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The King Of Fighters XIII + Steam Edition |OT| Now on Steam with Improved Netcode!

Nothing beats the BlazBlue (CS) netcode though.

I feel like everyone praises BlazBlue's "netcode" and asks "why can't every fighting game have netcode this good" when really the reason it plays so smooth online are the massive amounts of command buffer window and hitstun masking any input delay.
 
I feel like everyone praises BlazBlue's "netcode" and asks "why can't every fighting game have netcode this good" when really the reason it plays so smooth online are the massive amounts of command buffer window and hitstun masking any input delay.

When Arc System Works ported Arcana Heart 3 to consoles, they used an improved version of the BB netcode and the game runs just as good if not better. AH3 lacks the generous 5-frame input buffer of BB.

The real question is, "why can't Arc handle the home ports of every arcade fighter?"
 
When Arc System Works ported Arcana Heart 3 to consoles, they used an improved version of the BB netcode and the game runs just as good if not better. AH3 lacks the generous 5-frame input buffer of BB.

The real question is, "why can't Arc handle the home ports of every arcade fighter?"

This man speaks, truth. VSHG owners know wisdom like Buddah.
 

Fersis

It is illegal to Tag Fish in Tag Fishing Sanctuaries by law 38.36 of the GAF Wildlife Act
When Arc System Works ported Arcana Heart 3 to consoles, they used an improved version of the BB netcode and the game runs just as good if not better. AH3 lacks the generous 5-frame input buffer of BB.

The real question is, "why can't Arc handle the home ports of every arcade fighter?"
Arc System Works has a competitive advantage maybe they dont want to give their netcode to 'rival companies'? Or maybe SNKP doesnt want to spend the money.
Dunno.
 

Skilletor

Member
This man speaks, truth. VSHG owners know wisdom like Buddah.

:(

When the ps3 launched, I bought an HRAP because I knew Hori products. I played on a VSHG later and knew I made the wrong decision.

BTW, this game is amazing. It's reminded me what I love about 2D fighters that my once favorite series has left behind.
 
Arc System Works has a competitive advantage maybe they dont want to give their netcode to 'rival companies'? Or maybe SNKP doesnt want to spend the money.
Dunno.

Arcana Heart 3 was made by Examu. That company is a rival arcade developer.
Arc handled the home port.

I dunno if it's a money issue, though I'm sure Atlus has the means to bid higher than Arc does.
 
:(

When the ps3 launched, I bought an HRAP because I knew Hori products. I played on a VSHG later and knew I made the wrong decision.

BTW, this game is amazing. It's reminded me what I love about 2D fighters that my once favorite series has left behind.
I know what you mean. This is my GOTY. I don't buy DLC for games at all. But for KOF, I'm getting them.
 

Fersis

It is illegal to Tag Fish in Tag Fishing Sanctuaries by law 38.36 of the GAF Wildlife Act
Arcana Heart 3 was made by Examu. That company is a rival arcade developer.
Arc handled the home port.

I dunno if it's a money issue, though I'm sure Atlus has the means to bid higher than Arc does.
Dont know then.
What i do know is that XIII netcode sucks.
 
Can anyone recommend some good, effective Drive Cancels for Yuri? I try to do a Kohohken or Chou Upper to Thousand Slap but no matter what I try, I always Super Cancel into her DM.

I can't believe for as long as I've played KoF I never knew about the shortcut inputs trick. Still trying to wrap my head around it and put it to good use.
 

alstein

Member
so is the netcode worse than SF4's? shame if that is the case.

It is, though it's possible if your internet is good to find some folks who you play decently with. Not many, but they're out there.

Too bad one of them in my case ragequits if you don't let him hit you for 700+ damage.
 

Busaiku

Member
I found that the indicator for stable online play is inconsistent
I haven't had a 4 bar match yet, but not every 3 bar match is the same. Sometimes 2 bar matches have been better than 3 bar matches.
 

Tizoc

Member
DP+A/C until dead. They may hit you out of it or move out of range at times, but if they're in the corner they're as good as dead. This applies to pretty much all of the AI at least on default.

Thanks will try that out.

I'm back in the lab and am trying King ATM: Her NEOMAX is pretty tricky and does less damage at the corner.

