travisbickle
Member
Event was cancelled because of the actions of men. Suggestion it could go ahead without men. I don't see the problem.
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Swedish Comedian organizing man-free music fest until they learn how to behave
- Thread starter Andrew Korenchkin
- Start date
Event was cancelled because of the actions of men. Suggestion it could go ahead without men. I don't see the problem.
Yeah, this is the sort of danger I was trying to point out.
excelsiorlef
Member
Imagine reading this story and thinking that this was something of worth to put out in this world.
You're obviously not interested in replying to the things im writing. These theories are widely available, but as I -said- they are more complex, and also not defines by me so me stating them would be unneeded and secondary information. Look up utilitarism. It's kind of a starting point. Then read up on some of the stuff Rawls have said, he has good points. Here:
http://carneades.pomona.edu/2008-SPP/nts-0428.shtml
These festivals are an absolute shit show of drugs and alcohol. I bet that if they banned those two and tossed out anyone clearly inebriated there would be next to no problems of this kind, but that wouldn't be any "fun". It's easier to ban a whole gender than put down the bottle.
This won't be the same festival, it is a potential festival organized by different people, so no they're not banning men from a festival they've been able to attend for years.
You are a piece of shit racist, that's the hard truth of it.
You are a piece of shit racist, that's the hard truth of it.
Well...yes? I know how to behave and how to be a decent human being
Mahadev
Member
Event was cancelled because of the actions of immigrants. Suggestion it could go ahead without immigrants. I don't see the problem.
Event was cancelled because of the actions of blacks. Suggestion it could go ahead without blacks. I don't see the problem.
Event was cancelled because of the actions of gays. Suggestion it could go ahead without gays. I don't see the problem.
Event was cancelled because of the actions of gingers. Suggestion it could go ahead without gingers. I don't see the problem.
Event was cancelled because of the actions of people with green eyes. Suggestion it could go ahead without any people with green eyes. I don't see the problem.
Hmmm, is it just me or your post is incredibly bigoted and dumb if you take, I don't know, just one fucking second to think about it?
If you're going to allow venues to determine entry based on representation in crime statistics, then you have to consider how that will be implemented by racist venue owners.
But literally none of these are true so I have no idea what you are getting at.
Mahadev
Member
Way to completely miss the point, purposely or not. Congrats.
I feel you are missing the forest for the trees.
They are demonstrating that you can make this logical argument for any group and of the groups listed most people would consider them clear cases of either discrimination or absurdity.
Question then becomes are man a class or group worth "protecting"? I honestly don't know. I mean obviously we aren't wanting for anything right now. I read this story and I don't care. Let them have a safe place, but I also recognize the logic doesn't really track. Or at least I haven't heard a good argument for it. My humanity says fuck it. Let em do it, but my critical eye has me questioning. Maybe the privilege is enough of an argument?
kiunchbb
www.dictionary.com
They should narrow it down a bit more, just banning men are too general.
What race are those criminals? If all of them are the same race, perhaps we'll just ban that race from entering.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ccused-cover-up-sex-attacks-refugees-festival
Of course the reports that the assaults in Sweden are mostly caused by immigrants are disputed, but we can never be too careful right?
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
You really don't see the dangerous parallels in that statement?
El-Pistolero
Member
Sweden for you. Not surprised...
Psychoward
Banned
uncelestial
Member
It does sound racist, that isn't the hard truth, and it is worse than banning all men.
One person = Sweden.
Psychoward
Banned
Cool, it's good that you managed to miss out on the whole getting sexually assaulted portion of it though which is what this is about.
Not how one person anecdotally had a great time.
And I'm sure it was for the most part. That's part of the thing with festivals, most people don't notice these things. This has been a real issue with festivals as far as I can remember. I distinctly recall reading news reports during the 90's about Hultsfred and others festivals and the problems of sexual assault and harassment. It's not really something new, it's just finally being reported more and followed up on, it's not a day too soon, should've been more focus on these issues already back then
And you having gone to 100+ concerts, and thinking of Bråvalla 2016 as one of the most chill festivals ever, with it having more reported rapes than this years, should tell you how "safe" those other 100+ concerts/festivals really were for women.
SiegfriedFM
Member
Can we agree that men aren't a minority? So it's not discrimination to exclude men from a specific event. It's not like there aren't a bunch of other rock festivals. Judging by some of the outrage, it's also wrong to exclude men from women's dressing rooms and showers.
travisbickle
Member
I don't see the point of these hypotheticals unless you're willing to provide what illegal act ginger people or immigrants did that we can prove would be stopped completely by their removal?
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
You need to stop thinking about this one event in particular.
Muslims and terrorism, spring to mind as a comparison.
People have already provided this information in this thread, you just chose to ignore it:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...an-man-injured-in-attacks-by-gangs-in-cologne
You can't prove that sexual assault can be stopped completely by the exclusion of men. Women can commit sexual assault as well.
The issue here is that if you empower groups (either venue owners or lawmakers or judges) to deny entry to public accommodations based on some immutable characteristic, then you have to consider how that right can be abused.
michaelius
Banned
Replace men with any other group and think how would you react then.
Also it feels we are missing bigger problem here - why did the number of assaults increase in 2016 and 2017 ?
What was police doing during 2017 event ?
His Majesty
Banned
This is not the first time sexual assault is reported at a Swedish music festival I think. Stuff like this also happened at We Are Stockholm. It's good that Sweden is doing something about it but I don't think this here is the right solution.
Also makes you wonder how much this kind of stuff happens in other countries but is ignored.
Also makes you wonder how much this kind of stuff happens in other countries but is ignored.
Ah, so we're using that definition of discrimination.
And that analogy is.. something, I guess.
Zeyphersan
Banned
People really dont like being not invited to things
Do yall show up and crash the party when your friends/partners have a girls night out?
Do yall show up and crash the party when your friends/partners have a girls night out?
Good gosh.
? This is exactly what I was wrestling with in my post. Maybe you are saying it's clear cut, but i'm not sure it will be for me.
You're joking right? There hasn't been any protests against sexism?
Mahadev
Member
So women or gays aren't capable of sexual assault? Is this another generalization of yours? This forum is starting to make me believe in the horseshoe theory lately, Jesus Christ.
WITHOUT. PROTEST.
This thread is the first time anyone has ever been concerned with possible sexism. In fact, the term "sexism" was invented in the OP because humans didn't even have a concept of it before.
What a cluster fuck all round. Sad to hear about the number of assaults, that is not acceptable.
Jesus. They just said it was strange to read the story arc in total, not that the attacks didn't happen. No need to get pissy over that post.
Jesus. They just said it was strange to read the story arc in total, not that the attacks didn't happen. No need to get pissy over that post.
Yep. No men have ever been spoken up or taken action against sexism. None.
travisbickle
Member
plasmawave
Banned
One day for women only. One day for men only. One day for everyone.
Send me the cheque.
Send me the cheque.
Mahadev
Member
Well, if the event organizers said it it must be true and morally acceptable. So if an event organizer said "immigrants" instead of "men" you'd rush to defend them. Yeap, I'm done with this thread.
I wish this would work, but most of the big acts would only want to be at the final day unless the single gender days brought the same size crowds. I presume anyway, I could be totally wrong. Both on the acts and the relative crowd sizes on each day.