Master Thespian
Member
I've stated it about 100 times but until they make movement accessible, Tekken will continue to lose players.
Mist stance. ;_;
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Tekken Tag Tournament 2 |OT| Awaiting the "Final Battle"
- Thread starter AAK
- Start date
NinthPixel
Member
Invincible moves are the only way Tekken can have many characters and moves, and still be accessible. If you watched the videos I linked. You would understand that TR's invincible move is like the COD noobtube.
The invincible move allows someone to not be outright beat by something because the right response is not clear (10 hits, Hwoarang kick mashing, etc). If you watch even the worst of players in TR. Instead of mindlessly mashing, they are learning to make a strategy work for them with invincibles. It is introducing them to the fact that this is not rock'em sock'em robots. There are strategies to achieve victory. It makes me sick to my stomach that the majority do not see how brilliant this addition is.
Tekken started to fall flat when the only thing that most recent installments had to give us was combos extenders. With such long combos they had to increase health. Therefore, pokes cannot stand on their own in TTT2. They HAVE to lead into a combo, and that is the only unfortunate strategy in TTT2. To find a way to hit a launcher and that's it. Namco even realized this and increased the percentage in standing hits in the Unlimited update, but it is still not high enough to compete with combo damage which is nearing single combo KO range with some teams.
Tekken Revolution as a fight system is the best Tekken in my opinion. Even the backroll system has merits, because it is buzz-kill for new players to be picked up for such simple ignorance. It isnt like you cannot hurt people bad for backrolling, but you have to commit to it. Rather than practically "option selecting" a free combo for a simple mistake that even the best in the world do from time to time.
But anyways, that is how I view things.
The invincible move allows someone to not be outright beat by something because the right response is not clear (10 hits, Hwoarang kick mashing, etc). If you watch even the worst of players in TR. Instead of mindlessly mashing, they are learning to make a strategy work for them with invincibles. It is introducing them to the fact that this is not rock'em sock'em robots. There are strategies to achieve victory. It makes me sick to my stomach that the majority do not see how brilliant this addition is.
Tekken started to fall flat when the only thing that most recent installments had to give us was combos extenders. With such long combos they had to increase health. Therefore, pokes cannot stand on their own in TTT2. They HAVE to lead into a combo, and that is the only unfortunate strategy in TTT2. To find a way to hit a launcher and that's it. Namco even realized this and increased the percentage in standing hits in the Unlimited update, but it is still not high enough to compete with combo damage which is nearing single combo KO range with some teams.
Tekken Revolution as a fight system is the best Tekken in my opinion. Even the backroll system has merits, because it is buzz-kill for new players to be picked up for such simple ignorance. It isnt like you cannot hurt people bad for backrolling, but you have to commit to it. Rather than practically "option selecting" a free combo for a simple mistake that even the best in the world do from time to time.
But anyways, that is how I view things.
nailbombxx
Member
I see no problem with Tekken being as complicated as it is. It is now a more niche fighter than it once was, but if thats the product of its complexity, fine with me.
MikeBreezy92
Member
But then you run into the problem we have now with Tekken. No new players that go out to tournaments and games that don't particularly sell well. I don't mind TTT2 as is but I know its not good for the future of Tekken.
I agree with you on nearly every point (kudos to linking Extra Credits videos earlier btw), except for your claims about pokes in Tag 2. For sure, you ideally want to go for the combo, but when you combine the boosted poke damage along with rage, poke damage becomes just as insane. Outside of rage though, I agree that the typical fishing for launchers into absurd damage is the way to go.
Also, if you are implying that poke damage was better in DR, I would argue that poking was just as dangerous. In DR, not only did you have to deal with the crush system for your low pokes (keep in mind that hopkicks were -12 in DR and most characters didn't have strong i11 or i12 punishers like they do now back then), but low parries also granted full juggle damage. Simply put, outside of a few characters in some of the games, poking has been relatively weak compared to combo damage in Tekken for a VERY long time now.
Everyone that was playing even remotely competently during 5.0 remembers how dumb it was. 5.1 toned down the juggle damage and absurd tech oki, but you were still able to score 40% - 50% juggle damage easily without walls with nearly the whole cast. DR pretty much maintained the status quo of 5.1 as far as general mechanics go, but adjusted the balance of the cast. All of these versions of the game had that "guess right 2 - 3 times and you win" factor, and it didn't even need a netsu, or bound mechanic to pull that off.
