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[Banjo64]

Eh.....come on, bro. A cleaner room doesn't reach the level of "retcon" in any way.

It does, because it adds legitimacy to their operation. There’s a reason they changed it. They didn’t do it on a whim.

 

[Sorcerer]

Meh, I think I'll just wait for the next remaster/remake/anniversary edition/PlayStation 6 version...

 

[Ulysses 31]

It does, because it adds legitimacy to their operation. There’s a reason they changed it. They didn’t do it on a whim.

While I agree, I doubt this will sway players to the Fireflies side when keeping in mind all the other stuff they did before.

 

[ChiefDada]

Im sure there will be improvement there, like there as been with other cross gen game. But as far as I can tell remake is still using a pre calculated solution.
Now if you cant accept that not everyone shares your opinion that this is a generational leap beyond TLOU2, then thats on you.

Lol, I absolutely can, and do, accept this.

I do wonder though what was the most recent game (preferably a sequel within a franchise) you felt represented a generational leap?

 

[Sosokrates]

I see Cuckmann has continued his TLoU 2 retcon mission by continuing to make the grubby shit hole firefly operating room look like a modern day theatre. Can’t this mop head just hurry up and fuck off to become a failed TV director or whatever it is that his ambition is?

What's Druckmans retcon mission? Is he CIA?

 

[Banjo64]

What's Druckmans retcon mission? Is he CIA?

ret·con
[ˈrɛtkɒn]

NOUN

1. (in a film, television series, or other fictional work) a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events, typically used to facilitate a dramatic plot shift or account for an inconsistency:
   "we're given a retcon for Wilf's absence from Donna's wedding in ‘The Runaway Bride’: he had Spanish Flu"

VERB

1. revise (an aspect of a fictional work) retrospectively, typically by introducing a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events:
   "I think fans get more upset when characters act blatantly out of established type, or when things get retconned"

 

[Sosokrates]

Lol, I absolutely can, and do, accept this.

I do wonder though what was the most recent game (preferably a sequel within a franchise) you felt represented a generational leap?

Er... Tlou2, RDR2 nothing from this gen.

 

[Sosokrates]

ret·con
[ˈrɛtkɒn]

NOUN

1. (in a film, television series, or other fictional work) a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events, typically used to facilitate a dramatic plot shift or account for an inconsistency:
   "we're given a retcon for Wilf's absence from Donna's wedding in ‘The Runaway Bride’: he had Spanish Flu"

VERB

1. revise (an aspect of a fictional work) retrospectively, typically by introducing a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events:
   "I think fans get more upset when characters act blatantly out of established type, or when things get retconned"

So he made the firefly base look more detailed? Isn't that a good thing?

 

[Topher]

ret·con
[ˈrɛtkɒn]

NOUN

1. (in a film, television series, or other fictional work) a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events, typically used to facilitate a dramatic plot shift or account for an inconsistency:
   "we're given a retcon for Wilf's absence from Donna's wedding in ‘The Runaway Bride’: he had Spanish Flu"

VERB

1. revise (an aspect of a fictional work) retrospectively, typically by introducing a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events:
   "I think fans get more upset when characters act blatantly out of established type, or when things get retconned"

Applying that definition to this scene is a major reach. That's fine though. We can just disagree.

 

[DForce]

People often bring up retcon and plotholes in TLOU conversations without knowing what the words actually mean lol.

 

[Ulysses 31]

Applying that definition to this scene is a major reach. That's fine though. We can just disagree.

Not really, the room didn't look dilapidated because it was a technical limitation of the PS3/4, it was part of the visual story telling of what was happening at that point of the plot.

 

[Banjo64]

Applying that definition to this scene is a major reach. That's fine though. We can just disagree.

No we can’t. One of us must die.

 

[Banjo64]

People often bring up retcon and plotholes in TLOU conversations without knowing what the words actually mean lol.

And people often bring them up knowing perfectly well what the words mean.

 

[DForce]

And people often bring them up knowing perfectly well what the words mean.

In TLOU conversations? No.

An example is from your comment alone.

 

[Topher]

Not really, the room didn't look dilapidated because it was a technical limitation of the PS3/4, it was part of the visual story telling of what was happening at that point of the plot.

The entire game is a visual overhaul. Nothing about the story or plot has changed. I can't see this having any impact on how people view the events whatsoever.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

Some truly sad shit.

Which says more about their character than they realize. There are certain lines which as humans we don't cross, period.

Did you come from ResetEra? You guys sure sound like it. The world has gone soft. Nobody can say anything without someone getting offended. "How dare you joke about accessibility features". Give me a break.

