Mid holds are more attack specific in DoA 5. 6H for mid kick, 4H for mid punch is now universal, if that's what you're asking.
Bayman and others have some more advanced holds, but that's character specific.
The Fighting Game Noob Thread: From Scrub to Master
- Thread starter Cindi Mayweather
- Start date
Mid holds are more attack specific in DoA 5. 6H for mid kick, 4H for mid punch is now universal, if that's what you're asking.
Bayman and others have some more advanced holds, but that's character specific.
zedreamcast
Member
Anybody got any Ken tips? Like a BnB since ive learned C.mkxxfireball is awful for him.
Crab Milk Mickey
Member
Perhaps an odd question: would it be appropriate if I posted match videos here for critiquing, be it constructive feedback from myself and others who feel so inclined? I ask because I consider myself above average (broadly speaking) and relatively experienced with my main character, so my skill level may be outside of this thread's intended demographic, but I've always felt my fundamentals and subsequently decision-making were lacking. Maybe the self-study will benefit others too in what to look out for in their play and if nothing else, it'll act as a brain exercise of sorts leading up to Street Fighter V.
I think that's what I'm about to do too. I'm still completely mashing buttons on Xrd and I really need critiquing on using Ky.
Not certain if this is what you're looking for but here's my quick take on it.
Mainly I'd suggest to start learning Ky's gatlings (and standard combos afterwards) and use cases of each of his normals. I see you using particular normals a lot but other ones not much if at all. For example in the video, the majority of your jump ins on a grounded opponent were using j.P and while it does have uses in that type of situation, it shouldn't be a go to button for it. You should use j.S for normal jump in situations instead. Another example would be the uses of 6H throughout the matches.
On a general level, it would be good to work on your movement. I saw a lot of walking back and forth and generally not much mobility except for some occasional dashing. Practicing something like dash FD break (ie doing a dash then cancelling the momentum into Faultless Defense) should help with getting acclimated to being more mobile on the ground.
Being cognizant of building/having meter and using that meter should be something to work on as well. There were instances where you used the meter for overdrives and an occasional dead angle but not much in the roman cancel department. Something simple like using Stun Edge YRC to have a fireball cover your approach would be a start or having an unsafe move blocked -> RRC to safety.
I think a lot of it is just getting started on learning the mechanics of the game and trying stuff out. Watching some Ky match videos should show you some of the above points.
The thread is good for all skill levels. You can post some matches or try to play with people that will help you improve.
As far my skills go, I would say fundamentals are one of my strong points. If you wish, we can try playing someday and I try to help.
I really need to go back to Xrd, even if it`s only for fun. I don`t main Ky, but I can offer only practice rounds if my connection permits.
Actually this is the type of critique I'm looking for. also I really have a hard time differentiating all of the roman cancels on the button presses. I do agree with the mobility and the jumping. I was also told by a friend to tone it down which I'm gonna have to do.
@SephLuis: I'd love to practice with anyone. I'll usually be on Saturday 8-11/12pm. My PSN is my username if you wanna practice.
Cindi Mayweather
Member
This thread is for all skill levels as a place to critique our games so we can ALL get better.
Tornix
Member
I'll add you when I get home. I use Axl, but I play my brother's (annoying ass) Ky all the time.
Anything Ken-related I would defer to Momochi.
Example of one his videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQ4PVisbrIs
His YT channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPB5UJ70KDnL_hy0TyT79NA
Edit: There's not too many, but he has lots of good information.
markwaters
Neo Member
cr.mk xx hadoken isn't too bad for Ken, but it isn't a block string and isn't super reliable outside of neutral pressure/FADC combos (most of which would use HP shoryu anyway). It's -7 on block, so lots of things can punish it if not spaced properly is the biggest issue. Use it sparingly, but don't forget about it and also realize how fantastic Ken's cr.mk is on its own as a footsie tool. You'll get miles out of raw cr.mk at max distance.
Your go-to punish is close HK xx HP shoryuken OR EX tatsu. Anything that can be punished easily, this is what you should hit them with. Target combo (mp>hp) is acceptable to cancel into as well -- it comes out 2 frames faster, but does slightly less damage because of scaling.
Your go-to hit confirm is cr.lk, cr.lp, cr.lp xx HP shoryuken. This is tricky because cr.lp chains into itself, so you want to be sure to slightly delay the second cr.lp so it links and can be canceled otherwise the SRK won't come out.
There's a lot more than those two, but they'll get you started. Ken has some cool combos, but he predominantly gets his wins by controlling the neutral game (kara grab 2 scary), hitting simple but effective punishes thanks to a 3 frame reversal, and getting tricky mixups out of ex tatsu (both grounded and airborne).