When it comes to Tag 2, the added damage across the board is the real problem. Bound added damage to juggles to a big chunk of the cast in comparison to DR when it was introduced in T6. When you add tag assault to make juggle damage even more absurd, increase poke damage, and bring back netsu to make both poke damage and solo combo damage over the top, you have officially made the damage bubble of Tekken burst.
So that's my stance on it. I've been very vocal in here before about giving most of TR's mechanics (sans the incredibly stupid stat and critical arts systems) a fair shake, but a bunch of people just seem to hate change. When pressed about it, they kind of start to talk in circles. It comes more as old man syndrome instead of legitimate gripes to me really. I just really have my fingers crossed for some drastic changes for whatever the next Tekken game is. I don't care if it risks us ending up with another Tekken 4. It's time for this series to evolve in another direction.
NinthPixel
Member
I can agree, ManBig. I think I just feel that way about pokes because my main is Xiaoyu, and she feels like a top tier in TR compared to TTT2. So, I definitely have a bias.
It's good that you're here, because some people just love bringing Ling up as an example of a character that supposedly can't maintain offense in TR due to invincible moves. I know very little about that character, but still think (from experience of fighting against her) that the notion that she can't maintain offense in TR is BS. You can do a much better job shedding light on that subject than I can.
I think the hardcore, dedicated tournament-going fans already bought the game. The sales are low because TTT2 didn't tract well with the casuals. Tournament-goers are a very small minority as far as sales go.
I kind of disagree here too. I would say even after a year and half of release, TTT2 is still not fully explored. There are still new things I'm learning on a consistent basis and there are STILL team combinations that have I yet to see fully explored. I don't see TTT2 not having longevity.
This may be true for the US scene but TTT2 held a lot of success in Japan and Korea. We are on our third Master Cup. There was the Global Championships. And we had various TV iterations for TTT2, which no other fighter has had (i.e. Tekken Strike). I wouldn't say there's a problem with the game, I would say there's a problem with the scene. Some people just want things spoonfed to them.
Or this can be the nice compromising opinion to have.
Cosmic Forge
Member
Lol, I didn't want to just come out and say it like that, because feelings tend to get hurt over this stuff. But yeah, it's starting to look like a lose-lose scenario with Tekken's future.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
I honestly think the new era of gaming(shoot!! Shoot!, bang, bang, boom!!!!!, etc) is mostly what damaged the popularity of Tekken and other fighting games. I do not think dumbing down or streamlining the next Tekken release will automatically send gamers flocking to it like bees to honey or is a resolution to the problem. Fighting games unfortunately seem like they are becoming a niche genre once again and I think the sales for each are indicative of that. TTT2 sales were definitely admirable for a fighting game, but it's the lowest selling Tekken of all time which is a travesty because of all of the unprecedented effort, content and time that went into the game. Namco imo really gave true Tekken fans the definitive Tekken experience with TTT2. Tekken is, has and will most likely be popular with the hardcore crowd but sadly, the game just didn't appeal to casuals or was labeled as too complicated and the fact that shooters, sports and other genres dominate all and they have more accessibility. Casuals to my knowledge like fast, easy access to games, flashiness and even handholding. If a game is too complex or requires some or substantial effort, there is a chance they will drop it and move on. Nothing wrong with that, but that is reality. Honestly, I think introducing the tag team mechanics also turned off some gamers. Heh, I know some people who went back to Tekken 6 or Revolution because of them. I think if Tekken 7 went back to the one vs one mechanics, it could bring back some fans. I thought they were overwhelming at first, but ended up really liking them and getting fairly accustomed to them quick.
Also, another potential scenario is some Tekken fans have moved on and play other types of games that require less commitment and time. Tekken has been out for approximately 20 years, right? I've been playing Tekken since Tekken 1 in the arcades and I am still playing it today. Most people I converse with say, I use to play Tekken back in the day when Tekken 3 or Tekken 5 was popular. There is a new Tekken game? Oh, ok. I didn't know. I just play COD and Fifa now. Not really into fighters anymore or they think their reflexes aren't what they used to be.
I think Tekken Revolution was actually a good idea for the casual Tekken/fighting game fans and for a more laid back experience, but I do not want them tampering with traditional Tekken where it loses it's identity and depth. They could potentially lose their diehard fanbase in trying to appeal to people who do not care for fighters in the first place. I say leave Tekken complicated....er...deep and let the fans decide if they still want to play and invest time with the franchise and let the others play Tekken Revolution 2 or whatever. Going back to 1 vs 1 mechanics will probably cut down on some of the complications, so that could be a start.
