Support NeoGAF

[Skel1ingt0n]

So you think the Surface would be a better product if MS was somehow able to only allow programs that support touch?

I think it would be a better product if it could somehow emulate touch.


You guys... I don't dislike the thing. I think it's great. My only argument is that desktop navigation on a 10", high-resolution desktop causes issues when using your fingers. Can they be fixed? I'm not certain. But it unquestionably doesn't work as well as it would in a perfect world. That's it.

 

[Returners]

I think it would be a better product if it could somehow emulate touch.


You guys... I don't dislike the thing. I think it's great. My only argument is that navigation on a 10", high-resolution desktop causes issues when using your fingers. Can they be fixed? I'm not certain. But it unquestionably doesn't work as well as it would in a perfect world. That's it.

Finger scrolling is decent in Metro, it's just the legacy things that somehow needs to be slightly "compatible". I feel that MS has done what it can.

I was looking for a laptop that looks good while not sacrificing portability, and I believe I have found it with the Pro.

I'll need to spend more time with it @ work and see how good it is there.

 

[PG2G]

No, I'm arguing the Surface is not an ideal tablet. Just like I would argue that the iPad is not an ideal eBook reader. Just because something can do more, doesn't mean it does the simpler things better. The Surface is a great laptop; but it isn't perfect as a tablet.

What are you doing with a "tablet" that puts you in the non touch friendly desktop mode? Almost every traditional tablet use case can be handled without leaving metro.

 

[bigtroyjon]

Pretty good surface commercial.

Youtube

Didn't really like it, too similar to the RT commercial.

One thing I really did like was them calling it the Surface Pro at the end and not using the convoluted Surface with Windows 8 Pro.

 

[BrownChickenBrownCow]

Decent commercial, glad they showed a little of what it can actually do.

 

[Pooya]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnzVIBoxTTs

League of Legends, EVE Online, Dota 2 and MATLAB.

using MATLAB with stylus seems fun.

 

[Feep]

Just installed Bastion, and it was running flawlessly at 1080p. What a beautiful game.

I fucking love this thing.

 

[DagsJT]

After some more usage with the RT, I'm quite liking it. There's definitely lag, especially on games. "Rat On A Snowboard" even lags and there's nothing even going on with that! Something isn't right and a Tegra3 should be able to at least handle ROAS.

Otherwise, "Mobile.HD" works brilliantly so that's a major plus. I've got the UK Netflix showing on my Metro UI, and then I can access the US Netflix using the browser so very pleased with that. "Pow!" seems decent for comics. "Tome" for Goodreads.

But the games really are a letdown. Hardly any decent games and what ones are there run very poorly. I realise it's not an iPad and that'd be more suited for games etc but the Tegra3 works great on the Nexus 7 and it's just not working right in the RT. Whether that's due to the Nexus 7 using all of the Tegra3 cores and the RT not using them all, or whether it's poor coding, or a problem with RT itself, I haven't got a clue. But it's not as fluid as it could/should be.

 

[crisdecuba]

So after thinking about it some more, I think I'm going to take the plunge. One question - if I got with the 64GB model and have a 32GB Class 10 MicroSD card that will always be in the device, will I experience slower performance if I mainly use the SD to store documents?

 

[Nero3000]

After some more usage with the RT, I'm quite liking it. There's definitely lag, especially on games. "Rat On A Snowboard" even lags and there's nothing even going on with that! Something isn't right and a Tegra3 should be able to at least handle ROAS.

Otherwise, "Mobile.HD" works brilliantly so that's a major plus. I've got the UK Netflix showing on my Metro UI, and then I can access the US Netflix using the browser so very pleased with that. "Pow!" seems decent for comics. "Tome" for Goodreads.

But the games really are a letdown. Hardly any decent games and what ones are there run very poorly. I realise it's not an iPad and that'd be more suited for games etc but the Tegra3 works great on the Nexus 7 and it's just not working right in the RT. Whether that's due to the Nexus 7 using all of the Tegra3 cores and the RT not using them all, or whether it's poor coding, or a problem with RT itself, I haven't got a clue. But it's not as fluid as it could/should be.

Check of you have installed all the latest firmware updates. Some of those improved the performance from launch.

 

[DagsJT]

Check of you have installed all the latest firmware updates. Some of those improved the performance from launch.

I did have a firmware update, and a few software updates, but hasn't fixed it. It's probably not as bad as the launch lag but clearly noticeable.

 

[derFeef]

Im thinking about importing again -.-

 

[kazinova]

Oh, crap, the Pro can play LoL really well.

Hmm...how much could I sell my RT for...? $400?

 

[ambientmystic]

Got borderlands 2 running well enough, lowest settings.

