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The final battle begins today: Bush vs. Kerry debate

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"Let this be our Final Battle"
 
H

Hournda

Member
Bush will shellack Kerry just because his positions are so much easier to argue. Kerry might be a better debater and he might supposedly have the facts on his side but Bush's arguments are simple, clear and easy to articulate. Example: terrorism. Bush: "We got rid of the Taliban, we got rid of Saddam, Libya gave up its arsenal, Pakistan is on our side now, etc." Kerry: "Uh I kind of supported the war but now I don't...?" Bush will win this like he's won every debate since he ran for governor of Texas. Kerry might be right on the issues, but he won't win the debate.
 
B

Baron Aloha

A Shining Example
Hournda said:
Bush will shellack Kerry just because his positions are so much easier to argue. Kerry might be a better debater and he might supposedly have the facts on his side but Bush's arguments are simple, clear and easy to articulate. Example: terrorism. Bush: "We got rid of the Taliban, we got rid of Saddam, Libya gave up its arsenal, Pakistan is on our side now, etc." Kerry: "Uh I kind of supported the war but now I don't...?" Bush will win this like he's won every debate since he ran for governor of Texas. Kerry might be right on the issues, but he won't win the debate.
Click to expand...

Don't forget that some republicans have been going around for weeks hyping up Kerry's debating skills and downplaying Bush's (just like in 2000). This means that unless Kerry totally blows Bush away and floors everyone he loses the debate in the eyes of many people. Bush on the other hand wins if just manages to utter a single sentence correctly.
 
E

ErasureAcer

Banned
The debate tonight is about foreign policy...who do we all think is gonna win the debate? :D

Bush-Saddam was evil
Kerry-Your war has made America less safe
Bush-But Saddam was evil
Kerry-Iraq was no threat
Bush-But Saddam was evil
Kerry-People in the middle east are now saying you're evil
Bush-Saddam was evil, brutal, nasty, repulsive, criminal, vigilante dictator, we did the right thing!
Kerry-At what cost? Our standing in the world, more enemies against America, hundreds of billions of dollars wasted, thousands of American and Iraqi lives lost, a less stable Iraq, and no plan for stabilization even 18 months after the war started.
Bush-I'm a hero.
Kerry-Keep telling yourself that.

Moderator-Gentlemen. Let's move onto foreign policy with another nation closer to home, Native Americans. President Bush, here's my question for you:

http://media.ebaumsworld.com/sovereignty.mov

Kerry-Ladies and Gentlemen the man now acting as the President of the United States is a moron. You may not like me, you may not agree with everything I have to say. But this man *points over to Bush* has lost his mind. He can't even answer a simple question on Tribal Soverignty, let alone anything with detail. On November 2, you have a choice between a man who not only looks like a chimp but has a brain like one too and John F Kerry, a man who understands that diplomacy and working not only with friends but with nation's that we might not be friendly with, is how we as Americans become more safe and more repsected in the world. The choice is obvious.
 
I

iapetus

Scary Euro Man
An interesting article from the BBC.

High stakes at election debate
By Justin Webb
BBC correspondent in Washington

Some 50 million Americans are expected to watch the first debate between George Bush and John Kerry.

That is many more voters than watched the candidates' speeches at their party conventions this summer.

That audience makes the debates, especially this first one, the single most important set-piece event of the entire presidential election campaign.

If you had to boil the entire election down to 90 minutes, this is the 90 minutes.

The stakes

In a sense, this debate, scheduled for 2100 (0100 GMT), is all about John Kerry, and not about George Bush at all.

All President Bush has to do is survive this debate.

All the evidence shows that he is very good at surviving.

He can stay focused. He can stay on message. He can hit home a strong, simple set of ideas. He does not get tempted to take chances, to take risks.

But Senator Kerry has to risk everything.

He has to persuade the American people, in this debate, of something that they have not been persuaded of so far - that he has the kind of character that they want to see in the White House.

The lines of attack

Ahead of the debate, the campaigns have been testing attack lines.