This is of course, only my opinion.
Also, another potential scenario is some Tekken fans have moved on and play other types of games that require less commitment and time. Tekken has been out for approximately 20 years, right? I've been playing Tekken since Tekken 1 in the arcades and I am still playing it today. Most people I converse with say, I use to play Tekken back in the day when Tekken 3 or Tekken 5 was popular. There is a new Tekken game? Oh, ok. I didn't know. I just play COD and Fifa now. Not really into fighters anymore or they think their reflexes aren't what they used to be.
I think Tekken Revolution was actually a good idea for the casual Tekken/fighting game fans and for a more laid back experience, but I do not want them tampering with traditional Tekken where it loses it's identity and depth. They could potentially lose their diehard fanbase in trying to appeal to people who do not care for fighters in the first place. I say leave Tekken complicated....er...deep and let the fans decide if they still want to play and invest time with the franchise and let the others play Tekken Revolution 2 or whatever. Going back to 1 vs 1 mechanics will probably cut down on some of the complications, so that could be a start.
This is of course, only my opinion.
MikeBreezy92
Member
Casuals don't like Tekken because its the same game and its hard to get into. I am more concerned about Tournament players.
Seems more anecdotal than actual proof that the game hasn't reached Marvel 3 status when it comes to discovery. You may just be learning new thing but most of the stuff you've learned as I've been finding out recently is already out there.
Gaming is always bigger in Asian countries so I really don't give it much attention. When almost every game is getting tournaments niche or not, its very hard to just say "Oh its doing well cuz its got this and this." The Global Championship was a farce because it was arcade only. While it was a dope tournament since we got no European play, it really wasn't global, just Asian countries, Australia, and the US.
Also to what I bolded, there's fine line there. Some things should be spoon fed . something shouldn't.
Generally speaking, I just don't like blaming outside things when there are internal issues that can be worked out. Because while those external issues can end up not really mattering in the end, the internals can stay hidden and still affect things.
Just to add though... Its a rare to find a competitive BB/GG/Anime player in the Philippines, almost everyone was casual, DOA is the same. People learned to play other games because there's too many people on the Tekken cab. And most right now are playing Tekken/SF/Marvel. So, yeah, it's wrong to really assume games will always be played competitively still in Asia mike. Especially in a economy striken place like my country that pretty much "discourage" gaming as a expensive hobby.
MikeBreezy92
Member
DEATH;105715454 said:
I wasn't speaking specifically though...I was just saying Asia in general tends to play more games. I know some areas may play not play everything like you've said. Koreans don't really dabble in SF and would rather play KOF or Tekken for example.
They do play "more" games because they are exposed to people playing games. Internet Cafes and Arcades are kida like the regular bar in Asia in terms of accessibility, and for a asian collectivist culture, when I see nice normal people playing games, there will be a possibility for me to try it out.
But it speaks though why many of these countries STILL play Tekken. It just speaks. This is why I was saying there is nothing wrong with the game. The real problemI Is noobs in the west actually trying out the game, when the cool thing is to play capcom games... People who legit tried loved the game or at worst, gave mad respect to the game.
This reminds me of Juicebox's rant...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udldIh7CNUs
Whether you like him or not, he brings up legit point. The thing too is that little bit of decline in Marvel and suddenly, Tekken picks up now to people...
Terareflection
Member
Tekken's less popular because it has other fighters to compete with now.
MikeBreezy92
Member
Same could be said when it was popular back when FGs were "dead" in the early 00's. Only Capcom really didn't put out any FGs everything else was Tekken, GG, KOF, Soul Calibur, DOA, VF, and other stuffs.
I wouldn't necessarily say casuals don't like Tekken. Up until TTT2, each Tekken entry was selling over 3 million. Tekken is pretty much still a household name.
I don't think it's anecdotal. You have everything right in front of you. The discovery period in TTT2 is hardly comparable to UMvC3.
How often do you see teams like Anna/Heihachi, Roger/Paul, Dragunov/Kuma. There are so many potential team combinations and I don't think a lot of these teams have been fully explored yet. Hell, I've never seen anyone competitively use Anna's f,f+3,4,3 into CAT stance into qcf+2,1 in a tag assault and that is a legitimately good tag assault option.
