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[ascii42]

You must have owned some godawful RWD cars then.

1976 Oldsmobile 98
1986 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham
1996 Volvo 960 wagon

Not bad cars at all, just built for comfort and space over handling (Oldsmobile and Cadillac hadn't even heard of handling yet). The Olds is over 19 feet long, nothing is going to make that thing handle well.

 

[reilo]

So like I said...

 

[TheOMan]

Alright Automotive GAF - I'm looking to buy another car in the next 6 months or so.

I'm really interested in getting something with AWD and preferably forced induction, but I'm not into the full size SUVs. Honda is off the list as is Acura (however, the NSX reboot has caught my attention, looks like it will be amazing). New and used are both on the table. As for pricing, nothing too crazy (ie, anything approaching 6 figures is a non-starter).

A guy on my street has a GTR - amazing vehicle, just wasn't for me. I mean, I really liked it, but something about it didn't feel right. Couldn't really put my finger on what. Crazy performance for the money though.

I've looked at the Evo - very fun, still considering it, but I think it's a little too boy-racer for me. The 135i is a great ride too (yeah, I know RWD, but wow). I could probably be talked into a RWD platform, but FWD is out for sure.

I'm gonna take a Golf R for a spin as it looks like it will be a fun one. What else should I be considering? If you make a suggestion that I can try out, I'll make sure to report back here as to how it went!

So - in summary for features:

1. AWD (*maybe* RWD)
2. Forced Induction
3. Price is variable, but nothing crazy

 

[David Incorporated Esq.]

How about a mid 2000's 911 Turbo? If you're already willing to pay GTR money you can get a very nice one.

Really though it doesn't seem like you have any idea what you're actually looking for. Nobody cross-shops GTRs and VW Golfs.

 

[TheOMan]

How about a mid 2000's 911 Turbo? If you're already willing to pay GTR money you can get a very nice one.

Really though it doesn't seem like you have any idea what you're actually looking for. Nobody cross-shops GTRs and VW Golfs.

You're right, that's the problem - really not sure what I want. Maybe the first thing I should do is figure out how much I want to spend?

Also - that's the thing, wasn't willing to pay GTR money for the GTR. Amazing car, but it didn't click with me.

I should have also said that it should be able to seat 4...so I guess the criteria so far are:

1. AWD
2. Forced induction
3. Seat 4?

 

[BoobPhysics101]

911 Turbo.

 

[AlphaSnake]

BMW 335xi Coupe + Mods?

Audi S5 Supercharged Coupe (arrives in August for US, available in Europe now)

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Alright Automotive GAF - I'm looking to buy another car in the next 6 months or so.

I'm really interested in getting something with AWD and preferably forced induction, but I'm not into the full size SUVs. Honda is off the list as is Acura (however, the NSX reboot has caught my attention, looks like it will be amazing). New and used are both on the table. As for pricing, nothing too crazy (ie, anything approaching 6 figures is a non-starter).

A guy on my street has a GTR - amazing vehicle, just wasn't for me. I mean, I really liked it, but something about it didn't feel right. Couldn't really put my finger on what. Crazy performance for the money though.

I've looked at the Evo - very fun, still considering it, but I think it's a little too boy-racer for me. The 135i is a great ride too (yeah, I know RWD, but wow). I could probably be talked into a RWD platform, but FWD is out for sure.

I'm gonna take a Golf R for a spin as it looks like it will be a fun one. What else should I be considering? If you make a suggestion that I can try out, I'll make sure to report back here as to how it went!

So - in summary for features:

1. AWD (*maybe* RWD)
2. Forced Induction
3. Price is variable, but nothing crazy

1M?

 

[David Incorporated Esq.]

Do you want four real seats? Like to seat four adults? Or would you settle for a 2+2?

 

[TylerD]

Charger SRT8! Slam the peddle to the floor, rubber shredding, battering ram!

It's not AWD or FI but it has room for 5 and 470 horsepower and 470 lb-ft of torque starting at $46,660.

 

[TheOMan]

911 Turbo.

I think I want 4 seats.

BMW 335xi Coupe + Mods?

