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[Dead Man]

It seems that this stupid chicane is gone.

That would be good news.

Depends on your definition of 'front runners' I guess. I think if you're competing for podiums on a fairly regular basis, you're at least a front runner.

As for finishing 4th most years,

1991 - 3rd
1992 - 4th
1993 - 4th
1994 - 3rd
1995 - 3rd
1996 - 2nd

Paints a slightly different picture.

Looking at the points in those years, I wouldn't say they were frontrunners, but as you say, that is probably due to different definitions of front runners. The original post I was replying too said they had always been in the championship hunt.

 

[Templar Wizard]

Ferrari have always been at the sharp end, alas not the sharpest.
its very funny that even faced with data, a clown will always stand his ground

and another clown, Eddie Jordan on Kimi's possible movement:

'Jordan said Raikkonen had made a return to Red Bull his first priority but when talks with the world champions broke down, he turned his attention to Ferrari.

He could also stay with current team Lotus for a third season. '

Nicely covered Eddie.

 

[Kipp]

It seems that this stupid chicane is gone.

It doesn't surprise me that I'm in the minority here, but I kind of like(d) that chicane. It required a lot of precision and was punishing to mess up, and it was pretty unique. Oh well.

 

[Dead Man]

Ferrari have always been at the sharp end, alas not the sharpest.
its very funny that even faced with data, a clown will always stand his ground

Nice :/ Keep it up.

Edit: I was having a pretty civil debate I thought, and you weigh in with that bullshit?

 

[Templar Wizard]

Heikki Kulta on Kimi's possibilities:
I think he is wrong on Kimi being 'Alonso's number 2 driver', was Kimi Massa's number 2?

'Lotus seems to be the most natural option, because Räikkönen has obviously enjoyed to the fullest the 1 1/2 years he has worked with the team.

Ferrari would certainly be a team that would stir up many emotions. The combination Fernando Alonso and Kimi Räikkönen would beforehand form the strongest driver duo, where the value of it would be emphasized in the WCC-serie. But somehow I have the feeling that Räikkönen doesn't want to go back to Maranello – and certainly not as Alonso's driver number 2.

Felipe Massa has been given time until Monza. Before that we won't hear any driver news from Ferrari. During my vacation I heard from Italy that especially Nico Hülkenberg had lifted up his stocks as Alonso's teammate.'

http://blogit.ts.fi/formulablogi/2013/08/19/spekulaatiot-uusiksi/

 

[Templar Wizard]

Nice :/ Keep it up.

Edit: I was having a pretty civil debate I thought, and you weigh in with that bullshit?

Give me a break. I call you a clown, take a look at your avatar
also, you are shown some data and yet you still find it hard to acknowledge a teams position? whats your definition of a frontrunner? top 1 spot for about.... oh, I don't know... 30 years???

 

[Dead Man]

Give me a break. I call you a clown, take a look at your avatar
also, you are shown some data and yet you still find it hard to acknowledge a teams position? whats your definition of a frontrunner? top 1 spot for about.... oh, I don't know... 30 years???

I was debating exactly that. If reading is too hard for you I suggest you get some tutoring. But hey, lets just sling shit, right? Don't actually debate, that's too hard.

Edit: Look, if you were just having a laugh, fine, but to then cap it with the bullshit statement about data is just weak. Very fucking weak. The entire debate is about semantics (again, it seems to be in every thread). So if you don't want to talk about what a constitutes being miles off the pace or a front running team, don't. Just don't snipe at others who will take the time to actually discuss something.

 

[Templar Wizard]

On topic, I don't see whats so 'bullshit' about historical data eg results et all? SURELY that's what matters and is what one will form opinions from?

 

[Dead Man]

On topic, I don't see whats so 'bullshit' about historical data eg results et all? SURELY that's what matters and is what one will form opinions from?

Historical data is the basis that is used to form opinions about what the data means. If a team comes second, but has only half the points of the winning team, are they on the pace or not?

 

[Templar Wizard]

Compared to the 10 teams behind them? Just because you don't have a double defuser or weapon X from year Y and you are always touching the podium doesn't make you a bad team.
to be even clearer: Williams WERE a top team, but when you place out of the points for several years...

 

[Shaneus]

Hulk to Ferrari? I thought he was looking to replace Fucking Grosjean?

 

[Templar Wizard]

James Allen seems to think Hulk is the strongest bet by a fair margin. He would be right.

 

[Shaneus]

Now I think of it, I hope Grosjean stays in F1. Means he's not in the WEC.

 

[Templar Wizard]

Lotus should be Kimi/Maldonado

Ferrari should be Alonso/Hulk

 

[Dead Man]

Compared to the 10 teams behind them? Just because you don't have a double defuser or weapon X from year Y and you are always touching the podium doesn't make you a bad team.
to be even clearer: Williams WERE a top team, but when you place out of the points for several years...

Never said they were a bad team, talk about putting words in peoples posts.

 

[Templar Wizard]

I believe I said 'a team'...

'talk about putting words in peoples posts' etc

 

[Dead Man]

.