And just from this year's final round, you had this stuff.
Not necessarily. Not every fighting game thrives in Asia. UMvC3 being one of the prime examples of a game that has a huge scene in America but is lacking in Korea and Japan.
You've posted similar opinions in the past and I am in large agreement.
I don't want to sound all high and mighty but this past generation of gamers has helped proliferate the worst trends (i.e. Call of Duty clones). And they keep selling too. These trend also led many reputable franchises to tarnish their names chasing after that mainstream money (looking at you Resident Evil). In that respect, I'm glad TTT2 stayed true to its roots.
NinthPixel
Member
ManBig, it definitely irritates me how much people theory fight Tekken Revolution. Invincibles simply add another layer to the mind game. Every character released has been largely unaffected.
TR Hwoarang players are the biggest babies about it, but most of his common custom kick strings interrupt invincibles. If you get invincibled playing Hwoarang, then thank your lucky stars that you only suffered 30 damage instead of a sidestep launcher. I have two PS3's and tested it, so don't even start with me Hwoarang players.
Sayah, TTT2 is like UMVC3 in that room for exploration is much, but only a small portion is gold. You will never see a respectable tournament won by a Xiaoyu/Doctor B team, and that holds true with most of the team combinations. Teams have ruined the idea that you can never lose from Tekken's character select screen. My previous Tekken's (&TR) playing Xiaoyu in the good old ATL has taught me that I can win if I train hard enough. TTT2 doesn't give me that same encouragement. You play a strong team or you sit down and not play.
TR Hwoarang players are the biggest babies about it, but most of his common custom kick strings interrupt invincibles. If you get invincibled playing Hwoarang, then thank your lucky stars that you only suffered 30 damage instead of a sidestep launcher. I have two PS3's and tested it, so don't even start with me Hwoarang players.
Sayah, TTT2 is like UMVC3 in that room for exploration is much, but only a small portion is gold. You will never see a respectable tournament won by a Xiaoyu/Doctor B team, and that holds true with most of the team combinations. Teams have ruined the idea that you can never lose from Tekken's character select screen. My previous Tekken's (&TR) playing Xiaoyu in the good old ATL has taught me that I can win if I train hard enough. TTT2 doesn't give me that same encouragement. You play a strong team or you sit down and not play.
nailbombxx
Member
Unlike Marvel, however, you do not see the same characters in 90% of teams (Doom, Vergil, etc.) There is a much bigger reservoir of a viable teams.
Cosmic Forge
Member
I don't think invincibles add a layer to Tekken. They replace layers, so it's more like "lateral (or sideways) progress", if that's the right term for it. It's no better than giving all characters an identical parry or reversal. It may be a "stepping stone tool" for beginners, but in the end, it's a poor replacement for conventional "Yomi". It's effective at super low levels, creates a ton of turtling at the mid level, then becomes mostly obsolete at high level, when a solid read is just better suited with a launcher/crush/sidestep anyway.
Despite this, I think TR is a necessary evil. At this point, I'm almost hoping that Tekken forks off into two separate roads. One for the oldschool/hardcore crowd, and one for the new guys. The only way to keep this from happening is MAYBE a single game that has various modes, so that a separate metagame can form based on players preferences. Kinda like how there's a solo option in Tag, but also for handling stuff like bounds, invincibles, etc.
Online and VS could have customizable lobbies that allow the makers to set universal ground rules that toggle these features on/off to their liking. Then, like minded players could join up. Tournaments then could follow suit based on what emerges as the popular trend.
/opinions
Despite this, I think TR is a necessary evil. At this point, I'm almost hoping that Tekken forks off into two separate roads. One for the oldschool/hardcore crowd, and one for the new guys. The only way to keep this from happening is MAYBE a single game that has various modes, so that a separate metagame can form based on players preferences. Kinda like how there's a solo option in Tag, but also for handling stuff like bounds, invincibles, etc.
Online and VS could have customizable lobbies that allow the makers to set universal ground rules that toggle these features on/off to their liking. Then, like minded players could join up. Tournaments then could follow suit based on what emerges as the popular trend.
/opinions
I'm no pro at Tekken, so this is no opinion based on in depth analysis or anything, but I find Tekken Revolution to be pretty annoying. There was no one of my charakters as a starter, but no problem, I just learned how to play Kazuya and Kaz+Hei became one of my favourite teams in TTT2, so there's actually a positive side to it 
I played up to Fighter-rank and up to this point, nearly all fights were the same. My opponent walks back, waits for me to dash in or run towards him and then he uses an invincible move. If he uses Law db+4 is his weapon for everything. Okay, it's understandable if such things happen in the Kyu-ranks (they don't even exist in TR), but I quit after a Berserker tried this shit and never played it again.
