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The Flash S3 |OT| It was me, Barry.

B

BLOODED_hands

Member
Just_myles said:
Barry should be put on trial. Simple as that. If the flash writing team knows what they're doing there should be some sort of punishment. I mean we did get a glimpse of Barry in prison so it's possible.
Click to expand...

Definitely but then Earth-1 would be donezo. Barry punished for his crimes against humanity, in prison until the end of time. Let's be honest, they won't do Wally justice and he will job just as much as Barry. Sure he is the best Flash in the comics but this is the CW. Everybody gets a nerf.

By the way, does anybody think they will recognize that the Legends basically does what Barry does but on a semi-smaller scale? Or are we stuck with "Blame everything on Barry"?
 
J

Just_myles

Member
BLOODED_hands said:
Definitely but then Earth-1 would be donezo. Barry punished for his crimes against humanity, in prison until the end of time. Let's be honest, they won't do Wally justice and he will job just as much as Barry. Sure he is the best Flash in the comics but this is the CW. Everybody gets a nerf.

By the way, does anybody think they will recognize that the Legends basically does what Barry does but on a semi-smaller scale? Or are we stuck with "Blame everything on Barry"?
Click to expand...

I'm all for kid flash taking over. Warner bros. has Ezra miller now. I think they wrote the character the tv Barry Allen into a deep pit with no way of getting out of it. Unless the villains step in and somehow inadvertently changing things. Who knows.

The legends have done far far worse.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
Cisco is still being selfish and a bit of a dick in my opinion. There's no way to prove that what Barry did even caused Dante's death. They have time traveling friends that interfere with history way more than Barry does. And Barry even having the ability to time travel in the first place is the result of someone else already altering history. There's so much going on in terms of timeline shenanigans that I think blaming it on Barry is way too harsh, especially when people from the Flashpoint timeline are messing around with the current timeline as well (how do we know that Savitar didn't do it?). Plus Cisco practically begging Barry to use time travel to save his brother not that long ago makes Cisco look pretty hypocritical too.

Cisco's reaction right now is up there with Felicity's reactions about Olivers kid in the selfishness department.
 
J

Just_myles

Member
Sephzilla said:
Cisco is still being selfish and a bit of a dick in my opinion. There's no way to prove that what Barry did even caused Dante's death. They have time traveling friends that interfere with history way more than Barry does. And Barry even having the ability to time travel in the first place is the result of someone else already altering history. There's so much going on in terms of timeline shenanigans that I think blaming it on Barry is way too harsh, especially when people from the Flashpoint timeline are messing around with the current timeline as well. Plus Cisco practically begging Barry to use time travel to save his brother not that long ago makes Cisco look pretty hypocritical too.
Click to expand...

I agree that the flash we have now is the result of time meddling. However, that just drives the point further. Barry should know better.

Also we can't prove anything about Dante. What we do know is that he was alive before Flashpoint and dead after. Sorry but correlation does imply causation. Blame the writing team.
 
S

Septimus Prime

Member
BLOODED_hands said:
Definitely but then Earth-1 would be donezo. Barry punished for his crimes against humanity, in prison until the end of time. Let's be honest, they won't do Wally justice and he will job just as much as Barry. Sure he is the best Flash in the comics but this is the CW. Everybody gets a nerf.

By the way, does anybody think they will recognize that the Legends basically does what Barry does but on a semi-smaller scale? Or are we stuck with "Blame everything on Barry"?
Click to expand...
Let's see, so far, they've:

-Killed a shogun.
-Introduced a time ship to various people from different eras, including
-Vandal Savage.
-Stopped a nuke but also
-Set off a nuke.
-Told Damien Darhk about his future.
-Created an entirely new person.

And much more. Barry's antics are child's play compared to theirs.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
Just_myles said:
I agree that the flash we have now is the result of time meddling. However, that just drives the point further. Barry should know better.

Also we can't prove anything about Dante. What we do know is that he was alive before Flashpoint and dead after. Sorry but correlation does imply causation. Blame the writing team.
Click to expand...

