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Television Displays and Technology Thread: This is a fantasy based on OLED

M

Madness

Member
J-Rzez said:
To each their own. I prefer OLED handling compared LED. LED is so bright its distracting, not to mention it still can't do OLED blacks.

As long as its not a mess, ill be getting a A1E, which I could easily get a Z9.
Click to expand...

Like you said to each their own. I personally have found, especially after having seen Planet Earth II in UHD Bluray that I would rather have FALD and better color accuracy and like 2500 nits of brightness for some of the scenes. OLED level blacks are great, but with FALD you are getting very close to them, while having all the benefits of LED such as zero image retention, nit brightness going higher and higher.

stanley1993 said:
Ok, so I just went to best buy. It's between the B6 and X930E. Which one is better? During the day, our living room is very bright. There are windows everywhere. According to the best-buy-guy, the X930E can imitate the black of the B6. It also has a much better processor. Which one will last longer(look the best for the longest)? How much of a role does a processor play in a tv? The B6, I heard, has a third party processor. The X930E has the X1 extreme. Let's say, between these two, money doesn't matter. Which should I get? I know both are good. I watch more tv at night but still have a lot of bright lights on during that time. For a bright room, does the X930E really have better picture?
Click to expand...

The 4K X1 Xtreme is the best image processor on the market and will give you Dolby Vision support through a software update soon. If you watch more tv at night, OLED would be great, but during the day, OLED would pale compared to the X930E which hits upto 1400 nits+ and close to over 1000 sustained. Either or will give you great HDR viewing. Rtings prefers the blacks of the X930E even over the X900E which has FALD due to the way they have implemented the new zone lighting. Is cost equal between both?
 
Y

Yawnny

Member
I just don't understand why everyone wants all this crazy brightness when most natural images seem to be less bright and harsh. I know backlight doesn't really take away from brightness, contrast, and other settings, but isn't there a limit to when your eyes are tearing up just because it's so damn bright?

OLED can easily get to the point where my eyeballs physically hurt it's so bright.
 
S

stanley1993

Neo Member
Madness said:
Like you said to each their own. I personally have found, especially after having seen Planet Earth II in UHD Bluray that I would rather have FALD and better color accuracy and like 2500 nits of brightness for some of the scenes. OLED level blacks are great, but with FALD you are getting very close to them, while having all the benefits of LED such as zero image retention, nit brightness going higher and higher.



The 4K X1 Xtreme is the best image processor on the market and will give you Dolby Vision support through a software update soon. If you watch more tv at night, OLED would be great, but during the day, OLED would pale compared to the X930E which hits upto 1400 nits+ and close to over 1000 sustained. Either or will give you great HDR viewing. Rtings prefers the blacks of the X930E even over the X900E which has FALD due to the way they have implemented the new zone lighting. Is cost equal between both?
Click to expand...

X930E is $300 more, but I'll spend that much more if it's the better tv. Can a software update to the X1 extreme ever make the tv even better? For example, can it make picture better or does it make apps run better? (like ram, cpu, and gpu in any other hardware(consoles, phones...))
 
J

J-Rzez

Member
Yawnny said:
I just don't understand why everyone wants all this crazy brightness when most natural images seem to be less bright and harsh. I know backlight doesn't really take away from brightness, contrast, and other settings, but isn't there a limit to when your eyes are tearing up just because it's so damn bright?

OLED can easily get to the point where my eyeballs physically hurt it's so bright.
Click to expand...

To each their own like I said. The usage benefit time of contrast outweighs the time to time extreme brightness in movies. There's times my EF9500 feels too bright to me in HDR content like in Planet Earth 2. Sure it gives you more color range at times, but I think the newer OLEDs hit a bright enough factor. The C7 seems to be dominating reviews thus far, and likely only the A1E will have a shot at dethroning it in the US market.

I like the 930E as well, but for movies, I wouldnt use it due to halo/bloom. The 900E does a really great job at a better price, thus I'm considering getting that for my computer in 49".

My local best buy got up three more models that I checked out. The 940E is an extremely pretty TV for people wanting larger than 65" at a good price. It really narrows the bridge between it and the 75" Z9, and the price difference can go a long way towards other equipment like audio, other stuff, or money in your pocket.

