serenewarfare
Banned
If Savitar Barry was created when Savitar Barry kills Iris, then how did Barry ever become Savitar in the first place and why did he kill Iris?
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The Flash S3 |OT| It was me, Barry.
- Thread starter ZeroX03
- Start date
Claude Augario
Member
How they handled Flashpoint was disappointing but if this evil Barry really is from the Flashpoint timeline I will be willing to forgive them... to an extent. Alchemy under the control of Savitar knowing the metas from Flashpoint makes sense if that Barry/Flash was aware of the them. He probably got stranded in the current timeline after things got changed back to normal.
A dark, twisted Barry that lost everything (including both living parents) from an alternate counterpart and never loved Iris gets sent on the long path to handing himself Ls from the future.
But then none of this accounts for the fact that he has current Barry's memories so who the fuck knows what's really going on here.
A dark, twisted Barry that lost everything (including both living parents) from an alternate counterpart and never loved Iris gets sent on the long path to handing himself Ls from the future.
But then none of this accounts for the fact that he has current Barry's memories so who the fuck knows what's really going on here.
Jesus, that was not earned in the slightest. You can't do the big self-indulgent Keyser Soze reveal when it's something anybody with a brain figured out like ten episodes ago.
I was kind've getting psyched because I was starting to think it was all a misdirect and Savitar was Joe's girlfriend, but that wasn't to be.
I also liked the way Barry still sucks at his powers, but a week after Caitlin gets her powers she's already come up with a ton of different ways to utilize them and is already zipping around the city on ice slides.
I was kind've getting psyched because I was starting to think it was all a misdirect and Savitar was Joe's girlfriend, but that wasn't to be.
I also liked the way Barry still sucks at his powers, but a week after Caitlin gets her powers she's already come up with a ton of different ways to utilize them and is already zipping around the city on ice slides.
Here is the thing that makes no fucking sense whatsoever.
Ok so lets say that savitar is future Barry. WHY is he tormenting past barry with killing iris. Barry had to have done something to him? But he cant cause hes the same person.
I don't see motivation here, it doesn't make sense.
However. Remember the time remnant at the end of season 2? What if that is savitar. That he got sent to the speedforce and lost connection with all he cared about. This is the only reason I can think of for motivation.
Ok so lets say that savitar is future Barry. WHY is he tormenting past barry with killing iris. Barry had to have done something to him? But he cant cause hes the same person.
I don't see motivation here, it doesn't make sense.
However. Remember the time remnant at the end of season 2? What if that is savitar. That he got sent to the speedforce and lost connection with all he cared about. This is the only reason I can think of for motivation.
Same here, man. Fuck youtubers' desperation for clicks through their clip-posting content.
Seriously. The moment Barry said he had a plan, I was immediately all like "oh God, don't do Barry's plan you guys. Alright, what is it?"
Turns out it was "say nice things about Caitlin while Cisco hides in the rafters"... (?)
Even without Caitlin knowing what was going to happen, I'm not sure what they expected to happen there.
Also, Barry didn't really seem to be paying attention to the words he said that he'll later precisely and exactly remember and convey to Caitlin with such detail that she's also able to exactly remember them with perfect timing.
The writers for this show.. oi.
serenewarfare
Banned
Yeah but then how would he have all of Barry's memories from these specific moments in time? It has to be a future version of this Barry.
Although, given the timeline of events, we know Savitar has to be post-Crisis Barry, so maybe that's somehow connected?
How devastated were you
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
Well, whatever. Even if the reveal weren't blatantly obvious, that wouldn't have saved the tedium of the rest of the episode. When the characters aren't stuck doing Savatar-related crap, they're locked in horribly uninteresting romantic drama. And for all the build-up of Caitlin being Killer Frost, the stakes feel awfully low. There's just no tension there at all.
serenewarfare
Banned
But again, there's no explanation for it to be any Barry other than the one we've been watching this whole time, because no other version would have this level of intimate knowledge.
