Yeah, I'll take the C7 over the RS7.
Also, the train wreck rolls on at Lexus...
Why, Lexus, why?? That is horrid. Have the Japanese forgotten how to make a good looking car?
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The Automotive Discussion Thread
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Why, Lexus, why?? That is horrid. Have the Japanese forgotten how to make a good looking car?
CosmicGroinPull
Member
Viperbah
Member
I'm 29 and hate imports. Muscle beats imports everytime. EVERYTIME
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8c4VcTnLvc
SteveMeister
Hang out with Steve.
Cadillac unveiled the ELR. It's gorgeous, beautifully appointed, has tons of very cool tech. Uses the VoltTec powertrain, supposedly will get about 1 mile shorter electric range and a total electric + gas range of about 300 miles. GM claims it'll perform better than the Volt (but still not really anything to write home about).
BUT, it looks like it's going to cost $55-$60k, if not more. This is squarely in Tesla Model S 60kwh battery territory (230 mile range). I think I'd opt for the Model S. Not only is it similarly priced, it's significantly faster, has a lot more space, and of course is a pure-electric, the advantage being one of simplicity in the drivetrain.
BUT, it looks like it's going to cost $55-$60k, if not more. This is squarely in Tesla Model S 60kwh battery territory (230 mile range). I think I'd opt for the Model S. Not only is it similarly priced, it's significantly faster, has a lot more space, and of course is a pure-electric, the advantage being one of simplicity in the drivetrain.
The 60kWh Tesla costs $70k before the $7500 tax credit. So there's still the potential for a pretty good price difference between the two if the $55k - $60k estimate is before the tax credit. (Man, if people bitched about tax credits subsidizing Volt purchases after bailing out "Government Motors," wait until they hear about subsidizing Cadillac purchases).
+5 internets!
BTW everyone: 2013 WRC season preview! http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=26961
Does anyone know where we can find english TV coverage of it?
SteveMeister
Hang out with Steve.
Not quite - the base price for the 60kWh S is $62,400 before the $7500 tax credit -- although if you add the high power wall connector, twin chargers and access to the Supercharger network you'll bump that up to $67,100 (again before the tax credit).
A fully loaded 60kWh S tops out at $76k. Check out the configurator here.
My understanding is that Red Bull has taken over ownership of the coverage so I imagine they will have details on how to watch it.
edit: It looks like there isnt even any concrete information on how it is going to be broadcast in the UK. Such a shame.
It says "With $7500 Tax Credit" in the configurator.
It also says "After $7500 Tax Credit" here http://www.teslamotors.com/models/options
SteveMeister
Hang out with Steve.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Infiniti Q50 (G37 redesign) looks damn good. Also, as far as I know, Acuras last redesign (what they have out now, with that transformers grille) have been actually designed in the US.
Lexus was always iffy to me. Slightly spiced up toyota-level interior, and only IS had good looking exterior. This is par for the course for them IMO.
Today was a day for driving. Terrible weather for it here in the South with a cool, grey drizzle that's lasted for days but I was off of work so it was time.
I first drove an Audi A3 Sportwagon. 2012 model CPO at the Audi dealership. Nice looking on the outside and of course beautiful on the inside. Tan leather with black accents which is a great combination. The steering, shifter and clutch were all much lighter than I'm used to and the road noise was a little more than I'd want in a premium brand car but overall it was a nice car and I could see myself driving one.
Next up was a G37. I actually drove two of them, one a sedan with the 7 speed automatic (2009) and one a coupe with the 6 speed manual (2012), both at the Infiniti dealership. The G37 surprised me a little bit with its willingness to play. The roads were wet and the salesman kept encouraging me to goose the throttle and I was able to get the rear end to kick out just about at will which was pretty fun. The G37 is also one of those rare cars that I prefer the auto over the manual transmission. The auto in sport mode shifted quickly and was pretty much always where I wanted it to be whereas the manual had a lot of driveline thrash coming through the stickshift that was very out of place in an upscale car. Steering was nicely weighted which is something I find Nissan does rather well in it's sporty cars. I also didn't like the interior all that much. It's looking a little bit dated at this point and overly busy for my taste although it was comfortable and roomy.