Saw the 75" Q7, not impressed at all. Then finally saw the 65" Q9. I'm sorry, but its price I expected a lot more from it. And I mean a lot. The Z9 still walks it imo. Any hype for it is misplaced imho.

Its amazing how far Samsung fell this year. But I suspected that as soon as I saw them in consumer confusion mode with "QLED" slapped everywhere. I didn't see LGs new LEDs yet and wonder if even they can compete well, heck, pass the Samsung's.

As far as the question about Sony updates, yes, they can update and improve overall IQ with them. It can also be bug fixes, lag fixes, stability, etc..
 
L

LilJoka

Member
Yawnny said:
I just don't understand why everyone wants all this crazy brightness when most natural images seem to be less bright and harsh. I know backlight doesn't really take away from brightness, contrast, and other settings, but isn't there a limit to when your eyes are tearing up just because it's so damn bright?

OLED can easily get to the point where my eyeballs physically hurt it's so bright.
Click to expand...

It physically hurt my eyes and my families on the B6 65" at 50+. It arrived on 80 OLED light.
It's now set to 45.
The tv literally lights up the room it's so bright in the evening. I have a large lamp lighting the room.
 
W

wege12

Member
Recent B6 OLED owners, what is your manufactured date?

Mine is February 2017, which seemed kinda late to me considering the launch of the 2017 OLED models.
 
Theonik

Theonik

Member
holygeesus said:
I'm not sure what that last sentence means? All I know, is there are people on the AVSForum, who are buying this Sony OLED, despite slating the LG 2016 models for their lack of brightness with HDR. It's strange what brand loyalty does to people.
Click to expand...
What I am saying is that in return, Sony has fixed other issues. It's a trade, and neither set can hit the brightness to do HDR justice anyway, but you basically get rid of near back and banding issues as well as reduced ABL. (this last one is important as the OLED measurements last year were not accounting for drops in brightness over time)

Kyoufu said:
The 65" ZD9 is £3,499 here which is a pretty good deal for a premium TV. Sadly the 75" is almost double that price. :/
Click to expand...
I've seen the 75" going around refurbished for about £3400. You need to be lucky though.
 
holygeesus

holygeesus

Banned
Theonik said:
What I am saying is that in return, Sony has fixed other issues. It's a trade, and neither set can hit the brightness to do HDR justice anyway, but you basically get rid of near back and banding issues as well as reduced ABL. (this last one is important as the OLED measurements last year were not accounting for drops in brightness over time)
Click to expand...

As have all the 2017 models.
 
D

Dantero

Member
My Sony W905A unfortunately just died so I guess I'm going to get a new tv sooner than I was planning on.
I've been using it as a pc monitor and for all my consoles with no issues. I'm eyeing the LG B6 as a replacement, are any of you guys using that as a monitor?
 
W

wege12

Member
Dantero said:
My Sony W905A unfortunately just died so I guess I'm going to get a new tv sooner than I was planning on.
I've been using it as a pc monitor and for all my consoles with no issues. I'm eyeing the LG B6 as a replacement, are any of you guys using that as a monitor?
Click to expand...

I use my B6 as a monitor. The only problem I have with it is when you open full screen apps such as file explorer or chrome where the automatic brightness limiter will kick in and lower the brightness quite a bit. It's not desirable, but not a deal breaker to me. Gaming on the PC however is perfect.
 
D

Dantero

Member
wege12 said:
I use my B6 as a monitor. The only problem I have with it is when you open full screen apps such as file explorer or chrome where the automatic brightness limiter will kick in and lower the brightness quite a bit. It's not desirable, but not a deal breaker to me. Gaming on the PC however is perfect.
Click to expand...

If that's the only problem that might no be so bad. I usually use dark themes anyway. Weird that you apparently can't turn it off.
 
D

DOT DASH DOT

Member
Yawnny said:
I just don't understand why everyone wants all this crazy brightness when most natural images seem to be less bright and harsh. I know backlight doesn't really take away from brightness, contrast, and other settings, but isn't there a limit to when your eyes are tearing up just because it's so damn bright?

OLED can easily get to the point where my eyeballs physically hurt it's so bright.
Click to expand...

It's the highlights that are important with HDR, so you really do want as high a full screen brightness as you can get! Just because a TV can do a million nits it doesn't mean it'll sear your eyes out, as the metadata tells the TV how to display at what nits.