WrenchNinja
Member
Stretching out this reveal to episode 20 was a really stupid move
The reveal itself was solid
The rest of the episode was pretty good, lots of fun moments with HR, Tracy was cool, Malfoy trying to talk about the power of love to Cisco, and more Joe relationship stuff
Really liked Killer Frost pulling an Iceman ice slide, neat effect
The reveal itself was solid
The rest of the episode was pretty good, lots of fun moments with HR, Tracy was cool, Malfoy trying to talk about the power of love to Cisco, and more Joe relationship stuff
Really liked Killer Frost pulling an Iceman ice slide, neat effect
kinda disappointed
like oliver stabbing Ras with a sword through league bulletproof armor
but then again, if they can pull off how barry turned into savitar than i can take this back
I don't get it.
1) Current Barry goes to Bad Future and meets Wig Barry, who says he doesn't know who Savitar is. He tells Barry to find Scientist, who helped him trap Savitar too late.
2) In the present, because Barry found Scientist, there's a Warehouse Showdown
3) During Warehouse Showdown, Caitlin knows exactly what happens because Savitar told her.
In order for Savitar to know what happened, Current Barry had to have been in a situation that (according to Wig Barry) never happened. If it was all predestined, Wig Barry would have to have known Indeterminate Barry was Savitar, as he'd already lived through Current Barry finally realizing it.
Indeterminate Barry seems scarred, so he'd need to be post-Wig Barry, I guess.
So either 1) Wig Barry lied to current Barry for no raisin and then got all scarred and became Indeterminate Barry or 2) the writers messed up.
1) Current Barry goes to Bad Future and meets Wig Barry, who says he doesn't know who Savitar is. He tells Barry to find Scientist, who helped him trap Savitar too late.
2) In the present, because Barry found Scientist, there's a Warehouse Showdown
3) During Warehouse Showdown, Caitlin knows exactly what happens because Savitar told her.
In order for Savitar to know what happened, Current Barry had to have been in a situation that (according to Wig Barry) never happened. If it was all predestined, Wig Barry would have to have known Indeterminate Barry was Savitar, as he'd already lived through Current Barry finally realizing it.
Indeterminate Barry seems scarred, so he'd need to be post-Wig Barry, I guess.
So either 1) Wig Barry lied to current Barry for no raisin and then got all scarred and became Indeterminate Barry or 2) the writers messed up.
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
There are too many Barrys in this show.
Maybe this Savitar is the current Barry in the future that went into to that alternative timeline so while the future changed his knowledge hasn't and why i'm smelling copper
again. no motivation.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
It could be an alternate Barry from further down the timeline. He probably hasn't diverged yet or maybe any time soon. It could be a speed remnant that Barry creates to fight Savitar (that emo-Barry hinted at).
The exact future that Barry traveled to no longer exists because Barry has now acted on information he received from it.
Depending on when Savitar is from, his memories could be overwritten with any changes currently being made.
Tragicomedy
Member
Hey guys, remember when Savitar sang, "All I want to do is come running home to you" to Iris? That was great.
I believe he meant it as a threat.
I believe he meant it as a threat.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
I feel like even a season 1 style reveal where the audience is explicitly shown way before the characters in the show would have ultimately been better.
They could have had things slowly ratchet their way up as an evil Barry is out there operating. Maybe they could have paid off that Barry-in-prison tease from season 1.
The whole Iris thing should have been scrapped becuase it has gotten reptitive real quick and wasn't much interesting. I wonder if the crossovers affected it causing the reveal to happened much later though it doesn't really excuse them.
Permanently A
Junior Member
Drink every time someone tells Barry to "Run Barry, run" or something along those lines
Drink every time someone on this show gives a pep talk (I know all the CW shows do it, but for some reason it bugs me more on here lol)
Drink every time a villain successfully escapes from Barry despite him being a speedster
Drink every time Barry does something stupid (two shots if it involves time travel).
Drink every time someone keeps a secret.
Drink every time there's manufactured relationship drama.
MHWilliams
Member
There's no problem with the reveal. I don't really have a problem with Savitar being Barry.
The issue has been the handling of the reveal and the pacing of the season overall. The point of any reveal is to exceed expectations. You offer hints and then you reveal something that surprises and excites. The audience should say, "I didn't expect that, but it makes so much sense."
This is largely why the Arrow reveal of Prometheus works. Or the original reveal of Reverse Flash.
