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Team Fortress 2 Official PC Thread. SO. WORTH. IT.

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1

1-D_FTW

Member
That would actually be a good achievement. Sacrafice yourself X times at a CP. I'm not just talking medics, but as a general achievement.

Speaking of stickies: I don't play demoman enough to have figured it out, but can you shoot a sticky onto an enemy and then turn them into an unwilling human bomb?

EDIT: I'm done for the day. Logged on to play a little Trackmania United and saw the TF2 server was almost full. So I logged in. Spent the first 2 minutes shooting bombs at a wall in the supply room because I had a short in my headphone cable that was only giving me mono. So I needed to hear when I fixed it.

Once I figured that out, I ran out and died once or twice. Then I took a teleport that disoriented me a bit. And when I turned there were a couple engis shooting their shotguns and the medic shooting his needle gun my way. So I'm running around looking for a spy and run out the back entrance and some asshole tells the medic I'm just stupid. Fuck off, dude. That game quickly ended, played five minutes in the next round of Gravel Pit (Where I was running into a meat grinder at B because 1/3 of the team was wasting resources by capturing A. Yeah. That can't be taken at any time.) So I just quit and played Trackmania for 45 minutes.
 
F

Firestorm

Member
Yeah, I sacrifice myself so much it's not even funny. I only have two achievements left. 10 sentry kills and dustbowl. Once the Medic achievements come out I'll stay away from Medic for a while as there should be plenty of 'em. I'll get them once it's quieted down a bit.
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
I can't believe it switched to 2fort and we lost the vote to get out of there. Who the **** votes to keep 2fort? I see 24/7 2fort servers and I think it's a small subset. But we just lost the vote to switch. Why, dear god?
 
I

Icy

Banned
1-D_FTW said:
I can't believe it switched to 2fort and we lost the vote to get out of there. Who the **** votes to keep 2fort? I see 24/7 2fort servers and I think it's a small subset. But we just lost the vote to switch. Why, dear god?
Click to expand...

buh bye 2fort.
 
O

omgimaninja

Member
Icy said:
its crap. I am so gonna remove it from the rotation. I don't think any of us here can stand it.
Click to expand...
Thank god! I was going to ask if you could remove it :D Watch the server drop from 24 players to <10 once it says "switching to 2fort"
 
C

Cheeto

Member
2fort is one of the most genius maps in the package. Unfortunately, people in large groups generally aren't geniuses, must be why the map seems so shitty. I guess I'll stick to PUGs for my 2fortz
 
H

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
What you should do is have the voting system list "2fort" but have it always change to something like dustbowl instead. :D
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
Crushed said:
2fort rules.

Anyone who hates it is just a stupid baby.
Click to expand...

The only time anyone ever wins is if you're playing a really crappy team (This weekend we had an engineer built an entrance tunnel in their intel room. We won that match.)

Otherwise it's stalemates. And you can either pad your stats by playing defense. Or get ground up constantly attacking. But nobody ever wins when you have to score to 4.

Icy said:
buh bye 2fort.
Click to expand...

Thank you.
 
T

Twig

Banned
As an avid 2fort hat3r or something something, that map is so totally awesome with a good team.

Unfortunately that's rare.
 
F

Firestorm

Member
I love the whole relay thing with 2fort where a team coordinates to get the intelligence as far as possible and then die. Then someone else comes by and does the same until you get to your side of the map and cap it.
 
D

Davidion

Member
1-D_FTW said:
The only time anyone ever wins is if you're playing a really crappy team (This weekend we had an engineer built an entrance tunnel in their intel room. We won that match.)

Otherwise it's stalemates. And you can either pad your stats by playing defense. Or get ground up constantly attacking. But nobody ever wins when you have to score to 4.
Click to expand...

IMO CTF is so difficult in TF2 because the team-based nature of the game makes it so very difficult for a small band to break through a fortification, not to mention come back out alive.

It's a shame, I think these harder maps can make for some spectacular games between good teams. Oh well, que sera...
 
C

Confidence Man

Member
1-D_FTW said:
The only time anyone ever wins is if you're playing a really crappy team (This weekend we had an engineer built an entrance tunnel in their intel room. We won that match.)