What if the cause/blame is going the wrong direction though. Barry wasn't the only time traveler involved with Flashpoint. (That is on the writing team though, everyone basically forgot about Reverse Flash's role in this).

It just seems like Cisco should be smart enough to remember all of the stuff that's going on here instead of just lashing out at Barry.
 
H

HoopzBarkley

Member
I know its probably not it at all, but I sometimes think that Reverse Flash did this to Dante and Caitlin just to give Barry shit like still preserve the past but still fuck him over.
 
B

BLOODED_hands

Member
Just_myles said:
I'm all for kid flash taking over. Warner bros. has Ezra miller now. I think they wrote the character the tv Barry Allen into a deep pit with no way of getting out of it. Unless the villains step in and somehow inadvertently changing things. Who knows.

The legends have done far far worse.
Click to expand...

I think they can give Barry a redemption arc. Probably not soon but he will get one. But for now, he has no way(s) to redeem himself. He could save multiple Earth's and still get ridiculed because "reasons". Not to bring in BvS again but that's one thing I liked about it. They put Supes on trial albeit it wasn't done that well, it made things in the DCEU more "human".

I think if they want to, they have to make Barry disappear for a while. Have Wally be in charge for a season. Something like that, something to make Barry's team actually needing and missing Barry.
 
J

Joni

Member
Legends messing with time isn't as potent. We know their timetravel takes times to set and that time has a tendency to fix itself. Like they might nuclear explode a town, but it is like right around Chernobyl.
 
J

Just_myles

Member
A redemption arc will likely happen. Albeit like one or two episodes tops.

Like I said earlier the villains will likely be the ones to inadvertently undo the changes of flashpoint. It can't be Barry.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
BLOODED_hands said:
I think they can give Barry a redemption arc. Probably not soon but he will get one. But for now, he has no way(s) to redeem himself. He could save multiple Earth's and still get ridiculed because "reasons". Not to bring in BvS again but that's one thing I liked about it. They put Supes on trial albeit it wasn't done that well, it made things in the DCEU more "human".

I think if they want to, they have to make Barry disappear for a while. Have Wally be in charge for a season. Something like that, something to make Barry's team actually needing and missing Barry.
Click to expand...

Why ?
Barry does not need a redemption arc .
I mean right now with have 2 people angry at him that is it .
As Oliver told him people make mistakes and he just have to do better next time.

EDIT make that 1 person since caitlin got over it .
 
J

Joni

Member
Just_myles said:
A redemption arc will likely happen. Albeit like one or two episodes tops.

Like I said earlier the villains will likely be the ones to inadvertently undo the changes of flashpoint. It can't be Barry.
Click to expand...

Why even bother? Caitlyn possibly turning into Killer Frost from time to time is interesting, Diggle Jr needs to be a boy for Connor Hawke, ... Dante doesn't seem that interesting.
 
B

BLOODED_hands

Member
Septimus Prime said:
Let's see, so far, they've:

-Killed a shogun.
-Introduced a time ship to various people from different eras, including
-Vandal Savage.
-Stopped a nuke but also
-Set off a nuke.
-Told Damien Darhk about his future.
-Created an entirely new person.

And much more. Barry's antics are child's play compared to theirs.
Click to expand...

Sure, but you have to admit that the writer's haven't fully shown and acknowledge the Legends' changes. We can list everything out but right now Flashpoint has done the most damage that was shown besides the dark and dour future timeline.

They really need to show all the damages the Legends has caused and not just Stein having a daughter. The Legends cannot be all holier than thou right now when they have done much worse. We just haven't seen all the damage they've caused.

-

Yeah, that's why I said the Supes trial wasn't done well. They at least recognized how dangerous a being like Supes is. It's not going to get all dark and dour like the DCEU but it would be nice to see Flash face his consequences on a larger scale and have the world recognize how strong Barry is.

-

Barry doesn't need a redemption arc but he should get a chance to redeem himself and prove that he can still be trusted.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
BLOODED_hands said:
S Yeah, that's why I said the Supes trial wasn't done well. They at least recognized how dangerous a being like Supes is. It's not going to get all dark and dour like the DCEU but it would be nice to see Flash face his consequences on a larger scale and have the world recognize how strong Barry is.
Click to expand...