And yeah, the cel-shaded outlines are ugly and the power-ups are annoying.
I played up to Fighter-rank and up to this point, nearly all fights were the same. My opponent walks back, waits for me to dash in or run towards him and then he uses an invincible move. If he uses Law db+4 is his weapon for everything. Okay, it's understandable if such things happen in the Kyu-ranks (they don't even exist in TR), but I quit after a Berserker tried this shit and never played it again.
And yeah, the cel-shaded outlines are ugly and the power-ups are annoying.
GrayFoxPL
Member
"Annoying" is pretty much perfect word to sum up Revolution with it's 200 power 4 hit ko, invincible noob tube or dumbed down wake up. I stand by what I said Revolution will not teach any new player how to play Tekken, but spew a slew of Tekken morons who'll be helpless in a real game, for sole reason that playing like a moron will get you destroyed in eg. Tag2. Then you learn, stop playing stupid and become a real player.
In Revo you can get far by just being dumb. So what a poor dude comming from Revolution to eg T6/Tag2 can do under heavy mixup preassure ? Did Revolution teach him to try to backdash, sidestep, low parry? To even look and understand what the opponent is doing? Any kind of awareness? No because mash invincible to escape mix up - that's what he knows.
Changes are needed but let's not encourage stupidity and lazyness by dumbing down fundamentals.
In Revo you can get far by just being dumb. So what a poor dude comming from Revolution to eg T6/Tag2 can do under heavy mixup preassure ? Did Revolution teach him to try to backdash, sidestep, low parry? To even look and understand what the opponent is doing? Any kind of awareness? No because mash invincible to escape mix up - that's what he knows.
Changes are needed but let's not encourage stupidity and lazyness by dumbing down fundamentals.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Honestly, it makes me dread the future of gaming. It's depressing to see so many Japanese franchises stay genuine to their roots and then get buried under the weight of more popular games or trends. Then developers think emulating Western games or "trying" to appeal more to outside regions will easily rectify the issue only to find out that it is typically more detrimental than beneficial to the franchise. A lot of people keep asking, what is wrong with Tekken? What do we need to change? What will make it sell more? I just don't want Namco to cannibalize or significantly change Tekken for the worst just to appeal to casuals. I guess we will see what happens with the next installment.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
I'm no pro at Tekken, so this is no opinion based on in depth analysis or anything, but I find Tekken Revolution to be pretty annoying. There was no one of my charakters as a starter, but no problem, I just learned how to play Kazuya and Kaz+Hei became one of my favourite teams in TTT2, so there's actually a positive side to it
I played up to Fighter-rank and up to this point, nearly all fights were the same. My opponent walks back, waits for me to dash in or run towards him and then he uses an invincible move. If he uses Law db+4 is his weapon for everything. Okay, it's understandable if such things happen in the Kyu-ranks (they don't even exist in TR), but I quit after a Berserker tried this shit and never played it again.
And yeah, the cel-shaded outlines are ugly and the power-ups are annoying.
While, I do think TR was a good idea in concept to get more players to try out the franchise and for exposure for the Tekken brand, yes the game can be annoying. Yeah, lol so many matches do start out like the way you described. Walk back and wait and then let then invincibles over and over and over again with an occasional laser or throwing!!!! So many players love to shamelessly spam invincibles and rely on 3 to 4 moves. The leveling/powering up seems like fun on paper, but it can literally break the game when fairly inexperienced Paul, KING or Kazuya players can decimate you in 4 hits. Well, at least it can be turned off. As you stated, new players do not understand the fundamentals for the games and end up getting obliterated in Tekken 6, Tekken 5, TTT2, etc and wonder why. Also, I really detest the coin system and the unlockables take an eternity to unlock. I think TR can be a fun diversion, but I hope it doesn't replace regular Tekken with stripped down fundamentals.
NinthPixel
Member
Walk back invincible is far less annoying than a wall tag hopkick. The former can be countered, the latter is just a matter of when TTT2 will give you a strange wall splat that you are not ready for.
This high horse mentality that those of us that don't like TTT2 are just weak has to stop. When someone who loves Tekken as much as Pokchop does and he says he is tempted to quit TTT2. Something is wrong, end of story.