Next was a 328i coupe with a 6 speed. 2009 model. It was Platinum Bronze with a Saddle leather interior and while I'm fairly neutral on the exterior color that saddle leather interior was awesome. After the busyness of the G37 the more spartan, driver focused BMW interior was appreciated and definitely more to my taste. I like the coupe lines much more than the sedan and even in the "base" 328i I thought the car had plenty of power and of course the smoothness of the power delivery is pretty much BMW's claim to fame. It's stellar, is what I'm saying. The steering and shifter were lighter than my Porsche and the G37 but also more direct and connected feeling than the Audi I drove first. I actually don't praise BMW here like some do as I felt the feel was "fine" but nothing to write home about. Still, I liked the car a great deal and I can tell why the 3 series is so popular. It does just about everything well and it's not offensive in really any way.
Last up was an IS250. Since finding one of those with a manual transmission is just about impossible I ended up trying out an automatic AWD version from 2010. It was dark blue with a light colored interior and had the softest leather I've ever felt in a car interior. Seriously, it was pillow soft. I immediately liked the interior better than the G37 although it's still busier and slightly more cramped feeling than the BMW or the Audi. The brakes were weird in that they would do nothing for an inch and then suddenly grab hard but other than that the car drove well if less athletically than the G37 or the 328i. The IS250 is a very solid feeling car and a good looking one but I was surprised that it transmitted more road noise into the cabin than the G37 or the BMW. I thought Lexus cars were supposed to be really quiet? At any rate I was surprised at how much I liked the IS250 given it's Toyota heritage and it's small'ish engine and automatic transmission.
Tomorrow I'm going to call and get some insurance rates and check out some maintenance histories on some of these cars. Unlike some I'm not afraid of a used German car if it's been well maintained and is in good working order.
The same dealership had the BMW and the Lexus and they made me a very good offer on the BMW that would decrease my monthly payment by about $125 with a better interest rate than I have on my Porsche. I'm tempted but I don't want to jump into anything.
I first drove an Audi A3 Sportwagon. 2012 model CPO at the Audi dealership. Nice looking on the outside and of course beautiful on the inside. Tan leather with black accents which is a great combination. The steering, shifter and clutch were all much lighter than I'm used to and the road noise was a little more than I'd want in a premium brand car but overall it was a nice car and I could see myself driving one.
Next up was a G37. I actually drove two of them, one a sedan with the 7 speed automatic (2009) and one a coupe with the 6 speed manual (2012), both at the Infiniti dealership. The G37 surprised me a little bit with its willingness to play. The roads were wet and the salesman kept encouraging me to goose the throttle and I was able to get the rear end to kick out just about at will which was pretty fun. The G37 is also one of those rare cars that I prefer the auto over the manual transmission. The auto in sport mode shifted quickly and was pretty much always where I wanted it to be whereas the manual had a lot of driveline thrash coming through the stickshift that was very out of place in an upscale car. Steering was nicely weighted which is something I find Nissan does rather well in it's sporty cars. I also didn't like the interior all that much. It's looking a little bit dated at this point and overly busy for my taste although it was comfortable and roomy.
Next was a 328i coupe with a 6 speed. 2009 model. It was Platinum Bronze with a Saddle leather interior and while I'm fairly neutral on the exterior color that saddle leather interior was awesome. After the busyness of the G37 the more spartan, driver focused BMW interior was appreciated and definitely more to my taste. I like the coupe lines much more than the sedan and even in the "base" 328i I thought the car had plenty of power and of course the smoothness of the power delivery is pretty much BMW's claim to fame. It's stellar, is what I'm saying. The steering and shifter were lighter than my Porsche and the G37 but also more direct and connected feeling than the Audi I drove first. I actually don't praise BMW here like some do as I felt the feel was "fine" but nothing to write home about. Still, I liked the car a great deal and I can tell why the 3 series is so popular. It does just about everything well and it's not offensive in really any way.