At this point it make no sense to do that .
The world already know how strong flash is or how dangerous he could be .
Look at what Zoom did last season and metas over last few years.
And they are not going to tell the world time travel is possible .

The DCTV universe is in a very difference place than the movie universe.
 
B

Briarios

Member
Barry got his punishment before realizing the repercussions of what he did -- he had to ask someone, straight up ask, to murder his mother. There really isn't much more of a punishment for him.

Then we have Thawne stating things will be different - that's because of what HE is doing to the timeline, they just haven't pieced it together yet. Barry is unaware the Legends have been interacting with him.

Thawne must be gleeful that Barry is blaming himself for everything. That's pretty much his goal in life.
 
G

GravityInsanity

Member
Finally caught up with the show because I've been busy. I can't believe how much of a girl Cisco turned into following that last episode. Also, that Diggle and Barry scene when he found out what happen to his Daughter...
giphy.gif
 
T

tci

Member
I am really close to giving up on this whole series. The action is decent, but the drama is like approaching a retarded level. Might hold out until the end of the season. Not sure yet.

It is not Supergirl levels yet, where I have watched my last episode with this cross-over one. The writers should all be fired imo.
 
B

BLOODED_hands

Member
Briarios said:
Barry got his punishment before realizing the repercussions of what he did -- he had to ask someone, straight up ask, to murder his mother. There really isn't much more of a punishment for him.

Then we have Thawne stating things will be different - that's because of what HE is doing to the timeline, they just haven't pieced it together yet. Barry is unaware the Legends have been interacting with him.

Thawne must be gleeful that Barry is blaming himself for everything. That's pretty much his goal in life.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Barry begging Thawne to kill his mom again..... That's fucked up and something nobody STAR Labs, Arrow Team, and The LoT can ever face and do. That's something a person cannot come back from. It took alot of shit for Barry to come back from that (and hopefully he stays that way) and be sort of hopeful when he came back from Flashpoint.
 
V

Volimar

Member
Shaanyboi said:
But when it went to the future last season, Diggle already had a son instead of Sara. So... Flashpoint maybe was "always meant to happen?"
Click to expand...



There was still time for Diggle to have a son that would have been the guy in the future. It didn't have to be Sara's replacement.
 
R

Realeza

Banned
tci said:
I am really close to giving up on this whole series. The action is decent, but the drama is like approaching a retarded level. Might hold out until the end of the season. Not sure yet.

It is not Supergirl levels yet, where I have watched my last episode with this cross-over one. The writers should all be fired imo.
Click to expand...

GTFO. Just see the impressions in this thread.
 
Maddocks

Maddocks

Member
the_firewithin said:
If Diggle was so pissed he doesn't have a daughter instead of son does he hate his son now? It's not like Barry said his daughter died
Click to expand...

Yup, the way Digg acted at finding out he had a son instead of a daughter made me go....so he never wanted a son to begin with? In his head nothing ever changed, but he was so hurt. Having a son was a mistake confirmed!
 
V

Violence Jack

Member
Maddocks said:
Yup, the way Digg acted at finding out he had a son instead of a daughter made me go....so he never wanted a son to begin with? In his head nothing ever changed, but he was so hurt. Having a son was a mistake confirmed!
Click to expand...

Ditto. That was not how I expected him to react. It's not like Barry killed his daughter. He just had a boy instead of a girl.
 
Grizzlyjin

Grizzlyjin

Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Violence Jack said:
Ditto. That was not how I expected him to react. It's not like Barry killed his daughter. He just had a boy instead of a girl.
Click to expand...

I think the implication of that is sailing over some heads. His daughter was wiped from existence. They don't know that the gender was simply swapped. Barry even admits that he isn't quite sure if baby Sara is the same "person" as baby John. It's more than just a gender swap, he did something that changed a big part of Diggle's life and isn't sure how it even works.
 
