Zoe
Member
That's for changing the 'masu' form, and it's 'shou' not 'sho'. If you're using plain form, it's "kikou", "ikou", "nomou", etc.
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The Big Ass Superior Thread of Learning Japanese
- Thread starter RevenantKioku
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That's for changing the 'masu' form, and it's 'shou' not 'sho'. If you're using plain form, it's "kikou", "ikou", "nomou", etc.
To elaborate on Zoe's answer, it's not dictionary form + shou, but plain form (kiku, iku, nomu) with the "u" replaced with "ou". If you're using -masu form, it's kikimashou, ikimashou, nomimashou etc.
Thanks, guys. I always forget about the "u" in "shou." I always pronounce it with the u intact, but I always forget that it actually exists!
And we haven't gone over this specific grammar lesson yet for short form. It'll be good to know this when we touch upon it. Again, thanks!
Reading is really hard in the beginning with all languages. I remember when I first started trying to read Chinese. Just like you, my head hurt so much after just a few sentences. Now i can read almost effortlessly if I know most of the words. You just have to stick to it.
Regarding listening, you just have to do it all the time. Going to the store? Listen to a podcast. Playing a game? Listen while you play. And so on. Everything will come together. I know that many consider Korean a very hard language when it comes to understanding speech, so this becomes extra important.
Best way to learn vocab in my opinion is extensive reading (as opposed to intensive reading). When you get somewhat comfortable with reading you should read a lot of stuff relating to many different subjects. You will see the same words over and over again and because you're reading in a context it will be easier to remember. I have never really tried worldlists or stuff like that, so I can't really comment on that. This is just how I do it.
Btw, I'm not learning Japanese or Korean but I like coming into the this thread and checking out what everyone's doing and so on. I think most, if not all, learning concepts apply to all languages.
Splash Wave
Member
I never had time to take Japanese while I was at UC Berkeley, but I'm remedying that now--this Saturday marks my first attempt at learning the language, and I could not not be more excited. There's a place called in San Francisco called Soko Gakuen that offers incredibly cheap classes.
Since I only just graduated and I'm working part time, I figure this is the perfect time to learn.
Since I only just graduated and I'm working part time, I figure this is the perfect time to learn.
ImpassionateGods
Member
What is the difference between 時、〜たら、and dictionary form + と？
It seems to me they all translate to "When I do X" and I can't figure when it is and isn't acceptable to use them. My japanese teacher's explanation doesn't make much sense to me.
It seems to me they all translate to "When I do X" and I can't figure when it is and isn't acceptable to use them. My japanese teacher's explanation doesn't make much sense to me.
Hrm, so this is just my first impressions but... let's use "to do" (する） as an example
勉強する時 = While I'm studying...
勉強したら = After I've studied...
勉強すると = If/When I've studied...
I can't really back it up with the grammatical proof, but that's the difference I get in my mind. Hopefully others can chime in... heh.
I got really sick yesterday and don't think I will be studying for a few days at most. Anyone know what happens in Anki if you don't review for a few days? I am assuming the reviews pile up, but I'm not sure if the number of reviews will continue to stay high or anything.
My understanding is:
dictionary form + と expresses an inevitable consequence - so "when you push the button, the light comes on". You can't use that for, say, "when I rule the world, I will buy everyone a pony" - that would be a 〜たら situation. Remember that the たら ending can be used for conditional sentences as well, so there's a degree of uncertainty about it - it's not inevitable that it's going to happen.
plain form + 時, on the other hand, has nothing to do with consequences. It's just "when (something happens), (something else will happen)" (or its past equivalent). The 時 part is literally just locating the action at a particular time.
Getting it done for free is a crapshoot of finding people who have their own reasons to care.
Out of curiosity, what is it and what's it for?
Worst case it you'll have a bit of "spikes" down the road, assuming you work all of your backlog off in one day. Only the "due" cards pile up. The daily new cards do not.
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I now finished Kanjidamage and at chapter 29 of 40 of the HumanJapanese App.
Not sure where to go after this.
ImpassionateGods
Member
Does this sentence make sense?
もうすませないと思います.
I'm trying to say something along the lines of "I don't think I'll finish anymore".
もうすませないと思います.
I'm trying to say something along the lines of "I don't think I'll finish anymore".
I'd be more than happy to pay for it, I just don't know where to go to get the best translation. It's 5 or 6 pages describing art techniques written in Japanese.
Context?