Also, definitely check out the Momochi videos pooptest posted. Let me know if you have any other questions! I'm not a Ken main but he's fun to play as, so I know a little about him.
Differentiating the roman cancels isn't too difficult as long as you associate each colour with the state of your move and the state of the opponent.
Yellow RCs occur when you cancel in the start up and early active frames of the move as long as opponent is not in hit or block stun. Not all moves can be YRC'd.
Red RCs occur when you cancel during the start up, active or recovery frames of a move when the opponent is in hit or block stun.
Purple RCs occur when you cancel during the late active or recovery frames of a move when the opponent is not in hit or block stun. Not all moves can be PRC'd.
I think when you lay it out like that, you can see the difference between yellow and purple are just in the state of the move. While Red is different from the other two based on the state of the opponent.
The above is only discussing RCs in relation to cancelling a move but you can also do them in neutral or movement or moves that aren't attacks. There's also a particular case with Red RCs where you'll get one if the opponent uses a Blue burst. For more details take a read at the dustloop wiki entry.
Crab Milk Mickey
Member
Alright, cool. Was wondering since I'm a stickler for semantics, so I'll get around to posting something later today or tomorrow.
That was a lot for me to take in, but I think I get it. I'll try utilizing the roman cancels more when I play.
You can just link the dragon punch after the second jab ofc
This. I'm sure everyone has run into someone playing like online and lost at least a round because you figure they surely wouldn't just keep doing it, and by the time you realize they are half your life is gone already so a random ultra can kill you.
Karsticles
Member
2.5 hours of DoA matches tonight with Milk. I think I made a lot of progress, even figured out a bnb.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Offensive holds lose to vanilla holds.
markwaters
Neo Member
True! Some wonky spacing stuff happens if you link it on some characters because of pushback though. I think most of the time I inadvertently end up doing both in any given match.
Snacks the sober sea lion
Member
Easy BnB you've probably seen a million times is c.lk c.lp s.lp c.mk xx EX hurricane. Gives you a long time to confirm, and Ken's lights and mediums all combo into each other easily just by pushing the buttons, no link timing or anything. But only EX will combo from max range, anything else will be punishable unless you're fighting a big character.
Fernando Fernandez
Member
I've been using the SF Mad Catz pad for the whole of last gen/PS4 USF4 and enjoy using it, I feel it makes me a better player. I'm realistic, I don't think it will work on SFV. So do I get that 50 quid pad or do I pay 20 quid extra and get my very first stick?
Cindi Mayweather
Member
What do you feel more comfortable with? If you can do everything you want with a pad, stick with pad. I can't do everything I want with pad so I'm switching to stick. Do what feels right.
It may work on SF V and it seems to work well for you - stick with it for a bit before diving into a new purchase, IMO.
I personally can't use a pad for SF so I've been rocking sticks for a while but that's just me. Everyone's different!
ShinMaruku
Member
Soon you will have to show me. :E
Karsticles
Member
Video is 80% done uploading, (50GB). I will post the link when it is done.
pattheflip
Neo Member
I did a replay review show last night, if anyone wants to check it out! Went over two USF4 matches and a Rising Thunder match.
ScrubLi playing Chun vs. Gen: https://youtu.be/5xGQPwtXc5M?t=2m44s
Tebarusan playing Gief into Decapre: https://youtu.be/5xGQPwtXc5M?t=25m44s
Aremah playing Talos into Dauntless: https://youtu.be/5xGQPwtXc5M?t=42m11s
Feedback welcomed! If you have videos you want me to go over, PM me here or tweet me @pattheflip. Also, I got some good people coming into chat to help critique as well, so if you ever want to drop by, please follow my stream at twitch.tv/pattheflip!
Edit: the original video was cut off, reuploaded for the RT chunk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITxmlaFzUVo
ScrubLi playing Chun vs. Gen: https://youtu.be/5xGQPwtXc5M?t=2m44s
Tebarusan playing Gief into Decapre: https://youtu.be/5xGQPwtXc5M?t=25m44s
Aremah playing Talos into Dauntless: https://youtu.be/5xGQPwtXc5M?t=42m11s
Feedback welcomed! If you have videos you want me to go over, PM me here or tweet me @pattheflip. Also, I got some good people coming into chat to help critique as well, so if you ever want to drop by, please follow my stream at twitch.tv/pattheflip!
