I'm still waiting on my Rift but the Vive straps do not go over my ears. I find the Vive comfortable even with glasses but my girlfriend finds it to be way too heavy and says the weight is too much on the front of her head. We tried adjusting but it just doesn't work well. I think that this is going to be a very personal question and vary greatly just based on the head and face size and shape of different people.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
The High-end VR Discussion Thread (HTC Vive, Oculus Rift, Playstation VR)
- Thread starter Cartman86
- Start date
I'm still waiting on my Rift but the Vive straps do not go over my ears. I find the Vive comfortable even with glasses but my girlfriend finds it to be way too heavy and says the weight is too much on the front of her head. We tried adjusting but it just doesn't work well. I think that this is going to be a very personal question and vary greatly just based on the head and face size and shape of different people.
If you just look at the headsets (which I consider wrong, but hey, that's what you asked for), then I think they are somewhat equivalent. Each has its own advantages and disadvantages.
The Rift is a bit lighter and easier to put on. The Vive has adjustable eye relief distance. Both have good optics in terms of sweet spot, but both also have different types of optical artifacts. The Vive has a slightly larger FoV, the Rift has slightly more pixels per degree. The Rift has slightly better straps, the Vive has a slightly more comfortable face interface (that sounds silly).
I do think that the Vive is hands-down the far more comfortable of the two to wear with glasses.
cleveridea
Member
Yeah, I'm thinking of holding off buying until I can try one (supposedly demo units will come available at gamestops, but all my nearby stores are just packed with stuff everywhere so I dont see how they make the space!)
Wont get one for months most likely, but at $800 its sounding a bit too risky to buy one without trying it. I'd rather wait to test them out and if necessary wait for later models than buy one now and have it collect dust because its just too uncomfortable. In the meantime I have the Gear VR to experience the non-gaming (or very simple gaming, I love the smash hit game and the space shooter) applications which are surprisingly awesome.
cleveridea
Member
Cool thanks. Yeah to me I want the full experience with tracked controllers and room scale, and I cant afford both rift and vive. I'd slightly prefer oculus because of more games and I intend to program for it as a developer. Vive would be the no brainer buy if oculus didnt have the controllers and room space coming, since I consider that central to the true potential of VR.
Well, from what we know at this point Oculus decidedly doesn't have room scale coming. Every time someone asks them about it they reiterate that they are not targeting that.
I mean, of course all of that could change, but even if they do perform such a re-shift in focus (and personally I don't think this looks likely, although I'd be very happy if they did), the Rift HMD itself isn't designed for a room scale target.
The cables are too short, the FoV is angled upward and focused on the horizontal over the vertical, and there is no camera to orient yourself or grab a drink off the shelf.
Of course, none of those are absolute dealbreaker problems in and of themselves if they can get the tracking working at room scale sufficiently well, but it is rather obvious that one of these systems was designed for 360° / room scale and the other wasn't.
I mean, of course all of that could change, but even if they do perform such a re-shift in focus (and personally I don't think this looks likely, although I'd be very happy if they did), the Rift HMD itself isn't designed for a room scale target.
The cables are too short, the FoV is angled upward and focused on the horizontal over the vertical, and there is no camera to orient yourself or grab a drink off the shelf.
Of course, none of those are absolute dealbreaker problems in and of themselves if they can get the tracking working at room scale sufficiently well, but it is rather obvious that one of these systems was designed for 360° / room scale and the other wasn't.
Chairmanchuck
Member
I actually wonder whether the delay of Touch was, so they could see how the competition/userbase reacts to roomscale. I mean Touch seems to be finished already, they show it off at events like GDC, but doesnt release it, while there doesnt seem big problems.
Wonder if they delayed it so they can see, whether roomscale might be important, to offer a roomscale solution with Touch.
cleveridea
Member
Ah thanks for the info. I was given bad info then. Def want the room scale, so that rules out oculus. I have a Gear VR and get terrible motion sickness whenever a game has direct controller movement, I know it depends on the game and they can use tricks like teleportation with otherwise fixed perspective but I think that room scale is the only version that will completely eliminate it - which I'll need to test of course since I havent had the chance to try it yet.