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

Some big news better break today, something has to bring an end to this unbearable bullshit.

 

[Hammer24]

And Eddie has already proven is no fool about these kind of stuff.

No offence, but Eddie tells the craziest stories and gossip of them all.
He once said, that RSC was gay. That WW arranged RSC´s marriage, so no word would get out. And that Cora is WW´s former squeeze, and the kid actually from WW himself. Two "problems" solved in one stroke.
That's why I take everything from him with HUGE amounts of salt.

Now for the news:
- despite "very differing data" from teams, Pirelli will NOT change the tyre dimensions for next year. Only Merc voted for this, everyone else against. But Pirelli officially asked FIA to work with different tyre mixtures between front and rears next year to compensate. So... Merc engine truly the monster? Hembery "one manufacturers data is really alarming"
- the talk is now, that that's the way FIA wants to make next years playing field level
- Kimi the odd man out?
-- LOT insists on a pay cut
-- with RIC to RBR, FER has now no pressure to have two #1 drivers
-- that's good for MAS, his chances for one more year increase rapidly
-- HUL now seen as RAI biggest competitor, no matter for what cockpit

 

[Dead Man]

No offence, but Eddie tells the craziest stories and gossip of them all.
He once said, that RSC was gay. That WW arranged RSC´s marriage, so no word would get out. And that Cora is WW´s former squeeze, and the kid actually from WW himself. Two "problems" solved in one stroke.
That's why I take everything from him with HUGE amounts of salt.

Now for the news:
- despite "very differing data" from teams, Pirelli will NOT change the tyre dimensions for next year. Only Merc voted for this, everyone else against. But Pirelli officially asked FIA to work with different tyre mixtures between front and rears next year to compensate. So... Merc engine truly the monster? Hembery "one manufacturers data is really alarming"
- the talk is now, that that's the way FIA wants to make next years playing field level
- Kimi the odd man out?
-- LOT insists on a pay cut
-- with RIC to RBR, FER has now no pressure to have two #1 drivers
-- that's good for MAS, his chances for one more year increase rapidly
-- HUL now seen as RAI biggest competitor, no matter for what cockpit

Good. Ridiculous request.

 

[ramparter]

Lotus should be Kimi/Maldonado

Ferrari should be Alonso/Hulk

I don't think Lotus need another crash talent.

PS: RSC did look kinda gay...

 

[Hammer24]

Good. Ridiculous request.

We´ll talk again, if next year brings a repeat of this years tyre drama. Imagine exploding rears, whenever the pilots engage KERS.

 

[Dead Man]

We´ll talk again, if next year brings a repeat of this years tyre drama. Imagine exploding rears, whenever the pilots engage KERS.

Yeah, that's fine. I think they should change the construction, but to change the dimensions at this point is ridiculous.

 

[Hammer24]

Yeah, that's fine. I think they should change the construction, but to change the dimensions at this point is ridiculous.

The point is, that different tyre dimensions mean you´d need a different gearbox.
If the problem arises next year, they can´t change on the fly. So in the end we´ll see races, where some teams stop once (because they have to change once by rule), and others four to five times. If they´re lucky.
And don´t forget: next years KERS will not be started by hand, but by a kickdown function in the gas pedal. Will be hard for drivers to avoid using it.

 

[DrM]

Now for the news:
- despite "very differing data" from teams, Pirelli will NOT change the tyre dimensions for next year. Only Merc voted for this, everyone else against. But Pirelli officially asked FIA to work with different tyre mixtures between front and rears next year to compensate. So... Merc engine truly the monster? Hembery "one manufacturers data is really alarming"

Now this will be interesting.

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

We´ll talk again, if next year brings a repeat of this years tyre drama. Imagine exploding rears, whenever the pilots engage KERS.

Well if the rumours are true, it'll only be Merc that are fucked.

They'll just get told to turn down their engine on the quiet.

Edit: Hah, forgot to think of Merc as a supplier as opposed to a team. Still, I'd expect the same outcome - pressure to on their engine as opposed to the tyres.

 

[Hammer24]

Edit: Hah, forgot to think of Merc as a supplier as opposed to a team. Still, I'd expect the same outcome - pressure to on their engine as opposed to the tyres.

Wouldn´t work. Next years engine package needs to be a closed box.

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

Wouldn´t work. Next years engine package needs to be a closed box.

I thought they're free to continue to develop for the first year before another freeze?

 

[Hammer24]

I thought they're free to continue to develop for the first year before another freeze?

Yes they can. In a way. They still have only a set number of engines they can use in season, so the development will mostly have to be in the workshop.

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

Yes they can. In a way. They still have only a set number of engines they can use in season, so the development will mostly have to be in the workshop.

But if it comes down to engine or tyres again in the face of 'splodey nonsense, I just can't see it being the tyres that are going to get changed again. The engine would be the 'easiest' tweak, and if that means changing some rules on the fly, I think we have some good precedent already that'll happen.

 

[Hammer24]

But if it comes down to engine or tyres again in the face of 'splodey nonsense, I just can't see it being the tyres that are going to get changed again. The engine would be the 'easiest' tweak, and if that means changing some rules on the fly, I think we have some good precedent already that'll happen.