Audi S5 Supercharged Coupe (arrives in August for US, available in Europe now)

335xi Coupe - will try this out
Audi S5 - been thinking about Audis in general, I don't know much about them. Any other models you'd recommend here? Same guy that owns the GTR has a Q7, engine blew up on him recently so he's pretty sour on them.

1M?

If the dealerships here ever get one, I'll give it a go, however it's RWD.

Do you want four real seats? Like to seat four adults? Or would you settle for a 2+2?

4 real seats are definitely preferred. 2+2 would be doable, but not if I don't have to.

Charger SRT8! Slam the peddle to the floor, rubber shredding, battering ram!

It's not AWD or FI but it has room for 5 and 470 horsepower and 470 lb-ft of torque starting at $46,660.

Beastly - I'll see if I can get a test drive and report back!

 

[reilo]

Audi S4?

 

[AlphaSnake]

335xi Coupe - will try this out
Audi S5 - been thinking about Audis in general, I don't know much about them. Any other models you'd recommend here? Same guy that owns the GTR has a Q7, engine blew up on him recently so he's pretty sour on them.

Did he have a 3.6? Those were terrible motors, they don't even build them anymore. If he had a 4.2L, he must've never changed its oil or beat the absolute hell out of it. I beat on my old 4.2L A6 until 80K, and ended up hurting the torque converter and the engine never so much as peeped at me until I traded it in. Otherwise, I haven't heard a single issue with the 3.0L Supercharged V6 that is available now in the S4, A6, and the S5. Take a look at all three. I now have a 2012 A6 3.0 Supercharged...it's a brilliant motor. I'm considering the APR tune (400HP) and looking into an exhaust of some sort, but not certain.

An S4 is very likely what you're looking for, though.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

Did he have a 3.6? Those were terrible motors, they don't even build them anymore. If he had a 4.2L, he must've never changed its oil or beat the absolute hell out of it. I beat on my old 4.2L A6 until 80K, and ended up hurting the torque converter and the engine never so much as peeped at me until I traded it in. Otherwise, I haven't heard a single issue with the 3.0L Supercharged V6 that is available now in the S4, A6, and the S5. Take a look at all three. I now have a 2012 A6 3.0 Supercharged...it's a brilliant motor. I'm considering the APR tune (400HP) and looking into an exhaust of some sort, but not certain.

An S4 is very likely what you're looking for, though.

4.2L is the V8 for the S5, right? Such a great engine.

Also, the SC'd V6 is awesome. Any V6 with an SC is pretty sweet. Audi makes great engines, they just can't fucking get their electronic reliability and general reliability on par. If they could get it up to Porsche level, they'd be a far better brand.

 

[AlphaSnake]

4.2L is the V8 for the S5, right? Such a great engine.

Also, the SC'd V6 is awesome. Any V6 with an SC is pretty sweet. Audi makes great engines, they just can't fucking get their electronic reliability and general reliability on par. If they could get it up to Porsche level, they'd be a far better brand.

The 4.2L has existed since the late 90s for Audi, it's just been refined with time from 290-300HP, to 335HP, then to 355HP, then to 375HP on the current A8, and then overhauled for 450HP in the RS5.

It's a bulletproof design, Audi's LSx, if you will. They could've definitely kept the basics of this motor around and just improved it by adding displacement and additional engineering.

But yeah, Audi's stupidity comes from the fact that they insist on using fiber optic wiring throughout the entire car. It's a mess. If Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Acura, etc. don't use F.O. on their cars with infotainment systems and achieve such fantastic levels of interface quality...why does Audi insist on this? In fact, that applies to Benz and BMW, as well. Germans feel like they have to be different for the sake of it. It's so annoying, but they do it intentionally so that service areas are busy. It's all a business, man.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

The 4.2L has existed since the late 90s for Audi, it's just been refined with time from 290-300HP, to 335HP, then to 355HP, then to 375HP on the current A8, and then overhauled for 450HP in the RS5.

It's a bulletproof design, Audi's LSx, if you will. They could've definitely kept the basics of this motor around and just improved it by adding displacement and additional engineering.

