Bobby Roberts
Banned
Why would it need to be Citizen Kane? What about Citizen Kane applies? Do you think people who don't like Seth MacFarlane dislike him because he doesn't attempt grandiosity on the level of young Orson Welles?
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'Ted 2' dogged by claims of racism, sexism, homophobia and transphobia
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Why would it need to be Citizen Kane? What about Citizen Kane applies? Do you think people who don't like Seth MacFarlane dislike him because he doesn't attempt grandiosity on the level of young Orson Welles?
No, it isn't that. It's just that people desperate to seem relevant in these "changing times" are going after low hanging fruit that people won't bother to argue because, "well duh, it's the family guy guy, of course it's low brow; we'll still read your article though".
Imagine if people like this, on a week like this, decided to go after Trey Parker and Matt Stone specifically for The Book of Mormon.
Not that it really matters as the general masses have decided that Pitch Perfect is the height of comedy, vomit tubes being the end all be all of gaiety and levity. Ugh.
March of the Crabs
Member
Yes!
gutter_trash
Banned
Jerry Seinfeld also says the there are too many comedians nowadays who overuse profanity and filth to get a cheap laugh the lazy way
Silver Arrows
Banned
That's because Mike Judge is actually a good writer, and isn't willing to go for the bottom of the barrel cheap shots like Seth does.
kerotan_eater
Banned
"he uses his liberalness conservatively, to berate what he thinks is normal or safe or established in American culture. His tolerance is tinged with intolerance. "
Seems to be just what Family Guy is.
Seems to be just what Family Guy is.
I can't say I'm surprised after that red band trailer.
Or it could be because his "comedy" consists of shit like telling trans women that they're really men.
Or it could be because his "comedy" consists of shit like telling trans women that they're really men.
March of the Crabs
Member
Seth doesn't write either of them. American Dad is so much better than FG though that it's not even funny.
ryutaro's mama
Member
'100 Ways to Die In The Old West' was one that I watched on a 9 1/2 hour flight back from the UK.
I didn't laugh once.
I didn't laugh once.
it's not an issue on being able to take a joke, it's an issue of a very bad comedian delivering dumb bro jokes just to be offensive.
yup x1000
Mango The Magician
Banned
It's almost like it's a comedy or something. 
Well...let's not get crazy, the first couple seasons of King of the Hill were...dicey. And this is the man who did Beavis and Butthead.
The difference is, he evolved. I totally think MacFarlene could do the same if he wanted to, but I think he's having too much fun being the crass class clown in the TV industry because he's, somehow, managed to find a way to stay relevant in the field while most imitators and competition end up getting left at the roadside.
Family Guy is dreck. I stopped watching long before the dog ate the little child's feces. So I have no doubt Ted 2 is more of the same, only somehow less.
But the furor makes me wonder how a movie like Blazing Saddles, which was legitimately funny, would fare today.
Would it be shouted down?
But the furor makes me wonder how a movie like Blazing Saddles, which was legitimately funny, would fare today.
Would it be shouted down?
March of the Crabs
Member
excelsiorlef
Member
Why do so many people respond to criticism by saying well what do you expect?
Just because that's what's expected doesn't mean he can't be criticized.
I mean shit should we just let racists be racist because that's that we expected them to be?
Just because that's what's expected doesn't mean he can't be criticized.
I mean shit should we just let racists be racist because that's that we expected them to be?
I doubt it, Blazing Saddles was brilliant, and shouldn't even be in the same paragraph as Seth
Silver Arrows
Banned
Yeah, I won't disagree with the quality of KOTH swinging wildly in different directions. It still did in later episodes, look at any Peggy episode. Those were the epitome of boring.
Purple Cheeto
Member
If they weren't all racists as well they might feel this way.
People in this thread are referencing his body of work. I don't see anymore making definitive statements about this movie.
Also, it's always "PC culture" until the mockery is pointed upward at the majority/privileged class(then it's 'reverse racism' or 'misandry'). It's so easy to make jokes about brown/trans/gay people. Like someone said, it's low hanging fruit.
Also, it's always "PC culture" until the mockery is pointed upward at the majority/privileged class(then it's 'reverse racism' or 'misandry'). It's so easy to make jokes about brown/trans/gay people. Like someone said, it's low hanging fruit.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Are you saying the examples you read in the OP are legitimately funny and should be compared to Blazing Saddles?
Seems like another case of "if it were funnier, it would've been fine." I'm not particularly interested in seeing the film. The first one had a few laughs but this one doesn't inspire much hope. Seth had a decent run but he's let his shtick define him and he's becoming a parody of himself.
I think that there would be some some outrage over how often Bart gets called a nigger in that film, but he quickly overcomes that label and is practically anointed by the film's end.
