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Television Displays and Technology Thread: This is a fantasy based on OLED

M

Mrbob

Member
Gorocketcat said:
How did you switch them into 444 mode?

EDIT: Nevermind, I'm an idiot. I was thinking you did something else.
Click to expand...

Yeah it's just UHD Deep Color on the LG TV. The Yamaha receiver was a little tougher to switch but not overly difficult. Needed to hold some buttons for advanced setup on power up and switch to 4k mode 1.

Also, I noticed Nex Machina has HDR support on PC and it's very nice. Colors really pop now since it uses a lot of neon.
 
P

Prisoner KSC2-303

Member
I think I'm going to grab a B7. I hesitated because of HDMI 2.1, but with no details about Scorpio and VRR I wonder if we won't see that feature until the next generation, and that could be 2020. May as well enjoy an OLED for a few years before worrying about that.
 
M

mrklaw

MrArseFace
The Real Abed said:
So, I'm surprised and kind of shocked that my new TV doesn't have Picture in Picture. It's a 2017 50" Samsung UHD TV. PIP would be amazing. I'd use it all the time. Do TVs not come with PIP anymore? Or did I just luck out? I mean my 2006 32" Polaroid had PIP. Seems like a feature that they could literally build in with a software update or something. Is there a technical reason? Did PIP just die off in the last 11 years and go the way of 3D?

I would totally have the YouTube app constantly open in PIP while playing my games full screen. (Like I can on my MacBook.)
Click to expand...


PiP seems badly supported these days. Even when it was more widely supported, it tended to be limited to one digital input alongside an analog input or internal tuner. I don’t think I’ve ever had a set that would allow two digital inputs - which would have been great.
 
R

RomeoDog

Banned
Prisoner KSC2-303 said:
I think I'm going to grab a B7. I hesitated because of HDMI 2.1, but with no details about Scorpio and VRR I wonder if we won't see that feature until the next generation, and that could be 2020. May as well enjoy an OLED for a few years before worrying about that.
Click to expand...

I have an E6 and relized VRR is a PC feature and will probably not be used by devs in future consoles because if they target a frame other than 30 or 60 they're just going to piss off everyone without VRR and that's going to be a huge percentage of us.
 
TheBoss1

TheBoss1

Member
RomeoDog said:
I have an E6 and relized VRR is a PC feature and will probably not be used by devs in future consoles because if they target a frame other than 30 or 60 they're just going to piss off everyone without VRR and that's going to be a huge percentage of us.
Click to expand...
Good point. I wonder why most devs don't include the option to play at 30/60 fps in console games. They can add a toggle for VRR displays if they wanted to but I lost all hope for the foreseeable future when it comes to having options on consoles.
 
T

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
mrklaw said:
PiP seems badly supported these days. Even when it was more widely supported, it tended to be limited to one digital input alongside an analog input or internal tuner. I don’t think I’ve ever had a set that would allow two digital inputs - which would have been great.
Click to expand...
Seems like it'd be a perfect feature at home in todays market when every TV has its own OS and processor that could easily support concentrating on two video sources at once. Even if using it disabled any special filtering or such, just to have the option would be neat. I'd love to be able to play my Wii U/Switch while YouTube sits in the corner. I guess I'd just have to go with the alternative of just having my laptop playing YouTube while I'm playing my consoles.

At least when I'm on my MacBook I'll be able to put YouTube in a PIP window on macOS. (Does Windows 10 even have anything like this? Eventually I'll be gaming on a PC connected to my TV.)

Whatever. Was just an observation. It probably wouldn't be useful for me anyway if it only played the audio from one source at a time and didn't have an option to merge audio from both. I remember my old TV had multiple PIP modes. One where there was an actual smaller PIP in a corner of your selection, then one with both inputs next to each other and one with the two in opposite corners slightly overlapping. Though it sucked that it put a thick blue border around the currently selected one and only played the audio from that one.
 
V

VGChampion

Member
Pulling the trigger on the 55" X900E. Just waiting on Best Buy to let me know when it's ready! :)

Almost went with a Vizio M Series set but changed my mind at the last minute.
 
