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Surface |OT|
- Thread starter strata8
- Start date
The Office update takes a huge amount of time to install, since it's essentially doing a full replacement of the Beta version with the RTM version.
Unless you want to start using Office right away, I recommend you just like Windows Update take care of it in the background sometime. You can manually install it at any time, but I think it might be slowly rolling out to people over the next few weeks for automatic install. And it'll install automatically even when the device is sleeping in Connected Standby.
Holy shit! That would be amazing.
DataStream
Member
Much like others here, I went down not sure if i was going to purchase. Given that I use Zun... er Xbox Music, the free year coupons still being in stock solidified the decision. I might return it or hold onto it until the pro to ebay it.
You really should see it in person, though the screen could be a bit higher res, its very good quality and hides its lower res well. More than anything though, the cover and device itself is a step up in terms of quality. I particularly like the Heather Grey (its not black) cover and its external fabric detailing.
The build of the machine is really quite excellent. After using the iPad for so long (had both v1 and v2) it is quite a different form factor in wide screen and portrait, but the weighting of the device is such that one handed portrait use is actually rather comfortable to me (though I do have larger than average hands). The feel of the device is much more angular than an iPad but it also feels more sturdy. I do find that the cover is a bit cumbersome when you are using it in tablet mode and find that its best to simply take it off.
Was about a 30 minute wait at the SF popup to buy one (around 2pm), they bought me frozen yogurt while I waited in line. MSFT is doing a good job getting this thing out there from what I can see. It seemed as if 3 people were entering the line for each 2 that made it to the point of sale.
Edit: And the automatic advancement detection feature in IE is soooo good for forums. Don't miss chrome from my win8 desktop as of yet.
You really should see it in person, though the screen could be a bit higher res, its very good quality and hides its lower res well. More than anything though, the cover and device itself is a step up in terms of quality. I particularly like the Heather Grey (its not black) cover and its external fabric detailing.
The build of the machine is really quite excellent. After using the iPad for so long (had both v1 and v2) it is quite a different form factor in wide screen and portrait, but the weighting of the device is such that one handed portrait use is actually rather comfortable to me (though I do have larger than average hands). The feel of the device is much more angular than an iPad but it also feels more sturdy. I do find that the cover is a bit cumbersome when you are using it in tablet mode and find that its best to simply take it off.
Was about a 30 minute wait at the SF popup to buy one (around 2pm), they bought me frozen yogurt while I waited in line. MSFT is doing a good job getting this thing out there from what I can see. It seemed as if 3 people were entering the line for each 2 that made it to the point of sale.
Edit: And the automatic advancement detection feature in IE is soooo good for forums. Don't miss chrome from my win8 desktop as of yet.
DataStream
Member
There is definitely some sluggishness in some apps. I think this is highly dependent on how people are handling loading of assets, it seems like some devs aren't caching downloads per session and are just redownloading them every time they are needed (at least it feels that way).
.png?psid=1)
Screenshot shortcut on the Surface (and all other 8/RT tablets):
Hold Windows key (the one on the actual tablet), tap Volume Down button
You should see the screen fade, and you'll see a screenshot in your Pictures library
Skel1ingt0n
I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
I'm a big Apple fanboy - I'm happy to admit. Have had an iPhone since Day One on first gen, and currently have an iPhone 5, iPad 3, and an iMac. But with that said, I really do like to consider myself a rather objective user of devices, and while I poke fun at MS and Google, I certainly am thrilled for any serious competition to enter the fray - as in the end that's best for the consumer.
Buddy at work has been hyped to hell for this thing - and when some of the mediocre reviews hit, you know I came in and ragged on him all day. But it was all in good fun, and I was excited to try the thing out today after he returned from grabbing his delivery.
My impressions:
-First thing was his Touch Cover was broken. The "\" key kept auto-pressing and was making the accessory completely unusable. I wanted to make jokes, but I know that feel too well - it sucks. I told him he should leave work again and go grab another from the MS Store, and he did. Second one gave no issues at all.