Otherwise it's stalemates. And you can either pad your stats by playing defense. Or get ground up constantly attacking. But nobody ever wins when you have to score to 4.
Click to expand...

So it's like any other map, then.
 
T

Teknopathetic

Member
"So it's like any other map, then."


Naw, on any of the other CP points a slightly better team can eventually win in a really good match up, or even equal teams. 2fort is absolutely ridiculous, and it's not even 2fort's fault, I'd say it's just CTF with TF2 in general.
 
C

Confidence Man

Member
Teknopathetic said:
"So it's like any other map, then."


Naw, on any of the other CP points a slightly better team can eventually win in a really good match up, or even equal teams. 2fort is absolutely ridiculous, and it's not even 2fort's fault, I'd say it's just CTF with TF2 in general.
Click to expand...

I don't think that's the case. I see wins on 2fort just as often as I do on cp maps.

I think the real issue with 2fort and ctf is the lack of a sense of progress. Even if you lose or go to stalemate on a cp map there's still some accomplishment felt in pushing the line forward to the next point.
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
You see wins on the gaf server? I'm sure given enough time, you'd obviously have wins. But the timer eventually (mercifully) kicks in and it's a map change with no winner or loser.

Maps like Gravel Pit and Dustbowl have a winner and a loser. Even if you lose, there's resolution.

And the other CP maps can have their stalemates, but it's at worst 50/50 somebody is gonna get the victory (The non overtime variety.)

My hate of 2fort is that nobody ever wins. Even if it was one round up to 3... I could be more tolerant. But it's 4 captures for one point, and you need 3 points? So a team needs 12 captures for the victory. The server always changes before you get to that point (And very few people would wanna play 3 hours to otherwise achieve map change and winner/loser.)
 
C

Cheeto

Member
Again, the map is fine. It's the people that play the map. Naturally, if no one wants to use their mics and coordinate with each other; no one will win. One person cannot do it all on that map.
 
R

Richardfun

Member
Even with decent coordination, 2fort is just way too easy to defend, and therefore doomed to end in stalemate. Even if you run in over the bridge (or through the sewers) with a fair sized group (with at least one medic), the opposing team ought to have a sentry in the courtyard. If positioned correctly, the medic will need to use his ubercharge in order to have someone take it out.

After that, if you survive the sentry and the enemy's people, you go down into the intel room, where any team with half a clue will have another sentry right there in the intel room, maybe even two. Since you already used your uber, you'll get cut to pieces there, and if you do manage to get to the intel, the other team's people will have respawned and hunt you down, usually making it impossible to return the enemy intel to your base.

Keeping in mind the abovementioned scenario, you explain to me how you're supposed to win 2fort in the normally alotted time (not that I'm lobbying for longer playing time on 2fort, mind you).
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
Well then they should have had a clan mode you can enable. And a public mode for the rest of us 99 percent.

Seriously, there's three entrances. They all basically lead through the same choke point however. The tunnel is completely useless. Yeah it avoids sniper fire, but so does running under the bridge. So not only do all three points of entry basically converge at the same point, but you have to then run past the other team's spawn locker. And there's no med kits (Which should be available in public mode). The map is designed for failure. Can you capture with good team work? Yes. But you can also defend with good teamwork. So it's a battle of attrition to get at least 12 captures. TF2 is such a cool short burst game. You play a little of one map and have a winner and move on. 2fort is a marathon when everything else is a sprint.
 
C

Confidence Man

Member
1-D_FTW said:
You see wins on the gaf server? I'm sure given enough time, you'd obviously have wins. But the timer eventually (mercifully) kicks in and it's a map change with no winner or loser.

Maps like Gravel Pit and Dustbowl have a winner and a loser. Even if you lose, there's resolution.

And the other CP maps can have their stalemates, but it's at worst 50/50 somebody is gonna get the victory (The non overtime variety.)

My hate of 2fort is that nobody ever wins. Even if it was one round up to 3... I could be more tolerant. But it's 4 captures for one point, and you need 3 points? So a team needs 12 captures for the victory. The server always changes before you get to that point (And very few people would wanna play 3 hours to otherwise achieve map change and winner/loser.)
Click to expand...

