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The Formula 1 2013 Season |OT| End of the Webber Era

B

brotkasten

Member
Diablo Rosso said:
What makes you say that?
Click to expand...

There's some huge hype about Mercedes' next years V6 engine.

Extremely fast, more than 100 BHP over the competition and they wanted wider tyres from Pirelli for next season, as they feared the current spec wasn't enough to put the power down. They also showed off the engine very early.
 
N

NHale

Member
Diablo Rosso said:
What makes you say that?
Click to expand...

Rumors around the paddock and public comments from Ferrari and Renault complaining about the regulation changes (even Newey complained...).

And if the rumors are true I doubt the biggest fireworks of next year will be Alonso vs. Kimi. It will be the Mercedes vs. McLaren accusations...
 
S

Shaneus

Member
I'm guessing this?
hDzhjq2.png
 
D

Diablo Rosso

Member
NHale said:
Rumors around the paddock and public comments from Ferrari and Renault complaining about the regulation changes (even Newey complained...).

And if the rumors are true I doubt the biggest fireworks of next year will be Alonso vs. Kimi. It will be the Mercedes vs. McLaren accusations...
Click to expand...

Mercedes vs McLaren will be interesting, especially with Honda coming back as well. I'm sure Mercedes will look for anything to try and get McLaren and Honda in trouble.
 
D

DD

Member
Gruso said:
Some interesting words on the Massa situation from Some Brazilian Guy On The Internet.



From here: http://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/co...sa_will_not_be_driving_for_ferrari_in/cc5ngqv

What do you reckon? From out of his arse, or a realistic assessment of the importance of F1 in Brazil?
Click to expand...
I'm brazilian, so here goes my opinion in bad english. Globo is huge and powerful, and yes, they have the money and the influence. Their relationship with Bernie and the FOM is excelent, and Bernie already said that he will try to help putting Nasr on the grid, because he says that he needs a brazilian there. Why? Because Brazil is usually the country where F1 has it's biggest audience. But the times of Fittipaldi, Piquet and Senna are long gone, and the audience numbers are decreasing rapidly. People are always trying to find the "new Senna", but the fact is: the CBA (Brazilian Confederation of Motoring) is a joke, the only feeder series is the South American Formula 3, which is another joke. So you either are a rich boy that can go to Europe, or you need to be extremely lucky the get some good sponsors here, because the brazilian companies usually prefer to invest in football, for example. Besides Nasr, there's no other brazilian in sight, so if Massa is out and things don't work for Nasr, there will be no one else. So I think that it's easier for Globo to simply drop transmiting the F1.

I have big respect for Massa because he opposes CBA for a long time. He's not the only one that does that, be he was the only one that actually did something tho change things here, as he lauched the Formula Futuro, a cheaper feeder series that offered a seat for the champion in the Formula Abarth, in Italy. But unfortunately things didn't worked out and they had to put an end to the Formula Futuro.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Nearly impossible to say which constructor will be strongest next year. Everything points to Mercedes, but then with that driver lineup you really can't count out Ferrari and you'd have to be an idiot to discount the team that's managed to out develop everyone else for the last four years.
 
M

massivekettle

Member
Diablo Rosso said:
Ferrari are the favourites. Depends on how good the car is, and if Ricciardo can step up.
Click to expand...

Wat? RBR and Brawn recently proved that you don't need the best lineup to win WDC/WCC. The best car will suffice most of the time.

Also, rumours are that Ferrari is either not comfortable with new regs or is behind Renault and Mercedes in engine/ERS package development.
 
Mastah

Mastah

Member
Hammer24 said:
OK guys, now that its all officially official - how do you rate RBR´s chances for the WCC next year?
Click to expand...

It's kinda silly to make predictions without any knowledge whatsoever about power units. If Renault has the best PU over race distance and good enough to be with both Red Bulls in Top 5 in quali, then they are on their way to yet another WDC and WCC.

After 2012 anyone could easily see Red Bull clawing lost downforce back from exhaust gases and again producing rocketship of a car. Before 2014 it takes a brave man to make any meaningful predictions based on zero reliable data we have.
 