R

Raticus79

Seek victory, not fairness
I'm going to get the 55" LG C7 from Best Buy today (Canada) to replace my monitors. They have a "save double the tax" promotion going on which works out to a few hundred bucks off in Alberta.

I had originally been thinking of holding out for one of the new monitors coming up in Q7, but didn't really want 21:9 1440p resolution and the 4K/120 ones will just be 27". Considering those monitors are expected to be around $2000 USD, I figured I might as well just check out an OLED instead. The tipping point for me was 1080p120 support. I have a bunch of games where I can put that to good use with supersampling to help make up for the lower resolution.

I expect they'll have a firmware update at some point for this issue mentioned on rtings:
"Update 05/31/2017: 1080p @ 120 Hz + HDR does not work properly. Its brightness appears to be following the SDR gamma curve rather than the HDR PQ curve, making everything look off and too bright."
 
P

Prisoner KSC2-303

Member
RomeoDog said:
I have an E6 and relized VRR is a PC feature and will probably not be used by devs in future consoles because if they target a frame other than 30 or 60 they're just going to piss off everyone without VRR and that's going to be a huge percentage of us.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I wouldn't expect them to target other frame rates, but I still expect it to come to consoles at some point because the benefits with regards smoothness and eliminating screen tearing still apply to games at 30/60fps. I'm just done waiting for the next big thing, I think I'd rather enjoy something now.
 
O

OG_Original Gamer

Member
Lima said:
If anything with HDR10+ coming next year part of HDMI 2.1 DV has less of a future.

HDR10+ is basically the same thing under the open standard for HDR which means neither TV manufacturers nor content creators have to pay the DV license fee.
Click to expand...

I don't think studios and display manufacturers are stressing over paying Dolby a licensing fee.
 
O

OG_Original Gamer

Member
MrFlooD said:
Vizio P series at Costco. Perfect gaming TV.
Click to expand...


Vizio P Series has one of the highest HDR contrast ratio on the market. Just got a beta firmware update, that gives you on screen apps to go along with the Smartcast app you can install on your phone.

PQ update appears to show a boost in nits, which may explain why the 2017 model is now in the shootout against the Sony Z9D, 940e, Samsung Q9F, and LG C70 or W7 OLED. I'm not sure if Sony A1E is part of the shootout.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
Thanks for that Digital Foundry video link before with the custom resolution tool. I was able to add PS4 type resolutions like 3200 X 1800 and have my Nvidia GPU scale to 4K. There is barely a difference. 1800P is a little softer but not by much.

OG_Original Gamer said:
I don't think studios and display manufacturers are stressing over paying Dolby a licensing fee.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Also, the moves Dolby are making lately is setting themselves up nicely for the future. Offering a Dolby Vision software solution means any TV manufacturer can add Dolby Vision to their set now. Also, being able to work on HDMI 2.0 is huge. If HDR10+ is going to require HDMI 2.1 then Dolby Vision will always have a wider audience. My gut feeling is HDR, HDR10+, and Dolby Vision all become standard on 4K UHD discs.
 
Mercador

Mercador

Member
Mrbob said:
It looks like the P series is going to be almost identical to last year's version but with a traditional remote. The M series got some upgrades with lighter P series features like dimming zones, but less of them (32 on M, 128 on P). If you have the money I'd probably recommend the P series. There is some information on the two sets here:

https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/vizio-2017-smartcast-p-series-m-series-tvs/
Click to expand...
Thanks

I think, price wise, I'll go with the M. Costco Canada still have the older model with the tablet, hopefully it will costs less without it.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
Remember the old M isn't as good as the new M. Just the P series that is the same.

If you are going M series I'd get the 2017 model.
 
O

OG_Original Gamer

Member
Mrbob said:
It looks like the P series is going to be almost identical to last year's version but with a traditional remote. The M series got some upgrades with lighter P series features like dimming zones, but less of them (32 on M, 128 on P). If you have the money I'd probably recommend the P series. There is some information on the two sets here:

https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/vizio-2017-smartcast-p-series-m-series-tvs/
Click to expand...

Difference is, the 2017 M Series can reach 800 nits. P75 HDR black level on new beta firmware is 0.004, contrast ratio nearly 80,000:1.
 