No, not on the gaf server (I never catch it running there). Why is it four captures for a win? I thought the default was three. I don't know how much control the server has over things like that, but maybe the capture/win limits could be adjusted.

Personally I find Hydro the worst of them all. It stalemates probably 90% of the time I play it on any server.
 
C

Cheeto

Member
Richardfun said:
Even with decent coordination, 2fort is just way too easy to defend, and therefore doomed to end in stalemate. Even if you run in over the bridge (or through the sewers) with a fair sized group (with at least one medic), the opposing team ought to have a sentry in the courtyard. If positioned correctly, the medic will need to use his ubercharge in order to have someone take it out.

After that, if you survive the sentry and the enemy's people, you go down into the intel room, where any team with half a clue will have another sentry right there in the intel room, maybe even two. Since you already used your uber, you'll get cut to pieces there, and if you do manage to get to the intel, the other team's people will have respawned and hunt you down, usually making it impossible to return the enemy intel to your base.
Click to expand...
There isn't a single spot on the map where a lone demoman or soldier can't take out a sentry.
 
J

Jacobi

Banned
Firestorm said:
so I guess that's how TF2 is supposed to look? I almost feel like getting a desktop again :(
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Come on guys, TF2 runs like that on my 2-year old.

The video is frightening. Although it is weird that the guy doesn't seem as good with the uzi

BTW I'll get a headset just for TF2, GAF I thought you should know ;)
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
Confidence Man said:
No, not on the gaf server (I never catch it running there). Why is it four captures for a win? I thought the default was three. I don't know how much control the server has over things like that, but maybe the capture/win limits could be adjusted.

Personally I find Hydro the worst of them all. It stalemates probably 90% of the time I play it on any server.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty certain it's first team to four captures wins a point. And you need 3 points for there to be a victor and map change.

Now it's been forever since I've seen that occur, so I have no idea if that was a server setting. Or whether it's been changed. I know that's what it used to be. And recently there have never been any winners and you're just killing time till the server changes maps.

WhatRuOn said:
There isn't a single spot on the map where a lone demoman or soldier can't take out a sentry.
Click to expand...

True. But you also have lots of soldier and pyros on defense doing short sweeps. So it's not like you can just be a lone wolf and slowly destroy a sentry. People will be flanking behind you every five seconds.

That's why if there were two legit entry points and the other team had to split their defense a little better, it wouldn't be so slow.
 
X

Xizk

Member
I think we should keep 2fort but change the settings. For example, get 1 capture to win the round, 3 rounds. I think it was the penny-arcade servers that do that and apparently it works well.
 
T

Twig

Banned
Richardfun said:
Keeping in mind the abovementioned scenario, you explain to me how you're supposed to win 2fort in the normally alotted time (not that I'm lobbying for longer playing time on 2fort, mind you).
Click to expand...
Two medics, two ubers! It can be done, and it's really not that hard to build up a couple ubers if you're willing to not rush out of the spawn area.

A good team has players that are willing to switch when the situation calls for it.

Hell, even if you don't have two medics, a good demoman can take out the sentries without an uber (though an uber definitely helps) as long as there's no one else shooting at him (or he has someone backing him up like... a medic).

It can be done!

(I still hate it though.)
 
I

Icy

Banned
Has anyone tried chain ubering?

heavy <-- Medic #1 <-- Medic #2.

I'm jsut wondering if anyone has hit uber on medic #2 and while medic #1 heals the hweavy is the uber goes all the way through? This will need some testing.
 
C

Confidence Man

Member
1-D_FTW said:
I'm pretty certain it's first team to four captures wins a point. And you need 3 points for there to be a victor and map change.

Now it's been forever since I've seen that occur, so I have no idea if that was a server setting. Or whether it's been changed. I know that's what it used to be. And recently there have never been any winners and you're just killing time till the server changes maps.
Click to expand...

The default number of captures is three, I don't know why it would be set to four (if you create a server and try the map alone it defaults to three).

And it's supposed to stalemate when the map time limit is reached. It shouldn't just go on forever until someone wins.