ImpassionateGods
Member
I was emailing my teacher to let her know my video camera malfunctioned so I wouldn't be able to finish my project when I originally said I could. I got it worked out though.
vas_a_morir
Banned
Question JLPT N1-Gaf:
Honestly, how big of a jump is it from N2 to N1? Say, compared to N3 to N2? I'm studying throughout the year early, and I'm just wondering how different of an experience it will be compared to N2. (I've only ever taken the N2 test)
Honestly, how big of a jump is it from N2 to N1? Say, compared to N3 to N2? I'm studying throughout the year early, and I'm just wondering how different of an experience it will be compared to N2. (I've only ever taken the N2 test)
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I took 1 almost ten years ago now, but I don't think 2->1 is that much of a jump at all. From a grammar standpoint it's almost a waste to just study for 2 and not go a bit further to include 1. From a kanji standpoint I can see how people might get a little more intimidated. If kanji's not a big deal for you, it's better to just go all the way. I guess the comparison would be like 4->3, but def not as big as 3->2.
Thanks! I feel a lot better and am slowly trying to work it off today. Hopefully studying will go back to normal tomorrow.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I took and passed JLPT 1 back in 2005. It was the only time I've ever taken the JLPT, so I can't compare it to earlier levels, but I don't really see the point in taking anything but the highest level.
Maybe I'm just unaware, but I've never seen any kind of job posting or qualification requisite that lists anything below JLPT 1 (or N1 now). It seems to me that it would be best to just study for JLPT 1 and keep trying it until you pass.
vas_a_morir
Banned
I agree. People shouldn't waste their time with N2 unless you need something to motivate you to study.
I haven't seen many job postings asking for JLPT anything, but I did see one that asked for a minimum of JLPT N2.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I'm moving to Japan in August for school but I know very little Japanese. I can read katakana/hiragana and some kanji and can form basic sentences using grammatical rules that I've learned over time.
Since I only have four months to go, what can you guys recommend me to do with the remaining time I have? What programs should I use to study? Thank you!
Since I only have four months to go, what can you guys recommend me to do with the remaining time I have? What programs should I use to study? Thank you!
vas_a_morir
Banned
Aren't you the one who asked the question?
Yeah. But, I do agree with his answer that the JLPT is fairly useless.
Splash Wave
Member
What's the difference between "ja, mata" and "dewa mata"?
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Jya is slightly more casual, deha is slightly more polite.
CornBurrito
Member
So the OP is all about Kanji. I want to start learning Japanese, and it seems ridiculous to just jump into Kanji. I assume I should first learn Hiragana, right?
What's the best way to learn Hiragana? Any interesting sites that make it more interesting than rote? Or sites where I can download worksheets?
How important is learning Katakana? Can I save that for last and learn Hiragana and a few Kanji before jumping into that?
What's the best way to learn Hiragana? Any interesting sites that make it more interesting than rote? Or sites where I can download worksheets?
How important is learning Katakana? Can I save that for last and learn Hiragana and a few Kanji before jumping into that?
When I learned hiragana, I had to simply write down the characters hundreds of time. There isn't really a simple way to remember hiragana besides repetition. Flashcards were also useful.
And katakana is very important. Katakana contains all of the foreign words, so words like coffee or sports will always be written in katakana.
CornBurrito
Member
Alright. I'll print out a Hiragana chart and get to writing.
I wish Kanji didn't exist.
I wish Kanji didn't exist.
Once you'll know them, you'll wish they were used in every single language on the planet.
Nothing beats meaning-centered, pronunciation independent symbols as a means of basic written international communication (in the absence of a universal language, obviously).
See numbers, for example.
Alright. I'll print out a Hiragana chart and get to writing.
I wish Kanji didn't exist.
Kanji is actually pretty neat. When you retain some of the characters, it makes translating and reading Japanese a lot easier. Hiragana gets meshed together, so it becomes somewhat of a nightmare to read them at times (especially on a computer). Kanji is great to distinguish when a word ends, a particule happens, and then when a new word begins. Now the pain is the ass is actually remembering said kanji.
I am about to complete Japanese II, and I am still amazed of the lack of seeing a formal plural system. Does that even exist for Japanese, or is it merely based on context?
CornBurrito
Member
But pronunciation matters for READING Kanji out loud and I haven't a clue how you figure that out.
Sounds like a problem that could be fixed with punctuation :/
There are some pluralization systems, but they're not universal or even close to it. Mostly you're looking at context.
Practice, more practice, and a recognition that lots of kanji are tagged with a radical that does nothing but give you the reading.
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
5 months in and I'm still kinda slow at reading Hiragana and Katakana. Slightly doing better only.
Also, what are good (or probably easy) Kanji words to practice for beginners?
Also, what are good (or probably easy) Kanji words to practice for beginners?
HumanJapanese is very good, imo.