O

OG_Original Gamer

Member
Mrbob said:
Thanks for that Digital Foundry video link before with the custom resolution tool. I was able to add PS4 type resolutions like 3200 X 1800 and have my Nvidia GPU scale to 4K. There is barely a difference. 1800P is a little softer but not by much.



Agreed. Also, the moves Dolby are making lately is setting themselves up nicely for the future. Offering a Dolby Vision software solution means any TV manufacturer can add Dolby Vision to their set now. Also, being able to work on HDMI 2.0 is huge. If HDR10+ is going to require HDMI 2.1 then Dolby Vision will always have a wider audience. My gut feeling is HDR, HDR10+, and Dolby Vision all become standard on 4K UHD discs.
Click to expand...

Dolby Vision Display Manager, knows your specific display color gamut, peak brightness, and black level. To compress it down to a single term "Color Volume", bright and dark colors, increases overall scene contrast. This presents a almost 3D like effect.

Even the EOTF curve is display specific, so you should expect your display to perform to its maximum capabilities.
 
G

Goofy

Member
65C7P OLED currently $2296.99, and 55C7P OLED 1596.99 at Fry's brick and mortar only.

Use Citi price rewind to take an extra $500 off the 65 by matching to TV superstore, or an extra $298.99 off the 55" by matching to TV superstore.

INSANE deals, your price will vary slightly based on local taxes. Assuming 7 percent sales tax and price rewind, your final price would be $1958 for the 65 or $1410 for the 55"

Enjoy.
 
Stiler

Stiler

Member
Goofy said:
65C7P OLED currently $2296.99, and 55C7P OLED 1596.99 at Fry's brick and mortar only.

Use Citi price rewind to take an extra $500 off the 65 by matching to TV superstore, or an extra $298.99 off the 55" by matching to TV superstore.

INSANE deals, your price will vary slightly based on local taxes. Assuming 7 percent sales tax and price rewind, your final price would be $1958 for the 65 or $1410 for the 55"

Enjoy.
Click to expand...

Dang! That's an amazing deal on the 65, too bad there's no Fry's around here.
 
T

tokkun

Member
So the HDMI 2.1 spec was announced for release in "early Q2". Q2 has now come and gone with no spec release or any update about the delay.

It's hard to say for certain without knowing what's going on behind the scenes, but I'm getting more pessimistic that we will see HDMI 2.1 on flagship 2018 TVs. Practically speaking, there is a sequence of steps that has to happen between spec release and support in TVs. The companies that produce the video processing chips need to tape them out, get manufacturing samples validated, and go into full production. That could take several months. The TV manufacturers then need to get the chips, integrate them into their electronics systems, support features in firmware/software, deal with any issues, and do their own validation. At least a few more months.

Now consider that the big manufacturers show off their new sets at CES, which is 6 months away. Seems like time may be running out.
 
Jigolo

Jigolo

Member
tokkun said:
So the HDMI 2.1 spec was announced for release in "early Q2". Q2 has now come and gone with no spec release or any update about the delay.

It's hard to say for certain without knowing what's going on behind the scenes, but I'm getting more pessimistic that we will see HDMI 2.1 on flagship 2018 TVs. Practically speaking, there is a sequence of steps that has to happen between spec release and support in TVs. The companies that produce the video processing chips need to tape them out, get manufacturing samples validated, and go into full production. That could take several months. The TV manufacturers then need to get the chips, integrate them into their electronics systems, support features in firmware/software, deal with any issues, and do their own validation. At least a few more months.

Now consider that the big manufacturers show off their new sets at CES, which is 6 months away. Seems like time may be running out.
Click to expand...
I don't expect to see any TVs this year with it but I never did. We might hear a sliver of info about 2.1 at IFA but nothing real solid. Maybe something along the lines of "coming early next year" rumblings. I hope media guys that head out to IFA ask TV reps about 2.1 so we get an insight on what they're thinking
 
K

kaizoku

I'm not as deluded as I make myself out to be
Just ordered a LG 55C6, excited to be joining the 4K family and OLED at the same time! But I gotta say standing in the store, the main TVs that really popped were Samsung, just so vibrant. Even over other LEDs. Made me worry for a moment!

The OLED's in store had planet earth 2 on but even so they did not look as spectacular as the Samsung demo video loops. Is that mainly store front effect? If OLEDs put on the vibrant demos of the Samsung would theh look equally amazing (slightly dimmer maybe).
 