Last up was an IS250. Since finding one of those with a manual transmission is just about impossible I ended up trying out an automatic AWD version from 2010. It was dark blue with a light colored interior and had the softest leather I've ever felt in a car interior. Seriously, it was pillow soft. I immediately liked the interior better than the G37 although it's still busier and slightly more cramped feeling than the BMW or the Audi. The brakes were weird in that they would do nothing for an inch and then suddenly grab hard but other than that the car drove well if less athletically than the G37 or the 328i. The IS250 is a very solid feeling car and a good looking one but I was surprised that it transmitted more road noise into the cabin than the G37 or the BMW. I thought Lexus cars were supposed to be really quiet? At any rate I was surprised at how much I liked the IS250 given it's Toyota heritage and it's small'ish engine and automatic transmission.
Tomorrow I'm going to call and get some insurance rates and check out some maintenance histories on some of these cars. Unlike some I'm not afraid of a used German car if it's been well maintained and is in good working order.
The same dealership had the BMW and the Lexus and they made me a very good offer on the BMW that would decrease my monthly payment by about $125 with a better interest rate than I have on my Porsche. I'm tempted but I don't want to jump into anything.
Finally finished wrapping/sewing my steering wheel! Love how it looks now...
That looks stupid and lame and I am not even jealous.
twinturbo2
butthurt Heat fan
So you're jelly, then.
A skosh.
Finally finished wrapping/sewing my steering wheel! Love how it looks now...
I'm torn. Not to diss it, but the material (maybe bad pic?) looks a bit like sponge foam grips I've seen. Is it alcantara? Also still not convinced that alcantara is a good material for contact surfaces, but if you're happy, that's what matters! How much did it run you? How difficult was it?
How does it match up with the rest of the interior?
Looking for one of these, myself:
Looks good, but not as good as the best modern BMW steering wheel ever, but that would probably be too expensive and might not have fit in the X1.
Not sure if this has been posted, but I didn't see it yet and wanted to share:
http://www.topgear.com/uk/photos/The-Top-Gear-magazine-Car-of-the-Year-2013-01-17
yeah, I know, not as good as a Jag, but still.
While driving through America recently, James May and I happened upon a car of such unparalleled awfulness that we slowed down to get a closer look. It was called a Nissan Versa, and I simply can't imagine what the design team was thinking of when they were styling it. The Austin A35, probably. Both of us agreed it was the worst car we had ever seen and that, in all of our lives, we'd never encounter a machine that we'd like the look of less. But then, round the very next corner, we stumbled upon a Chevrolet something or other which was even more terrible. Part Chrysler PT Cruiser and part Morris Traveller, it was a disjointed mishmash of nothing that anyone likes.
And then later, while hanging around in a San Diego car park, we noticed another car. We had no idea what it was. It had four wheels, four doors and was made from metal. There were windows and doors, and neither of us could come up with a single reason why someone should have bought such a thing. It wasn't as stupid as the Nissan and Chevy we'd seen earlier. In fact, it wasn't stupid at all. Nor was it ugly. It was nothing. It was just a car-shaped hole in the view. Later, we learned it was a Hyundai. We even found out which model. But we can't remember now.
I'll be honest. I struggle to put a name to most of the cars I see on the road today. Gone are the days when you could spot a MkI Cortina even though you had only caught a glimpse of its rear tail-lights. Now, many cars are just tools, as individual as washing machines. They come. They get reviewed in What Car? They go. That's why I like the GT86 so much. Because it's come barrelling into the bottom end of the marketplace with a big, dirty smile on its face and a suggestion in the way it stands that it would like to have fun with your middle parts. It's a car designed for one thing only: fun. First and foremost, it has rear-wheel drive. This is very important. Of course, you can propel a car by the front wheels in the same way that you can make a sauce using cornflour. But if you want to do it properly, you need a roux. And that means turning the engine around and fitting a propshaft. Yes, it's more of a faff, and you end up with a smaller boot and less space in the cabin, but these things should not trouble the genuine petrolhead. Because when you have rear drive, you have balance. You have a division of labour. The front wheels to the steering. The ones at the back to the propulsion.