This high horse mentality that those of us that don't like TTT2 are just weak has to stop. When someone who loves Tekken as much as Pokchop does and he says he is tempted to quit TTT2. Something is wrong, end of story.
I would argue that TTT2 has a lot more room for exploration in contrast to UMvC3. In UMvC3, not all teams are viable and pretty much everyone has some top tier player in their team. UMvC3 has certain characters that are too good, other characters that are too bad, some that work better on point, others that work better as anchors, etc. In contrast, literally any team composition can work in Tekken and you don't have to discount a character just because they're not "fit" for the team or the team composition.
And eeer, we've had b-tier characters like Kuma/Panda destroy players in tournaments. And there was also a Dr. B player that obliterated a lot of the competition in one of the international tournaments (can't remember the name). We even have people like Kane using Angel and doing really well in tournaments. To make the argument that lower tier characters have no chance in a "respectable" tournament would be false.
I don't mind Tekken Revolution and yeah, it has helped bring in more players into Tekken.
They really need good in-game tutorials imo instead of dumb-ing down.
MikeBreezy92
Member
This didn't surprise me one bit, I could tell he didn't like the game before he actually said it.
I don't like the Marvel 3 comparison at all because really...they are in no way similar...
Dumbing down is a bad thing.
And how is that wack ass easily punishable strategy annoying...that sounds like free wins to me.
GrayFoxPL
Member
MikeBreezy92
Member
DEATH;106001510 said:
I don't what RIB has to do with anything but yeah I can see how that's a problem. Some people can't play two characters. I doubt that his only reason lol.
So who wants to get bodied by the best Baek in the US? lol
As far as TTT2 goes, I can personally attest that I'm in a minority. I'm one of those people that don't have much of a social life and just plays games all day.... and TTT2 was meant for me. I play, watch, and read about Tekken in my spare time. Hence this game was made for me. I stopped watching movies, listening to licensed music, eating outdoors, and many other things just so I can save to travel for tournaments.
And every successive tournament I go to I see fewer and fewer people playing. Even in my local community the few guys who would call me up to play a few games don't do so anymore.
I personally think TTT2 isn't just the best Tekken, but probably the greatest piece of software entertainment I've ever experienced and I KNOW that whatever changes Namco will do for the next game there's less than a percent chance it'll eclipse the brilliance of TTT2. I suppose people don't have the same mentality or lifestyle I do and hence can't enjoy TTT2 as much as I have.
Not today man, but soon! But you still have to claim the best Baek in USA title from Protege!
BTW NinthPixel, I think you're selling your character short in TTT2. I definitely believe any character or any team is viable in this game. For example, check out this deathmatch between Yuuyuu and Matador. Yuuyuu uses probably the lowest damage team in the game with Xiaoyu and Zafina and yet she still manages to hold her own against one of the top 10 players in Japan.
Starts here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CF3MDp9WdHM&t=1h43m30s
Continues here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ogYjRSuVC8
Also, missed your post from the TR thread, yeah GG's. You destroyed me haha. I dunno why I kept getting disconnected. I don't get that many disconnects in TTT2. Also, everytime we got a disconnect it was a free coin... everytime I lost, it was premium coin LOL. lost like 15 premium tickets that day haha. I think I should finally buy my main character anyway.
And every successive tournament I go to I see fewer and fewer people playing. Even in my local community the few guys who would call me up to play a few games don't do so anymore.
I personally think TTT2 isn't just the best Tekken, but probably the greatest piece of software entertainment I've ever experienced and I KNOW that whatever changes Namco will do for the next game there's less than a percent chance it'll eclipse the brilliance of TTT2. I suppose people don't have the same mentality or lifestyle I do and hence can't enjoy TTT2 as much as I have.
Not today man, but soon! But you still have to claim the best Baek in USA title from Protege!
BTW NinthPixel, I think you're selling your character short in TTT2. I definitely believe any character or any team is viable in this game. For example, check out this deathmatch between Yuuyuu and Matador. Yuuyuu uses probably the lowest damage team in the game with Xiaoyu and Zafina and yet she still manages to hold her own against one of the top 10 players in Japan.