But yeah, Audi's stupidity comes from the fact that they insist on using fiber optic wiring throughout the entire car. It's a mess. If Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Acura, etc. don't use F.O. on their cars with infotainment systems and achieve such fantastic levels of interface quality...why does Audi insist on this? In fact, that applies to Benz and BMW, as well. Germans feel like they have to be different for the sake of it. It's so annoying, but they do it intentionally so that service areas are busy. It's all a business, man.

Agreed 100%. I HATE shit like that, and it's a huge reason why I won't buy a modern German car. It's very pretentious and short-sighted.

Plus I feel that Germans don't have the performance/$ ratio unlike Japanese and American cars. I can pick up a used Z06 for the same price as an M3 or S5... and it'll utterly rape those cars. I have also seen GTR's go for around $55-70k. Yes, there are lots of arguments to be made, but the truth of the matter is that in general, it costs more to own German cars, the performance isn't as good as Japanese/SOME American alternatives, and the cost to upgrade them is SO much more.

Just a small example: Ground Control makes coilovers (their springs, Koni yellow shocks) for a lot of cars. This is a very high quality setup, much better than your average "JDM" bullshit coilovers, right? For S2000: $900~. For an E36 M3: $1800+. What the fuck?Same thing with KW V3's: they were $2.3k retail for my S2000. The retail for them is closer to $3k for stuff like E46 M3's etc, yet they are pretty much the exact same design and don't have really anything extra other than different ways to mount them/valving differences/spring-rates.I call it the "German" tax. And the average BMW interior is nowhere near Lexus or Acura quality, if anyone wants to bring the interior BS into the equation.

Sorry for the huge rant, but I think it's so strange that beginning in the late90's, Audi, BMW, and Mercedes seem to have collectively thrown up their hands and said "fuck quality control, let's just do whatever the hell we want and if reliability suffers, so be it!"

 

[AlphaSnake]

BMW interiors are pretty tight, actually. My buddy was selling a 2000 X5 and 2001 740i on his lot, both were squeak free with over 100K miles on each. If anything, Benz interiors are not only ugly, but they're cheap and rattle too. Audi, though...cream of the crop.

Acura's interiors are decent, but their massive knob in the center console is ugly. Lexus' interiors are just plain boring looking, but the new 2012 GS350 is here to change all of that thankfully, looking more like a BMW interior than anything.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

BMW interiors are pretty tight, actually. My buddy was selling a 2000 X5 and 2001 740i on his lot, both were squeak free with over 100K miles on each. If anything, Benz interiors are not only ugly, but they're cheap and rattle too. Audi, though...cream of the crop.

Acura's interiors are decent, but their massive knob in the center console is ugly. Lexus' interiors are just plain boring looking, but the new 2012 GS350 is here to change all of that thankfully, looking more like a BMW interior than anything.

No way dude. BMW interiors have, for the last decade, been very underwhelming compared to Audi and Mercedes (and I know others see it the same way.)

Here's a 335i vs an S4:

To me, the 335i looks like a much 'cheaper' interior with not as much nice finish.

 

[Yeah_its_Bob]

Alright Automotive GAF - I'm looking to buy another car in the next 6 months or so.

I'm really interested in getting something with AWD and preferably forced induction, but I'm not into the full size SUVs. Honda is off the list as is Acura (however, the NSX reboot has caught my attention, looks like it will be amazing). New and used are both on the table. As for pricing, nothing too crazy (ie, anything approaching 6 figures is a non-starter).

A guy on my street has a GTR - amazing vehicle, just wasn't for me. I mean, I really liked it, but something about it didn't feel right. Couldn't really put my finger on what. Crazy performance for the money though.

I've looked at the Evo - very fun, still considering it, but I think it's a little too boy-racer for me. The 135i is a great ride too (yeah, I know RWD, but wow). I could probably be talked into a RWD platform, but FWD is out for sure.

I'm gonna take a Golf R for a spin as it looks like it will be a fun one. What else should I be considering? If you make a suggestion that I can try out, I'll make sure to report back here as to how it went!