-The build quality of the device is extremely nice. It feels sturdy as hell, but it's also pretty light. It's the closest tablet to rival the iPad on the exterior hardware side. The kickstand, from what I hear, is very hard to break. But with that said, it would probably still worry me that I'd accidentally snap it doing something stupid.
-16x9 is weird as hell. It's funny, I remember thinking it was stupid that Apple went 4:3ish back during the iPad reveal. But it really does make a lot more sense, I think. I have very large hands, and it is a struggle to reach and touch things with your thumbs when holding the unit in landscape. I know that's not a common way to hold it, but I noticed it as an issue more than once this afternoon. It also makes Portrait mode look unwieldy long. The dimensions aren't much greater than my iPad, but the device did feel quite a bit larger.
-The Touch Keyboard is genius. I mean, really great. I was expecting to be disappointed, but in just about five minutes I was typing at about 50% my normal speed. After regular use, I could see myself typing 75% speed without much issue. No, it's FAR from a real keyboard. But it's a huge step up from an on-screen keyboard, and it's much more convenient than the iPad options. It's also crazy how this weird accessory has a better trackpad than most every Windows laptop I've ever used.
-Apps are SOOOO slow to load the first time. I know it's only the first time - but it's really bad. Some simple apps were taking 15+ seconds too load after a cold boot. Apps that take just 1-3 seconds on my iPad.
-The Metro UI is pretty decent. I don't have much experience with it outside a few videos, but it definitely looks really sleek and modern. I can't comment on usability too much with my little hands-on time, but I didn't really have any complaints. But then again, people make fun of the iPad's row of icons - but I think it's impossible to get any easier than that.
-The device is extremely gesture-heavy, it seems. Unfortunately, some of the gestures are kinda wonky. Slide on the sides is weird, and I didn't feel it was ever working exactly right.
- Multi-tasking is AWESOME! This was my favorite take-away. Having email constantly running on the side while browsing the internet or reading or whatever is just great. The only thing I'd consider my iPad-totin-self jealous of.
- Why oh why is Apple the only company than can make a perfect smooth browsing experience? Safari is, in my mind, still leaps and bounds above the competition in the mobile space. Pinch to zoom works better, scrolling is smoother, and there's just so much less "jank." Internet browsing is my #1 use on my iPad, and so I really wish the competition could step their game up. No, the Surface isn't bad by any means; but it's an obvious step down form iOS.
- Lol @ the marketplace. That's really all I can say. MS needs developers on this thing ASAP.
-Office is great. I'd love to have Word and Excel on my iPad - fully featured. I think I'll get it some day. But yeah, it's definitely handy. That said - and while I know why it's the case - I really hate that Office loads up in the desktop environment. Two environments is really dumb, in my opinion. Yes, I've heard all the reasons and arguments. But I just don't agree. I think there has to be a better solution.
-Price is fair. 32GB for the price of a 16Gb iPad. That said, I think they should have included the touch cover. It's a must-own accessory. It's one of two big differentiating factors, and it's silly MS doesn't include it. I compare it to the X360 launching with two SKUs. Just a dumb money-grab.
-No 4G?! Why? It's not even an option without 4G. I must have email everywhere when traveling.
-The screen is good. Not great, but servicable. It's unquestionably a large downgrade from the Retina iPad, though. Hoping Gen 2 has a higher resolution.
***
Overall, I was impressed. It's definitely the first "high-end" tablet that I could see myself buying over an iPad. In a lot of ways, it's still inferior to Apple's offering. But just one simple thing is what my mind keeps coming back to - the intelligent multi-winow multitasking. It works really well. But I don't like the 16x9, and I don't know how it'd work on a 4:3. I hope Apple comes up with a good, competitive solution. I wish MS the best of luck.
EDIT:
Picture of our productive Friday in a nutshell ;p
Buddy at work has been hyped to hell for this thing - and when some of the mediocre reviews hit, you know I came in and ragged on him all day. But it was all in good fun, and I was excited to try the thing out today after he returned from grabbing his delivery.