Also, when you have rear-wheel drive, you can do better skids. And to make sure you can do those skids at low speeds - so it's nice and safe if (when) something goes wrong - the GT86 is not fitted with fat, grippy tyres. Instead, it sits on the same rubber Toyota uses on the Prius. Of course, there's no point going to all the trouble of fitting rear drive if you then put the engine from an electric screwdriver under the bonnet. See the original MX-5 for details on this. And, at first, I thought Toyota had fallen into the same trap. Two litres in a modern heavy car doesn't seem like enough. But it is. Just. And just' is enough. Because it means you can get the car into a slide and hold it there. Well, you can't, obviously, because you are on a road. But you could, if you weren't.
The GT86 is a lovely car to drive. The steering is without fault, the ride is sporty without being stupid, the handling is epic, the grip is poor, by which I mean excellent, and there is enough oomph to ensure you aren't last away from the lights. Inside, you get all the toys you need and none that will only ever be used once, by the salesperson in the showroom, and then never used again. Apart from cruise control.
Likewise, Toyota hasn't bothered with much in the way of hand-stitched leather or carbon-fibre cupholdery. Because if it had, the car would have been £35,000. And that would have put it up against a BMW M135i in a battle it couldn't win and shouldn't be fighting in the first place. Normally, I would argue that there is no such thing as cheap and cheerful. There is cheap and disgusting or expensive and cheerful. But here is an exception. It is cheaper than a BMW M135i. And it is more cheerful. It's not especially good-looking, and it doesn't make an especially intoxicating noise. And it only seems to be available in quite the most revolting red I've ever seen. But none of this matters once you push the starter button, put some tunes on the stereo, snick it into first and set off.
In traffic, you'll be in a car, same as everyone else. You're no better off than Simon Cowell in his Roller or that foolish idiot in the Nissan Versa. It's the same story on the motorway. But there will come a moment when the traffic thins, the police aren't looking and there's a nice bit of road ahead. At a time like this, a GT86 will make you happy. You will be revelling in the sort of thrills normally only on offer to the super-rich, but your thrill is better, because it's not scary. To make a Ferrari misbehave, you need to be doing Mach 2. To make a GT86 squirrel about, you only need be doing 20.
And even then, it's so composed that you know exactly what you should do next. Brake is my suggestion. And then get in the back. Because this car is so well sorted, it'd probably make a better fist of rescuing the situation than you would. It's not a great car. But it is a very good car at a great price. Which makes it a pleasant oddity. And that's why it's my choice for Car of the Year. It is also the reason - after a long argument involving lots of people shouting about Range Rovers - that the GT86 scoops the big prize. This is the Top Gear magazine Car of the Year. And a worthy, cheap, and terribly amusing winner it is.
http://www.topgear.com/uk/photos/The-Top-Gear-magazine-Car-of-the-Year-2013-01-17
yeah, I know, not as good as a Jag, but still.
British definition of cheap is different than the US, and on that front the BRZ fails miserably.
haters still gonna hate tho.
Because some of us have issues with the way it looks and its price?
MisterNoisy
Member
Styling is subjective, but what's wrong with the price?
I'll admit it's no modern Bimmer or Merc in the 'wtf is that stupid front bumper' category, but it's un-ugly enough for the bright side to shine through easily.
And its price is fine. There's a floor to how cheap you can make a completely new car on an unshared platform. Considering this isn't also some sedan or minivan somewhere else, it's not bad.
In that case, Heil Toyota! Sieg Subaru!