I think we have to agree to disagree.
I think, before a manufacturer tones done his engine (we´re still talking about racing, right?), Pirelli would be forced to bring harder and harder compounds. Up to a point where they can simply leave out the rubber and bring all-wood carcasses. ;-)

 

[Templar Wizard]

In 2014, Pirelli wouldnt be to clever bringing tires with an aggressive delta. Put a stronger compound in the agreed dimensions and work from there.
There is enough potential for chaos in the new regs.

 

[Seanspeed]

Looking at the points in those years, I wouldn't say they were frontrunners, but as you say, that is probably due to different definitions of front runners. The original post I was replying too said they had always been in the championship hunt.

Well it was said they had always been at 'the sharp end'. Again, depends on how you define that. I take that to mean a front-runner, but its not wrong to consider that meaning regularly fighting for the title, either.

Anyways!

The point is, that different tyre dimensions mean you´d need a different gearbox.
If the problem arises next year, they can´t change on the fly. So in the end we´ll see races, where some teams stop once (because they have to change once by rule), and others four to five times. If they´re lucky.
And don´t forget: next years KERS will not be started by hand, but by a kickdown function in the gas pedal. Will be hard for drivers to avoid using it.

The tire dimensions shouldn't be so different that it would require an entirely new gearbox. We're not talking several inches different or anything.

Its possible that Mercedes are simply trying to feed some slightly exaggerated data to the FIA/Pirelli and scare them a bit into making tires that would perhaps prevent them from having the same troubles they're having this year. Brawn's a clever fellow and don't think any team would be above trying to be sneaky like that.

 

[Hammer24]

The tire dimensions shouldn't be so different that it would require an entirely new gearbox. We're not talking several inches different or anything.

A larger diameter had been ruled out almost from the getgo. The last proposal was to make the rear tyres 2cm wider. And yes, that would have meant new gearboxes for everyone. (Yíppeeee!)

 

[Lach]

F1 will be back soon!

Had a dream about the race last night. Hamilton won in front of Hülkenberg and Vettel.
Then Hamilton and Hulk were disqualified for some reason.
On the podium were Vettel 1st, Alonso 2nd and 3rd was some guy in full American Football Gear...

 

[cmr-94]

F1 will be back soon!

Had a dream about the race last night. Hamilton won in front of Hülkenberg and Vettel.
Then Hamilton and Hulk were disqualified for some reason.
On the podium were Vettel 1st, Alonso 2nd and 3rd was some guy in full American Football Gear...

Sounds more like a nightmare ! haha

 

[Lach]

Eddie Jordan believes Kimi will go to Ferrari. And Eddie has already proven is no fool about these kind of stuff.

After his spot on prediction on Hamilton last season (which hardly anyone else took seriously) I'll give Eddie's the benefit of the doubt....
That would probably lead to Hulk moving to Lotus?

 

[Jibbed]

Anyone heading to Spa this weekend then?

I'm about to start the first leg of my journey today.. Liverpool - Leeds to pick up a few people and stay over there tonight, then driving down first thing in the morning. 1331 miles in total haha, should arrive at the campsite 9pm local time.

 

[DrM]

Anyone heading to Spa this weekend then?

I'm about to start the first leg of my journey today.. Liverpool - Leeds to pick up a few people and stay over there tonight, then driving down first thing in the morning. 1331 miles in total haha, should arrive at the campsite 9pm local time.

Just be careful on roads in Belgium, they are in quite bad shape in that part of the country. Watch for holes....

 

[operon]

Eddie might get some things wrong but when someone such as Bernie wants some info out there, Eddie is usually the guy he gets to do it.

 

[DD]

Fun fact: Massa first met Ferrari's crew in Interlagos when he was a food delivery boy.

 

[Shaneus]

Fun fact: Massa first met Ferrari's crew in Interlagos when he was a food delivery boy.

"You're-a twenty-a minutes a-late-a. This-a pizza, she's-a cold!"

 

[DD]

"You're-a twenty-a minutes a-late-a. This-a pizza, she's-a cold!"

lol

 

[Big Takeover]

"You're-a twenty-a minutes a-late-a. This-a pizza, she's-a cold!"

 

[brotkasten]

Next mental breakdown coming in 3, 2 ...

 

[Psychotext]

I can't even imagine.

 

[DrM]

Eh, if they released the dog to home service he is not in critical condition

Also, back to racing, 2 DRS zones in Spa:
First : detection down to Eau Rouge, activation on Kemmel Straight
Second: detection before the last chicane, activation on start/finish straight

 

[Templar Wizard]

No wonder the dog is sick, he was perforated!
http://instagram.com/p/dDBgBnL0yg/#

 

[Pimpwerx]

One more day until Spa, the best race on the calendar. Hell, one more day for the return of F1. I can't wait! PEACE.

 

[ClassyPenguin]

"You're-a twenty-a minutes a-late-a. This-a pizza, she's-a cold!"

oh lol