My impressions:
-First thing was his Touch Cover was broken. The "\" key kept auto-pressing and was making the accessory completely unusable. I wanted to make jokes, but I know that feel too well - it sucks. I told him he should leave work again and go grab another from the MS Store, and he did. Second one gave no issues at all.
-The build quality of the device is extremely nice. It feels sturdy as hell, but it's also pretty light. It's the closest tablet to rival the iPad on the exterior hardware side. The kickstand, from what I hear, is very hard to break. But with that said, it would probably still worry me that I'd accidentally snap it doing something stupid.
-16x9 is weird as hell. It's funny, I remember thinking it was stupid that Apple went 4:3ish back during the iPad reveal. But it really does make a lot more sense, I think. I have very large hands, and it is a struggle to reach and touch things with your thumbs when holding the unit in landscape. I know that's not a common way to hold it, but I noticed it as an issue more than once this afternoon. It also makes Portrait mode look unwieldy long. The dimensions aren't much greater than my iPad, but the device did feel quite a bit larger.
-The Touch Keyboard is genius. I mean, really great. I was expecting to be disappointed, but in just about five minutes I was typing at about 50% my normal speed. After regular use, I could see myself typing 75% speed without much issue. No, it's FAR from a real keyboard. But it's a huge step up from an on-screen keyboard, and it's much more convenient than the iPad options. It's also crazy how this weird accessory has a better trackpad than most every Windows laptop I've ever used.
-Apps are SOOOO slow to load the first time. I know it's only the first time - but it's really bad. Some simple apps were taking 15+ seconds too load after a cold boot. Apps that take just 1-3 seconds on my iPad.
-The Metro UI is pretty decent. I don't have much experience with it outside a few videos, but it definitely looks really sleek and modern. I can't comment on usability too much with my little hands-on time, but I didn't really have any complaints. But then again, people make fun of the iPad's row of icons - but I think it's impossible to get any easier than that.
-The device is extremely gesture-heavy, it seems. Unfortunately, some of the gestures are kinda wonky. Slide on the sides is weird, and I didn't feel it was ever working exactly right.
- Multi-tasking is AWESOME! This was my favorite take-away. Having email constantly running on the side while browsing the internet or reading or whatever is just great. The only thing I'd consider my iPad-totin-self jealous of.
- Why oh why is Apple the only company than can make a perfect smooth browsing experience? Safari is, in my mind, still leaps and bounds above the competition in the mobile space. Pinch to zoom works better, scrolling is smoother, and there's just so much less "jank." Internet browsing is my #1 use on my iPad, and so I really wish the competition could step their game up. No, the Surface isn't bad by any means; but it's an obvious step down form iOS.
- Lol @ the marketplace. That's really all I can say. MS needs developers on this thing ASAP.
-Office is great. I'd love to have Word and Excel on my iPad - fully featured. I think I'll get it some day. But yeah, it's definitely handy. That said - and while I know why it's the case - I really hate that Office loads up in the desktop environment. Two environments is really dumb, in my opinion. Yes, I've heard all the reasons and arguments. But I just don't agree. I think there has to be a better solution.
-Price is fair. 32GB for the price of a 16Gb iPad. That said, I think they should have included the touch cover. It's a must-own accessory. It's one of two big differentiating factors, and it's silly MS doesn't include it. I compare it to the X360 launching with two SKUs. Just a dumb money-grab.
-No 4G?! Why? It's not even an option without 4G. I must have email everywhere when traveling.
-The screen is good. Not great, but servicable. It's unquestionably a large downgrade from the Retina iPad, though. Hoping Gen 2 has a higher resolution.
***
Overall, I was impressed. It's definitely the first "high-end" tablet that I could see myself buying over an iPad. In a lot of ways, it's still inferior to Apple's offering. But just one simple thing is what my mind keeps coming back to - the intelligent multi-winow multitasking. It works really well. But I don't like the 16x9, and I don't know how it'd work on a 4:3. I hope Apple comes up with a good, competitive solution. I wish MS the best of luck.