We know almost certainly that President Bush is going to say something along the lines of: "The trouble is, Senator Kerry, you say that this is your position on Iraq at the moment, but maybe that is not your final position."

That is, President Bush will try to blunt John Kerry's criticism of the war on Iraq by saying that the senator has changed his position many times.

From the Kerry side, we can be equally sure that he will accuse President Bush of having made mistakes in Iraq.

He will bring up the "Mission Accomplished" sign that was the backdrop for the president's speech on an aircraft carrier when Mr Bush declared an end to major combat operations in Iraq.

There are certain things which are wholly predictable, and each side will predict the other one's attack and will be trying to get rebuttal messages out to the press during the debate.

In Washington, we even have so-called "pre-buttals", which are responses to attacks that have not been made but are expected.

Rules of engagement

Of course, the candidates are banned from asking each other questions during the debate.

This is just one of the numerous rules, regulations and restrictions laid out in an extremely detailed 32-page "memorandum of understanding" hammered out between the two campaigns.

It is probably fair to say that more of the stipulations came from the White House than from the Kerry campaign.

For its part, the Kerry camp was desperate to get three debates with the president.

The White House decided to give them three debates, but got some things back in return.

The ground rules are a matter of extraordinary detail, down to the heights of the podiums that the candidates will stand behind, and the temperature at which the hall will be kept.

The Bush campaign was keen to have a light that would flash once a candidate has gone over the allotted two minutes for an answer.

They think that Kerry is a long-winded waffler and that he will be embarrassed by his light continually going off.

The Democrats have fought for keeping the room very cool, as they believe that they have a sweat problem with their candidate.

They remember the famous 1960 John F Kennedy-Richard Nixon debate in which Mr Nixon's perspiration problem is thought to have lost him the debate in voters' eyes.

The Kerry campaign won - the room will be kept at "industry standard".

There is nothing that either side has left to chance.

Kerry's only hope

Both sides have been trying to manage expectations ahead of the debate.

Republicans have been saying that John Kerry is the best debater since Cicero, believing if they set the bar high enough, Mr Kerry cannot possibly win.

But there is one poll that, on the face of it, looks like a plus for George Bush but actually may be John Kerry's only hope.

Released just days ahead of this first debate, the poll showed that 52% of Americans asked believe that George Bush will win the first face-off and only 39% of those polled think John Kerry will win.

But this is about doing better than expected.

For John Kerry, there is a real opportunity to surprise a lot of Americans, and in the process persuade them to vote for him.

These debates are his only hope.

Only two things threaten George Bush's re-election at this point: events in Iraq and this debate.

But like the election, this debate is George Bush's to lose.


INSIDE THE DEBATES
Candidates will flip a coin to speak first and choose lectern
No props or notes allowed, except pen and blank paper
Warning light to flash when candidates go over allotted speaking time
Candidates not to question each other directly, but can ask rhetorical questions
Candidates not to step out from behind lecterns
Studio temperature to be kept at "industry standard"
Each candidate to have own make-up artist

MODERATOR: JIM LEHRER
Born in Kansas in 1934
Anchor of 60-minute evening news programme on PBS since 1983
Has chaired nine previous presidential debates
Praised and criticised for low-key approach to moderating
Click to expand...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3702906.stm
 
E

explodet

Member
MODERATOR: JIM LEHRER
Click to expand...

I'd love for him to come out and say "I'd like to introduce my assistant moderators: Al Franken and Bill O'Reilly!"
(With alternates Jeanane Garafalo and Ann Coulter)
 
D

Diablos

Member
Once again the media forces you to make up your mind. There is a vice presidential debate, and I believe TWO more Bush vs. Kerry debates coming up after this one. Don't tell the people to make up their minds until all the debates are done with. Yeesh.
 
M

Mermandala

Member
Cool said:
Everyone knows that all Bush wants is oil.
Click to expand...

Pipes just want Laid!