So - in summary for features:

1. AWD (*maybe* RWD)
2. Forced Induction
3. Price is variable, but nothing crazy

It seem you are looking for a BOSS. I mean a Mustang Boss 2012 great handling and enough power also seat 4 and cost around 40,000. Or you can wait for the 2013 Shelby which makes 650 hp.

 

[reilo]

Agreed 100%. I HATE shit like that, and it's a huge reason why I won't buy a modern German car. It's very pretentious and short-sighted.

Plus I feel that Germans don't have the performance/$ ratio unlike Japanese and American cars. I can pick up a used Z06 for the same price as an M3 or S5... and it'll utterly rape those cars. I have also seen GTR's go for around $55-70k. Yes, there are lots of arguments to be made, but the truth of the matter is that in general, it costs more to own German cars, the performance isn't as good as Japanese/SOME American alternatives, and the cost to upgrade them is SO much more.

Sure, but then you are at a stop-light and look at the interior and say, "geez, no wonder this car is $30k cheaper".

Comparing luxury to high-performance affordable is a tricky tight-rope to walk.

 

[AlphaSnake]

No way dude. BMW interiors have, for the last decade, been very underwhelming compared to Audi and Mercedes (and I know others see it the same way.)

Here's a 335i vs an S4:

To me, the 335i looks like a much 'cheaper' interior with not as much nice finish.

In this instance, I actually much, much prefer the interior of the BMW. The B7 interior looked weird with the nav screen. It looks much nicer in the current B8 S4. I love the interior of my girlfriend's 335i Coupe, especially with the dark wood accent (not the ugly ones above). Her car isn't a convertible, but same exact interior below:

 

[BoobPhysics101]

Sure, but then you are at a stop-light and look at the interior and say, "geez, no wonder this car is $30k cheaper".

Comparing luxury to high-performance affordable is a tricky tight-rope to walk.

Agreed, but I really don't see German interiors being a huge, huge upgrade. Not $30k worth of upgrade, anyways.

For example, S2000 (AP2) interior:

E92 M3 interior:

$40k more worth of interior? Not to me. Then again, I'm not freaking out about the interior, I'm looking for a reliable car that can be upgraded to have amazing performance, has a great chassis, a strong engine, excellent steering, etc etc.

Perhaps I am simply too performance-focused to really put a huge priority on interior.

 

[reilo]

The thing that makes the BMW interior look cheap is the two-tone. I hate beige interiors. Will never own a car with beige interior ever again.

Funny you bring up the S2000 interior... I hated it when I drove my friend's S2K. It's completely nonsensical. The fact that the car controls are basically split into two different sections is bizarre. It's not very functional.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

Am I crazy or this car not awesome?

 

[BoobPhysics101]

The thing that makes the BMW interior look cheap is the two-tone. I hate beige interiors. Will never own a car with beige interior ever again.

Funny you bring up the S2000 interior... I hated it when I drove my friend's S2K. It's completely nonsensical. The fact that the car controls are basically split into two different sections is bizarre. It's not very functional.

You live in Bizarro World sometimes! S2000 interior is one of the greatest, most functional interiors for performance driving ever devised.

Everything is centralized around the driver/wheel. The shifter is literally inches away from the steering wheel, which means less time spent moving your hand to it.

All of the audio controls are to the left of the steering wheel (so you never actually have to touch or look at the CD player/radio), and all of the heating/air controls are to the right. They are positioned so that you spend a minimal amount of time with your hand away from the wheel. Everything is even angled slightly so that it's facing the driver. The passenger side is almost an afterthought.

There are few cars that come close in terms of being better designed around the driver being able to do everything he needs to do with minimal distraction or fuss. The car has been painstakingly designed to be driver-oriented, and it's glorious.

Look at that! Compare it to the 'holy fuck so many buttons let me look away from my driving so I can figure out what the fucking I'm doing' center cluster that most cars have, and especially the BMW's I posted above. Nonsensical? Ridiculous. And just to give you a comparison, here's your Mazdaspeed 6 cluster.

