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Television Displays and Technology Thread: This is a fantasy based on OLED
- Thread starter BumRush
- Start date
holygeesus
Banned
I'm not sure what that last sentence means? All I know, is there are people on the AVSForum, who are buying this Sony OLED, despite slating the LG 2016 models for their lack of brightness with HDR. It's strange what brand loyalty does to people.
I got my C6 2 weeks ago and the curve is really subtle. Doesn't bother me at all. I also have mine in the living room and had to put against a wall adjacent to a large window. Actually thinking about getting the LG specific wall mount after I have some time in this position. (Currently updating the living room)
In the daylight with the blinds open, bright room setting works for me. (bright enough for watching)
Best TV I've ever had tho. Got my 55" at $1100 shipped after PP. Just wish I could've gotten the 65", but I felt like it was just more money than I wanted to spend for my first OLED.
Metalstrike
Member
Z_Y
Member
Yep. The P series is one the better reviewed TVs in that size on rtings.
Power regulation because of EU and California laws. Nothing else.
Shit Panasonic was able to engineer a 58" 4K Plasma TV with an absurd light output. Avjunkie (Panasonic engineer) from Hdforums said that they were actually investing into the technology but difficult manufacturing and the 2010 EU law changes for power consumption killed it. IRC he said its power consumption was in the neighborhood of 600W. Absurd for a 58" TV of course.
I don't agree with people saying lifespan as it is actually less of a concern. LG's 2016 OLED lifespan is rated as 100.000 hours at which point they have lost half their initial brightness (which would probably still be bright enough in a darker viewing environment). That's like 30 years if you run the TV 10 hours a day. Most LCD's with backlighting are actually lower rated with 60-70.000 hours. Even then other parts will fail before that or the TV will be so obsolete that you throw it on the scrap yard anyway.
2013 OLED's were rated ~30.000 hours I believe and even that is an absurdly high number where other parts of the TV will surely fail.
holygeesus
Banned
I think it would be crazy to buy a C7 when you can get a B6 for half the price, judging by that review alone. Uniformity is worse on this years models? Wow.
Not sure how you're coming to that conclusion.
They look slightly better but it's hard to judge when panel lottery is a thing.
vpance
Member
So nothing we didn't already know. And recommended to buy a B6, of course. With it being able to be had for a little over $1000 it's a no brainer.
No commentary on dirty black/level improvements, so kind of a useless review. Though I think by most user impressions is that it's been fixed.
I mean the finer 0.5 steps in the brightness control alone is huge for near black detail.
Also look at that 50% window. Damn. I don't get why they don't put up numbers for 75% also. Far more real world content is in that range instead of the stupid peak brightness which always makes OLED look bad.
Metalingus5150
Member
Is dirty screen effect a thing even on OLED?
DOT DASH DOT
Member
And therein lies the issue with OLED, it's going to take them years, if at all before they are able to hit high peak brightnesses for HDR. OLED has mastered SDR, but this is gonna be the 1 area that's gonna hold it back.
Beer Monkey
Member
Local dimming on non-OLED sets is a far greater current problem to my eyes.
holygeesus
Banned
If one feels confident enough, the same can be achieved by entering the service menu on the 2016 models and adjusting in there. There is a big thread on AVS forums that goes into detail. You can draw out a lot more shadow detail and make more incremental steps to eliminate the nasties associated with said detail. It works very well.
Not sure how you're coming to that conclusion.
They look slightly better but it's hard to judge when panel lottery is a thing.
That was based entirely on the Rtings review where they say that very thing. You are right though, it is still a lottery but surely improvements were expected in this regard?
demosthenes
Member
Can you consistently get one for tgat price though? I've checked local best buy stores and they still have them 2k+
Has the b6 input lag been improved?
holygeesus
Banned
Yes it's 28ms in Game and HDR Game modes, for both 1080p and 2160p material. 4k 4:4:4 material is still laggy, which is where the 7-range offers a big improvement - 21ms
Actually, me comparing the uniformity of the 2017 and 2016 LG OLEDs makes no sense anyway as they are all using the same panels, as are all the 2017 models, including Sony. Of course uniformity is going to be as hit & miss on each.
Sorry, mine was selfishly UK only. Currently John Lewis have the C7 for £3000 and B6 for £1700 but it drops to 1500 on occasion. I just don't think it's worth the extra, but I say that as someone who hasn't seen the 7-range in action. The C7 owner in here seems very happy with it.