G

Gruso

Member
DD said:
I'm brazilian, so here goes my opinion in bad english. Globo is huge and powerful, and yes, they have the money and the influence. Their relationship with Bernie and the FOM is excelent, and Bernie already said that he will try to help putting Nasr on the grid, because he says that he needs a brazilian there. Why? Because Brazil is usually the country where F1 has it's biggest audience. But the times of Fittipaldi, Piquet and Senna are long gone, and the audience numbers are decreasing rapidly. People are always trying to find the "new Senna", but the fact is: the CBA (Brazilian Confederation of Motoring) is a joke, the only feeder series is the South American Formula 3, which is another joke. So you either are a rich boy that can go to Europe, or you need to be extremely lucky the get some good sponsors here, because the brazilian companies usually prefer to invest in football, for example. Besides Nasr, there's no other brazilian in sight, so if Massa is out and things don't work for Nasr, there will be no one else. So I think that it's easier for Globo to simply drop transmiting the F1.

I have big respect for Massa because he opposes CBA for a long time. He's not the only one that does that, be he was the only one that actually did something tho change things here, as he lauched the Formula Futuro, a cheaper feeder series that offered a seat for the champion in the Formula Abarth, in Italy. But unfortunately things didn't worked out and they had to put an end to the Formula Futuro.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the insight :)
 
M

massivekettle

Member
Interesting bit from BBC.

Seeing Alonso and Raikkonen battle it out in equal machinery would be a prospect many would savour - it would be fascinating to find out who would come out on top.

That will be debated endlessly - as comparisons between all the top F1 drivers always are. But one engineer who has worked closely with both is in doubt.

"I think Alonso, pretty convincingly," he said. "Everywhere - especially qualifying and the first laps of the race."
Click to expand...
 
B

Big Takeover

Member
DD said:
I'm brazilian, so here goes my opinion in bad english. Globo is huge and powerful, and yes, they have the money and the influence. Their relationship with Bernie and the FOM is excelent, and Bernie already said that he will try to help putting Nasr on the grid, because he says that he needs a brazilian there. Why? Because Brazil is usually the country where F1 has it's biggest audience. But the times of Fittipaldi, Piquet and Senna are long gone, and the audience numbers are decreasing rapidly. People are always trying to find the "new Senna", but the fact is: the CBA (Brazilian Confederation of Motoring) is a joke, the only feeder series is the South American Formula 3, which is another joke. So you either are a rich boy that can go to Europe, or you need to be extremely lucky the get some good sponsors here, because the brazilian companies usually prefer to invest in football, for example. Besides Nasr, there's no other brazilian in sight, so if Massa is out and things don't work for Nasr, there will be no one else. So I think that it's easier for Globo to simply drop transmiting the F1.

I have big respect for Massa because he opposes CBA for a long time. He's not the only one that does that, be he was the only one that actually did something tho change things here, as he lauched the Formula Futuro, a cheaper feeder series that offered a seat for the champion in the Formula Abarth, in Italy. But unfortunately things didn't worked out and they had to put an end to the Formula Futuro.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the insight. How is the karting scene these days? It used to be a real strong point for young Brazilians.

I think you share some of the same problems as young drivers from the many other parts of the world - Europe has always been the best destination for junior formulas, except now the age at which they do it is much younger. Nasr moved when he was 17. Senna (who was considered young) 21, Piquet 24.

Years ago those guys could make that decision as an adult and go alone if need be, now we're talking about children. It's almost impossible to pack your kid up at 16 or 17 and move to Europe to pursue a racing career.
 
T

Templar Wizard

Member
Im really looking forward to Massa racing now with nothing to lose. He can now outqualify and outrace Alonso since he isn't held back by Ferrari's contract and the clause that Alonso is number one, no matter what his performance is.
 
P

Psychotext

Member
Templar Wizard said:
Im really looking forward to Massa racing now with nothing to lose. He can now outqualify and outrace Alonso since he isn't held back by Ferrari's contract and the clause that Alonso is number one, no matter what his performance is.
Click to expand...