So all UE3 based games are fair game for the Surface? Pretty much all of the latest ports for the PC are in UE3 (DmC, Dishonored, Borderlands 2). Kewl.

Strange that CryEngine games are a no go.

 

[crisdecuba]

I'm chomping at the bit to just order a 64GB one online.

Can anyone confirm: If I got with the 64GB model and have a 32GB Class 10 MicroSD card that will always be in the device, will I experience slower performance if I mainly use the SD to store documents? (including some games).

 

[BrownChickenBrownCow]

I think it would be a better product if it could somehow emulate touch.


You guys... I don't dislike the thing. I think it's great. My only argument is that desktop navigation on a 10", high-resolution desktop causes issues when using your fingers. Can they be fixed? I'm not certain. But it unquestionably doesn't work as well as it would in a perfect world. That's it.

I totally agree, you would have to make the desktop zoom ultra huge to make it useable at that resolution.

However with a pen, if you choose to use it... It works.

 

[I'm an expert]

So after thinking about it some more, I think I'm going to take the plunge. One question - if I got with the 64GB model and have a 32GB Class 10 MicroSD card that will always be in the device, will I experience slower performance if I mainly use the SD to store documents?

I actually had to go back and reread the last few pages since I thought I mixed up the users. So, you bought a Pro, returned it in a few hours, bought an Ipad, returned that, and now you want a Pro..again? Or is it an RT? Wtf are you doing?!?!

 

[crisdecuba]

I actually had to go back and reread the last few pages since I thought I mixed up the users. So, you bought a Pro, returned it in a few hours, bought an Ipad, returned that, and now you want a Pro..again? Or is it an RT? Wtf are you doing?!?!

Hahaha yup, that's right. The Pro...again. I'm making sure I'm making a final decision with as much info as possible. I'd never tried an iPad for anything longer than 2-3 minutes, so I felt I need some way to compare.

Edit: There were a couple of reasons for returning the Pro so quickly:

1. I mistakenly tried to use it in tablet form for primarily interacting with the desktop component, which I've learned since then is not really the way it's intended to be used. Kind of like holding the N64 controller by the left prong and trying to use the analog stick.
2. Many recommended an iPad as an alternative, and I had never used one before for a lengthy period of time, so I felt like I was potentially making a premature decision.
3. I read the MS Store's return policy, and it said something to the effect that the product had to be unopened, so I was worried that if I didn't take it back right away, I'd lose all opportunity to return it. If I'd bought it at Best Buy I would have kept it longer and played with it more.

Oh, and I haven't returned the iPad yet. I wanted to get a good amount of time with it. In the end it feels nice for what it is, but I'm often wishing that things would just "work" with the rest of my Windows set up.

 

[I'm an expert]

Hahaha yup, that's right. The Pro...again. I'm making sure I'm making a final decision with as much info as possible. I'd never tried an iPad for anything longer than 2-3 minutes, so I felt I need some way to compare.

Damn..wherever you're shopping must have an amazing return policy.

 

[Divvy]

I've been playing guild wars2 on it and it runs pretty well on low settings.

However the fan gets really loud and the surface gets pretty warm. Hope I'm not damaging it.

 

[Divvy]

Also, anyone else have issues where the on screen keyboard doesn't show up sometimes? Especially in metro apps?

 

[RurouniZel]

Does anyone have any inkling how long it would take Wacom to fix its drivers for the Pro? Days? Weeks?

 

[TheLaughingStock]

What are you doing with a "tablet" that puts you in the non touch friendly desktop mode? Almost every traditional tablet use case can be handled without leaving metro.

I guess it's confusing because (like past windows tablets) you have the option to do a bunch of stuff and given what's currently out there you need to switch to the most appropriate input method. The other mobile OSes successfully penetrated the market first, so we (overall) just forget/don't care that they're limited and we're never in a desktop environment trying to do certain things. Seems like the best course of action for mobile would be no desktop at all. Maybe RT gets there.

 

[a secret-boss]

Hahaha yup, that's right. The Pro...again. I'm making sure I'm making a final decision with as much info as possible. I'd never tried an iPad for anything longer than 2-3 minutes, so I felt I need some way to compare.

Edit: There were a couple of reasons for returning the Pro so quickly:

1. I mistakenly tried to use it in tablet form for primarily interacting with the desktop component, which I've learned since then is not really the way it's intended to be used. Kind of like holding the N64 controller by the left prong and trying to use the analog stick.
2. Many recommended an iPad as an alternative, and I had never used one before for a lengthy period of time, so I felt like I was potentially making a premature decision.
3. I read the MS Store's return policy, and it said something to the effect that the product had to be unopened, so I was worried that if I didn't take it back right away, I'd lose all opportunity to return it. If I'd bought it at Best Buy I would have kept it longer and played with it more.