Edit: the original video was cut off, reuploaded for the RT chunk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITxmlaFzUVo
Crab Milk Mickey
Member
USFIV: Dhalsim vs Gen
Some general notes:
Broad strokes and some of my slip-ups originated from inexperience against a particular character, but that isn't an excuse and the Gen honestly had a better grasp on how to take control and how to succeed with his game plan. As mentioned earlier in the thread, my fundamentals are lacking.
Some general notes:
0:15 --- Already defaulting to a bad auto-pilot habit, namely backwards jumping when in the corner so I could maybe land Dhalsim's aerial b. MK, followed by resorting to his LK slide. The former has good priority and all, but I only got myself out of a pinch when I had already lost half my health. Should've bothered to escape a lot sooner since I didn't know how to fight Gen.
0:48 --- Overhead tagged me, but I really should've expected that. Usually either that or a throw attempt that people often use to finish off a low health opponent. Same end result during 3:05, so evidently I neglect being mindful about a basic (and common) routine.
1:45 --- I need to be more conscious about focus attacks like this one. I have a tendency of wanting to hit someone a second time after a limb has been absorbed, but good players space theirs correctly and crumple me thanks to the counter hit I put myself. May have felt inclined to do so because I was nearing the corner again, but this is a personal flaw that happens anywhere on the screen to be honest as evidenced by 3:05.
2:00 --- Bit of a gambit play here. Part of me says this wasn't a bad idea at all because it could've very well wrapped up the round if I didn't teleport too low off the ground (or used b. MK for small hitboxes instead of b. HP) based off of which way Gen was blocking... but at the same time, if I teleported in front of him and still whiffed, I wouldn't have compromised my position. Shot myself in the foot here.
2:20 --- One example (of several) that highlights that I need to cut down on pointless movements. Not sure what I was thinking since nothing Gen could've done would've been beaten by the Yoga Drill, but it almost cost me the round. The teleport at 3:25 got me in trouble too, for... no reason whatsoever.
2:50 --- Another display of being too content randomly pressing buttons, so I wasn't ready to try and anti-air the next jump-in. May have been a non-issue if I didn't just barely miss the standing b. MK, but it's still a legitimate flaw.
4:24 --- Third focus attack-related mistake, except this time I pressed standing FP after the absorbed attack. I need to cut down on this at that range, because prior to the focus attack Gen was already at a distance where he could've pre-emptively jumped over it and punished me before Dhalsim could recover. Back HP also would not have been fast enough to keep him at bay from that close too, so I can't even blame it on sloppy inputs. What followed afterwards was some decent defense... until I ate another FA crumple thanks to the exact same carelessness. The throw I ate at 4:48 was silly too; again I defaulted to Dhalsim's LK slide, which is easily punishable at point blank, and a reversal teleport (while not too safe either) would've been logical since Gen lacked the Ultra to try and bait it out.
4:52 --- The Super here was worth a shot I suppose seeing how Gen was combo-happy, but I really should've applied my meter differently; I've been sitting on a full bar for so long, in retrospect. What happened around the 5 minute mark was also unfortunate: I had consciously spaced myself correctly for an anti-air Ultra 2 once I removed myself from the corner and it would've landed if I didn't drop the input, so this is one of several examples where my execution falters when in a do-or-die pressure scenario.
5:35 --- Glad I got the read off of his sweep with Ultra 1 - probably the more suitable one too given Gen's lower-than-normal jumping arc - due to his past tendencies, but I've been hit by them too often as is. Need to improve my overall defense for low attacks.
6:26 --- Not much to add here. Multiple lapses in judgement that I've already listed above that eventually lead to me being dizzied, but on the flipside that bought me enough time to formulate a plan in my head with the resources at my disposal. Also followed it up with a Yoga Fire set-up I kept in my pocket precisely for a decisive moment like this, so despite the abundance of mistakes, the epiphanies - especially how I gained the Super - felt gratifying. Neutral jumps are a problem I need to remedy, however.
0:48 --- Overhead tagged me, but I really should've expected that. Usually either that or a throw attempt that people often use to finish off a low health opponent. Same end result during 3:05, so evidently I neglect being mindful about a basic (and common) routine.
1:45 --- I need to be more conscious about focus attacks like this one. I have a tendency of wanting to hit someone a second time after a limb has been absorbed, but good players space theirs correctly and crumple me thanks to the counter hit I put myself. May have felt inclined to do so because I was nearing the corner again, but this is a personal flaw that happens anywhere on the screen to be honest as evidenced by 3:05.
2:00 --- Bit of a gambit play here. Part of me says this wasn't a bad idea at all because it could've very well wrapped up the round if I didn't teleport too low off the ground (or used b. MK for small hitboxes instead of b. HP) based off of which way Gen was blocking... but at the same time, if I teleported in front of him and still whiffed, I wouldn't have compromised my position. Shot myself in the foot here.
