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Tales of Series | Community Thread | Localizing more games than Square Enix
- Thread starter kayos90
- Start date
R_thanatos
Member
i usually disagree silently with the renaming of the characters & locationq in tales of ..
but
For xillia i really don't like the changes..
"muzét"
WTF
but
For xillia i really don't like the changes..
"muzét"
WTF
It should go in the monthly update thread. I'll do it later.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
It's got class, I like it.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
I don't see the problem. Its the exact same pronunciation as her JP name.
dakkumauji
Member
Oh hi, we got moved to community. :x
Muzét doesn't sound that bad.
Muzét doesn't sound that bad.
RPGCrazied
Member
Less than 2 weeks for Xillia. The excitement is killing me!
Pretty excited myself.
Everyone aboard the hype train.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Ending [t]s are silent in French, yes. It'll be pronounced the same way as it was in Japanese.
However, I'm pretty sure it's very uncommon for ending 't's to be used when the preceding 'e' has accent aigu.
I'm not entirely convinced this localized name is (proper) French. A fluent friend was explaining this to me, how it defies French spelling conventions.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
It's not, but phonotactically, it's certainly going to take after the vowel as opposed to the ending /t/. French is not a phonetic language, as phonetic languages like Arabic says that each letter has a corresponding sound. Lettres muettes in French are a different case, and /t/s are generally silent towards the end. B, C, F, K, L, Q, and R are usually pronounced at the end of a word, while D, G, M, N, P, S, T, X, and Z are usually silent.
I dunno. I took French since the first grade, so that's what it sounds like to me in my head. I assume that they're going to go with the Japanese pronunciation for it, especially since the phonotactic nature of é is pretty much in the middle in terms of vowel placement in the mouth. Based on instinct, I'd generally end with the vowel as opposed to completely ending the word with a consonant since that's generally not how /t/s work in French. The only exceptions that I know of are: brut, ouest, huit, words ending with -ct ending, and words ending with -pt. Of course, my linguistic background's more in Latin, and I didn't study a ton of in-depth French outside of my first two years of undergrad.
Edit: I know why I feel that way. It's because of the word l'été ("summer"). If it didn't have the extra é at the end, I wouldn't pronounce the /t/ due to Optimality rules/phonology rules in my head. It's peculiar, because I can't recall off the top of my head a word that's even spelled that way right now. Actually, let me make a quick call to someone. He may be fluent in Quebecois French but it's French nonetheless.
Edit2: I made the call. And this dude's been speaking French since he was a baby and agreed. You cannot pronounce the /t/ at all because that's just not how the phonotactics work. He did think it was peculiar that it's [ét] because you just don't see that. Either way, that's not how French works. If it's CV, then you don't pronounce the ending consonant. If it's VCC, you do in some cases like -ct and -pt.
I'm surprised they didn't go with Musée, myself, but that might be because that word means "museum" in French. If they were to pronounce the /t/ at the end of the word, it would've been spelled "Musétte" instead.
I dunno. I took French since the first grade, so that's what it sounds like to me in my head. I assume that they're going to go with the Japanese pronunciation for it, especially since the phonotactic nature of é is pretty much in the middle in terms of vowel placement in the mouth. Based on instinct, I'd generally end with the vowel as opposed to completely ending the word with a consonant since that's generally not how /t/s work in French. The only exceptions that I know of are: brut, ouest, huit, words ending with -ct ending, and words ending with -pt. Of course, my linguistic background's more in Latin, and I didn't study a ton of in-depth French outside of my first two years of undergrad.
Edit: I know why I feel that way. It's because of the word l'été ("summer"). If it didn't have the extra é at the end, I wouldn't pronounce the /t/ due to Optimality rules/phonology rules in my head. It's peculiar, because I can't recall off the top of my head a word that's even spelled that way right now. Actually, let me make a quick call to someone. He may be fluent in Quebecois French but it's French nonetheless.
Edit2: I made the call. And this dude's been speaking French since he was a baby and agreed. You cannot pronounce the /t/ at all because that's just not how the phonotactics work. He did think it was peculiar that it's [ét] because you just don't see that. Either way, that's not how French works. If it's CV, then you don't pronounce the ending consonant. If it's VCC, you do in some cases like -ct and -pt.