Is this just you guys fanboying over this rip off of a remake? Maybe that's why I'm getting demonized over this. You don't like the negativity in calling Sony and ND out because you're getting the game and don't want anyone hashing your mellow. The truth is this games pricing is a new low for Sony and their marketing was full of shit too talking about gameplay changes.

The reason I'm angry is because It sucks watching this industry go down the tube while watching you guys accept less and less for more $ from these companies. Spend your money how you like but don't defend these practices. This is why everything's getting more expensive and why companies like Sony are more deceitful and greedy. If this was 10 years ago, Sony would've given the people who bought part 1 a discount. Gamers wouldn't have accepted this kinda pricing after getting led to believe things were going to be significantly improved, after having factions removed, and after having bought the game twice already. The Sony store still says "enhanced exploration and gameplay changes".

The accessibility shit is insulting. I stand by that. It may sound extreme and insensitive but I'm frustrated with the way this industry is right now.

 

[DForce]

Joel's character model looks older in the remake. That's a retcon, right? He looks more like a disheveled man compared to the remaster!

That's not how retcons work.

In the original game, the surgeons wanted Marlene to give the OK before operating on Elle.

Hey Anna... It's been awhile since we spoke. I uh... I just gave the go ahead to proceed with the surgery. I really doubt I had much of a choice, asking me was more of a formality. I need you to know that I've kept my promise all these years... despite everything that I was in charge of, I looked after her. I would've done anything for her, and at times...

Joel woke up from his unconscious state, found out the surgery would kill Ellie, and made the decision to save her. He walked into the operating room and that's when he killed Jerry Anderson.

A retcon would have to alter this scenario plot, which did not happen in The Last of Us Part II.

If updated graphics to a scene is a retcon, then that would mean the entire story was retconned since everything looks different.

 

[Topher]

The accessibility shit is insulting.

That's a you problem.

 

[Ulysses 31]

The entire game is a visual overhaul. Nothing about the story or plot has changed. I can't see this having any impact on how people view the events whatsoever.

Like I said earlier, I don't see this changing anyone from team Joel to team Fireflies or vice versa. But it is a change to make the Fireflies appear more favorably.

 

[Topher]

Like I said earlier, I don't see this changing anyone from team Joel to team Fireflies or vice versa. But it is a change to make the Fireflies appear more favorably.

That's the assumption being made here, yes.

 

[blastprocessor]

The kid posted an hour of footage really like the transition to cut scenes and back to game play, so slick now.

 

[Dorohedoro]

Joel's character model looks older in the remake. That's a retcon, right? He looks more like a disheveled man compared to the remaster!

They gave him more wrinkles, made him look disheveled.

If updated graphics to a scene is a retcon, then that would mean the entire story was retconned since everything looks different.

Inb4 the TLoU2 derangement syndrome sub unironically says this.

 

[Y0ssarian]

 

[GymWolf]

It’s such a Sony forum that the 2 best games voted last year were from Microsoft Studios.

Tbf 2021 for sony wasn't exactly their best year, returnal was by far their best game and 10 people played that game (not really 10 but you get the gist)

 

[tmlDan]

Did you come from ResetEra? You guys sure sound like it. The world has gone soft. Nobody can say anything without someone getting offended. "How dare you joke about accessibility features". Give me a break.

Is this just you guys fanboying over this rip off of a remake? Maybe that's why I'm getting demonized over this. You don't like the negativity in calling Sony and ND out because you're getting the game and don't want anyone hashing your mellow. The truth is this games pricing is a new low for Sony and their marketing was full of shit too talking about gameplay changes.

The reason I'm angry is because It sucks watching this industry go down the tube while watching you guys accept less and less for more $ from these companies. Spend your money how you like but don't defend these practices. This is why everything's getting more expensive and why companies like Sony are more deceitful and greedy. If this was 10 years ago, Sony would've given the people who bought part 1 a discount. Gamers wouldn't have accepted this kinda pricing after getting led to believe things were going to be significantly improved, after having factions removed, and after having bought the game twice already. The Sony store still says "enhanced exploration and gameplay changes".

The accessibility shit is insulting. I stand by that. It may sound extreme and insensitive but I'm frustrated with the way this industry is right now.

so you relate accessibility features to the industry going down the drain, that's not just insensitive - you're a pathetic, selfish POS. The resources for stuff like that is minimal in the grand scheme and does not make games worse.

Be better.

 

[TexMex]

I really dont think an official review will help you here. It was a 10/10 game, its gonna get the same score again but most probably every review will state its up to you if you deem it worth your money to pay $70. The game itself is impossible to get a low score jsut because it didnt change enough.