Addition:
This guy seems to keep up to date video on the WRC in case anyone is looking! https://www.youtube.com/user/WRCforeva
Lagspike_exe
Member
A Japanese car winning Car of the Year award in Top Gear in the same year the new Range Rover came out is quite an achievement.
Yes, I ended up trading it today. The weather has been so terrible down here in the South lately with all of this rain that I think the dealers were getting desperate to move some vehicles. I really wasn't planning on purchasing yet but I got offered a very good deal on a car I liked and was comfortable with so I took it.
I ended up going with the AWD Lexus IS250. It's a 2010 with 34k miles on it, one owner just off of lease 10 days ago and it had a good service history which I have come to appreciate. I'll miss the directness of the Porsche and it's gorgeous curves but the Lexus still has enough sizzle for me while being far more practical and comfortable. And it's going to cost me $100 less a month in car payment which my wife already is excited about.
Slayer-33
Liverpool-2
Not in dat look dept son.
ClassyPenguin
Banned
He's a huge fan of the MX5 and other low power driver's cars, so it's no surprise.
It's an expensive car to make. Would have been better if they did without the Boxer engine but Subaru will be Subaru.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
So...when he hates a car that everyone else loves, that means it's really bad or something?
Clarkson's a dummy. An entertainer first, a journalist last.
Logic doesn't necessarily work like that. And I don't he's a dummy, he just plays one on TV.
I certainly don't take his opinions to heart (I like American cars too much for that to be possible), but I always find them interesting. Clarkson's good at telling you about how great a car is, then telling you it actually sucks. Or he'll tell you how crappy the car is the whole review, then he'll tell you it's actually great. The Audi R8 vs. Corvette ZR1 review on Top Gear is a good example of both.
Yeah, I can't imagine if Subaru came out a car without AWD or a Boxer engine.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
It is.
33-Hit-Combo
Member
The Toyobaru Train rolls on - GM planning a RWD FR-S rival:
http://www.autoblog.com/2013/01/17/gms-reuss-says-rear-wheel-drive-scion-fr-s-rival-on-the-list/
This is good for everyone! Maybe it'll get Hyundai and Nissan to put the next Gencoupe and Z on a diet.
http://www.autoblog.com/2013/01/17/gms-reuss-says-rear-wheel-drive-scion-fr-s-rival-on-the-list/
This is good for everyone! Maybe it'll get Hyundai and Nissan to put the next Gencoupe and Z on a diet.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
At 3200lbs, with airbags eveyrwhere and an interior full of upscale features, a large motor, ~50/50 weight distribution, the Z doesn't need a diet. It's pretty lightweight as is.
weekend_warrior
Banned
Reminds me of my old Monte Carlo, which isn't necessarily a good thing...
If it's over 2,500lbs, it's not worth building.
Lightweight is 2500 lbs. Anything up to 3000 or so is middle weight at best. Once you clear 3200, you're firmly into heavy territory.
No one would call a Mk IV Supra a lightweight car, for example, and that's in the same league here.
Bring out a Z with fewer airbags, less 'upscale features', and you can probably save 200lbs easy. I'm hoping the next one gets back to its roots, because I always wanted an early Z.
YuriLowell
Member
Waits for 370Z Defense Force.
The 370Z Defense Force is already here.
Just confirmed with my wife, this will be our next car. I'm still waiting on pricing to be announced to see if we will get the Overland or the Limited. I would love to have the Summit or SRT8, but I bet the price would put us over our budget.
:lol
What about a Corvette Z06, which is around 3200 lbs as well? That's about as light as you're going to get with a car with a V8.
BrokenEchelon
Banned
We need to go lighter.
If you really think more than one and a half tons is light, you've got your head in the clouds. I mean come on. A Ford Fusion base model is only 100-200 lbs heavier. A family sedan.
Let's get real here. You may like it, it may be a fine car, but it is heavy. You can't argue this except relative to a Ford F-150 or something.
We need to go lighter.
Drop a small block in there and you'll be good to go.
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