F

Fowler

Member
Hi there! Can anyone with the Sony A1 OLED answer a question: Is the stand adjustable?

I'm trying to figure out how to fit it in my super tight setup, and not sure about how deep the 55" goes with the stand. It looks like it's 339mm according to the dimensions, but I'm not entirely sure, and wanted to know if I could make it shallower by having a less dramatic tilt angle. (I don't care about the tilt visually, just want to make sure it fits!)

Thank you!
 
Stiler

Stiler

Member
kaizoku said:
Just ordered a LG 55C6, excited to be joining the 4K family and OLED at the same time! But I gotta say standing in the store, the main TVs that really popped were Samsung, just so vibrant. Even over other LEDs. Made me worry for a moment!

The OLED's in store had planet earth 2 on but even so they did not look as spectacular as the Samsung demo video loops. Is that mainly store front effect? If OLEDs put on the vibrant demos of the Samsung would theh look equally amazing (slightly dimmer maybe).
Click to expand...

Stores use the torchlight mode (aka dynamic setting) which make the colors pop but it makes the colors less accurate for what you are meant to see. It is a cool color mode and favors lighter objects.

It's a tactic that tv makers/stores have used for a long time.

https://www.cnet.com/news/what-is-tv-color-temperature-and-why-does-it-matter/
 
T

Terbinator

Member
Fowler said:
Hi there! Can anyone with the Sony A1 OLED answer a question: Is the stand adjustable?

I'm trying to figure out how to fit it in my super tight setup, and not sure about how deep the 55" goes with the stand. It looks like it's 339mm according to the dimensions, but I'm not entirely sure, and wanted to know if I could make it shallower by having a less dramatic tilt angle. (I don't care about the tilt visually, just want to make sure it fits!)

Thank you!
Click to expand...

I don't believe so - https://youtu.be/tSYO7nvOWCs?t=1m14s

The counter balance looks like it is a fixed length from the TV.
 
Haint

Haint

Member
OG_Original Gamer said:
I don't think studios and display manufacturers are stressing over paying Dolby a licensing fee.
Click to expand...

LOLWAT. Why do you think Samsung doesn't support it, their SOCs are more than up to the task. It's 100% the licencing fee, and based on the $15 Dolby Atmos fee end users are being asked to pay on Xbone for the license, DV is bound to be a significant cost, $10s of dollars per unit.
 
O

OG_Original Gamer

Member
Reallink said:
LOLWAT. Why do you think Samsung doesn't support it, their SOCs are more than up to the task. It's 100% the licencing fee, and based on the $15 Dolby Atmos fee end users are being asked to pay on Xbone for the license, DV is bound to be a significant cost, $10s of dollars per unit.
Click to expand...

TCL pays the licensing fee and they're currently not a household name, in the display market. Samsung chose not to license DV, because they like to have complete control of the image quality of there displays. DV takes control of the backlight, color gamut, and basically making every picture in HDR nearly identical. HDR10 requires each manufacturer to provide there on tone mapping algorithm, what does that mean for Samsung if they can provide better tone mapping than Sony, LG, Panasonic, Vizio, TCL. Sony joined because Dolby went hardware and software, Sony has the hardware, so they just used software. They're four models planned to receive firmware update for DV support.

Samsung is bigger than Vizio and they could afford it but Samsung couldn't. Then Vizio displays are cheaper and originally shipped with a free tablet.
 
J

J-Rzez

Member
Fowler said:
Hi there! Can anyone with the Sony A1 OLED answer a question: Is the stand adjustable?

I'm trying to figure out how to fit it in my super tight setup, and not sure about how deep the 55" goes with the stand. It looks like it's 339mm according to the dimensions, but I'm not entirely sure, and wanted to know if I could make it shallower by having a less dramatic tilt angle. (I don't care about the tilt visually, just want to make sure it fits!)

Thank you!
Click to expand...

Above post is correct.

I have an A1E. Stand has a kick bar with weight to be assembled at the back end. They make universal stands (sanus) that support 65" TV's so you can put the tv in wall mount mode and attach to that if need be.

Any other questions feel free to ask.
 
