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The Formula 1 2014 Season |OT| Who Will Win? Nobody Nose
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Templar Wizard
Member
If you Watch the f1 legends with Irvine his take on the Ferrari is that Schumacher was a good worker but it was actually Todt who assembled the team, he hired MSCH and Brawn etc..
So the MSCH myth is really a myth.
That's true. Didn´t want to deny them their part in the success.
Norwegian Rudo
Member
I just rewatched the 1994 season, and MSC got screwed repeatedly by the authorities in a desperate attempt to tighten up the championship he was running away with. It was so blatant that I have no sympathy at all for Hill for what happened in Australia.
BTW, the Japan GP that year is the craziest shit I have ever seen in F1.
This just makes it even more likely that the car will err towards Alonso's well known requirements by the designers in the team, the whole level playing field argument is nonsense.
I don´t think so. FER just built a car as good as they could. Way too many unknowns and intangibles to tailorsuit it to a single driver. Remember, before this season RAI had never driven even a break-by-wire system. He had a lot more adjusting to do than ALO - but we´re now at the end of June, and this argument runs out of steam pretty fast.
nature boy
Member
In 94 Schumi won more races even though he was disqualified in two of them and didn't participate in another two. How does he NOT deserve the title?
In 95 he won more than 50% of the races.
In 2007 Lewis has something like a race win and a half advantage to Kimi with two races to go and lost it. Epic choke from both Lewis and Mclaren (I would say Fernando as well, but the team weren't really going to help him winning the title).
Do you really think the situations are similar?
P.S.: Kimi is seriously overrated as a driver. Likable character nevertheless.
This is backwards logic too. If there are so many intangibles, you go with what you know. Your lead driver prefers more oversteer? That's the direction.
That's the way it works in a normal winter dev cycle, but not when power train AND aero rules change significantly at the same time. Then its more like throwing shit at a wall and see what sticks.
pants
Member
Did Schumacher win those races, or did Damon, in the better car, throw them away?
That's all I'm asking here
Templar Wizard
Member
bu bu bu James Allison said!!!!
I think they may have been targeting an Alonso focus and highest Power Unit output but they failed quite badly on both fronts. They have a tricky car and terrible Power.
It reminds me of 2012, but unlike then the Canada upgrade didnt work
Another year of 'best of the least dominant car'
Fruitster
Member
The 94 Williams was far from a beast of a car. It was acknowledged as being very difficult to drive, even Newey stated as such. Senna even struggled with it. It improved certainly, but Schumacher's Benneton that year was nailed to the road. Schumacher had the best car that year, and easily. 95 however, the Williams was miles better, and Schumacher utterly cleaned house. Hill and Coulthard made far too many mistakes that year while Schumacher was peerless in an inferior car.
Psychotext
Member
So what are the penalties which will be handed out for using too many car bits? I'm assuming as of a couple of races from now we'll basically be seeing Vettel (and some others) starting X places back in every race.
c) Should a driver use more than five of any one of the elements a grid place penalty will be imposed upon him at the first Event during which each additional element is used. Penalties will be applied according to the following table and will be cumulative :
Replacement of a complete power unit = The driver concerned must start the race from the pit lane.
The first time a 6th of any of the elements is used = Ten grid place penalty.
The first time a 6th of any of the remaining elements is used = Five grid place penalty.
The first time a 7th of any of the elements is used = Ten grid place penalty.
The first time a 7th of any of the remaining elements is used, and so on = Five grid place penalty.
A power unit or any of the six components will be deemed to have been used once the car's timing transponder has shown that it has left the pit lane.
If a grid place penalty is imposed, and the driver's grid position is such that the full penalty cannot be applied, the remainder of the penalty will be applied at the driver's next Event. However, no such remaining penalties will be carried forward for more than one Event.
rockman zx
Member
Alonso feedback is so bad that it broke the wind tunnel and tricked the engineers to think it was ok for quite some years, Alonso feedback is so bad that the designers make shitty wings and floors, Alonso feedback is so bad that the engine people in Maranello makes a shitty PU.