 

[reilo]

If you're gonna put the audio controls near the steering wheel... why not just put it ON the steering wheel? That has been standard practice for years.

Besides, if you are actually using this car up to its full potential (ie on a track), you won't be fucking around with the audio controls. It's weird to think of it that way because it would never happen. Ditto for the HVAC system.

I didn't find the interior functional nor user friendly at all. Not to mention I felt all of the controls were cramped into one spot, but that can be excused given the size of the car.

I get the thought behind it, but it's not applicable to real life world scenario and it just clutters up a space that should be minimal and sparse.

EDIT: The Speed6 interior is very clean and intuitive. HVAC, radio, clock management. That's it. Top to bottom. Not to mention the clean lines it exhibits and has a little bit of symmetry going on.

You are far overstating this "THE HANDS NEED TO BE ON THE WHEEL AT ALL TIMES" bullshit. That's never the case in a real life scenario, why clutter up the dashboard area?

 

[BoobPhysics101]

If you're gonna put the audio controls near the steering wheel... why not just put it ON the steering wheel? That has been standard practice for years.

Besides, if you are actually using this car up to its full potential (ie on a track), you won't be fucking around with the audio controls. It's weird to think of it that way because it would never happen. Ditto for the HVAC system.

I didn't find the interior functional nor user friendly at all. Not to mention I felt all of the controls were cramped into one spot, but that can be excused given the size of the car.

I get the thought behind it, but it's not applicable to real life world scenario and it just clutters up a space that should be minimal and sparse.

EDIT: The Speed6 interior is very clean and intuitive. HVAC, radio, clock management. That's it. Top to bottom. Not to mention the clean lines it exhibits and has a little bit of symmetry going on.

You are far overstating this "THE HANDS NEED TO BE ON THE WHEEL AT ALL TIMES" bullshit. That's never the case in a real life scenario, why clutter up the dashboard area?

I think you misunderstand the philosophy behind the car. It's entirely function over form in so many areas. The HVAC + radio stuff is situated so that minimal time is spent diddling with them and so that you're not accidentally hitting different buttons while driving if you do need to use them. The car came out in 1999, far before audio on the steering wheel was common. Also, that would've meant adding size to the steering wheel, compromising function for form.

The car really isn't meant for 'real life scenarios.' It was designed to be a pure performance car for track driving but also being acceptable to drive on public roads. The audio system, the HVAC, the radio is all meant simply as basic convenience and luxury. Honda offered the CR S2000's without radio and HVAC from the factory if desired, for example.

The car simply couldn't fit a huge big cluster in the middle, like your Speed 6, the BMW's, etc, nor did it fit into design philosophy. I know it seems strange compared to most cars, but when you live with the car and also use it for performance, the design is simple, excellent, and extremely functional. It's simple, no frills, and somewhat spartan - but the car was never meant to be a luxury cruiser or a daily driver.

 

[reilo]

Then why are you comparing it to luxury gran tourers...? You're bizarre. You basically started an argument with yourself.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

Then why are you comparing it to luxury gran tourers...? You're bizarre. You basically started an argument with yourself.

Main point was that 'is interior worth the extra $30k?' I brought up a couple of familiar examples. Perhaps I should've used an E46 M3 as an example, since that was a more fit comparison vs an S2000.

Perhaps a better example would be Mustang GT 5.0 vs E92 M3, which really comes down to 'fit and finish of the interior', right? Performance is extremely similar, but one costs 2x~ as much as the other.

 

[reilo]

You do realize my $30k comment was an exaggeration, right? Do you take everything literally?

 

[BoobPhysics101]

You do realize my $30k comment was an exaggeration, right? Do you take everything literally?

I think GT 5.0 vs M3 proves that your $30k comment isn't actually very far off-base, despite you having stating it as an exaggeration.

 

[reilo]

I think GT 5.0 vs M3 proves that your $30k comment isn't actually very far off-base, despite you having stating it as an exaggeration.

It's not, but the GT is one end of an extreme. I think the Corvette interior is pretty offensive, too, but at least it's somewhat of an improvement over the 2000 Vette, which basically sourced half its interior from a Chevy Lumina.