The follow up, intermediate version, has just been released on ipad and should follow on other platforms soon.
Practice, practice, practice! Kana are a week or two of effort, and that's college syllabi talking, not my ego. Anyone can do it, and you can too!
Zoe
Member
Be sure to use one that shows the stroke order. It actually helps even if you don't really intend to write by hand.
I thought that was the case. Damn, it simply feels so weird not having an universal plural system.
Katakana are still difficult for me to fully retain. I don't really get to practice them as much as I would like too. I'll have to focus on them during this summer.
I don't know what to do, guys :/ I found affordable Japanese lessons and I'm excited to finally studying the language "formally" instead of trying to self-teach myself. It's probably going to be nice meeting more people interested in learning the language and all. The thing is... first of all, I'd be taking the lessons on Saturdays since I really can't from Monday to Friday, it's a 3 hours session from 8:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. - Also, call me lazy, but I reaaaaally don't love the idea of having to wake up at, like 5:30 a.m. on Saturdays... that's because this school isn't really too close from where I live.
I'm torn... I want to get serious about learning Japanese but I'm not sure 3 hours weekly are worth the effort. What would you guys do? Would you keep the "self-teaching" method in this case?
I'm torn... I want to get serious about learning Japanese but I'm not sure 3 hours weekly are worth the effort. What would you guys do? Would you keep the "self-teaching" method in this case?
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
What are your goals overall? When it comes down to it, the majority of all my accomplishments with the language before actually moving to the country were due to self-teaching. It's certainly viable, assuming you're taking it seriously. Are you, as of right now, putting in 3 hours of uninterrupted self-study weekly? If not, perhaps it's best for you to get some outside motivation by going to these classes. Or do you already stick to a strict schedule of study and these classes would just be a supplement? Then perhaps you can dedicate the time/money that you would put towards the classes to furthering your self-studies even more.
The truth is, nope, I don't have a studying schedule by any means and recently I had been very lazy about it... it wasn't until I was in Japan last month that I remembered I should be actually studying the language
As for goals, I'm not sure. Of course I want to be able to speak Japanese eventually, but I really can't think of short term goals. If I'm done with kana then I guess basic grammar/vocabulary is what I should be studying next, right?
As for goals, I'm not sure. Of course I want to be able to speak Japanese eventually, but I really can't think of short term goals. If I'm done with kana then I guess basic grammar/vocabulary is what I should be studying next, right?
LeroyPantwether
Member
Hooray, last sakubun of the semester.
Booooo, this one was a little more difficult for me. Some advice would be greatly appreciated.
It is about pizza. We had to explain why we like our fav food, and how to make it.
ピザは私の大好物です。
私は小さかった時は、毎週の週末に母とピーザを料理をします。
母は台所に上手な人ので、私によく教えました。
とても楽しかったです。
楽しい思い出です。
私は、最近は、週末友達とピザをするのが好きです。
ピザを作るのは簡単だと思います。
たくさんの食料品を必要としません。
ピザの材料は砂糖と強力粉とパン酵母と塩と湯とオリーブ油とソースとモッツアレラチーズです。
初めに、大きなボールに強力粉と砂糖と塩とパン酵母を混ぜます。
次ぐに、混ぜるながら早く湯とオリーブ油を入れます。
そして、一分間に混ぜて続けます。
それを終わった時は、生地を発酵させるために冷蔵庫に2時間入れます。
待つながら、オーブンを予熱します。
次ぐに、十分ぐらいでピザ生地を捏ねます。
次ぐに、ピザ生地を押しつぶすして、円形を作ります
次ぐに、ピザの上にソースとモッツアレラチーズを入れます。
最後に、ピザをオーブンに入れて、15分間焼きます。
私のピザ料理法は簡単だが、ピザの上にいろんな食料品を入れられます。
肉や野菜や果物はいいトッピングですけど、今までに、魚とピザを食べたことがありません。
美味しくないかもしれません。
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Booooo, this one was a little more difficult for me. Some advice would be greatly appreciated.
It is about pizza. We had to explain why we like our fav food, and how to make it.
