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[Davey Cakes]

I shit you not, this is still to-date the hottest kiss I have ever seen captured on motion video.

feature=player_detailpage&v=bvfJRLTNmUI#t=132s]Youtubes[/url]

The emotional context, Dax's soft, sweet whisper, the face-touching and the kiss sound effects, the way their lips meld... even the trill spots on their necks and temples add to it.

It's a perfect kiss.

My mother is a bit conservative. She walked in while I was watching this scene and was a bit disturbed by it.

It was literally one of the only moments of the show that she'd seen, out of all 176 episodes that I'd watched in the span of a few months. Such bad timing. She kind of judged the show by the moment, but there's no other episode quite like this one in the entire series.

The scene wasn't ruined entirely but upon re-watch it's a bit stronger than I remember. I always enjoyed that it wasn't just some random lesbian kiss used for shock value; it had even deeper meaning because the intimacy was basically between the symbiants, not the hosts. The love persisted throughout time, and it easily crossed gender barriers. What a great message.

 

[elrechazado]

It's said repeatedly throughout TNG onwards that replicated food cannot compare to freshly made food.

That's said by dipshit foodies like sisko. And don't make me post Rikeromelettes.gif

 

[Htown]

Actually, can we add the Ferengis in general? They were comic relief enemies in their early TNG appearances, but swiftly became a way for the show to have T&A in DS9 while still getting to go "look at these inferior people with their T&A!" Quark was saved by some terrific acting, but he's the only Ferengi in the show history I think is a decent character.

Only unintentionally. They were seriously trying to build up the Ferengi as a legitimate threat in the first few episodes. They mentioned them in episodes where they didn't appear, laying the groundwork that they were a powerful rival to the Federation. Then they finally show up and WOW did they miss the mark.

 

[Suairyu]

That's said by dipshit foodies like sisko. And don't make me post Rikeromelettes.gif

Nuh-uh. Remember Worf's bachelor party? And Julian and O'Brian go to eat, and they're all "wheres our juice?" and Quark is all "it's coming, but it'll take time. Unless you want it replicated...?" and they're all "we shall wait".

Only unintentionally. They were seriously trying to build up the Ferengi as a legitimate threat in the first few episodes. They mentioned them in episodes where they didn't appear, laying the groundwork that they were a powerful rival to the Federation. Then they finally show up and WOW did they miss the mark.

"You've heard of phasers before."

How could the Ferengis not have phasers?

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

it's at this point that Kirk discovers that they don't worship the 'sun', but rather a 'son', the son of God, and declares how grand it is that Christianity has spread among the stars (with no obvious or explainable means). It wasn't a bad episode, I just found that to be an unnecessary piece of evangelism.

It wasn't supposed to be that it had spread, but TOS had several cases of planets that took the parallel development concept to the extreme.

How about The Omega Glory, where Kirk and crew help the space Americans defeat the commie space Asians?

Exactly. Yangs (Yankees) and Kohms (communists).

 

[elrechazado]

We need a gif of those bad ferengi whip energy weapons. Second only to the bowcaster in bad weapon design in sci fi.

 

[Indrid Cold1]

Mama Robotnik, great OP. I consistently enjoy the hell out of your threads. Thank you!

Man, was Voyager ever a pile of shite. Back in the day though when I was younger I used to enjoy the Hirogen and Species 8472 episodes. I guess we all have our guilty pleasures.

But thinking on, even those were full of shit, what with the Hirogen pretending to be nazi's in the holodeck and Species 8472 randomly building a replica of Starfleet Academy in the middle of nowhere and their leader choosing to disguise himself as the bloody gardener.

 

[industrian]

Tuvix is an episode that rings a few bells.

Plus obviously Kirk's rather pathetic death.

And pretty much every 2nd/3rd episode in TOS.

Clearly humanity has found a cure for homosexuality in the future!

But wait... wasn't there some hot female trill on trill action in ds9?

Ohhhh yeah

I remember getting the most confused boner when watching this for the first time. I was only 10 at the time and all though.

Man, Terry Farrell was hot as hell.

 

[Escape Goat]

i thought the whole point of Dukat was that he didn't give a damn about Bajorans. The whole episode with Dukat and Sisko in the cave pretty much expose Dukat for what he really was (and what most Bajorans already knew him to be).

 

[Measley]

I really liked the bit in DS9 where Sisko boils it down to "the problem is Earth". Earth actually is the paradise the Federation thinks it is, and since that's where the HQ is, the Federation government is out of touch with the reality of the rest of the galaxy.

Ditto. That sort of set up actually made it easier to believe that people like Kirk, Picard, or Sisko could emerge from that universe. Obviously some people would want to get away from paradise and actually experience the "real" world.

Man, that Dax kiss is hot. I was so mad when she left the show. Her replacement just couldn't measure up.

