote Kadey and tell her I miss her.
 
R

Rice-Eater

Member
People say Momochi was mind fucked at Shadowloo Showdown, and people say Daigo was mind fucked at EVO. I say neither were mind fucked, Poongko made the correct reads and he was incredibly lucky with his guesses. The situation that Poongko put Momochi and Daigo in, there were no safe decisions. Upkicks lose to Seth's DP, back dash can get caught by tanden engine, blocking will result in SPD. They got put in situations where no decision was a good/safe one, it was just a roll of the dice and somehow Poonkgo guessed right like 90% of the time.

This is not me being a defender of the Japanese or anything like that. I'm a big Poongko fan and he's the reason why I actually started playing Seth. But I've played that match up with my friend at lower levels. I somewhat copy Poongko with the wake up 50/50. Sometimes I blow him up, sometimes he blows me up. Honestly it boils down to a brain dead game of rock, paper, scissors. Imagine if you played a friend and beat him 5 times in a row. Was he mind fucked or were you just very lucky? It was a great win by Poongko regardless of how he won it. But I don't think losing because of those circumstances should considered being mindfucked. If he blocked 5 times in a row and got SPD's every time, we would say why didn't he keep doing up kicks?
 
S

Satyamdas

Banned
Rice-Eater said:
People say Momochi was mind fucked at Shadowloo Showdown, and people say Daigo was mind fucked at EVO. I say neither were mind fucked, Poongko made the correct reads and he was incredibly lucky with his guesses. The situation that Poongko put Momochi and Daigo in, there were no safe decisions. Upkicks lose to Seth's DP, back dash can get caught by tanden engine, blocking will result in SPD. They got put in situations where no decision was a good/safe one, it was just a roll of the dice and somehow Poonkgo guessed right like 90% of the time.

This is not me being a defender of the Japanese or anything like that. I'm a big Poongko fan and he's the reason why I actually started playing Seth. But I've played that match up with my friend at lower levels. I somewhat copy Poongko with the wake up 50/50. Sometimes I blow him up, sometimes he blows me up. Honestly it boils down to a brain dead game of rock, paper, scissors. Imagine if you played a friend and beat him 5 times in a row. Was he mind fucked or were you just very lucky? It was a great win by Poongko regardless of how he won it. But I don't think losing because of those circumstances should considered being mindfucked. If he blocked 5 times in a row and got SPD's every time, we would say why didn't he keep doing up kicks?
Click to expand...
I agree that the game devolves into RPS or a coin flip regularly, but I don't think such situations are all braindead. Option selects do remove a portion of risk, but there are a lot of ways option selects can be avoided completely and punished, so reading your opponents' tendencies still factors heavily in high level matches. Fuudo's Ultra to catch Poongko's backdash wasn't an OS after all, it was just a gutsy read.

Poongko's success is a direct result of Seth having the best vortex in the game combined with his complete lack of fear and machine-like execution. The fearlessness that brought him to Top 3 at Evo is also the reason he lost to Fuudo and Latif, as all it took was a few too many reckless dps and one bad spd read and the glass cannon shattered. Poongko wasn't being brainless when he went for those dps and spd, he was picking Scissors because his gut told him his opponent was picking Paper for sure this time based on what had gone on in the match already and his instinct as a player.

I do agree with you though, I don't think Daigo or Momochi were mindfucked. They've seen and played against Seth since vanilla, even if no one had taken him quite to Poongko's level before now. They were just outplayed, period. The crux of the game is putting your opponent in bad situations where they have to guess and avoiding those situations yourself, and Poongko was simply able to get them on their heels more often and maximize damage and capitalize on his aggressiveness. Remarkably, even in Poongko's losses to Latif and Fuudo, he still was never pressured relentlessly or put on his heels, rather he made a tiny handful of errors that Seth cannot afford to make and it cost him the tournament.
 
C

Conceited

mechaniphiliac
I honestly just think Poongko doesn't give 100% until it's time to get serious, because I remember Momochi was beating him in casuals before Shadowloo Showdown pretty consistently.

I still think he would have won EVO if he hadn't done that first unsafe uppercut after the reset that was punished with ultra by Fuudo, he was essentially beating him up until that point but that mind-fucked him beyond all salvation.
 
S

Satyamdas

Banned
Conceited said:
I honestly just think Poongko doesn't give 100% until it's time to get serious, because I remember Momochi was beating him in casuals before Shadowloo Showdown pretty consistently.

I still think he would have won EVO if he hadn't done that first unsafe uppercut after the reset that was punished with ultra by Fuudo, he was essentially beating him up until that point but that mind-fucked him beyond all salvation.
Click to expand...
I disagree. I never buy the "I wasn't *really* trying 100%" excuse as a rule, and I am even less inclined to believe it in the case of Poongko, who regularly goes on winning streaks of 70 or 80 games in casuals. Sure, he might style unnecessarily in casual matches, but losing in casuals to Momochi doesn't mean anything. Momochi is one of the best players in the world, yo. And Poongko damn sure wasn't just farting around at any point during Evo or Shadowloo Showdown. Dude was in full on machine mode.
 
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