Future Barry makes thematic sense, but the show has been dragging that reveal out. It should've been a few episodes back. As it stands, the team has sort of been spinning in place for the past episodes, not accomplishing much and looking kinda of stupid doing so.
The issue has been the handling of the reveal and the pacing of the season overall. The point of any reveal is to exceed expectations. You offer hints and then you reveal something that surprises and excites. The audience should say, "I didn't expect that, but it makes so much sense."
This is largely why the Arrow reveal of Prometheus works. Or the original reveal of Reverse Flash.
Future Barry makes thematic sense, but the show has been dragging that reveal out. It should've been a few episodes back. As it stands, the team has sort of been spinning in place for the past episodes, not accomplishing much and looking kinda of stupid doing so.
Call an ambulance halfway through the episode so it arrives in time.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
*grins*
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
They seem to have a sort of gallows humor going on. You can order a drink called a Zoom for fuck's sake.
In the real world that would be like going into a Starbucks and ordering a Bin Laden off the secret menu.
In Batman i there was either villain themed menu or restaurant which is just weird
Basically. Future Barry being the villain isn't inherently bad or dumb, but due to the horrid pacing this season, it just made me realize that there is no way in hell that whoever they revealed to be Savitar would possibly be worth the extremely long and unnecessary wait. So for us to wait that long, in addition to Savitar ending up being someone many of us long suspected it would be, just further stinks up a season that was already quite mediocre.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
Y'know if yah drank anytime someone asked "Are you ok?" in anyone of these CW shows, you'd likely be dead of alcohol poisoning.
Pretty much
The pacing has been the worst this season
Y'all are complaining it's too predictable AND that it should have been done earlier? That's a contradiction, and y'all would just whine that the reveal came to early.
This thread is Arrow S3 God awful. The circle is complete
GuessMyUserName
Member
Savitar being Barry is cool, but the execution is just awful. They took way too god damn long dragging this out and then the big reveal is artificially padded with excruciating Joe relationship drama. I swear in one of those scenes of Joe talking to Cecile I was just screaming "reveal Future Barry already god damn".
Although the whole "I know everything you're doing" angle is annoying since Savitar can't be a Barry that fought Savitar. That kind of logic would lead to a nonsensical "Barry killed Iris because Barry killed Iris" plot thread and Barry's source of turning evil can't rely on it having already happened.
... How is that a contradiction? If it was done earlier it would be less predictable. The spoiler itself is fine, but dragging it out 20 episodes was shitty.
Although the whole "I know everything you're doing" angle is annoying since Savitar can't be a Barry that fought Savitar. That kind of logic would lead to a nonsensical "Barry killed Iris because Barry killed Iris" plot thread and Barry's source of turning evil can't rely on it having already happened.
... How is that a contradiction? If it was done earlier it would be less predictable. The spoiler itself is fine, but dragging it out 20 episodes was shitty.
So I saw this coming. This was a lot of stretching to get to this point. Unnecessary probably but they seem to be running out of ideas pun intended.
As satisfied as a cheeseburger and fries it is what it is.
Please no more speedster villains.
Also where does CW find its women? Cecile in that jogging outfit? Whew make a nigga wanna hop on the Bowflex, Girl look sweeter than a Hershey Kisses! I love you too Cecile.
As satisfied as a cheeseburger and fries it is what it is.
Please no more speedster villains.
Also where does CW find its women? Cecile in that jogging outfit? Whew make a nigga wanna hop on the Bowflex, Girl look sweeter than a Hershey Kisses! I love you too Cecile.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
It's not a contradiction. A less predictable reveal could have come earlier. The two concepts aren't mutually exclusive.
Not that I even have a problem with a late stage reveal, either.
Considering Arrow revealed its villain's identity somewhat early and I loved it, no, I highly doubt I'd suddenly complain if Flash followed suit. Even then, it's weird to assume that you'd know how people would react, especially when they're stating otherwise. As far as I'm concerned, the longer you wait, the more likelier it is that your audience (Or at least me anyways) starts to lose interest. Not always the case of course, but Savitar has been incredibly bland, especially compared to both Reverse Flash and Zoom (Also I know it's hard for the show to break the trend, but damn I'm tired of speedster villains), to the point where hurrying up and revealing his damn identity already is all he really had going for him imo