Oh, and I haven't returned the iPad yet. I wanted to get a good amount of time with it. In the end it feels nice for what it is, but I'm often wishing that things would just "work" with the rest of my Windows set up.

I actually heard it from a store person about their 30 day return.

because this dope is trying to trade in his Windows RT (purchased at launch lol ) for Pro

 

[MCD]

I tried two Atom tablets while I was in Japan: Fujitsu Arrows and Asus Vivo Tab.

One question immediately popped in my head: why the fuck did MS bother with Windows RT? And this is coming from someone who bought a Surface RT at launch.

Atom is more than capable of being light with good battery life so why bother with ARM?

 

[Epic Drop]

I've been playing guild wars2 on it and it runs pretty well on low settings.

However the fan gets really loud and the surface gets pretty warm. Hope I'm not damaging it.

If you dont mind me asking, how long could you run GW2 on those settings without plugging in to a power source?

 

[zorbsie]

Alright after a weekend with the pro, I'm totally in love with it. The type cover is so nice to type with. I've got a small wooden tray I'm using for typing while I'm sitting on the couch. It solves the whole "it's wobbly in my lap" argument. Watching top gear on the way to work today was amazing.

So let's talk traveling with the surface. How are people carrying this thing from home to work? I've got a sleeve that I used for my asus transformer that fits the surface pro nicely. I then put that into my backpack. But the backpack solution is just not working for me. I'm thinking about buying a satchel for it. That way it'll will be easier to access the device. What is everyone else using?

 

[Divvy]

If you dont mind me asking, how long could you run GW2 on those settings without plugging in to a power source?

Uhhh I have no idea. Probably not very long considering how hard the system is working to run it.

 

[Returners]

Anyone tried Starcraft 2 or D3 on it yet?

 

[eastmen]

http://t.co/x2MYk58Q. Ns working with partners to get photoshop and other programs acting right with the pen in the near future

 

[Medalion]

Still contemplating getting a Surface Pro

But I am not hugely wowed by Windows 8, nor the specs of this tablet in general...

Too expensive

It might as well be a Laptop at that price and configuration but with a detachable keyboard and fixed hard drive of 64 or 128GB or something

 

[btrboyev]

I tried two Atom tablets while I was in Japan: Fujitsu Arrows and Asus Vivo Tab.

One question immediately popped in my head: why the fuck did MS bother with Windows RT? And this is coming from someone who bought a Surface RT at launch.

Atom is more than capable of being light with good battery life so why bother with ARM?

AMD's latest gen chips also offer great performance and excellent battery life.

 

[Funky Papa]

Hold on to your horses. I've toyed around with a couple of Atom powered W8 tablets and they are shit on a stick.

Like, really bad.

 

[Ryu1999]

Just went to best buy to try the Pro out. Felt a bit heavier than expected but otherwise seems like it checks the boxes for what I'm looking for

 

[Bearded Dudebro]

Here's a question, most tablets and phones will lock and you can unlock them with a passcode. A lot of them have user facing cameras, why has no one setup a way to unlock the device with facial recognition? I'l love to find a way to do it with my Surface Pro. Any ideas?

 

[Funky Papa]

Here's a question, most tablets and phones will lock and you can unlock them with a passcode. A lot of them have user facing cameras, why has no one setup a way to unlock the device with facial recognition? I'l love to find a way to do it with my Surface Pro. Any ideas?

There are a number of laptops with facial recognition for locking and unlocking.

You can fool them with your driving license.

 

[DagsJT]

Here's a question, most tablets and phones will lock and you can unlock them with a passcode. A lot of them have user facing cameras, why has no one setup a way to unlock the device with facial recognition? I'l love to find a way to do it with my Surface Pro. Any ideas?

Android has facial recognition unlocking on their phones and tablets. Nexus 7 certainly has it.

 

[Damon Bennet]

Im thinking about importing again -.-

where would you import without paying a huge premium? I dont know any shop that ships worldwide. I am pretty sure I'll import, once I find one with a reasonable price

 

[brotkasten]

Updates coming for Surface Pro's digitizer pen: After seeing a tweet from PocketNow's Adam Z. Lein about some shortcomings around Surface Pro pen support for certain apps like Photoshop, I asked Microsoft for an update. A spokesperson sent the following:

"Surface Pro uses Windows Inbox Drivers and APIs (application programming interfaces) for the Surface pen, which support advanced features such as pressure sensitivity and eraser functionality. There are a number of apps in the Store that leverage these new Windows APIs and can take advantage of all that the Surface pen has to offer. The Surface pen does work with Photoshop, which runs on Surface Pro, though advanced features such as pressure sensitivity and eraser functionality may not be available at this time. Microsoft is working with the necessary partners to make advanced features of the Surface pen available across a number of applications in the near future."

http://www.zdnet.com/microsofts-sur...nts-more-cover-colors-in-pipeline-7000011130/

 

[RurouniZel]

http://www.zdnet.com/microsofts-sur...nts-more-cover-colors-in-pipeline-7000011130/

Well here's hoping its sooner rather than later.