Q

quiksilver1209

Neo Member
Great episode again. It was really awesome to see all the heroes together. But they really need to buff Kara on her own show. Shes OP on this Earth. Mick was great again. The Cisco drama is getting annoying but I understand the salt. Its nice to see Oliver being the real adult here and defend Barry. We aren't even sure if some of these things are Barry's fault. Savitor, Reverse Flash could have had a hand in it as well.


Definitely looking forward to Arrow tonight
 
B

BLOODED_hands

Member
Do y'all think Earth-38 is near Earth-1's Sun? Maybe they have a different colored sun and that's why Kara is stronger on Earth-1 compared to Earth-38. That's my reasoning as to why Kara is so strong anyways :p

If people hadn't noticed, they did the different Earth's have different filters again. Earth-1's filter is kind of darker compared to Earth-38 :( Earth-38 is just so brighter compared to Earth-1, lol.
 
B

BrokenFiction

Member
OK, I just caught up with the episode..

I don't care that it was fan service. I. DON'T. CARE.

Because...

that Hall of Justice is giving me life. I giggled like I was 10 years old again when I saw that.

I mean ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!

hall-of-justice-night-214350-640x320.png


*young me passes out*
 
S

Septimus Prime

Member
BLOODED_hands said:
Do y'all think Earth-38 is near Earth-1's Sun? Maybe they have a different colored sun and that's why Kara is stronger on Earth-1 compared to Earth-38. That's my reasoning as to why Kara is so strong anyways :p

If people hadn't noticed, they did the different Earth's have different filters again. Earth-1's filter is kind of darker compared to Earth-38 :( Earth-38 is just so brighter compared to Earth-1, lol.
Click to expand...
Well, Vancouver is less smoggy than LA.
 
P

PhoncipleBone

Banned
BrokenFiction said:
OK, I just caught up with the episode..

I don't care that it was fan service. I. DON'T. CARE.

Because...

that Hall of Justice is giving me life. I giggled like I was 10 years old again when I saw that.

I mean ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!

hall-of-justice-night-214350-640x320.png


*young me passes out*
Click to expand...
It was a wonderful moment. I will just add it to the list of moments from the CWverse that made me squeal with glee and get excited.

Some other moments: The first tease of Suicide Squad in Arrow S2. The tease of King Shark only to have him appear at the end of the episode. Martian Manhunter reveal on Supergirl.
 
T

Team Filler

Member
Not a fan of them giving Felicity shit-tier writing to Cisco. It's like Oliver said, nobody in these groups would have done differently than Barry if faced with the same choice.

I don't generally mind the legends having issue with Barry's actions since their whole thing is about trying to preserve the timeline, but Sara Lance has no business getting so upset at Barry and chastising him considering the kind of damage her behavior has/could have caused to the timeline. That's just trash writing for the sake of giving Barry more L's.

At some point Barry needs to set the record straight and remind these people that he begged his mother's killer to go back and murder Nora Allen so as to try and repair the timeline, and that no amount of their whining is going to match that.
 
C

cw_sasuke

If all DLC came tied to $13 figurines, I'd consider all DLC to be free
Mister Saturn said:
Not a fan of them giving Felicity shit-tier writing to Cisco. It's like Oliver said, nobody in these groups would have done differently than Barry if faced with the same choice.
Click to expand...

Cisco lost his brother - he has every right to be upset about this. This is a recent event - its not like he is pissed about it years after Barry told him.

Let a brother grief.
 
T

Team Filler

Member
cw_sasuke said:
Cisco lost his brother - he has every right to be upset about this. This is a recent event - its not like he is pissed about it years after Barry told him.

Let a brother grief.
Click to expand...

It's not the premise I have issue with, but the execution, and I'm blaming that on how these beats are being written. Cisco's grief is completely understandable, but how these scenes play out in reaction to that is terrible, IMO. I would expect Oliver to rip him a new one for going dicks out and jeopardizing them in such a moment of crisis, at the least, or Felicity speaking up on Barry's behalf. It's shit writing of this nature that changed Felicity from one of my favorites to most hated character and stopped me watching anymore Arrow, and I'm really not wanting to have the same thing happen here with Cisco and Flash.

For legends it's a whatever issue, that show's writing has been mostly shit since the first season so I'm more inoculated against it there.
 
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