ピザは私の大好物です。
私は小さかった時は、毎週の週末に母とピーザを料理をします。
母は台所に上手な人ので、私によく教えました。
とても楽しかったです。
楽しい思い出です。
私は、最近は、週末友達とピザをするのが好きです。
ピザを作るのは簡単だと思います。
たくさんの食料品を必要としません。
ピザの材料は砂糖と強力粉とパン酵母と塩と湯とオリーブ油とソースとモッツアレラチーズです。
初めに、大きなボールに強力粉と砂糖と塩とパン酵母を混ぜます。
次ぐに、混ぜるながら早く湯とオリーブ油を入れます。
そして、一分間に混ぜて続けます。
それを終わった時は、生地を発酵させるために冷蔵庫に2時間入れます。
待つながら、オーブンを予熱します。
次ぐに、十分ぐらいでピザ生地を捏ねます。
次ぐに、ピザ生地を押しつぶすして、円形を作ります
次ぐに、ピザの上にソースとモッツアレラチーズを入れます。
最後に、ピザをオーブンに入れて、15分間焼きます。
私のピザ料理法は簡単だが、ピザの上にいろんな食料品を入れられます。
肉や野菜や果物はいいトッピングですけど、今までに、魚とピザを食べたことがありません。
美味しくないかもしれません。
---
So I don't want to clog up this thread with more text analysis requests, but my Japanese buddy is currently not available and so I only have GAF right now to ask...
I just want to say in a short few sentences, that I think the Internet will be more important in regards to elections in the future. People will vote online and talk about politics, once more people use the internet.
I know there are mistakes, so any help would be appreciated:
ネット世論は大切
個人的な意見ですが、ネット世論はもっと大切になる都思います。たぶん、将来政府がネットで選挙を実施してできると、ネットでディスカッションをできることのは必要です。人々が自分の意見を書いたり、他人のを読んだりできる方法です。今まで、ネットでいろいろ極端な意見がありますけど、この意見は大数ではありません。体多数はネットを使うと、極端な意見は小部分になると思います。
I just want to say in a short few sentences, that I think the Internet will be more important in regards to elections in the future. People will vote online and talk about politics, once more people use the internet.
I know there are mistakes, so any help would be appreciated:
ネット世論は大切
個人的な意見ですが、ネット世論はもっと大切になる都思います。たぶん、将来政府がネットで選挙を実施してできると、ネットでディスカッションをできることのは必要です。人々が自分の意見を書いたり、他人のを読んだりできる方法です。今まで、ネットでいろいろ極端な意見がありますけど、この意見は大数ではありません。体多数はネットを使うと、極端な意見は小部分になると思います。
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
The truth is, nope, I don't have a studying schedule by any means and recently I had been very lazy about it... it wasn't until I was in Japan last month that I remembered I should be actually studying the language
As for goals, I'm not sure. Of course I want to be able to speak Japanese eventually, but I really can't think of short term goals. If I'm done with kana then I guess basic grammar/vocabulary is what I should be studying next, right?
What was the purpose of your visit? Fun? Work? Study? It doesn't sound like you have a very pressing need to study the language. If you're just doing it for your own enjoyment, maybe sacrificing that much time/money for a single study session isn't worth it. Just try to build a schedule where you fit in an hour a day, or an hour every other day, or whatever works for you. As long as you actually stick to it. There's trillions of study plans and guides and whatnot out there for you to reference.
My professor used to assign sakubuns, but she suddenly stopped for no particular reason. Now, we get to write skits and act them out!
not covered everything.
次ぐに（つぐに） --> 次に（つぎに）
ピザにいれる --> ピザにのせる (to put something into...to put something on)
You can replace 食料品 with 具.
ピザの上にいろいろな具をのせられる。
好きなスープの具はジャガイモです。好きなカレーライスの具はニンジンです。
You are writing with です/ます. So you should use 私のピザ料理法は簡単'ですが' instead of 簡単'だが'.
>将来政府がネットで選挙を実施してできると、ネットでディスカッションをできることのは 必要です。
I don't know what you want to say. Is it something like インターネットを利用して選挙を実施することと、ネット上でディスカッションをすることが必要です...?
>人々が自分の意見を書いたり、他人のを読んだりできる方法です。
I think you shouldn't omit a subject here.
「インターネットは」人々が自分の意見を書いたり、他人の意見を読んだりすることができる方法です。
>この意見は大数ではありません
多数（たすう）
>体多数はネットを使うと、極端な意見は小部分になると思います。
大多数（だいたすう）がネットを使うと、極端な意見は少数（しょうすう）になると思います。
But I think 多くの人がネットを使うようになれば、極端な意見は少数になると思います is more natural.
Vacations, visiting relatives. It's true that I don't -need- to, but I really want to since I'm going back in December and I'm considering a master degree over there. The main appeal is having a teacher so I can ask specific questions, and being around people who are also learning the language.
LeroyPantwether
Member
Thanks as always.
I will be in Japan from May 11-18th, you should let me buy you like 1000 pizzas for all the help you have given me!
vas_a_morir
Banned
Son, BIll Gates couldn't afford 1000 pizzas in Japan.
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