I have a feeling that he'll still play the team game, at least until Alonso is completely out of it.
 
M

Mobius 1

Member
DD said:
I'm brazilian, so here goes my opinion in bad english. Globo is huge and powerful, and yes, they have the money and the influence. Their relationship with Bernie and the FOM is excelent, and Bernie already said that he will try to help putting Nasr on the grid, because he says that he needs a brazilian there. Why? Because Brazil is usually the country where F1 has it's biggest audience. But the times of Fittipaldi, Piquet and Senna are long gone, and the audience numbers are decreasing rapidly. People are always trying to find the "new Senna", but the fact is: the CBA (Brazilian Confederation of Motoring) is a joke, the only feeder series is the South American Formula 3, which is another joke. So you either are a rich boy that can go to Europe, or you need to be extremely lucky the get some good sponsors here, because the brazilian companies usually prefer to invest in football, for example. Besides Nasr, there's no other brazilian in sight, so if Massa is out and things don't work for Nasr, there will be no one else. So I think that it's easier for Globo to simply drop transmiting the F1.

I have big respect for Massa because he opposes CBA for a long time. He's not the only one that does that, be he was the only one that actually did something tho change things here, as he lauched the Formula Futuro, a cheaper feeder series that offered a seat for the champion in the Formula Abarth, in Italy. But unfortunately things didn't worked out and they had to put an end to the Formula Futuro.
Click to expand...

I will second this (I'm also brazilian).

Globo is absurdly wealthy – they can certainly afford to support a driver if the situation demands it, although I'm not certain that regulations allow for broadcasters to directly sponsor teams. Another issue may be that many commitments were made for the World Cup and Olympics in the coming years, so funds may not be there, or at least the appetite for more risk.

Massa will get a seat, no questions about it. Bernie might use that as leverage to get his way, of course. He might demand the long rumored improvements at Interlagos in exchange. It certainly could be done with Globo money.
 
R

RomanticHeroX

Member
I haven't been so excited for a new season since...probably 2007. It's also great to be all in with Ferrari again! Let's just give Vettel his number 4 so 2014 can start.
 
D

DrM

Redmond's Baby
Good thing about this year's Vettel advantage is that we will soon hear some juicy bits from teams, that are in full 2014 mode ;)
 
R

RukusProvider

Banned
People counting out RedBull for 2014 should probably temper their excitement just so the potential meltdowns aren't so epic.

They have the engineering talent, a great driver and a monster budget.
 
A

Addnan

Member
Pretty good read on the BBC. This bit I liked.

Some sources say things got so bad between Alonso and Ferrari that they considered paying him off at the end of this season, but that their sponsor Santander, the Spanish bank, would not accept it.

Either way, the inescapable irony here is that Ferrari have got annoyed with Alonso for being what they wanted him to be, and signed as a result someone who they discovered wasn't that the last time around.
Click to expand...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/24048992
 
D

DD

Member
Gruso said:
Thanks for the insight :)
Click to expand...

:)


Big Takeover said:
Thanks for the insight. How is the karting scene these days? It used to be a real strong point for young Brazilians.

I think you share some of the same problems as young drivers from the many other parts of the world - Europe has always been the best destination for junior formulas, except now the age at which they do it is much younger. Nasr moved when he was 17. Senna (who was considered young) 21, Piquet 24.

Years ago those guys could make that decision as an adult and go alone if need be, now we're talking about children. It's almost impossible to pack your kid up at 16 or 17 and move to Europe to pursue a racing career.
Click to expand...

The karting scene seems fine, but the problem is what comes next. Brazilian Formula Renault is gone, just like the Formula Ford, Formula Chevrolet and Formula Futuro. So the next step is the shitty (and yet expensive) South American Formula 3, but the level here is too low. The boys need to go to Europe to learn the real deal.


Norante said:
I will second this (I'm also brazilian).

Globo is absurdly wealthy – they can certainly afford to support a driver if the situation demands it, although I'm not certain that regulations allow for broadcasters to directly sponsor teams. Another issue may be that many commitments were made for the World Cup and Olympics in the coming years, so funds may not be there, or at least the appetite for more risk.