EDIT:
Picture of our productive Friday in a nutshell ;p
Okay I put the movie onto my harddrive and then streamed it to my TV via xbox. It worked... but definitely more pixelated than it should be. Also, the surface had an error message that said "Can't play because file format isn't supported" and stopped playing on the surface, yet the movie continued to play on the xbox. Weird.
Interesting, thanks. It doesn't look to be using subpixel rendering, so I'm not sure how they're claiming ClearType here. Definitely looks like regular grayscale rendering if you magnify it.
Screenshot shortcut on the Surface (and all other 8/RT tablets):
Hold Windows key (the one on the actual tablet), tap Volume Down button
You should see the screen fade, and you'll see a screenshot in your Pictures library
I figured this out after googling, but it took me a little bit longer to figure out how to get that picture online. I tried using imgur.com on the desktop IE, but that was not working. Finally I ended up opening SkyDrive and figuring out that sliding up from the bottom opens the menu for assorted tasks.
Jetpack Joyride runs like shit on this, I don't know why
Ran much better on my iPhone 3G!So one of the Microsoft "store" pop-ups opened up at my local mall. I use the quotes because all they had was piles upon piles of Surface tablets. I was actually hoping to see a bunch of new W8 devices a la the Best Buy setups, but oh well.
Anyway yeah, the hardware is attractive, and while I wasn't impressed with the Touch Cover, the "real" keyboard seemed excellent and not overly bulky. I'm eager to see how the Pro version turns out, although I'm not eager to see the price. I assume at least $999 sans keyboard, based off how other new W8 devices are priced, and possibly more...
Anyway yeah, the hardware is attractive, and while I wasn't impressed with the Touch Cover, the "real" keyboard seemed excellent and not overly bulky. I'm eager to see how the Pro version turns out, although I'm not eager to see the price. I assume at least $999 sans keyboard, based off how other new W8 devices are priced, and possibly more...
.png?psid=1)
MrGreencastle
Member
Not sure if true, but I've heard the "metro" interface doesn't support Cleartype.
I figured this out after googling, but it took me a little bit longer to figure out how to get that picture online. I tried using imgur.com on the desktop IE, but that was not working. Finally I ended up opening SkyDrive and figuring out that sliding up from the bottom opens the menu for assorted tasks.
Jetpack Joyride runs like shit on this, I don't know why
Yeah I don't know what's up with that, the demo units at the store had sluggish performance in games. May need a few optimization tweaks in a coming update as my Nexus 7, with (I think) the same chipset, runs it fine.
--
Still waiting on that phone call to find out if Edmonton's store will be getting their Surfaces. It's still crazy to me that the entire city was basically forgotten, despite there being a pop-up store here in one of the largest malls in the world...
Yep, it's the same in the app as well. If it was using subpixel rendering, you would see colored (RGB) subpixels around the characters. I don't see any though, so that leads me to believe it's just using standard anti aliasing.
Some stuff in Surface/WinRT is confusing. I was trying to change the wallpaper on my desktop (app?). I can access the files in my pictures library on my desktop pc on windows 7 using the photos app, but from there all I can do with the photos is set them as the app tile/app background or lock screen. I found out the settings in the desktop app to change the background and it looked just like windows 7 but it could not see any of the photos from my desktop pc.
So to work around it I went into the photos app and found the wallpaper image on my desktop that I wanted to use, took a screenshot and then went back into the desktop app and set my wallpaper to the screenshot of the picture that I just took. Kinda confusing.
This took way too long:
So to work around it I went into the photos app and found the wallpaper image on my desktop that I wanted to use, took a screenshot and then went back into the desktop app and set my wallpaper to the screenshot of the picture that I just took. Kinda confusing.
This took way too long:
? Changing your desktop wallpaper is the same as 7. Not very hard. (right click on desktop, personalize-click desktop background-browse)
oh. lame.
He's saying you can't take the picture off your computer and set it as your desktop background even though you can do this kind of thing when working in the metro portion of RT.