The military bases/Mideast presence is the real prize I think. Bush and his smirk will play better for the camera than Kerry and his um, gravitas. It's true, if W stays relatively quiet he coasts to a "win". I hope there is more to it than "W" is for Win! NO! "W" is for Wrong! Kerry may surprise me though.

Looking forward to the VP debate more...
 
N

NetMapel

Guilty White Male Mods Gave Me This Tag
Once again, I must ask, is there a place on the internet where they show this live/streamed ? I don't have a TV :(
 
D

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
Overseer said:
You know. People don't what happened so long ago. They want to know two things:

1.) How can you help me?
2.) How can you do that?
Click to expand...

Let's try:
1.) How can you help my country?
2.) How can you do that?

That's better. I'm so sick of politics being about short-term benefits to the masses that are bad for the country. Most people just sit there going, "which candidate is going to give me the biggest refund?" We're voting for the leader of this country, not the person who's going to be your best buddy. I love when people hate on politicians for looking out for donors or friends or whomever, but then love politicians when they're looking for them with insignificant tax breaks or refunds. Vote for the guy who will best lead the country, not for who's going to help you. That whole selfish concept has bred so much of the crap that now plagues this country.
 
H

heavy liquid

Member
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm.../20040927/od_uk_nm/oukoe_campaign_kerry_horse

John Kerry, a 6-foot-4-inch Democrat, poked fun on Monday at George W. Bush, the 5-foot-11-inch Republican president for reportedly insisting that podiums be set far apart to offset his opponent's five-inch height advantage.

"You know when your horse is headed down toward the waterfalls or when your horse is drowning, it's a good time to change horses in midstream," Kerry said.

After a pause, he added: "May I also suggest that we need a taller horse? We could get through deeper waters that way."
Click to expand...
 
S

ShadowRed

Banned
Haven't read the entire thread so sorry if I repeat what someone else has said. Anyhow these debates are a bunch of BS. Both candidates have watered them down they have lost any meaning. Only pre approved questions can be asked and the candidates can't speak to one an other. What a bunch of BSthese so called debates are. All you are going toget are prescripted answers to pre screened questions and no one will be any closer to know anything different about the candidates. A waste of fucking air time.
 
J

JoshuaJSlone

Member
ShadowRed said:
Haven't read the entire thread so sorry if I repeat what someone else has said. Anyhow these debates are a bunch of BS. Both candidates have watered them down they have lost any meaning. Only pre approved questions can be asked and the candidates can't speak to one an other. What a bunch of BSthese so called debates are.
Click to expand...
While I basically agree with this...

All you are going toget are prescripted answers to pre screened questions and no one will be any closer to know anything different about the candidates. A waste of fucking air time.
Click to expand...
Considering how little most people seem to know, even repitition of the known will be really helpful to a lot of people.
 
N

Ninja Scooter

Member
Kerry's being a pussy again. Jeesh, wtf is wrong with this guy? Just say the Iraqi invasion was a MISTAKE and quit being afraid to call it that.
 
G

Gek54

Junior Member
Because he was backing the Iraq invasion in interviews not that long ago. If he calls it a mistake it would be a mistake that he had endorsed.
 
L

Loki

Count of Concision
Bush both pronounced the word "vociferously" correctly AND used it in its proper context; I shut the TV shortly thereafter, for fear of having a heart attack. ;) :p
 
I

Idle Will Kill

Banned
I wish they'd get off the fucking war in Iraq. There are other issues.

Bush is coming off as pretty dumb and repeats himself every chance he gets, and Kerry isn't being forceful enough.
 
D

demon

I don't mean to alarm you but you have dogs on your face
Celicar said:
So is Kerry. Half the time Kerry doesn't even answer the question posed to him.
Click to expand...
:lol
Kerry is answering the fucking questions. Bush half the time is spewing out the same canned, meaningless shit he always does.
 
N

nathkenn

Borg Artiste
they're both just repeating themselves, but bush has got the lamest debate tactics
i just dont understand how any could vote for him, he's so transparent is unbeleivable
 
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