I forget the name of the server, but one of the 2fort-only ones I frequent has it set up like that.
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
Xizk said:
I think we should keep 2fort but change the settings. For example, get 1 capture to win the round, 3 rounds. I think it was the penny-arcade servers that do that and apparently it works well.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't have a problem with that. If you knew you were working towards some goal, it'd be a fun map.
 
F

firex

Member
They just need to revise it so there's a way to the intel without going past the main spawn area, possibly even adding an extra path directly to the intel room so a sentry spot that could defend all 3 exits is nearly impossible. I think 2fort is most fun when teams have the basic honor rule of "no sentries in the intel room" so picking up the intel is easier, but you can't enforce that.

Or they could just add some health powerups, that might fix nearly everything since the other issue beyond getting the intel is how easy it is to kill the runner.
 
R

Richardfun

Member
WhatRuOn said:
There isn't a single spot on the map where a lone demoman or soldier can't take out a sentry.
Click to expand...

Without a medic with them? And also with people from the other team running around, one engi repairing the sentry? For instance, if you put it in the courtyard, up the stairs, I dare you to take that out with 1 demoman or soldier. The exits you can come out of are so close to that ramp that the sentry will hit you in a split second.
 
F

firex

Member
I dunno, I play demo a LOT on 2fort just for the purpose of taking out a sentry. once you have 4-5 stickies around it, any sentry is toast. And it's pretty easy to get that many up there.
 
I

Icy

Banned
Confidence Man said:
The default number of captures is three, I don't know why it would be set to four (if you create a server and try the map alone it defaults to three).

And it's supposed to stalemate when the map time limit is reached. It shouldn't just go on forever until someone wins.

I forget the name of the server, but one of the 2fort-only ones I frequent has it set up like that.
Click to expand...

Only problem with that, is those settings affect all CTF maps.
 
R

Richardfun

Member
TheOneGuy said:
Two medics, two ubers! It can be done, and it's really not that hard to build up a couple ubers if you're willing to not rush out of the spawn area.

A good team has players that are willing to switch when the situation calls for it.

Hell, even if you don't have two medics, a good demoman can take out the sentries without an uber (though an uber definitely helps) as long as there's no one else shooting at him (or he has someone backing him up like... a medic).

It can be done!

(I still hate it though.)
Click to expand...

But there lies the problem exactly. The people playing on the NeoGAF server are, usually, not retarded and know what they're doing. Because All the roads lead to the same point in 2fort (the courtyard), their defenders just have to wander between the battlements and the courtyard to keep everyone out of there. You'd be a very lucky man if you ran out into the courtyard in 2fort and there was a sentry without additional units, and without an engi repairing it. They are always there, because it's the only place to be.
 
I

Icy

Banned
Richardfun said:
Without a medic with them? And also with people from the other team running around, one engi repairing the sentry? For instance, if you put it in the courtyard, up the stairs, I dare you to take that out with 1 demoman or soldier. The exits you can come out of are so close to that ramp that the sentry will hit you in a split second.
Click to expand...

Why no medic? Its called TEAM Fortress. The game was balanced for all classes to be used and abused. I've got into Intel rooms as a heavy with no problem with 1-2 SGs.
 
R

Richardfun

Member
Icy said:
Why no medic? Its called TEAM Fortress. The game was balanced for all classes to be used and abused. I've got into Intel rooms as a heavy with no problem with 1-2 SGs.
Click to expand...

I was just responding to his claim that there isn't a single place on 2fort where a sentry can't be taken out by a lone demoman or soldier. Just don't think that's true :D
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
Cause the medic is high priority and likely to be dead.

I know when I do my five second sweeps around the chokepoint, I wait for the offense & medic to pass. Then I drop behind and kill the medic. And there's usually at least 2 -3 soldier and pyros sweeping the area for that.
 
R

Richardfun

Member
1-D_FTW said:
Cause the medic is high priority and likely to be dead.

I know when I do my five second sweeps around the chokepoint, I wait for the offense & medic to pass. Then I drop behind and kill the medic. And there's usually at least 2 -3 soldier and pyros sweeping the area for that.
Click to expand...

Yup, it's damn hard to stay alive as a medic on 2fort :)
 
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