2:20 --- One example (of several) that highlights that I need to cut down on pointless movements. Not sure what I was thinking since nothing Gen could've done would've been beaten by the Yoga Drill, but it almost cost me the round. The teleport at 3:25 got me in trouble too, for... no reason whatsoever.
2:50 --- Another display of being too content randomly pressing buttons, so I wasn't ready to try and anti-air the next jump-in. May have been a non-issue if I didn't just barely miss the standing b. MK, but it's still a legitimate flaw.
4:24 --- Third focus attack-related mistake, except this time I pressed standing FP after the absorbed attack. I need to cut down on this at that range, because prior to the focus attack Gen was already at a distance where he could've pre-emptively jumped over it and punished me before Dhalsim could recover. Back HP also would not have been fast enough to keep him at bay from that close too, so I can't even blame it on sloppy inputs. What followed afterwards was some decent defense... until I ate another FA crumple thanks to the exact same carelessness. The throw I ate at 4:48 was silly too; again I defaulted to Dhalsim's LK slide, which is easily punishable at point blank, and a reversal teleport (while not too safe either) would've been logical since Gen lacked the Ultra to try and bait it out.
4:52 --- The Super here was worth a shot I suppose seeing how Gen was combo-happy, but I really should've applied my meter differently; I've been sitting on a full bar for so long, in retrospect. What happened around the 5 minute mark was also unfortunate: I had consciously spaced myself correctly for an anti-air Ultra 2 once I removed myself from the corner and it would've landed if I didn't drop the input, so this is one of several examples where my execution falters when in a do-or-die pressure scenario.
5:35 --- Glad I got the read off of his sweep with Ultra 1 - probably the more suitable one too given Gen's lower-than-normal jumping arc - due to his past tendencies, but I've been hit by them too often as is. Need to improve my overall defense for low attacks.
6:26 --- Not much to add here. Multiple lapses in judgement that I've already listed above that eventually lead to me being dizzied, but on the flipside that bought me enough time to formulate a plan in my head with the resources at my disposal. Also followed it up with a Yoga Fire set-up I kept in my pocket precisely for a decisive moment like this, so despite the abundance of mistakes, the epiphanies - especially how I gained the Super - felt gratifying. Neutral jumps are a problem I need to remedy, however.
Broad strokes and some of my slip-ups originated from inexperience against a particular character, but that isn't an excuse and the Gen honestly had a better grasp on how to take control and how to succeed with his game plan. As mentioned earlier in the thread, my fundamentals are lacking.
zedreamcast
Member
So which ultra is best for what situation with Ken? I feel like ultra 2 would be best for anyone with a fireball since it goes through.
Crab Milk Mickey
Member
For SFIV / V / Rising Thunder, the camera ought to be centered so you don't cover up the meter(s) on one side. And since you were uncertain how to structure the video: you could experiment with watching a round in full at first (instead of the whole match) and then breaking it down after a rewind, if making the most of your time is a priority. Maybe you could also introduce the characters beforehand with a short bulletpoint list of what their noteworthy strengths and weaknesses are, something along the lines of "slow movement speed" and "high health pool" for Zangief, so newcomers have a clearcut understanding of how they're balanced out, if this is your target demographic.
Good video by the way.
Ken's U2 is viewed as bad if memory serves even for its intended purpose and while his U1 isn't a particularly great one either, most players still opt for that one for a (relatively) easy combo extension of sorts.
idk, look at that damage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwv-gXFA9Eo#t=7m40s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwv-gXFA9Eo#t=7m40s
I hate how ken looks when he step kicks.
pattheflip
Neo Member
Thanks for the notes! Still experimenting with format.
Camera stuff is tricky because there isn't really a good place to put it. If I put it in the middle it ends up covering important footsies space =/ I'll keep messing with it though.
Oops, last 10 min got cut off. Reuploading.
Cindi Mayweather
Member
OMG! THANK YOU!
zedreamcast
Member
So i seem to have a lot of trouble against people who block everything and tech everything, i cant seem to get around it. And i never seem to know what to do for oki.
Karsticles
Member
2.5 hours of me vs. Master_Milk in DoA5LR. This is my second time playing the game, so feedback is welcome:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ii3EwxKu-Ww
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ii3EwxKu-Ww
This is why SFIV is the only game where I don't play a fireball character.
If they consistently block and tech against you, you're probably too predictable.
Snacks the sober sea lion
Member
Even his kara throw? Remember that his back + mk is also an overhead with deceptive range, it's pretty tricky. There's not much to give in the way of advice unless you have a replay, since both of those are pretty broad subjects.