Dreamwriter
Member
Yeah, and then they proceed to say they aren't targeting any motion controls at all, that right now they are only targeting the base unit with an Xbox One controller. They've basically been implying that they are still trying to decide how exactly to market the Oculus Touch setup, depending on how developers end up using it. For example:
Palmer Luckey said:
So people with the Rift and the Vive, how much hassle is it switching between the two? How feasible is it to leave them both plugged in? (providing you have the amount of necessary ports) Any complications?
I've heard the Rift in particular is pretty easy to set back up (as in it's fairly plug-n-play after initial setup), so but wondered if there was any oddities that come out of using both of them (not simultaneously).
I've heard the Rift in particular is pretty easy to set back up (as in it's fairly plug-n-play after initial setup), so but wondered if there was any oddities that come out of using both of them (not simultaneously).
This was my plan, so I'm glad to hear it seems to work (even in your limited experience).
Someone over at reddit with both a vive and CV1 said that you can use both headsets at the same time if you have an SLI setup. Just plug one headset into each card and launch both applications simultaneously and it'll work like expected. He actually had an r390x not two discreet cards.
That would be awesome for 2 player games if you have the space. Last night, I did alt space with a friend and we had to pass the headset back and forth. It'd be awesome if we could both use altspace at the same time.
That would be awesome for 2 player games if you have the space. Last night, I did alt space with a friend and we had to pass the headset back and forth. It'd be awesome if we could both use altspace at the same time.
flipswitch
Member
Don't have a headset yet, but I'm looking forward to old PC games getting VR support. The question is how well is it implemented since it's a user mod. I want Deus Ex support asap! ( I know old game, but I want to be lost in its universe)
Which headset has the least amount of cords and is easiest to set up?
Which headset has the least amount of cords and is easiest to set up?
Vive has way more accessories but is very easy to set up and surprisingly has a lot less cords to plug into your PC than the Rift. Any 2D game can be played in Theatre mode through SteamVR with the Vive.
But keep in mind Deus Ex or any normal game isn't what VR is made for. You can't just grab an existing game and throw VR support on it.
flipswitch
Member
http://vr.mkeblx.net/oculus-sim/
Has this been posted yet?
Shows you what the view looks like in terms of screen door effect. I wonder how accurate it is.
Has this been posted yet?
Shows you what the view looks like in terms of screen door effect. I wonder how accurate it is.
It is very inaccurate
flipswitch
Member
It's not really possible to convey the effect on a normal screen. And SDE isn't a factor of resolution anyways.
Its simulation of Low Persistence isn't accurate either because it doesn't factor in black smear on OLED displays.
flipswitch
Member
But there is SDE, I've read it many times, just wondering how close it is to the simulator.
and I'm telling you, the simulator isn't accurate at all. Nobody is saying SDE doesn't exist.
Chairmanchuck
Member
So.
Are there any older projects that have been ported to either SteamVR, Oculus SDK 1.3 or OpenVR?
I see a lot of great things that were released on Oculus Share before, but seems unless you downgrade or edit something, you cant play those anymore. Like the New Retro Arcade.
What about The Witness? I remember Durante could run it in VR on the DK2. Is that possible yet?
From what I can see right now, we see the launch of both headsets, got some new and old experience, but not much "demos", "experiences" that were available on Oculus Share or are available on GearVR now.
Are there any older projects that have been ported to either SteamVR, Oculus SDK 1.3 or OpenVR?
I see a lot of great things that were released on Oculus Share before, but seems unless you downgrade or edit something, you cant play those anymore. Like the New Retro Arcade.
What about The Witness? I remember Durante could run it in VR on the DK2. Is that possible yet?
From what I can see right now, we see the launch of both headsets, got some new and old experience, but not much "demos", "experiences" that were available on Oculus Share or are available on GearVR now.
I wrote something about my direct comparison of the "seated experience" with both HMDs:
Comparing the seated Vive and Rift CV1 experience in Radial-G
The most surprising thing to me was how differently the optical artifacts manifested, and how preferable one was over the other.