The French Mistake scene, though? Yeah, that won't fly these days.
"PC Culture" and "Out Rage Culture" yelling is the laziest forms of argument today.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Nope. Ted 2 isn't being shouted down, either. Shouted *at* and shouted *down* are two completely different things.
But there's a lot of stuff currently airing, a lot of stuff that's come out on stage and in theaters, that does what Blazing Saddles did to varying degrees, that doesn't catch the shit MacFarlane's caught, and there are reasons for that, and most of them come down to MacFarlane's inability to deliver a punchline that doesn't aim for your shins instead of your chest or your chin.
It's basically a matter of how well satire can be applied and understood, and often, MacFarlane's idea of satire doesn't go any deeper than "see that weird thing that doesn't look or act like me? Isn't that weird? Let's poke at that for a second and then move on."
He's a 90s/early 2000s-era shock jock. That's all there really is to him, comedically. Every 15 minutes you could throw to a Nickelback song and a Disturbed cut followed by a credit commercial, before cutting back to the story with no harm done at all.
Silver Arrows
Banned
And yet it works so well, considering you have mouth breathers being the loudest when those are mentioned.
It's fine to say he's shit, and that the movie is shit (after seeing it), but I'm tired of the PC brigade saying stuff like "why is the movie about a cursing talking bear not actively doing its best to address the plight of racial and gender discrimination in the US?"
I just watched the first one again, and most of the "zingers" are just as bad as what's described here, at least for the homophobic side of things. Interesting to see how the climate of film criticism and social awareness has changed over the last few years. I don't remember the original catching almost any flak for its jokes, aside from a few blog posts. Most professional reviews seemed like they followed the "Oh, it's racist and homophobic, but it didn't really bother me" mindset, which today would be met with opposition. That movie didn't have race in the center of the film post-national-event directly related to the plot though, which makes me wonder if critical reception would be any better had they released it at a different time. Pitch Perfect 2 got similar criticism, and was a critical hit.
Being overly political correct just isn't funny. You can be witty, but that will only provoke a smirk. Most laughter comes from being offensive, blunt and over the top in one or another degree. Schadenfreude is real. I think nothing should be put onto a holy pedestal and you should be able to make jokes about everyone and everything. It's comedy, somebody will always be offended.
This is probably the most succinct description of Seth Mcfarlane I've ever heard.
double jump
you haven't lived until a random little kid ask you "how do you make love".
shocking.
I feel like this is the perfect example of "any press is good press".
I feel like this is the perfect example of "any press is good press".
FullMetalx117
Member
I think this is where Seinfield's plight of PC comes in
The issue it sounds like is that it is trying to address the plight of racial discrimination due to the very nature of the premise (Ted is considered not to be a person, thus losing all his rights and freedoms associated with being a human, and sets out to fight for his rights) and simply bungles it with ugly humor that undermines the social value it's trying to instill.
If Seth MacFarlane doesn't want to be held to the standards of making a film about the plight of race in the US, then why the hell did he make a comedy about race in the US?
I mean, he doesn't even have an obligation to "address the plight," but he could also, you know, not be a fucking bigot at the same time. "Intolerant tolerance," as Morris put it, is such a great, succinct way to sum up Seth MacFarlane's so called liberalism.
"You're not a woman" isn't a joke.
There's a line in comedy (it's a lot further out than for real life, but it's still there) that you're not supposed to cross, and Seth did.
As much as people seem to be sure that such comedy would be immediately rejected or panned for being to inflammatory, we have to remember that Sasha Conen Doyle's movies are less than 10 years old, the hangover trilogy less than five, and we're just now coming off the controversy of The Interview. Shit, we had a hot tub time machine come out a few months ago. The crass comedy isn't' going anywhere.
I think the better question is, who would you trust to give you that comedy? We don't really have too many truly great comedy directors anymore. We can't rely on Mel Brooks to serve us forever, Trey Parker and Matt Stone will probably end up going down a different road of entertainment in the not too distant future, Zack Galafanakas seems just about as hit or miss as Seth Rogan movies post Zack and Miri, and as sad as it is, the world has pretty much spoken, both on the production and the viewing side, when it comes to the modern black comedy, regardless of who's directing...
And nobody saw it.
It's far more likely that we're going to run out of people who understand comedy, racial relations, and society well enough to make something that makes us laugh at something we know to be actually wrong than dumb easy joke comedies going away. We should probably be more worried about that then whether or not Ted 2 will be any good.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
This criticism doesn't really work in general, but it really doesn't work in the context of the actual plot of Ted 2
Exactly. The title alone had people losing their minds.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
This is a pretty good counter-example.
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