Haint

Haint

Member
OG_Original Gamer said:
TCL pays the licensing fee and they're currently not a household name, in the display market. Samsung chose not to license DV, because they like to have complete control of the image quality of there displays. DV takes control of the backlight, color gamut, and basically making every picture in HDR nearly identical. HDR10 requires each manufacturer to provide there on tone mapping algorithm, what does that mean for Samsung if they can provide better tone mapping than Sony, LG, Panasonic, Vizio, TCL. Sony joined because Dolby went hardware and software, Sony has the hardware, so they just used software. They're four models planned to receive firmware update for DV support.

Samsung is bigger than Vizio and they could afford it but Samsung couldn't. Then Vizio displays are cheaper and originally shipped with a free tablet.
Click to expand...

You are overlooking the fact that all the other brand are chasing Samsung, they are a commanding #1 in market share and have been for probably over 10 years. DV is a key differentiator and marketing bulletpoint that's well worth the cost for (relative) underdogs. Putting it on cheaper units is a competitive advantage in a game to take market share away from Samsung. TCL in particular is all but certainly eating a loss on the P-series in a play to establish themselves a household name that's more synonymous with quality (i.e. gotta spend money to make money). Samsung doesn't need a leg-up, their brand is the differentiator. That's not to say I think it's good business, rather it's incredibly stupid, but they're arrogant as fuck just like Sony was. As the Koreans knocked the Japanese off their high horse, so too will the Chinese knock the Koreans. They don't give a fuck about tone mapping LOL, they care about the estimated $10-20+ per unit Dolby Laboratories are hoping to charge them in perpetuity if it becomes the defacto standard (which Samsung obviously doesn't want).
 
Stiler

Stiler

Member
OG_Original Gamer said:
TCL pays the licensing fee and they're currently not a household name, in the display market. Samsung chose not to license DV, because they like to have complete control of the image quality of there displays. DV takes control of the backlight, color gamut, and basically making every picture in HDR nearly identical. HDR10 requires each manufacturer to provide there on tone mapping algorithm, what does that mean for Samsung if they can provide better tone mapping than Sony, LG, Panasonic, Vizio, TCL. Sony joined because Dolby went hardware and software, Sony has the hardware, so they just used software. They're four models planned to receive firmware update for DV support.

Samsung is bigger than Vizio and they could afford it but Samsung couldn't. Then Vizio displays are cheaper and originally shipped with a free tablet.
Click to expand...

TCL is bigger than Sony in the worldwide tv marketplace.

It's just in NA the brand name isn't known because they built tv's here under the RCA brand for a while and then shifted to using their own name some years ago.

However in terms of the world tv marketplace they are the third largest maker in the world, right behind Samsung and LG.
 
O

OG_Original Gamer

Member
Reallink said:
You are overlooking the fact that all the other brand are chasing Samsung, they are a commanding #1 in market share and have been for probably over 10 years. DV is a key differentiator and marketing bulletpoint that's well worth the cost for (relative) underdogs. Putting it on cheaper units is a competitive advantage in a game to take market share away from Samsung. TCL in particular is all but certainly eating a loss on the P-series in a play to establish themselves a household name that's more synonymous with quality (i.e. gotta spend money to make money). Samsung doesn't need a leg-up, their brand is the differentiator. That's not to say I think it's good business, rather it's incredibly stupid, but they're arrogant as fuck just like Sony was. As the Koreans knocked the Japanese off their high horse, so too will the Chinese knock the Koreans. They don't give a fuck about tone mapping LOL, they care about the estimated $10-20+ per unit Dolby Laboratories are hoping to charge them in perpetuity if it becomes the defacto standard (which Samsung obviously doesn't want).
Click to expand...

Samsung is concerned with differentiation. It's the reason why most display manufacturers, although through the years have had to use the same gamma curve, color gamut, still pushed over saturated colors, pushed white to a blue tint, and avoided color accuracy. For Samsung there bread and butter is, Quantum Dots and peak nits.
 
RedAssedApe

RedAssedApe

Banned
Fellow PS4 owners...this isn't what the dual theme is supposed to look like right? That blue above the the wave is supposed to be fairly uniform no?

attachment.php
Click to expand...
 
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