King:
Jumping D-->St. D (2 hits)-->DF+D-->HD activate-->St. D (2 hits)-->DF+D-->HCB+BxxNEOMAX does 536 (give or take 20 or so points)

In the corner King has this nice little combo-
Jumping D-->St. D (2 hits)-->DF+D-->HD activate-->St. D (2 hits)-->DF+D-->HCB+B-->[DP+BxxHCB]*n-->QCFx2+PP
This combo does 651 damage


Mai:
Jumping C-->St. C-->HD activate-->St. C-->QCF+CxxNEOMAX does 612 damage
Jumping C-->St. C-->HD activate-->St. C-->QCF+CxxLvl. 1 superxxNEOMAX does 779 damage

You can also do:
Jumping C-->St. C-->HD activate-->St. C-->QCB+CxxQCF+CxxLvl. 1 superxxNEOMAX for something near 800 damage


Leona:
To cancel her moon slasher into her dashing slash input as follows:
Charge Dwn-Back, then Up-Back+P, then quickly press Fwd+K

Jumping C-->St. C (2 hits)-->HD activate-->St. C (2 hits)-->NEOMAX does 549 damage
Jumping C-->St. C (2 hits)-->HD activate-->St. C (2 hits)-->Kick superxxNEOMAX does 714 damage
Input the super after Leona poses for the explosion of the super for the NEOMAX to combo

Can anyone pull this off? I can't seem to get it >_<
Jumping C-->Cr. C-->HD activate-->Cr. C-->Dwn, Up+PxxSlash dashxxKick superxxNEOMAX


Iori:
Iori got it easy with comboing into his NEOMAX

Jumping C-->St. C-->DF+C-->HD activate-->St. C-->DF+C-->Lvl. 1 super-->NEOMAX does 853 damage

Jumping C-->St. C-->DF+C-->HD activate-->St. C-->DF+C-->QCB+BxxQCB+CxxDP+AxxNEOMAX does 715 damage
Jumping C-->St. C-->DF+C-->HD activate-->St. C-->DF+C-->QCB+BxxQCB+CxxDP+C-->Lvl. 1 super-->NEOMAX does 882 damage
Using Lvl. 2 does 953 damage. Note that you don't super cancel the DP+C, just input the super and catch them as they fall.
 

Shadow780

Member
I just had the smoothest session with a random on PSN. Everything felt good, execution was lagless. We must both be on fiber, near each other, and DMZ'd. Man when this game works online, the feel is orgasmic.

Too bad the next person immediately turned to shit :/
 
Atlus cares...maybe (From their forums)

Nothing's been said yet because there isn't anything to say yet. Big issues like this tend to go the way of official announcements, and official announcements typically aren't made unless there's something concrete and of substance to say. As should be obvious, SNK is going to be the shot caller when it comes to addressing these issues, and considering the game hasn't even released in Japan yet, you're gonna have to sit tight until things come together.

Go ahead and apply this response to the other issues that've arose. And please don't come at me with follow-up questions or anything, 'cause you won't hear anything else until an official announcement comes. Our PR dept. will probably be upset with me as it is just for making this post.

EDIT: lol...
 

notworksafe

Member
A patch will happen. SNK patched their other games. I'm not super shocked at the netcode having issues either. I don't think any 2D fighting game this gen has had fantastic netcode out of the gate.
 
Leona:
To cancel her moon slasher into her dashing slash input as follows:
Charge Dwn-Back, then Up-Back+P, then quickly press Fwd+K

Jumping C-->St. C (2 hits)-->HD activate-->St. C (2 hits)-->NEOMAX does 549 damage
Jumping C-->St. C (2 hits)-->HD activate-->St. C (2 hits)-->Kick superxxNEOMAX does 714 damage
Input the super after Leona poses for the explosion of the super for the NEOMAX to combo

Can anyone pull this off? I can't seem to get it >_<
Jumping C-->Cr. C-->HD activate-->Cr. C-->Dwn, Up+PxxSlash dashxxKick superxxNEOMAX

which part is giving you trouble? Also can I assume you're looping the dwn, Up+slash XX slash dash part 4 or 5 times? Lastly I'd substitute the first cr. A with a cr. A incase they're blocking high.
 

Tizoc

Member
which part is giving you trouble? Also can I assume you're looping the dwn, Up+slash XX slash dash part 4 or 5 times? Lastly I'd substitute the first cr. A with a cr. A incase they're blocking high.

I just have trouble doing the cancels (I keep messing my timings). For anyone who has tried that combo; how much damage does it do.
 

alstein

Member
I think with this game my "the closer it is to perfect, the more I rage at the imperfections" is really getting to me.