Comparing the seated Vive and Rift CV1 experience in Radial-G
The most surprising thing to me was how differently the optical artifacts manifested, and how preferable one was over the other.
your notes on fresnel light artifacts are precisely what I tried to describe back here: https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/421de1/the_fresnel_lenses_on_the_htc_vive_are_very/
The first few days when CV1 opinions were coming out, I was surprised to hear people describe the fresnel artifacts as "god rays." It wasn't until I tried a CV1 myself that I realized the headsets had different artifacts. I feel like the Vive's artifacts are "uglier" in that they almost resemble to me scratches on the lense, but I also feel like they're less noticeable than the rift's artifacts.
Yes, that's pretty much it. And when you think about a few bright spots rather than one, and a non-flat background, the "ugliness" becomes basically irrelevant while the fact that the Rift "god rays" are still quite prominent is an issue.
Melon Husk
Member
When you place you headset on the floor, do you see any vibration in the mirror display?
BTW, FYI, overclocking seems to have fixed the frame drop issue. Disabled camera for now too.
edit: meant to post this in the Launch thread...
BTW, FYI, overclocking seems to have fixed the frame drop issue. Disabled camera for now too.
edit: meant to post this in the Launch thread...
Zalusithix
Member
Heh, I didn't even think about the blending aspect in regards to the artifacts. It would indeed make sense that a larger, but more dissipated artifact would better blend into a non-uniform background than a smaller more intense one. Guess even the question of better optics is a toss up that's conditional on what's being displayed. Compromises everywhere.
My body is ready for gen 2
Zalusithix
Member
Yep, here's to hoping that gen 2 will see some improvements across the board. Still, with eye tracking and other features remaining to be implemented, we're not yet at a pure "refine" stage. Gen two will have rough spots of its own, regardless of whether it alleviates some of this gen's issues. It probably wont be till gen 3 or 4 that we have a final baseline for VR where from that point onward it's just refinement of existing implementations rather than radical changes.
Guardian Monkey
Member
Yeah.. even though the sde is way better on the newer headsets it is visible. The 4k rendering I dont think is right. I think that is still too good vs what it will really be.
I just finished playing that before getting here. Although it looks good. I find it rather dull in gameplay.
Guardian Monkey
Member
I would take wireless at current resolutions with more base stations than 4k wired though personally.
I'm so curious about Chunks, which enters early access tomorrow.
I thought it was a Roller Coaster creator/rider with a Minecraft aesthetic, but looking at the Steam page for it, the Roller Coasters are a workshop plugin add-on.
So it looks like a VR Creative Mode Minecraft with workshop support? How bizarre.
I thought it was a Roller Coaster creator/rider with a Minecraft aesthetic, but looking at the Steam page for it, the Roller Coasters are a workshop plugin add-on.
So it looks like a VR Creative Mode Minecraft with workshop support? How bizarre.
I really don't think wireless should take priority over any other improvement. It's the least of the problems with this gen. I've clocked 30 hours with this headset and not once did I trip or feel like a wireless solution would have let me move around more within the limited space I had. It's a minor inconvenience that becomes second nature real fast. I'd rather we hit the ideal display configuration first while we wait for wireless tech to inevitably catch up.
More base stations can work right now. All we need is a longer wire (and perhaps bigger houses?)
plagiarize
Banned
Thanks for doing this, I knew things would come back down to earth a bit once people have their headsets. The example using background noise probably explains why there's been a bit of a debate over whether the Rift has 'more' glare or not, from some people saying they're the same and some people saying the Rift is worse.
On a case by case basis you're going to have some games where it isn't an issue for both. You're going to have some games where it's a major issue for both. But I doubt you're going to have any cases where it's not an issue on the Rift yet is on the Vive and there will be cases as you say where it's much less noticeable on the Vive.
If Pinball FX2 was on the Vive, I doubt it would be as noticeable as it is on the Rift, for example. But Apollo 11 experience is probably going to be equally bad in both cases.
Eye tracking seems like it would be problematic with the current lens tech. The further to the sides you look, the blurrier the image.
I don't think it's a major issue for any game on either headset so far. The biggest issue seems to be in menus, which would improve over time as devs learn what not to do. How bad is it in Apollo 11?