^ This
Connecting to my network let me view all the photos in my desktop computer's pictures library in the Photos app, but I couldn't save them. I couldn't access them in the desktop app.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
Any idea how to get Exchange to work? Every time I try to set it up, it applies my Admin's settings, but when it tries to sync it says that it requires a strong password, and that my account password cannot meet the requirements.
I have this same account set up on my Droid and iPad with no problem. I have changed my MSN account password to be extremely complex (special character, alpha-numeric, upper and lower-case) and it still give me this error. Any thoughts?
I have this same account set up on my Droid and iPad with no problem. I have changed my MSN account password to be extremely complex (special character, alpha-numeric, upper and lower-case) and it still give me this error. Any thoughts?
bigtroyjon
Member
Click the neogaf symbol to the left of the thread title...
Really? One of my favorite parts of IE on Surface is how smooth it is, especially scrolling and zooming. Even on pages with Flash it's perfectly smooth. And in addition to that smoothness, it seems to load pages faster than I've seen on an iPad - even when loading multiple tabs in the background.
My only complaints with IE is that there are some less-perfect animations when tapping the address bar to pull up the keyboard, and when doing the Back gesture it has to take a couple seconds to re-load the previous page.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
WHOA! Never knew that trick. Thank you so much.
Took me years to stumble upon that one.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
Been here 7 years and never knew it. The things you learn randomly in threads.
I hope it gets the Entertainment Weekly tablet app soon. The largeness and the wideness would be awesome to read it with.
Also, dudes, this app is awesome: http://apps.microsoft.com/webpdp/en-us/app/star-chart/6df7e745-782f-44e7-b408-6259a8da6a7f
I got it when it was still free a few weeks ago, didn't realize it was going to cost $6. But it uses the accelerometer if you want so you can lift up the surface and look around. So cool!
Also, dudes, this app is awesome: http://apps.microsoft.com/webpdp/en-us/app/star-chart/6df7e745-782f-44e7-b408-6259a8da6a7f
I got it when it was still free a few weeks ago, didn't realize it was going to cost $6. But it uses the accelerometer if you want so you can lift up the surface and look around. So cool!
StudioTan
Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Wouldn't be Verge without it.
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
So how long till this thing gets jailbroken and we can have Flash for all sites?
I give it a few weeks.
Joshua Topolsky is the guy that said windows 7 makes him physically ill. Yes, Windows 7. I would suggest not to listen to him on anything related to Microsoft.
What's this about flash not working on all sites? That's stupid. I don't understand why they'd place a silly limitation like that.
Also, what are the payment methods for the Windows 8 store? Does it support prepaid credit cards or PayPal? I don't use a credit card so I'm worried that I'm going to be locked out of buying apps (like what happened with Windows Phone 7).
Also, what are the payment methods for the Windows 8 store? Does it support prepaid credit cards or PayPal? I don't use a credit card so I'm worried that I'm going to be locked out of buying apps (like what happened with Windows Phone 7).
SlowRevolution
Member
EW still hasn't even updated its iPad app for retina. Maybe they'll be faster with this since the resolution is different, but they've always seemed extremely slow to me.
He wasn't even on the podcast
On tablets everyone is moving away from flash. Afaik flash for Android was discontinued and the iPad has never supported flash. So even if it doesn't work on all sites, it's still better than the competition
Keep in mind that the whitelist for sites that use flash can potentially grow in the future, as Microsoft adds more sites.
Jables Swan
Member
I'm a little out of touch atm. What happened to the original Surface that was the tabletop touch screen thingy? Is that still around?
I thought I looked! Thanks so much. Now I really need the 64
That 8k dollar Samsung table?
Jables Swan
Member
Oh is that what it is now? Cheers.
MightyKAC
Member
All of these testimonials for the RT are REALLY getting me hyped for the Pro whenever it comes out. All I need to hear now is that it's battery can last 6-7 hours and it won't run me more than 1000$ - 1200$ for all the bells and whistles and it's pretty much a done deal from there.