I’m not looking for guidance. I already have it preloaded. I’m just curious.

But if you think it’s going to get across the board 10’s - could be wrong but I’d take that bet all day long. There’s no way.

 

[Topher]

I’m not looking for guidance. I already have it preloaded. I’m just curious.

But if you think it’s going to get across the board 10’s - could be wrong but I’d take that bet all day long. There’s no way.

I agree. I expect scores in the 80s primarily due to the price.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

I hate how they ruined the art.

Mocap, realism and 3D actors never did it for me but that's what the mainstream wants I guess.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Naughty dog are the smartest developers.

 

[GymWolf]

I hate how they ruined the art.

Mocap, realism and 3D actors never did it for me but that's what the mainstream wants I guess.

Pretty sure it used mocap and actors even on ps3.

 

[Markio128]

I agree. I expect scores in the 80s primarily due to the price.

You can almost guarantee that most sites will reference the price, rightly or wrongly. It’s where the hits are. In all honesty, I don’t think the game needs reviewing again, but then, there isn’t much else to review at the minute

 

[Bartski]

Naughty dog are the smartest developers.

 

[Topher]

You can almost guarantee that most sites will reference the price, rightly or wrongly. It’s where the hits are. In all honesty, I don’t think the game needs reviewing again, but then, there isn’t much else to review at the minute

You'll have every website under the sun reviewing this game. Nothing draws attention like TLOU it seems.

 

[TexMex]

I agree. I expect scores in the 80s primarily due to the price.

Price and the same things were calling out here, it doesn’t look that much better and there’s no/not enough new content. Less content if you consider the lack of multiplayer actually.

I’m all in because I love the original and I never played the ps4 remaster. Haven’t touched this game in a decade so it’s a good time to revisit. But I’ll admit I’m very underwhelmed with what has been shown so far, was expecting much more from a ps5 exclusive app.

 

[PrCat88]

$70!

I think it's cool they made it free on the playstation plus collection. My PS5 is ready.

 

[Topher]

Price and the same things were calling out here, it doesn’t look that much better and there’s no/not enough new content. Less content if you consider the lack of multiplayer actually.

I’m all in because I love the original and I never played the ps4 remaster. Haven’t touched this game in a decade so it’s a good time to revisit. But I’ll admit I’m very underwhelmed with what has been shown so far, was expecting much more from a ps5 exclusive app.

Well, I think it looks a lot better myself, but not enough for most to warrant pay $70. I'm also all in for the same reason, but I think Sony sabotaged themselves a bit with the pricing here. If sales stagnate due to reviews not being up to Naughty Dog's usual standards then the price may drop fairly quickly and so what was the point of it at all.

I think it's cool they made it free on the playstation plus collection.

 

[TexMex]

Well, I think it looks a lot better myself

To be clear I definitely think it looks better technically. Just not ten years and two console generations of tech better.

 

[Sosokrates]

To be clear I definitely think it looks better technically. Just not ten years and two console generations of tech better.

So true.

 

[Pelta88]

Tbf 2021 for sony wasn't exactly their best year, returnal was by far their best game and 10 people played that game (not really 10 but you get the gist)

This is problematic. You're talking about the amount of people that "played the game" when in fact the game was a financial success. Selling over 560K units 3 months.

PS5 is the fastest-selling PlayStation as it hits 10m sales milestone

PlayStation 5 is Sony's fastest-selling games console after surpassing 10 million sales worldwide. The new console reac…

www.gamesindustry.biz

Yes. Half a million units sold by a tiny studio (Housemarque) is consider a success to the point where Sony mentioned that success in their financials.




You can't frame facts to your liking. Especially not on a forum where we keep receipts. Returnal was a success because the game was sold at retail. The player count you made up to frame your argument is inconsequential.

 

[GymWolf]

This is problematic. You're talking about the amount of people that "played the game" when in fact the game was a financial success. Selling over 560K units 3 months.

PS5 is the fastest-selling PlayStation as it hits 10m sales milestone

PlayStation 5 is Sony's fastest-selling games console after surpassing 10 million sales worldwide. The new console reac…

www.gamesindustry.biz

Yes. Half a million units sold by a tiny studio (Housemarque) is consider a success to the point where Sony mentioned that success in their financials.




You can't frame facts to your liking. Especially not on a forum where we keep receipts. Returnal was a success because the game was sold at retail. The player count you made up to frame your argument is inconsequential.

Lmao those are extremely small numbers compared to any other big sony game, cmon.