So the higher the full screen brightness, the higher certain effects like street lights or particle effects can get.

The one area that lets OLED down.
 
R

Reckoner

Member
Is there a TV set announced with HDMI 2.1 support? And do you think the X8005D will be updated with the new standard this year or next year?
 
S

shantyman

WHO DEY!?
PrimeRib_ said:
If you're placing the TV in a bright room, the 930e would suit you best. The 930e gets extremely bright, enough to outshine any ambient light sources. OLED is king in dark or rooms with controlled light.
Click to expand...

This is why I got the 900E instead of a B6. There really are difference scenarios for each person so assuming one TV fits all is ridiculous.
 
T

tokkun

Member
Reckoner said:
Is there a TV set announced with HDMI 2.1 support? And do you think the X8005D will be updated with the new standard this year or next year?
Click to expand...

The standard itself has not even been released yet, only announced. Personally I doubt that any current hardware will be upgraded to HDMI 2.1 ever. I also would not be surprised if most 2018 hardware does not release with support for the full standard, similar to what happened with HDMI 2.0.

Scorpio, for example, is not announced to support the full standard, but just the variable refresh rate part.
 
Traxtech

Traxtech

Member
Can confirm the c7 recognises 1080p/120hz out of the box, tested it at my buddies house as his folks bought the 65 c7. Thinking about selling my b6 and my pc monitor and getting one.

It's basically 500 bucks more than I paid for my b6 anyway here in Australia which is silly.
 
ACH1LL3US

ACH1LL3US

Member
Traxtech said:
Can confirm the c7 recognises 1080p/120hz out of the box, tested it at my buddies house as his folks bought the 65 c7. Thinking about selling my b6 and my pc monitor and getting one.

It's basically 500 bucks more than I paid for my b6 anyway here in Australia which is silly.
Click to expand...


Looks great at 120hz right?
 
R

RedlineRonin

Member
Thorrgal said:
So I guess it will be nice to have a TV with HDMI 2.1 for Scorpio/PS5?
Click to expand...

I was actually reading up on this yesterday here and what's still really unclear to me is how much of this stuff is going to be backwards compatible. Even that article pretty much lands at "depends on what manufacturers want to do"

Anyway, my point is, in a perfect world you'd be able to buy something like an LG C7 this year, the spec is out next year, and LG releases an update to allow variable refresh rates (not sure if that's a hw limitation of the set itself or not).

It's obviously not in the manufacturer's interest to do that; they'd rather you buy a new TV. It sucks because 2.1 seems like it's worth waiting for esp if you game a lot, but there's zero clarity on whether anything will be backwards compatible with 2.0
 
P

PrimeRib_

Member
RedlineRonin said:
I was actually reading up on this yesterday here and what's still really unclear to me is how much of this stuff is going to be backwards compatible. Even that article pretty much lands at "depends on what manufacturers want to do"

Anyway, my point is, in a perfect world you'd be able to buy something like an LG C7 this year, the spec is out next year, and LG releases an update to allow variable refresh rates (not sure if that's a hw limitation of the set itself or not).

It's obviously not in the manufacturer's interest to do that; they'd rather you buy a new TV. It sucks because 2.1 seems like it's worth waiting for esp if you game a lot, but there's zero clarity on whether anything will be backwards compatible with 2.0
Click to expand...

I believe they can't make the higher resolution or refresh rates backward compatible with older HDMI spec due to bandwidth requirements, but I'm still holding out hope it's possible to make the variable refresh rate patchable in HDMI 2.0. Unlikely but we'll see. I'd certainly love to take advantage of it on the TV I just bought and not have to refresh my set again in 2018 ....
 
P

PrimeRib_

Member
Yawnny said:
I just don't understand why everyone wants all this crazy brightness when most natural images seem to be less bright and harsh. I know backlight doesn't really take away from brightness, contrast, and other settings, but isn't there a limit to when your eyes are tearing up just because it's so damn bright?

OLED can easily get to the point where my eyeballs physically hurt it's so bright.
Click to expand...

It has more to do with higher brightness being able to "beat out" any ambient light sources, including sunlight or light spillage from open floor plans or areas with uncontrollable light. As good as OLEDs are, they can't get the picture bright enough to compete against a brightly sunlit room.
 