It's a little tough to hit with. It's not as quick as Seth's or Abel's, but against shotos it's solid and it's good to have it just to make them afraid to throw fireballs.
Hey guys I need some tips on Xrd , I play Potemkin and I notice that most combos end with a hammerfall break (HFB) I've seen 2D Roman cancel > 6K >HFB>6K rinse and repeat. Is there any tricks on Xrd that will let me connect that with ease ? Or is it just a very small window?.-.
It's supposedly one of the hardest combos in the game, you'd have to be a master at charge buffering. Even F.A.B was dropping it at EVO due to a sleight change in input delay from what he's used to in the arcade version. If you're new to Pot, there're a lot of stuff you need to learn before 6K loops.
Learn the timing to blow up throw tech if you notice someone abusing it, who are you using? If you have an attack that goes over c.LK and is safe on block then it's probably your best choice, otherwise, you can do it with almost any other attack but the timing might be a bit harder to nail.
2.5hrs of jp VF from yesterday
http://youtu.be/UD0kPDxM_Gs
really strong jean named ち一ん early on. i'm 20 min in and so far have seen sarah, taka, aoi and jean.
bon appetit!
@kurtsune
akira mirror at 23min
http://youtu.be/UD0kPDxM_Gs
really strong jean named ち一ん early on. i'm 20 min in and so far have seen sarah, taka, aoi and jean.
bon appetit!
@kurtsune
akira mirror at 23min
I think either way you go can work. Inputs in SF V are much smoother and easier to pull off on a pad than in USFIV but same applies to stick movments, so it comes down to preference in the end.
Gipsy Danger
Member
As others have said it really is personal preference. Some motions are easier on stick and some are easier on pad. Just play with what you're comfortable with. Picking up a new control method can also take a lot of getting used to so you'd be bad at the game for at least a month or so.
TacosNSalsa
Member
Well last night I got mauled by ENGRAVINGS. If you don't know who he is , he is a high-level player/steamer in sf4. I only mention it because if you're in his stream and playing in his lobby at the same time he's an extremely nice guy and if you ask him questions he seemed more than happy to answer them and offer advice . So if you see his lobby on ps4 jump in ..he's really cool
markwaters
Neo Member
It's matchup dependent, but U1 is worlds more reliable in the long run. You can hit it from basically any errant shoryuken for 2 bars. It got a damage buff for non-counter hit, which gives it more power to equalize the life bars in a pinch. When in doubt, pick this one.
However, once you get comfortable with the flow of Ken's gameplay, lots of situations open up to let U2 shine for its better damage potential. Once you've got a knack for the spacing, hadoken (or EX hado for an easier link) xx fadc, U2 does lots of damage. You can also link it after close MK, but the link is hard (unless you get a counter hit) and the spacing is difficult. As you pointed out, it's a good threat in fireball heavy matchups as well.
Patience is the name of the game against defense-oriented players. They are relying on you to make mistakes or over-extend in your attempt to break their defense. One of the great things about Ken is that he can blow up people's teching game with kara throw threats -- he can be just out of range of most throws and still throw and also has a long-reaching, 4f normal in cr.MK to whiff punish and check their shins.
He also has TWO overheads in back MK and forward HK, and one of them can feint and move you forward (forward HK, hold HK for feint), so you can threaten it and go low/kara throw/etc. His tools allow you to keep opponents on their toes if you're patient.
One thing that took me a long time to realize as an aggressive player: you don't have to beat them by KO. As long as you don't take a lot of damage initially, there is no rush to close the round out. Conserve your resources, maintain a life lead where possible, and look for opportunities to pressure and limit their options. It's easier said than done and takes practice. Momochi is fantastic at this; check out all of matches on YouTube!
Edit: and in terms of Oki, sweep option select (meaty cr.lp and then press cr.lp+cr.hk after) is always a great bet against backdashers and people who don't/can't reversal a lot, meaty cr.lk hit confirms, forward HK feint shenanigans/safe jump setups, and just plain ol' keeping them pressured at good spacing is totally fine. He has mixups with air ex tatsu/ambiguous crossups and so forth too. I'm not super familiar with most of the tech, but in general you just want to keep them pressured without taking too many risks.
Marvel
could never
Great guy, did you er have the pleasure of fighting his Claw? Lol
TacosNSalsa
Member
Nope...he didn't have lube so he let me off "easy"...he's that Damn nice...😐😐😐
stn
Member
He's a good friend of mine. And yes, very cool dude. Easily my favorite streamer to watch.