 

[BruiserBear]

For me a BMW that was as reliable as a Japanese car would truly be the "ultimate driving machine". I feel like every single car in their lineup is pure sex on wheels. Unfortunately I'll probably never own one. :/

I bought a TSX in late 2006 precisely because it gave me that feeling that I get from a smaller BMW sedan. Of course it's not that similar in a lot of ways, but it was something about the essence of that car that gave me the feeling I get when I see BMWs. Simple but elegant with clean lines.

Unfortunately I got concerned about money and sold it off a year later. I've regretted it ever since. The money concerns I had were unfounded and I'm currently considering snatching up the same car if I can find it for the right price, and lowish miles.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

It's not, but the GT is one end of an extreme. I think the Corvette interior is pretty offensive, too, but at least it's somewhat of an improvement over the 2000 Vette, which basically sourced half its interior from a Chevy Lumina.

God, don't remind me... the C5 Vettes have some of the most horrific interiors ever. It's so offensive that it's distracting.


NSFW

 

[ascii42]

God, don't remind me... the C5 Vettes have some of the most horrific interiors ever. It's so offensive that it's distracting.
NSFW

That actually makes the current one look good.

 

[the_log_ride]

If you're gonna put the audio controls near the steering wheel... why not just put it ON the steering wheel? That has been standard practice for years.

Besides, if you are actually using this car up to its full potential (ie on a track), you won't be fucking around with the audio controls. It's weird to think of it that way because it would never happen. Ditto for the HVAC system.

I didn't find the interior functional nor user friendly at all. Not to mention I felt all of the controls were cramped into one spot, but that can be excused given the size of the car.

I get the thought behind it, but it's not applicable to real life world scenario and it just clutters up a space that should be minimal and sparse.
EDIT: The Speed6 interior is very clean and intuitive. HVAC, radio, clock management. That's it. Top to bottom. Not to mention the clean lines it exhibits and has a little bit of symmetry going on.

You are far overstating this "THE HANDS NEED TO BE ON THE WHEEL AT ALL TIMES" bullshit. That's never the case in a real life scenario, why clutter up the dashboard area?

Let me get this straight. You didn't think the S2K interior was functional or user friendly? You say that the controls are cramped in one spot, yet the placement serves to keep the interior as spartan and clean as possible. Just trying to understand where you're coming from.

 

[Halvie]

Alright Automotive GAF - I'm looking to buy another car in the next 6 months or so.

I'm really interested in getting something with AWD and preferably forced induction, but I'm not into the full size SUVs. Honda is off the list as is Acura (however, the NSX reboot has caught my attention, looks like it will be amazing). New and used are both on the table. As for pricing, nothing too crazy (ie, anything approaching 6 figures is a non-starter).

A guy on my street has a GTR - amazing vehicle, just wasn't for me. I mean, I really liked it, but something about it didn't feel right. Couldn't really put my finger on what. Crazy performance for the money though.

I've looked at the Evo - very fun, still considering it, but I think it's a little too boy-racer for me. The 135i is a great ride too (yeah, I know RWD, but wow). I could probably be talked into a RWD platform, but FWD is out for sure.

I'm gonna take a Golf R for a spin as it looks like it will be a fun one. What else should I be considering? If you make a suggestion that I can try out, I'll make sure to report back here as to how it went!

So - in summary for features:

1. AWD (*maybe* RWD)
2. Forced Induction
3. Price is variable, but nothing crazy

Don't waste your time.

TTRS. Without a second thought.

1M if you can find one.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

Don't waste your time.

TTRS. Without a second thought.

Shit, forgot about those. But isn't it only a 2 seater?

(p.s. fuckin' VW fanboy ;P) hahahah

 

[Halvie]

Shit, forgot about those. But isn't it only a 2 seater?

(p.s. fuckin' VW fanboy ;P) hahahah

Yeah 2 seater basically. Must have missed that in the requirements he listed. Saw the GT-R, so just assumed. Think you are nuts for not picking up the GT-R if you can swing it.

Only recommending it cause I like the engine(and steering wheel). Finally getting back to what they are best at (imo) .