Y

Yappadappadu

Member
Beer Monkey said:
Because 47ms display lag if you don't feed it native 4K. If I have to have 47ms lag I'd stick with my Kuro a couple more years, it has 48ms.
Click to expand...
That's the Sony OLED though.
The 2016 LG OLEDs measure lower when it comes to Full HD and below.

Yeah, for gaming I would even take a 2016 OLED over a Sony OLED.
The Sony OLED is really no option for retro gamers IMO.
 
R

RedlineRonin

Member
PrimeRib_ said:
I believe they can't make the higher resolution or refresh rates backward compatible with older HDMI spec due to bandwidth requirements, but I'm still holding out hope it's possible to make the variable refresh rate patchable in HDMI 2.0. Unlikely but we'll see. I'd certainly love to take advantage of it on the TV I just bought and not have to refresh my set again in 2018 ....
Click to expand...

That's kind of what's unclear. They actually should be theoretically backwards compatible from a bandwidth standpoint, because the connector on, let's say your 4K set and your UHD player isn't changing, it's just that the spec will enable for higher bandwidth signal transmissions (up to 48gbps), which then only necessitates upgrading to a cable that can handle that transfer rate.

Again, that's all heavily dependent on the manufacturers being willing to support legacy products via firmware updates...
 
B

Beer Monkey

Member
Kyoufu said:
I must be missing something here. The C6, E6 and G6 have 34ms input latency in both SDR and HDR.

The B6 has 28ms.
Click to expand...

1) If I'm wrong I stand corrected. I guess I misread that the LG was 47ms if not feeding it 4K.
2) I looked for Leo Bodnar 720p test results for days and haven't found any. If you have any LMK. 720p is still important to me because of OSSC, PS3 etc. It seems very few people have the Bodnar 720p tester.

Still the tint and lack of 4K reduce my interest, not likely to buy a 2016 at this point.
 
K

Kyoufu

Member
Beer Monkey said:
1) If I'm wrong I stand corrected. I guess I misread that the LG was 47ms if not feeding it 4K.
2) I looked for Leo Bodnar 720p test results for days and haven't found any. If you have any LMK. 720p is still important to me because of OSSC, PS3 etc. It seems very few people have the Bodnar 720p tester.

Still the tint and lack of 4K reduce my interest, not likely to buy a 2016 at this point.
Click to expand...

the latency in 720p and 1080p are the same. The numbers I posted above.

You're like 5 months late in terms of worrying about OLED input lag :p
 
T

Thorrgal

Member
RedlineRonin said:
I was actually reading up on this yesterday here and what's still really unclear to me is how much of this stuff is going to be backwards compatible. Even that article pretty much lands at "depends on what manufacturers want to do"

Anyway, my point is, in a perfect world you'd be able to buy something like an LG C7 this year, the spec is out next year, and LG releases an update to allow variable refresh rates (not sure if that's a hw limitation of the set itself or not).

It's obviously not in the manufacturer's interest to do that; they'd rather you buy a new TV. It sucks because 2.1 seems like it's worth waiting for esp if you game a lot, but there's zero clarity on whether anything will be backwards compatible with 2.0
Click to expand...

Yeah I actually meant worth waiting for the 2018 models. I'm in the market for a 65" OLED and was on the fence, but this has convinced me to wait for the 2018 models. I have a 2014 55" OLEd though
 
T

Thorrgal

Member
Beer Monkey said:
1) If I'm wrong I stand corrected. I guess I misread that the LG was 47ms if not feeding it 4K.
2) I looked for Leo Bodnar 720p test results for days and haven't found any. If you have any LMK. 720p is still important to me because of OSSC, PS3 etc. It seems very few people have the Bodnar 720p tester.

Still the tint and lack of 4K reduce my interest, not likely to buy a 2016 at this point.
Click to expand...

The 2016's are 4k though, and the tint problems solved too. My issue with the '16 models is the 65" price and now the lack of 2.1
 
J

jjonez18

Member
Need some guidance. I can get a 55" LG C6 now for around $1100. Or I can wait about a month and get a Sony 55" 900E for around $800-$900. I'm a console gamer. When I get them I'll probably pick up a PS4 Pro as well. How are these sets for gaming? If I put Horizon Zero Dawn (a 30fps game) into my PS4 Pro, which will look and feel the best in motion?