So many good things, which makes the bad (netcode, half-circles) stand out so much more.
 

TGMIII

Member
A patch will happen. SNK patched their other games. I'm not super shocked at the netcode having issues either. I don't think any 2D fighting game this gen has had fantastic netcode out of the gate.

Blazblue was fine on launch from what I remember, same with Arcana heart but that's a given.

It's a shame there's issues with the netcode as I really feel SNK needed to get a hole in one with the complete package and yet again they've tripped up somewhere. Hopefully they can put a little extra work in and make it better but I don't think we've seen any retail fighter get a patch that's made the netcode drastically better, have we?
 

Fersis

It is illegal to Tag Fish in Tag Fishing Sanctuaries by law 38.36 of the GAF Wildlife Act
Im having some input issues too. HCF being recognized as DPs and such but i think its my fault for playing with a DualShock 3

I want to get a MadCatz SSFIV TE Stick but the importers here sell them at double the price and i dont have a credit card to buy them from Amazon or something like that. :(
tl;dr: All the importes are crooks therefore i dont have a stick

BTW how bad is the regular SFIV stick compared to the Tournament Edition ?
 

alstein

Member
Blazblue was fine on launch from what I remember, same with Arcana heart but that's a given.

It's a shame there's issues with the netcode as I really feel SNK needed to get a hole in one with the complete package and yet again they've tripped up somewhere. Hopefully they can put a little extra work in and make it better but I don't think we've seen any retail fighter get a patch that's made the netcode drastically better, have we?

CT wasn't fine on launch from what I remember- people thought it was terrible, but it had a quick patch which gave it the online goodness.

I think SNK did enough to get by with the hardcores and single-player types who either play offline mainly or don't play online period , but they lost the stream monster class.

Tekken 6 netcode was worse then KOFXII before it got an online patch, it was SF4-quality afterwards. It cost Namco a bunch of money, because people waited, and ended up buying the game at discount instead of full price. It was a huge improvement, but I believe Namco reworked the netcode from scratch themselves.

Tekken 6 still has the best ranked mode system of any fighter.

I just hope SC5 improves on it more- that's my big worry there.

Im having some input issues too. HCF being recognized as DPs and such but i think its my fault for playing with a DualShock 3

I want to get a MadCatz SSFIV TE Stick but the importers here sell them at double the price and i dont have a credit card to buy them from Amazon or something like that. :(
tl;dr: All the importes are crooks therefore i dont have a stick

BTW how bad is the regular SFIV stick compared to the Tournament Edition ?

Yeah, I miss the controls of 98/02- that's my other flaw with the game. It feels like to get a hcb,f grab you have to use the shortcut- I hate that.

I really wish Arc would buy SNK, and give them their controls and netcode- that's all SNK needs to get the formula down perfect.

It's Hori pants as compared to Sanwa parts. I think it makes a large difference. If you can buy the good parts (if you have arcades there suppliers should be easy/cheap) and can mod the stick yourself or get someone to do it, you can replace the parts and get effectively a TE. When I played VF5 on 360, my only option was a Hori stick, it worked but it wasn't that good.

I imagine getting credit cards is hard in Argentina.
 
Last night I fought in three people who were using the PS3 with Iori The Power of the Flames. 2 of them without any experience with the character and his combos.

The Japanese version of the game that is coming to redeem the character code, correct?
 
It is, though it's possible if your internet is good to find some folks who you play decently with. Not many, but they're out there.

Too bad one of them in my case ragequits if you don't let him hit you for 700+ damage.

You and I really should play, I'd imagine our connection quality would be pretty good if we settled down and traded PSN's.

PSN : DiscoShark

Anyone else in the NC area feel free to add me as well, looking for some good quality matches. Fair warning though, I won't be on frequently until Finals are over and done with. :p
 

Fersis

It is illegal to Tag Fish in Tag Fishing Sanctuaries by law 38.36 of the GAF Wildlife Act
Unlocking colors is such a chore.
I would pay for a shortcut. Make it happen SNKP.

EX Iori comes out next week so maybe theyll add the color unlock too.
 

TGMIII

Member
Tekken 6 netcode was worse then KOFXII before it got an online patch, it was SF4-quality afterwards.