I'm surprised they didn't go with Musée, myself, but that might be because that word means "museum" in French. If they were to pronounce the /t/ at the end of the word, it would've been spelled "Musétte" instead.
I took French in high school so I'm definitely going to be reading it as "Musee" myself (on phone too lazy for accents lol). It's just how I know to read stuff, heh And I do think that's how it will be pronounced, but I'm not entirely sure it's accurate to say this name is French, that's all
Words ending in "e" sound like an accented "e" in Japanese (I think) so I can see why the localizers put in an accented "e" to terminate Muzet's name with the silent "t". If Musee was written out by an English speaker I would pronounce it Musee since I would assume the writer knew about but didn't choose to use accents.
Shame 8-4 doesn't talk about their localizing work on their podcasts.
Shame 8-4 doesn't talk about their localizing work on their podcasts.
R_thanatos
Member
As a french ( born there and speaking the language ), this writting is anything but french for me.
[t] are usually silent when you end a word or name with them but there are plenty of situations when they are not .. Case in point where anyone seeing "musét" will use all sounds because they see "é" and not "e". Why ? because you get the "é" sound with "et" in french . Adding "é" will get you another situation where you have to use all sounds meaning that at this point (t) is not silent anymore because adding an accent separate the sounds when you read them.
If you want the same sound in french , you have 2 choices:
-musée ( already a common name meaning museum )
-muzé ( doesn't mean anything in french )
So for me , when i read "musét" i get something quite different from what i'm accustomed to ( having played and completed xillia 1 & 2 )
Ps: I wrote this text for people who didn't understood my previous complain and why it sound very bad for me.
Now i was just stating my disagreement but i'm pretty sure i can ask the members of my familly how they will speak this word and get it wrong each time.
Personnally i think the silent (t) is there only to get a first name feeling
R_thanatos
Member
just in case somone wanted to point out a detail:
There are some cases in french where "et" doesn't get you "é" but "è".
Ex : "Palet" is written like this but when you use that word it ends like this "palè".
In very old french , you could use "é" to force the é in a word and get to surronding strong sounds silent, but we're not in the middle ages anymore , and it's now custommary to not add anything unnecessary if you can get the same result by simpler means.
This just means that if you end something by "et" in french , you go 2 solutions
it either means "é" or "è". adding an accent doesn't force the "t" to become silent in the regular mind of anyone because they will think that it is present because you can get the same result just with "é" or "è" , not with "ét" or "èt" in current french , you don't overcharge the words if there is no reason to , unless you deal with words that have a very long history in the language ( and this isn't the case since we're talking about a name for a character that has no direct relation to a common word )
So anyone reading , if not corrected , will use all the sound available because you added an accent.
And that's why the (t) is useless , it doesn't do a thing except confuse me.
This is also why there are no words using "ét" in french many were using that before ( old french ) but they got changed over time and ages and nobody use them that way anymore
Sorry for this french lesson.. let's get back to talk about "Tales of "
i'm done.
There are some cases in french where "et" doesn't get you "é" but "è".
Ex : "Palet" is written like this but when you use that word it ends like this "palè".
french got plenty of rules, and it gets complicated quite fast so i'll stick to modern french
In very old french , you could use "é" to force the é in a word and get to surronding strong sounds silent, but we're not in the middle ages anymore , and it's now custommary to not add anything unnecessary if you can get the same result by simpler means.
This just means that if you end something by "et" in french , you go 2 solutions
it either means "é" or "è". adding an accent doesn't force the "t" to become silent in the regular mind of anyone because they will think that it is present because you can get the same result just with "é" or "è" , not with "ét" or "èt" in current french , you don't overcharge the words if there is no reason to , unless you deal with words that have a very long history in the language ( and this isn't the case since we're talking about a name for a character that has no direct relation to a common word )
So anyone reading , if not corrected , will use all the sound available because you added an accent.
And that's why the (t) is useless , it doesn't do a thing except confuse me.
This is also why there are no words using "ét" in french many were using that before ( old french ) but they got changed over time and ages and nobody use them that way anymore
Sorry for this french lesson.. let's get back to talk about "Tales of "
i'm done.
Ah, that makes sense. Although Mozet might not necessarily be a french name so it doesn't follow the same rules *shrug*.