Good point. Until lens quality improves dramatically, we might be able to get by with solutions like MRS.
plagiarize
Banned
Not major as in 'it'll stop you enjoying the game' but major as in obvious and somewhat distracting.
flipswitch
Member
How important is a Windows 10, specifically DX12 for VR now and in the future?
I'm currently on win8.0, have some issues upgrading so I decided to buy win10.
Should I just get it over and done with and install it or stay on win8?
I'm currently on win8.0, have some issues upgrading so I decided to buy win10.
Should I just get it over and done with and install it or stay on win8?
Yaser Tech
Member
So I'm extremely undecided at the moment and need your guys help.
I just built a very capable PC so I can take full advantage of VR (i7, 980ti etc). I can't decide which headset to get. I had a vive preordered but that was a hot mess of logistics and it was cancelled. If I order one now it will hopefully arrive late May (but I doubt it). I had this idea in my mind that Vive is better in everything but I don't really know what I'm talking about, so I'd like some clarifications on that.
I don't mind buying from scalpers on ebay for a lot more to get it sooner, but there are no Vives even there. There's an oculus rift but somehow I feel like i'm buying an inferior product. Also, how good is Room Scale in Vive and are there a lot of games that support it? I'm kinda worried about oculus not having any peripheral controls.
I really appreciate any opinions on this.
I just built a very capable PC so I can take full advantage of VR (i7, 980ti etc). I can't decide which headset to get. I had a vive preordered but that was a hot mess of logistics and it was cancelled. If I order one now it will hopefully arrive late May (but I doubt it). I had this idea in my mind that Vive is better in everything but I don't really know what I'm talking about, so I'd like some clarifications on that.
I don't mind buying from scalpers on ebay for a lot more to get it sooner, but there are no Vives even there. There's an oculus rift but somehow I feel like i'm buying an inferior product. Also, how good is Room Scale in Vive and are there a lot of games that support it? I'm kinda worried about oculus not having any peripheral controls.
I really appreciate any opinions on this.
Felix Lighter
Member
Has this been posted?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RKh0B4SNp8&nohtml5=False
It's interesting. If it works correctly it solves a ton of VR problems but I think it may exacerbate one. It stimulates the inner ear along with the visuals. This should eliminate the sickness issue for games that don't have 1 to 1 motion but I would imagine that the urge to counter the motion to stay balanced would be irresistible making standing while playing even more risky.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RKh0B4SNp8&nohtml5=False
It's interesting. If it works correctly it solves a ton of VR problems but I think it may exacerbate one. It stimulates the inner ear along with the visuals. This should eliminate the sickness issue for games that don't have 1 to 1 motion but I would imagine that the urge to counter the motion to stay balanced would be irresistible making standing while playing even more risky.
The primary problem is it does not work nearly as well as you'd assume. Gvs provides blunt responses. It is good for making people fall down, not so much for making people believe they are actually moving.
Give an analogy - spin around a whole bunch, then stand still. Feel how the world feels like it is shifting? That is the kind of feeling gvs provides. And essentially in a binary on/off state.
InaudibleWhispa
Member
In terms of the headsets, they're both great. Oculus is getting the Touch motion controllers later in the year, but given that you're willing to pay above and beyond to get VR sooner rather than later, the Vive is probably your best bet right now given that it's the more complete VR experience. There are enough good room scale/motion control games to justify the additional cost.
libertytoast
Neo Member
As far as I know though, Oculus hasn't said anything about including a second sensor, or a standard chaperone system for Touch games. I really hope both of those things happen, so Touch and Vive have equal footing with room scale.
Zalusithix
Member
Every single demonstration for the Touch controllers has had two cameras. There's no way that they won't include a second one. How much they'll support an opposing camera configuration remains to be seen, however. Chaperone is just software. They could roll that out now if they wanted. Granted, it probably wouldn't be the best idea with a desk mounted camera that's easily moved during day to day activities.
Felix Lighter
Member
That's unfortunate. Then they are overstating the tech's capabilities in that video but I should have realized that when they switched to the business guys.
It says on the Oculus site itself that Touch ships with a second sensor.
https://www.oculus.com/en-us/touch/
Worth noting that gvs isnt new. Its been around for a long time.