 

[eastmen]

Alright after a weekend with the pro, I'm totally in love with it. The type cover is so nice to type with. I've got a small wooden tray I'm using for typing while I'm sitting on the couch. It solves the whole "it's wobbly in my lap" argument. Watching top gear on the way to work today was amazing.

So let's talk traveling with the surface. How are people carrying this thing from home to work? I've got a sleeve that I used for my asus transformer that fits the surface pro nicely. I then put that into my backpack. But the backpack solution is just not working for me. I'm thinking about buying a satchel for it. That way it'll will be easier to access the device. What is everyone else using?

I got the bundle at the ms store so I got a small sleeve.

I have a timbuk2 command bag in small

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005HEV52G/?tag=neogaf0e-20

It fits it really well

 

[Anony]

can someone who have the surface pro run prime95 on it? maybe for 10-15 mins
i want to know how hot it gets at max cpu usage

 

[eastmen]

So my keyboard is not being detected anymore. Dunno whats going on. I'm doing a system restore now to see if maybe it was adding windows media center

 

[zorbsie]

I got the bundle at the ms store so I got a small sleeve.

I have a timbuk2 command bag in small

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005HEV52G/?tag=neogaf0e-20

It fits it really well

Cool bag, I'll have to look into what other bags timbuk2 has. I think I want something smaller. essentially it'll just fit the surface and maybe my phone.

I also got the bundle, but didn't get a sleeve. I dropped by the store today to pick up an extra stylus (I just know I'm going to lose it) and the clerk remembered me and told me I didn't pick up my sleeve. They gave me one for nothing. The sleeve from MS is really nice.

 

[eastmen]

http://www.timbuk2.com/tb2/ off to the ms store

 

[Rommel]

Thought this was kinda cool (not unexpected)


From his Reddit AMA

thisisbillgates
I just got my Surface Pro a week ago and it is very nice.
I am using a Perceptive Pixel display right now - huge Windows 8 touch whiteboard. These will come down in price over time and be pervasive...

 

[brotkasten]

Thought this was kinda cool (not unexpected)


From his Reddit AMA

"These will come down in price over time and be pervasive..."

The said the same about the Surface and instead of making it affordable, they turned it into a tablet.

 

[TheLaughingStock]

I tried two Atom tablets while I was in Japan: Fujitsu Arrows and Asus Vivo Tab.

One question immediately popped in my head: why the fuck did MS bother with Windows RT? And this is coming from someone who bought a Surface RT at launch.

Atom is more than capable of being light with good battery life so why bother with ARM?

There's stuff like RT having security advantages, basic office may matter if you can't get it for free/discount, and not having to deal with desktop programs dragging down performance like netbooks in the past/present.

The main thing I think is that MS has just about complete control over the designs that's put out there. Additionally, I think netbooks messed up how much folks are willing to pay for a PC. MS wants to have nice build quality out there with margins similar or superior to the iPad.

 

[Epcott]

http://www.zdnet.com/microsofts-sur...nts-more-cover-colors-in-pipeline-7000011130/

Not sure if this bodes well for Adobe and Photoshop. I hope they take care of it ASAP.

I'd like to find a great graphic design program in the meantime, because spending ~$500 on CS6 for such a vague answer doesn't seem wise. I just have no idea what works well on the tablet's small screen.




I looked around today, and could not find any Surface Pros in stock. Staples only has sells the 64GB, and they're out. The two Best Buys I went to were out of everything as well.

Found a MS kiosk at a mall and put myself on the waiting list. For $399 more they said they would add the mechanical keyboard and Office with it, so I took the bait.

They also sell the Sensu brush at the kiosk:

https://www.sensubrush.com/

But when I asked how well it works with the Surface, the rep said it's not very good.
It's looking less and less like the art/writing tablet I had hoped it would be (-_-)

Any advice?

 

[FStop7]

The Surface pen does work with Photoshop, which runs on Surface Pro, though advanced features such as pressure sensitivity and eraser functionality may not be available at this time. Microsoft is working with the necessary partners to make advanced features of the Surface pen available across a number of applications in the near future."

That's not "working", then. Especially not when literally the first third party app MS showed off running on a Surface Pro at last year's unveil was Lightroom. That was literally the thing that got my attention and compelled me to want to buy one.