Give me a break, if there is something that is working in Ferrari, that is Alonso..... and the pit crew.
By the way, I guess 2009 didn't happen or maybe it was a great year by your standards.
Psychotext
Member
Ouch. Going to make for a fun rest of season for some drivers.
Basically Sebastian will soon be starting at the back of the grid for the remainder of the season. I hope he has written off this season already.
Psychotext
Member
I think you could tell pretty easily from the interviews that this is the case. He's just laughing it off at this point.
Seriously, MSC was an excellent driver but some people thinking the assembled the Ferrari dream team by himself are amusing.
nature boy
Member
Driver is not separated from car and team and vice-versa.
In 2007 Hamilton/Mclaren choked big time - it was their title to lose - not because they had a vastly superior car (Kimi actually won more races) but they blew a 15 point lead with two races to go AND they had 2 drivers fighting to the end. So how Mclaren lost the drivers title is beyond me.
So yes if Schumi or Damon choked on a 15 point lead with two races to go then the guy that won the title wouldn't be in my view so deserving on the title.
After qualy I thought my memory was playing tricks on me, I always disliked this track. Visually though it is a breath of fresh air with all the masses of tilke style tracks these days that just look like parking lots with paint.
Race suggested my memory may have been correct. Still really nice just to see a more traditional looking track though.
True words.
Formula one has had a lot of seasons that were about managing some part of the car. I think the increased radio comms and more systems that might need managing makes it seem like it is much worse than it used to be.
Race suggested my memory may have been correct. Still really nice just to see a more traditional looking track though.
True words.
Formula one has had a lot of seasons that were about managing some part of the car. I think the increased radio comms and more systems that might need managing makes it seem like it is much worse than it used to be.
I imagine they'll look at it as strategically as possible and replace things as needed to take the hits as lightly as possible.
God that would make me laugh. Fuck this sport's administration is broken.
Yeah, may as well replace everything at once a couple times than something different at every race.
The power unit can be 92% different by weight next year anyway. Only 8% has to homolglated for next year.
AFAIK, under the current rule REN would not be allowed to split the turbo for next year - which is what they´d have to do to close the gap.
RedBull and Mateschitz both pouring ice cold water on the idea of building their own engines.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114611
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114611
Roude Leiw
Member
i was about to post the same. even though i didnt like the nose in the beginning.
now the ferrari.... man what an ugly nose.
pants
Member
You have an interesting definition of winning vs being handed a title. You place way too much emphasis on the last couple of races. By your own admission Kimi had more victories than the other two yet he lucked into something. Okay. I'd call it clinch but never undeserved as he outscored his competitors over the course of a season.
It's also kind of nuts for you to say someone didnt deserve a title. A season is like 17 races brah. I for example don't rate Button as the fastest driver out there, but he for sure deserved his title.
Fox Mulder
Member
sad. It's one thing that he's struggling to adapt, but he's also getting shit cars and ricciardo is doing great.
I imagine many teams have written the season off already though.
Even without fighting for the championship win, it's important to do as well as possible for the constructors championship money up for grabs.
As it stands right now RBR and Merc have swapped over from last season, Ferrari are still 3rd, Force India have jumped 2 places from 6th to 4th, Williams 4 places from 9th to 5th, McLaren down 1 to 6th, Torro Rosso up 1 to 7th, Lotus down 4 to 8th, Marussia up 1 to 9th and Sauber down 3 to 10th.
Of the total prize pot, 50% is distributed evenly to any team that finished in the top 10 for 2 seasons on the bounce, the other 50% is given out based on final constructors position. 1st place receives 19% of that 50%, while 10th gets just 4%.
So for Red Bull and Mercedes it could mean $10m changing hands between them, while Williams might get an extra $20m for the jump to 4th, and Lotus lose nearly that from the drop to 8th.