Are you insane? T6 online has literally SECONDS of input delay online. SF4 is by no means amazing but it's perfectly playable, T6 online is no where near playable.
 

alstein

Member
Are you insane? T6 online has literally SECONDS of input delay online. SF4 is by no means amazing but it's perfectly playable, T6 online is no where near playable.

Wow, you must be playing a different game entirely then I am, or you never patched it.

Pre-patch, yeah it was that bad. Post-patch, 5 bar matches are very good, 4 bars is playable.

1-3 bars are like what you said still, but 3 bars is cross-country.
 

TGMIII

Member
Obviously I have it patched. I play with people all over europe in numerous fighting games and they're all playable, no huge delay and at worst we'll get a lag spike or two during a match. Tekken 6 is literally not playable online, you're playing a gimped version.

I don't know if most of your experience is playing online or if you just don't notice the delay but it is huge. I've played with guys who can go up against people like Ryan Hart and they won't touch the online due to how bad it is. That's how it is to me anyway, it's not my connection and it sure as hell isn't the guys I'm playing against, shoutouts to godlike Nordish internet, but for me the delay is way too much for a game as quick as tekken.
 

Kioshen

Member
I want to get a MadCatz SSFIV TE Stick but the importers here sell them at double the price and i dont have a credit card to buy them from Amazon or something like that. :(
tl;dr: All the importes are crooks therefore i dont have a stick

BTW how bad is the regular SFIV stick compared to the Tournament Edition ?

It's "usable" but you'll quickly want to strip the buttons/stick out and replace it with sanwa parts. It's pretty easy to do fortunately.
 
When Arc System Works ported Arcana Heart 3 to consoles, they used an improved version of the BB netcode and the game runs just as good if not better. AH3 lacks the generous 5-frame input buffer of BB.

The real question is, "why can't Arc handle the home ports of every arcade fighter?"

This has been bothering me as of late and I keep wondering why, I mean cant they just license out their netcode? Not a AH player but I did try AH3 once at a friends because he kept going on and on about how great the online was and man the smoothness of the netcode blew me away, I honestly thought atlus was going to use it for kof13
 

alstein

Member
Obviously I have it patched. I play with people all over europe in numerous fighting games and they're all playable, no huge delay and at worst we'll get a lag spike or two during a match. Tekken 6 is literally not playable online, you're playing a gimped version.

I don't know if most of your experience is playing online or if you just don't notice the delay but it is huge. I've played with guys who can go up against people like Ryan Hart and they won't touch the online due to how bad it is. That's how it is to me anyway, it's not my connection and it sure as hell isn't the guys I'm playing against, shoutouts to godlike Nordish internet, but for me the delay is way too much for a game as quick as tekken.

Tekken is a very, VERY lag-intolerant game. It's as bad as ST/HDR in that regard. This is why top players won't touch the online- it's not perfect, and 1f of lag makes a huge difference in that lag, moreso then any other fighter this gen, since Tekken is so reactive, and reactive fighters tend to perform terribly online, even with GGPO they're not that good- it's the game design.

I think the problems with Tekken online are largely the game itself, not so much the netcode, which is average.

This has been bothering me as of late and I keep wondering why, I mean cant they just license out their netcode? Not a AH player but I did try AH3 once at a friends because he kept going on and on about how great the online was and man the smoothness of the netcode blew me away, I honestly thought atlus was going to use it for kof13

It's possible that the netcode uses up a lot of console power, and KOF is more resource intensive then Blazblue and Arcana. I don't know if this is the case, but I'd buy this as an explanation.
This is a reason why GGPO had issues with CPS3 games.
 

TGMIII

Member
Tekken is a very, VERY lag-intolerant game. It's as bad as ST/HDR in that regard. This is why top players won't touch the online- it's not perfect, and 1f of lag makes a huge difference in that lag, moreso then any other fighter this gen, since Tekken is so reactive, and reactive fighters tend to perform terribly online, even with GGPO they're not that good- it's the game design.

But that's the thing, this just isn't a "tiny bit of lag/delay" it's fucking huge, if you're playing the game at any serious level it's unplayable.

Also we've seen top ST/3S US/JP players play on GGPO before and say it was fine so creating a netcode that accommodates top players, for even the quickest games, is perfectly possible. I'll give T6 that it's a game that came to consoles years after its arcade release so it's not going to be like BB where the game is built around the online but I honestly think it could have been better. I guess I might set my expectations too high for what netcode should be but they ain't called scamco for nothing.
 
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