Starts here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CF3MDp9WdHM&t=1h43m30s
Continues here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ogYjRSuVC8
Also, missed your post from the TR thread, yeah GG's. You destroyed me haha. I dunno why I kept getting disconnected. I don't get that many disconnects in TTT2. Also, everytime we got a disconnect it was a free coin... everytime I lost, it was premium coin LOL. lost like 15 premium tickets that day haha. I think I should finally buy my main character anyway.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGqrb2Vxbks
That explains all...
The thing is, most vets hate the game because unlike the previous games, you can't just move around and win. It's been said by alot of people, including Aris, that unlike the previous games, TTT2 is not a game where they can sleepwalk out of pools. They have to treat other players as threats, which in hindsight, is good, since it means a newer player can stand a chance. This is where the hoopla of FT2 vs FT3 sets come from.
In a sense, it's understandable for vets to have this frustration, especially when one of the new guns is RunitBlack lol. The problem is, vets like these are alot of say if people will play the game, even when TTT2 can be argued as having way more easier time breaking through and have success in a newbie standpoint.
MikeBreezy92
Member
I was there lol. I'm just saying PokChop getting mad at RIB was due to reasons outside of the actual game.
MikeBreezy92
Member
They've been saying that for awhile now. I think JDCR said it on a interview around release.
MikeBreezy92
Member
The next game may not be something you like, but if you enjoy TTT2 good on ya. I wuv it too.
FormallyFamicom
Member
Yeah I feel like I'm in a good spot, being my first Tekken I can enjoy the game, but I haven't grown so heavily attached to the franchise that potentially radical changes would turn me away.
Then again a big reason I still play it is because a lot of other people still do, so I hope that continues to be the case.
Then again a big reason I still play it is because a lot of other people still do, so I hope that continues to be the case.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
I honestly think the tag mechanics are what scare people off the most. Also, having to proficiently learn 2 characters probably isn't helping matters either. Tekken 5 and Tekken 6 were relatively tough to learn as well, but I definitely hear the most complaints about TTT2 for new players and even some experienced players. Yeah, that detailed tutorial is desperately needed. DOA5: Ultimate and Persona 4: Arena has detailed tutorials to name a few. TTT2 could use it. Might be a little hard to implement in the arcade version though.
A friend of mine began playing Tekken again with Tag 2 (the last Tekken game he played was Tekken 3 as a kid) and he became a Berserker without knowing any real Single or Tag combo. He just doesn't learn them. His main team is Hwo + Steve (same as mine). He relies on his reflexes, pressure and punish reaction and it works out for him, which is pretty cool in my opinion.
Playing just one character is pretty boring to me, so my only problem when starting to play TTT2 was arranging my teams. Hwoarang + Steve was pretty obvious to me, but Xiao, Lee, Jin, Eddy and Law were a problem in the beginning. Trying to find my perfect teams was something new and exciting to me. That's why I also think that TTT2 is the best Tekken to this day. The only thing that bothers me a bit is that Tag combos are way too long and strong. 90+ damage with one combo seems a bit too much to me^^
Playing just one character is pretty boring to me, so my only problem when starting to play TTT2 was arranging my teams. Hwoarang + Steve was pretty obvious to me, but Xiao, Lee, Jin, Eddy and Law were a problem in the beginning. Trying to find my perfect teams was something new and exciting to me. That's why I also think that TTT2 is the best Tekken to this day. The only thing that bothers me a bit is that Tag combos are way too long and strong. 90+ damage with one combo seems a bit too much to me^^
GrayFoxPL
Member
Berseker? I'd like to play against him.
I'm currently playing Steve+Kaz but it's a difficult team in terms of tag combos. With kaz you usually go for cd+3 to end combos, but if you go for decent tag filler with Steve, then you can't go for cd+3 with Kaz. It's all custom combos that are easy to drop online. Very strict and goes to hell on off axis opponent.
Good damage on tag buffering though.
That's the problem with teams - you find 2 characters that you like, put them together and it doesn't work out like you imagined. When I put together Bryan and Hei, their every combo exceeded 100 easily. Devastating team. But I just don't want to play Bryan + Heihachi.
He's a Marauder or Fighter currently, but he was Berserker for a long time and was aiming for Warrior. It's funny how one has to play everyday to stay "in shape". Pause for a week and you'll play like a noob. It's like real life, actually
I'll open a lobby next time you're both Online. I tell him to practice until then
Steve has decent fillers, but the follow-up is really hard. I always play it safe and just go for f3,2,f3,1.
Bryan himself is a devastating character. I played against a Bryan+Bruce Team and the combo damage was insane.