To RBR and Merc, $10m isn't so much, but to Williams and Lotus, $20m is a fat lump of change, as is the $10m that Sauber could lose out on.
Let's be honest, Kimi didn't exactly wipe the floor with Massa. Let's not forget the only reason Kimi has a title in the first place is because Massa moved over to give him in the win in Brazil. 2008 speaks for itself really.
Still wish Williams took home that one. Stupid pit strategies, always letting them down :/
Depending on when they'd be given the green light, wouldn't it be too late for them to start developing for next year? Obviously they have some development work in the bag with the current engine, but they're still building a largely different power plant from what they're currently using.
That's only the B reason. The WIL still needs way more tyres than the MER, and the higher the temperatures the higher the problem. The moment they got the weather forecast Sunday morning they knew and conceded that a 3-4 would be the optimal outcome. I´m pretty happy they were able to achieve that!
Not really, we´re talking more about parts placement (split turbo, see Merc engine) than anything else.
Sad news:
MSC medical record folder looks to have been stolen (in the old Grenoble clinic, just before his transfer) and is offered for sale by the thieves.
- They are trying to auction them to the media, initial bid 50k .
- no one knows if the offered stuff is for real
- but the theft has been confirmed
- (at least) the first two pages out of ten went missing
- his Swiss lawyers and his manager Sabine Kehm filed criminal complaints in France and Switzerland
MSC medical record folder looks to have been stolen (in the old Grenoble clinic, just before his transfer) and is offered for sale by the thieves.
- They are trying to auction them to the media, initial bid 50k .
- no one knows if the offered stuff is for real
- but the theft has been confirmed
- (at least) the first two pages out of ten went missing
- his Swiss lawyers and his manager Sabine Kehm filed criminal complaints in France and Switzerland
Sad news:
MSC medical record folder looks to have been stolen (in the old Grenoble clinic, just before his transfer) and is offered for sale by the thieves.
- They are trying to auction them to the media, initial bid 50k .
- no one knows if the offered stuff is for real
- but the theft has been confirmed
- (at least) the first two pages out of ten went missing
- his Swiss lawyers and his manager Sabine Kehm filed criminal complaints in France and Switzerland
What a bunch of fucking scumbags.
Ah, righteo (on both counts). Thanks for filling me inThat's only the B reason. The WIL still needs way more tyres than the MER, and the higher the temperatures the higher the problem. The moment they got the weather forecast Sunday morning they knew and conceded that a 3-4 would be the optimal outcome. I´m pretty happy they were able to achieve that!
Not really, we´re talking more about parts placement (split turbo, see Merc engine) than anything else.
I can't wait to see what a solid constructors finish is going to do to Williams next year. Will the money they get this year be apparent from the start of 2015, or will it take a while to see the effect of it?Well it must be a sound strategy in difficult times given that RBR have copied them by effectively sacking Newey.
The money, while important for WIL, is not key. The very good Merc relationship is. The Wolffs do talk a lot, I´m told...
Lauda quote: "Claire and Suzie are part of my family".
- Newey gets indecent offer from FER
- RBR (or better, Mateschitz) tells him he would counter any offer, no matter how high; and would let Newey choose his own role, just to make him happy and not go to the competition
- Newey agrees to stay with RB under these terms, but wants to change from F1 to the Americas Cup team, fulfilling his life long dream to be involved in the yachts design
- he´ll still help out with the RBR team on the car, but not in the fulltime role, starting 2015
Psychotext
Member
Smartest move they could make really. They still get his input, but instead of him being miserable, he gets to do what he wants to do.
Well, it's important in that it means they don't need another Pastor
I'm sure they said the 2015 car was the last one he'll work full-time on. Does that mean he'll push the 2015 out the door then leave the in-season development (mostly) to the new guard?
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
There's an article up on Autosport that quotes Toto Wolff saying that "transparency" between the Merc drivers suffered at the Austrian GP. Can't wait for it all to kick off again
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