It was literally a recurring meme in here when sony called returnal a huge success

 

[DispatchNinja]

I see Cuckmann has continued his TLoU 2 retcon mission by continuing to make the grubby shit hole firefly operating room look like a modern day theatre. Can’t this mop head just hurry up and fuck off to become a failed TV director or whatever it is that his ambition is?

U ok? Show us where the guy who made a video game you don’t like hurt you.

 

[Pelta88]

Lmao those are extremely small numbers compared to any other big sony game, cmon.

It was literally a recurring meme in here when sony called returnal a huge success

The problem is your still framing what a success is to fit your own narrative. Returnal is not a big sony game. It was made by a small team.

Actual success in gaming is defined by money invested and returned.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Lmao those are extremely small numbers compared to any other big sony game, cmon.

It was literally a recurring meme in here when sony called returnal a huge success

But the word success can't be just dismissed because of how much a game sells.

Stray selling 2M copies is a huge success. If a game like Red Dead Redemption 2 had sold that much it would've been a huge flop.

A success simply means a game has broke even and is now printing money. That's all.

If Sony wasn't happy with Returnal and the studio they wouldn't have acquired them. Period.

 

[GymWolf]

But the word success can't be just dismissed because of how much a game sells.

Stray selling 2M copies is a huge success. If a game like Red Dead Redemption 2 had sold that much it would've been a huge flop.

A success simply means a game has broke even and is now printing money. That's all.

If Sony wasn't happy with Returnal and the studio they wouldn't have acquired them. Period.

Dude, i'm not saying that the game wasn't good or downplaying the success of a niche genre like a bullet hell roguelite, those numbers are great if self contained, but as numbers to prove that many people on gaf played the game is a bit of a stretch don't you think?

The discussion even started from a semi-joke of gaf being mostly sony territory, poor returnal just got in the crossed fire

 

[GymWolf]

The problem is your still framing what a success is to fit your own narrative. Returnal is not a big sony game. It was made by a small team.

Actual success in gaming is defined by money invested and returned.

So we are saying the same thing basically, the game was not big and the numbers are not big, especially when it come to prove a point that many gaffers played that game where for logic and statistic we know it's not true, especially compared to the big games that have a way bigger audience and way bigger numbers.

Many many people in here weren't ready to spend 70 dollars at launch for a relatively small, kinda AA looking game of a pretty niche genre, there is no rewriting history for this one.

There were not enough copies around to win against stuff that you can play for free with gamepass (plus all the copies they sold externally)

 

[ChiefDada]

Any news on actually having 4K for TLOU 2. I honestly cant imagine why its not possible and been so long for a PS5 release. Unless they plan that for a "remaster" to get more cash again

Nvm.

 

[ChiefDada]

 

[Pelta88]

So we are saying the same thing basically, the game was not big and the numbers are not big, especially when it come to prove a point that many gaffers played that game where for logic and statistic we know it's not true, especially compared to the big games that have a way bigger audience and way bigger numbers.

Many many people in here weren't ready to spend 70 dollars at launch for a relatively small, kinda AA looking game of a pretty niche genre, there is no rewriting history for this one.

There were not enough copies around to win against stuff that you can play for free with gamepass (plus all the copies they sold externally)

You're still framing the argument to fit your own narrative. This is a business "Success" is defined by development costs and returns on the investment. Returnal's dev costs VS actual sales made the game a noteable success. As noted by Sonys mentioning of the IP during their quarterly financial statement.

Also mentioning GP is nonsensical. Returnal was and is being sold at retail. Half a million in 3 months for an indie title is a success. Regardless of the caveats you're trying to introduce.

 

[blastprocessor]

 

[Sosokrates]

This is problematic. You're talking about the amount of people that "played the game" when in fact the game was a financial success. Selling over 560K units 3 months.

http://[URL][URL]https://www.gamesi...station-as-it-hits-10-million-sales-milestone

[/URL][/URL]

Yes. Half a million units sold by a tiny studio (Housemarque) is consider a success to the point where Sony mentioned that success in their financials.




You can't frame facts to your liking. Especially not on a forum where we keep receipts. Returnal was a success because the game was sold at retail. The player count you made up to frame your argument is inconsequential.

I cant see how Returnal was financial success. If sony made on average $60 per sale, it would of made $33,600,000 from selling 560k, going by a dev team size of 80 and 4yrs and average salary of $70k/year it comes to about $22 million, double that for acting,tech,admin,office and advertising costs we are looking at a game ehich cost around $50 mill to make. They may make a profit eventually.

Sony probably meant it is successful in its quality and positive reception.