We already got a girl who has "-ette" in their name, Colette.
We already got a girl who has "-ette" in their name, Colette.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Yeah I read that in my old french book. It's just unnecessary and the e accent aigu does its job appropriately in modern French.
Thanks for the explanation, though! I learned something new.
R_thanatos
Member
i said in my first sentence up there that this isn't french , and then i explained why.
i just wanted to explain why i wasn't fan of the name and explain why it couldn't be french based.
Now it could work in another language perfectly and i don't care since it won't change my enjoyment of the game ( after all i'm done with xillia since ...months ) since i have no plans to get the localisation as of now.
My next tales of game will be the HD collection...
i just wanted to explain why i wasn't fan of the name and explain why it couldn't be french based.
Now it could work in another language perfectly and i don't care since it won't change my enjoyment of the game ( after all i'm done with xillia since ...months ) since i have no plans to get the localisation as of now.
My next tales of game will be the HD collection...
I missed that but yeah I agree (I only took 2 years of French in high school).
GarnetDust
Junior Member
Very happy to have found this. I am a huge fan of Vesperia and Symphonia. Played almost through Abyss, but didn't get to finish it, just yet, but love that one too. Started playing Phantasia....need to finish that.
I am not a fan of Phantasia. At all.
R_thanatos
Member
what's the problem with phantasia ? ( but first witch version did you play ? )
GBA is the only version i had the opp of playing and it's horrendously bad.
charlequin
Banned
Yeah, that makes sense, but it's because you're a French speaker. For English speakers (the target audience here) the "t" makes it look classy (because of English's history, we think of French loanwords as high-class) while the incorrect accent over the e makes sure people know to pronounce it in the French style (since otherwise they might default to saying "moo-ZETT.")
If it were supposed to be a real French name I would groan, but as a way of adding a French "flair" to a name for an English-speaking audience I think it works.
Interesting. i never knew that. Thanks.
Well it certainly got me to pronounce it right.
I may be weird, but if the "t" wasn't there I would actually think lower of the name.
Mozé. :/
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
Hmm... Kayos90 and Dark Schala put a lot of content for the OT but I don't think i can post everything coz there will be too many images.
I might relegate them to a 2nd post text version.
I might relegate them to a 2nd post text version.
R_thanatos
Member
This is like the worst version ever in english.
Maybe you should try the ps1 version or the psp versions that are so much better ?
I'm not denying that .. i was just stating my opinion as a french speaker that it make no sense.
I wasn't able to get screens in french for xillia 1 ( despite the fact that like Graces it will be localised in french even if it's only the text ) I just hope that they will not do a lazy job on this part. ( meaning that i hope that they will use a proper naming for her )
GBA Phantasia is seriously one of the worst Tales games period. The awful GBA translation and dub makes it even worse.
Hmm... Kayos90 and Dark Schala put a lot of content for the OT but I don't think i can post everything coz there will be too many images.
I might relegate them to a 2nd post text version.
LOL. Did we go overboard again? rofl.
I like to think that abomination doesn't exist along with Tempest.
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
Probably, I realized you guys like to keep your information very detailed (not a bad thing though!). But I'll try to do final adjustments.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
If you need to excise something, go ahead. Really sorry about that.
Sorry. As Schala mentioned, cut stuff out or something as needed.
Oh gosh. If you put her as Milla and me as Jude I just... I don't know mang....
dakkumauji
Member
If you make kayos Jude, remember to put him as the school boy outfit~
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
Who says I'm putting Dark Schala as Milla.
huehuehuehue
Oh gosh.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
...what's that supposed to mean? >:|Who says I'm putting Dark Schala as Milla.
huehuehuehue
Judging Tales of Phantasia based on the GBA version is like judging FFV based solely on the PS1 port, but 10x worse.
I couldn't stand the SNES version of ToP, but the PS1 port (with a translation patch) is amazing. One of my favorite 2D Tales games of all time. The battle system is simple, but it does what it does very well. Also, I enjoyed the story and the setting is one of the best in the series, IMO. The game's definitely worth giving another try with a better port.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
R_thanatos
Member
I don't know what happenned and i'm expecting the thread now , but not for the reasons i initially thought i would