Edit: only have one window in my room. Window is usually open letting in natural light. At night I usually have my lamp on at night. That's in the same position as the window.
 
holygeesus

holygeesus

Banned
Kyoufu said:
the latency in 720p and 1080p are the same. The numbers I posted above.

You're like 5 months late in terms of worrying about OLED input lag :p
Click to expand...

Also you are as likely to get tint and uniformity issues with the 2017 sets as you are with the 2016. Just you won't feel so bad paying less for your set if you go for a 2016 variant :p
 
W

Weevilone

Member
jjonez18 said:
Need some guidance. I can get a 55" LG C6 now for around $1100. Or I can wait about a month and get a Sony 55" 900E for around $800-$900. I'm a console gamer. When I get them I'll probably pick up a PS4 Pro as well. How are these sets for gaming? If I put Horizon Zero Dawn (a 30fps game) into my PS4 Pro, which will look and feel the best in motion?

Edit: only have one window in my room. Window is usually open letting in natural light. At night I usually have my lamp on at night. That's in the same position as the window.
Click to expand...

I'd be all over that C6 personally. As long as it's not full on sun shining on the screen you'll be fine. I just finished the platinum trophy on Horizon and it was jaw dropping beginning to end.
 
P

Paragon

Member
TheBoss1 said:
It's so hard deciding whether to wait for TVs with HDMI 2.1 or to jump in this year with the new OLEDs being great sets. The wait is unbearable.
Click to expand...
I ended up buying a G-Sync Ultrawide monitor while I wait for first or second generation HDMI 2.1 OLEDs and don't regret my decision at all.
Obviously it is much lower contrast than an OLED TV - than my old LCD TV too, but the aspect ratio, high refresh rate, low input lag, RGB pixel structure, and smoothness of G-Sync more than make up for it in my opinion.
Though it could be better, I was not unhappy with how my current TV handles movies/TV, only gaming.
My only regret is that I did not buy this (PG348Q) sooner, and I won't buy any new display without variable refresh rate support now. Even after just a week with it, I find it very difficult to go back to V-Synced 60Hz for gaming.
Obviously the two are very different, but depending on what you're looking for, and what your gaming setup is like, that may be an option.
 
C

Chumley

Banned
Yawnny said:
I just don't understand why everyone wants all this crazy brightness when most natural images seem to be less bright and harsh. I know backlight doesn't really take away from brightness, contrast, and other settings, but isn't there a limit to when your eyes are tearing up just because it's so damn bright?

OLED can easily get to the point where my eyeballs physically hurt it's so bright.
Click to expand...

Yeah I don't understand the brightness complaints. My living room during the day is completely sunlit, windows everywhere, and it's still totally fine. Night scenes might be hard to make out but that's normal in a brightly lit room.

I also just almost never watch anything during the day, and if I do I close the blinds.
 
N

ngower

Member
My Vizio E500i-b1 is on its way out—still working but the writing is on the wall. It may last until the holiday season, when TVs might be a tad cheaper, but the X900E is ~$1650 after tax right now at Best Buy (thanks Tennessee...). It's still $50 cheaper than MSRP, though, so I'm thinking about biting. I picked up a KS8000 impulsively last night (it was their last one in stock and I didn't want to miss out) but I can't say I'm super impressed with non-4K content and there's some noticeable audio lag that drove me crazy trying to watch a movie.

Just wondering what y'all would recommend: pick up the X900E now or hold off for a few months and see if I can't make better use of ~$1500?
 
S

simtmb

Member
holygeesus said:
Also you are as likely to get tint and uniformity issues with the 2017 sets as you are with the 2016. Just you won't feel so bad paying less for your set if you go for a 2016 variant :p
Click to expand...

The biggest problem with these OLEDs by far. I have yet to see a perfectly uniform one actually. But I haven't seen a 2017 LG set yet.

2016 sets and before I've noticed near black uniformity issues, and vertical banding issues of varying degrees of severity, and at least one or two dead sub-pixels on average. This has been across every panel I've seen. Still fantastic sets, but I wish it wasn't just LG in the game.
 
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