Solid Shammy
Banned
OLED's definitely have uniformity flaws, but the specific banding that plagues them look very different from standard LED defects that cause the DSE look. My friend and I both bought a C6, both panels have a vertical band right in the centre of the screen that show up brighter the scene (even pure whites), and my panel has noticeable banding all over the right side of the screen in darker scenes. My friends set has a really, really, noticeable vertical band left to the centre almost always present when looking at just about any blue scene, and he also suffers from yellow tinting with a few dead pixels in the centre. I guess I got the better panel, but I'm a bit upset by the banding, I'm really sensitive to uniformity flaws, and that's my real only criticism that holds me back from truly enjoying my TV. Forever looking for the perfect TV.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
This is the one with no speakers with vibrating screen right? I thought it will be out in summer.
TheBoss1
Member
Yeah that's the one. You can actually order (not pre-order) it on Amazon and other online retailers right now.
DOT DASH DOT
Member
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
LG C7 review.
The minimal size is 55 inches too.
All sizes below 55 inches are officially discontinued for all TVs (high end at least) now confirmed.
The minimal size is 55 inches too.
All sizes below 55 inches are officially discontinued for all TVs (high end at least) now confirmed.
I don't know, not impressed the C7 wasn't able to increae nits over 700. When you actually see televisions like the Z9D and an X930E, the brightness is just crazy when seeing HDR content.
I honestly would still prefer a 100% DCI LED with FALD that was over 1500-2000 nits rather than OLED. Any word on A1E brightness being that it is still an LG panel? Properly calibrated, something with over 99-100% color accuracy, FALD and hogh nit brightness gives you pretty much the best of all worlds. However every tv pretty much has had some issues. The X930E isn't full FALD, Samsung goofed the brightness on the Q7F QLED, etc.
I honestly would still prefer a 100% DCI LED with FALD that was over 1500-2000 nits rather than OLED. Any word on A1E brightness being that it is still an LG panel? Properly calibrated, something with over 99-100% color accuracy, FALD and hogh nit brightness gives you pretty much the best of all worlds. However every tv pretty much has had some issues. The X930E isn't full FALD, Samsung goofed the brightness on the Q7F QLED, etc.
I'm not sure if they've released them yet, but Sony's doing HDR in their 1080p and 720p sets this year.
ACH1LL3US
Member
I have the 65B6 and the uniformity on my C7 is significantly better. The B6 has 142hrs on it and the C7 has 77hrs.
Still a panel lottery in regards to unformity, 2017 is no exception to that but I have a C7 and also saw another that had 250hrs on it with 5% greyscale that had 80% less vertical banding then my B6.
I will be honest, Rtings numbers don't tell the whole story. For gaming, the C7 is superior to my B6.
B6 has 27ms at 4:2:0 chroma > C7 has 21ms with 4:2:2 chroma
B6 has 62ms at 4:4:4 chroma > C7 has 21ms with 4:4:4 chroma AND you can use ISF modes with same lag in pc mode so picture accuracy is much better for gaming on the c7!
Also under 35 oled light there is NO ABL in pc mode whereas there is significant ABL on the B6 and other 2016 oled's.
Frankly for gamers, I think it is crazy to go buy a B6 now over the C7. I would wait until the C7 is the same price as the B6 which will be later this year. Also 120hz native at 1080p at 4:4:4 and pc ISF mode, no prior oled can compare with that for gaming imho.
When the B6 and C7 are similar price this conversation really will be moot.
FYI, Dell now has available the 30 inch oled monitor to buy:
http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/acce...ven1=sXLIk3FRD&ven2=,&ven3=812503829508623082
I will be getting this too and test with the Leo Bodnar. I hope they are using an LG oled panel on this and not a Samsung rgb oled panel as I have found that in particular the 2017 LG oled's are very resistant to image retention!
ACH1LL3US
Member
The Samsung Q9 is an incredible tv and can hit 2000 nits
super low input lag too of 21ms in PC mode with 4:4:4 :0Aztechnology
Member
Wait... Wait. This supports 1080@120hz? Like for say PC gaming?
Fingers crossed for cheaper future iterations with 4k 120hz Freesync...
ACH1LL3US
Member
Yup and using it on mine it is amazing! Clarity is insane at 120hz native and the input lag is even lower of course! All at 4:4:4 in pc mode in ISF bright mode
It is much clearer in motion then the Asus RoG 144hz IPS and TN monitors I use to have
Aztechnology
Member
Yup and using it on mine it is amazing! Clarity is insane at 120hz native and the input lag is even lower of course! All at 4:4:4 in pc mode in ISF bright mode
It is much clearer in motion then the Asus RoG 144hz IPS and TN monitors I use to have
Having a 2015 Vizio P series TV for a short time (Which could do 1080p@120hz as well), prompted me to get a 144hz monitor while I wait for TV's to catch up. It's really something else. Looks like LG might be starting to take PC gamers seriously.