Massa will get a seat, no questions about it. Bernie might use that as leverage to get his way, of course. He might demand the long rumored improvements at Interlagos in exchange. It certainly could be done with Globo money.
Click to expand...

I'm not really sure about Massa getting a seat. People are talking about Lotus and McLaren, but I don't believe that there's real interest in them with Massa, and I can't blame 'em. On Formula 1 it's all about results, and for 3 years Massa isn't delivering it.

I see Nasr closer to a seat than Massa, because he's the "new Senna", you know, that new hope, even after Helmut Marko saying a big f*ckin' HELL NO to him via brazilian press. It's all about the audience.
 
N

navanman

Crown Prince of Custom Firmware
Zeknurn said:
@ScarbsF1: Chief aerodynamicist Nicolas Hennel has left Ferrari after just over a year in the role, previously he was at McLaren and Renault

Interesting.
Click to expand...
Another failed year for Ferrari and another tech guy gets fired. These guys aren't singularly the cause of the problems. Costa wasn't to blame for 2012 car as has been shown and is doing a great job for Mercedes.

They also just fired Head of Aero Marco De Luca too.

Hulk had contract agreed with Ferrari in Hungary, was informed of Kimi taking the seat by text message.
 
D

DrM

Redmond's Baby
Hennel and De Luca will find new employers very soon, Hennel is already linked to Mercedes. So Bigois will be the next scapegoat if they underperform next year.

But Stefano is still in the saddle. I do not know what is this guy doing to LdM to keep his position...
 
M

Mobius 1

Member
DD said:
:)




The karting scene seems fine, but the problem is what comes next. Brazilian Formula Renault is gone, just like the Formula Ford, Formula Chevrolet and Formula Futuro. So the next step is the shitty (and yet expensive) South American Formula 3, but the level here is too low. The boys need to go to Europe to learn the real deal.




I'm not really sure about Massa getting a seat. People are talking about Lotus and McLaren, but I don't believe that there's real interest in them with Massa, and I can't blame 'em. On Formula 1 it's all about results, and for 3 years Massa isn't delivering it.

I see Nasr closer to a seat than Massa, because he's the "new Senna", you know, that new hope, even after Helmut Marko saying a big f*ckin' HELL NO to him via brazilian press. It's all about the audience.
Click to expand...

You're right about the seat, I don't expect him to get a McLaren seat. More like a smaller team where his experience will make up for sheer results. Williams could use that (and money). Besides, we'd be rid of fucking Maldonado.

I just saw the photos of him and Domenicali that were posted today on formula1.com and now I'm sad. Felipe went throught the sort of injury that ends careers and still had the spirit to return. Like Lauda before him, you have to respect that. Lesser drivers would retire.
 
Myoclonic Jerk

Myoclonic Jerk

Member
Kimi said once that he will end his career in Ferrari..

Talk about a man of his word


So many things are making sense now. To me at least

- The Kimi sacking wasn't based on motivation, ability/skill..etc.. It was either financial or because Alonso didn't want him there (as this time)
- Ferrari acknowledges that they made a mistake by firing Kimi, and as much as I hate that team, even when Kimi drove for it, all the respect to them for ignoring their public image and doing the right thing
- Kimi never wanted to leave Ferrari, which devastated him and made him refuse 3 offers from Toyota, McLaren and Mercedes
- Alonso is losing his grip inside Ferrari and LdM wants to show him who's the boss. Probably his latest shenanigans is what made LdM hire Kimi despite Alonso opposing to it
- Alonso had no idea that the deal was done!! Otherwise he wouldn't say stuff like I want Felipe to stay, or I'll be happy if he stays.
- I'm an idiot for laughing really hard when the rumor first started. I never doubted Kimi's intention to go to Ferrari because he always said that he has no issues or bad feelings towards the team. The only thing he kept saying was "things could've ended in a better way"..

- I'm so frikin excited right now. And really looking forward to see Kimi kicking monobrow's ass
 
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