If we got the RS3 I would say that then

Can't think of much else that is FI really. S60R? That is awd, right? S4(face lift for 2013)? C63. Even thought it isn't awd / fi they are bonkers.

 

[mickcenary]

Peugeot 205 GTI. So besotted with this car right now. I have a standard 306 from '97 and while it is a lovely car, the amount of character/charm just does not compare.

 

[Halvie]

Peugeot 205 GTI. So besotted with this car right now. I have a standard 306 from '97 and while it is a lovely car, the amount of character/charm just does not compare.

x2

 

[weekend_warrior]

If you have GTR money, that means you have M5 money.

Or Mercedes Benz S63 AMG money.

 

[h1nch]

No way dude. BMW interiors have, for the last decade, been very underwhelming compared to Audi and Mercedes (and I know others see it the same way.)

Here's a 335i vs an S4:

To me, the 335i looks like a much 'cheaper' interior with not as much nice finish.

I agree that the E90 interiors were/are less flashy than a lot of their competitors, especially in photos. I used to dislike the E90 interior until I spent time in one. I think they have a lot of subtle touches that look great in person, such as the way the gauges are slightly raised, and the metallic border around them, etc. I prefer the E90 interior to the B7, but much prefer the B8 (too much hard plastic around the shift lever though). I think a lot of it has to do with the quality of the materials, which isn't very apparent in photos. BMW interiors, spartan as they may be, don't have much hard cheap plastic, and the dials and buttons feel solid.

Overall I dislike Japanese and American interiors. Too tacky and spaceship-like for my tastes. I guess I just have a thing for horizontally oriented german interiors.

 

[nitewulf]

S2000 itself, when it was new, was an expensive car. these aren't meant for little boys, they are two seater roadsters for executives and businessmen, professionals.

As for the BMW interiors, it depends, I have the chrome finished interior, which is part plastic, part metal. It's pretty sleek. But interior is more than just the dash. The seats, fit and finish of the seats, the color theme etc all come into play. My interior is Red Coral leather, sport seats with lumber support, you can depress it and inflate it at will to fit the contours of your back, etc. The interior is pretty tight.

As for the guy looking for a new ride, if you aren't too hung up on a turbo/supercharger...think about an E92 M3, naturally aspirated V8, 414 HP.

 

[twinturbo2]

Now that the redesigned Porsche 911 is out in the wild, it's time for the Boxster to get its time in the sun.

Jalopnik has some of the first details- more power, wider width, more toys, and lighter weight.

http://jalopnik.com/5875351/the-2013-porsche-boxster-is-longer-wider-lighter-better

 

[AlphaSnake]

Headlights look goofy, but the I like the improved interior. They finally got rid of that ugly 'brow' line across the center console that the Carrera has been sporting all these years, including the new one.

 

[twinturbo2]

Headlights look goofy, but the I like the improved interior. They finally got rid of that ugly 'brow' line across the center console that the Carrera has been sporting all these years, including the new one.

The headlight design was swiped from the 918 RSR concept, fwiw.

 

[ameratsu]

US-spec Abarth 500 pricing starts at$22,700 with destination and a day at a HPDE class included.

First GAFfer to get one wins my affection.

Sort of want. Not looking forward to hearing about the Canadian premium on this though.

Spoiler

I predicted it would be at least $26k in Canada earlier in this thread

 

[aznpxdd]

I prefer the E90 interior to the B7, but much prefer the B8 (too much hard plastic around the shift lever though). I think a lot of it has to do with the quality of the materials, which isn't very apparent in photos. BMW interiors, spartan as they may be, don't have much hard cheap plastic, and the dials and buttons feel solid.

Wat. BMW's interior plastic are shit.

Coming from someone who spent a lot of time driving an E90 335i, X3 and X1.

 

[SlickWilly223]

I'm in the market for a decently size manual transmission sedan.. $30,000 cap but I would prefer not to get something that expensive.

Should I just get a Volkswagen Passat TDI? After I built one on their website, it came out to like 26,000. And I'd probably save a lot of money on fuel.

Thoughts?