Refresh rate > HDR > Adaptive Sync
for me, but all three are important.
ACH1LL3US
Member
120hz on the oled is better motion clarity then the ROG 144hz I had, the pixel response on the oled is .2ms, the ROG ips was an average of 4ms BUT there were color transitions that exceeded 10ms.
Basically at 120hz native on the oled the clarity is the best I have seen on a display, I wish more of you could see this! If I could have you all over to see it I would
It really is a sight to behold!Thanks for this post
yes, other parts will fail first, or the tech will simply be obsolete in that time. Older OLEDs had much much shorter half life's. They would exponentially decrease to just above half very quickly and then a different degradation mechanism would decrease brightness linearly for the rest of its useful life, ideally. This tech evolved quite rapidly.
Chris_Rivera
Member
Yup and using it on mine it is amazing! Clarity is insane at 120hz native and the input lag is even lower of course! All at 4:4:4 in pc mode in ISF bright mode
It is much clearer in motion then the Asus RoG 144hz IPS and TN monitors I use to have
Can you set the aspect ratio to 1:1 in this mode? As in small picture surrounded by black.
I don't know if I can stomach the stretched image, at least for PC.
Also what are you playing that hits a consistent 120fps?
ACH1LL3US
Member
I have a Titan XP so at 1080p most games that are not locked to 60hz can be run at 120fps or higher.
As for running 1080p on the screen, it is no different looking as running PS4/Xbox one games on here except I can run msaa etc on here at 120hz.
Friend of Sonic
Member
Man, I guess I'm waiting on the X7 then, that lag is great
To each their own. I prefer OLED handling compared LED. LED is so bright its distracting, not to mention it still can't do OLED blacks.
As long as its not a mess, ill be getting a A1E, which I could easily get a Z9.
Yup and using it on mine it is amazing! Clarity is insane at 120hz native and the input lag is even lower of course! All at 4:4:4 in pc mode in ISF bright mode
It is much clearer in motion then the Asus RoG 144hz IPS and TN monitors I use to have
Does the game have to maintain 120fps for that clarity? What happens if you're using 120hz and the game is running @ 60fps?
Haint
Member
Is 1080p/120 official, native functionality on the C7, or are you having to use those EDID Custom Resolution override hacks to get it?
vpance
Member
Whenever the 75" X940E comes down to $3K range that will be the one to buy, since the Z9D/E/F will forever be priced in the spaceship tier. It's basically a Z9D with 250 zones. Til then, if you can get past the curve and lack of DV, the 65" KS9800 is the last man standing. Prices are down to around $2400 now if you look around. Who knows when the next sanely priced 65" FALD will come around, if ever.
FALD is just niche for the foreseeable future I guess, unless those Chinese TV makers go full steam and start giving some competition in that space. Got no clue where LED tech is headed, but I don't think edge lit is the way forward.
Doesn't it suffer from horrible haloing when watching movies? I'd rather just get the ZD9 if I was buying an expensive Sony TV.
stanley1993
Neo Member
Ok, so I just went to best buy. It's between the B6 and X930E. Which one is better? During the day, our living room is very bright. There are windows everywhere. According to the best-buy-guy, the X930E can imitate the black of the B6. It also has a much better processor. Which one will last longer(look the best for the longest)? How much of a role does a processor play in a tv? The B6, I heard, has a third party processor. The X930E has the X1 extreme. Let's say, between these two, money doesn't matter. Which should I get? I know both are good. I watch more tv at night but still have a lot of bright lights on during that time. For a bright room, does the X930E really have better picture?
If you're placing the TV in a bright room, the 930e would suit you best. The 930e gets extremely bright, enough to outshine any ambient light sources. OLED is king in dark or rooms with controlled light.
vpance
Member
From the impressions I've seen it's a cut down Z9D, but in 75". It halos a bit worse I guess? Not that the Z9 halos badly to begin with. And not as horribly like a low zone FALD would.
I mean if somehow the Z9 drops as quick in price as other TVs usually do, then you go for that, but at the moment there is no successor to it so the price remains high. If the 940 line continues as it does then it'll hit $3K next year. Z9 will probably still be $5K+, at 65" too. That's a huge gulf in value.
Since I think most people watch stuff at night the OLED has always seemed like a no brainer.
The person asking said their room was well lit, even at night. Sheesh, OLEDs are nice TV's but not the second coming.
The 65" ZD9 is £3,499 here which is a pretty good deal for a premium TV. Sadly the 75" is almost double that price. :/