 

[industrian]

How about The Omega Glory, where Kirk and crew help the space Americans defeat the commie space Asians?

There's that one episode where the Klingons give the "town people" muskets to fight the "hill people" and Kirk is adamant about giving the "hill people" the same guns to keep the status quo. I don't think they could bash us over the head harder with Vietnam even if they tried.

 

[Cheerilee]

#1 should be Shatner's death in Generations.

All of Shatner in Generations was bad.

I recently rewatched that TOS episode where these plant spores gave everyone total bliss and perfect health. The entire crew got infected, and they all beamed down to the planet to go party with the spores. All except Kirk. He's alone and helpless to operate the ship. Finally even he gets hit with the spores. Now he can rejoin his crew! He happily calls Spock with the good news. He goes to pack his bags, and he hesitates. He goes to beam down. No no NO! A part of him gets so fucking pissed at his pansy-assed self that his Super Saiyan anger burns the spores clean out of his body.

Not one person from the colony or his entire crew had that kind of a reaction. In order to trigger the same response in the now-emotional Spock, he had to start talking the most horrible shit about Spock's mother and father, and how Spock himself is such a filthy piece of half-breed shit that he defiles the woman he loves every time he touches her.


Now picture Kirk in the Nexus, stuck in an infinite loop of wood-chopping and egg-frying and horsey rides.

 

[danwarb]

The Ferengi are godawful comedy characters in DS9, and elsewhere.

 

[Escape Goat]

All of Shatner in Generations was bad.

I recently rewatched that TOS episode where these plant spores gave everyone total bliss and perfect health. The entire crew got infected, and they all beamed down to the planet to go party with the spores. All except Kirk. He's alone and helpless to operate the ship. Finally even he gets hit with the spores. Now he can rejoin his crew! He happily calls Spock with the good news. He goes to pack his bags, and he hesitates. He goes to beam down. No no NO! A part of him gets so fucking pissed at his pansy-assed self that his Super Saiyan anger burns the spores clean out of his body.

Not one person from the colony or his entire crew had that kind of a reaction. In order to trigger the same response in the now-emotional Spock, he had to start talking the most horrible shit about Spock's mother and father, and how Spock himself is such a filthy piece of half-breed shit that he defiles the woman he loves every time he touches her.


Now picture Kirk in the Nexus, stuck in an infinite loop of wood-chopping and egg-frying and horsey rides.

We meet Kirk in the nexus mere moments after he arrived there. Not saying anything about Generations was good but time doesn't exist in the Nexus.

 

[AAequal]

i thought the whole point of Dukat was that he didn't give a damn about Bajorans. The whole episode with Dukat and Sisko in the cave pretty much expose Dukat for what he really was (and what most Bajorans already knew him to be).

In earlier season they descriped Dukat more lenient then other Kardashians, he showed some mercy. At some point they did a complete reversal in his thinking and behavior but didn't care explain his "lenient" attitude during the ocupation. I have to admit I haven't seen the later seasons for a long time but IIRC his change came as somewhat big surprise for me.

 

[Technosteve]

i liked star trek nemesis

 

[Slayven]

Well in the novels at least they explained why Geordi went from conn officer to chief engineer. The Enterprise is such a wanted posting that people apply for any spot that is open and they are qualified for, and then try to work their way to where they really want to be.

 

[Henchmen21]

All of Shatner in Generations was bad.

I recently rewatched that TOS episode where these plant spores gave everyone total bliss and perfect health. The entire crew got infected, and they all beamed down to the planet to go party with the spores. All except Kirk. He's alone and helpless to operate the ship. Finally even he gets hit with the spores. Now he can rejoin his crew! He happily calls Spock with the good news. He goes to pack his bags, and he hesitates. He goes to beam down. No no NO! A part of him gets so fucking pissed at his pansy-assed self that his Super Saiyan anger burns the spores clean out of his body.

Not one person from the colony or his entire crew had that kind of a reaction. In order to trigger the same response in the now-emotional Spock, he had to start talking the most horrible shit about Spock's mother and father, and how Spock himself is such a filthy piece of half-breed shit that he defiles the woman he loves every time he touches her.


Now picture Kirk in the Nexus, stuck in an infinite loop of wood-chopping and egg-frying and horsey rides.

Except it wasn't an infinite loop, atleast not from Kirk's perspective. Guinan says it (in VO) and Kirk himself later says it that he just arrived (from his perspective.)

Besides, one was a chemical reaction from the spores while the other was a space time continuum thingy. One has clear physical reaction while the other..well, who knows how that would effect people.

 

[Escape Goat]

In earlier season they descriped Dukat more lenient then other Kardashians, he showed some mercy. At some point they did a complete reversal in his thinking and behavior but didn't care explain his "lenient" attidude during the ocupation. I have to admit I haven't seen the later seasons for a long time but IIRC his change came as somewhat big surprise for me.

But he did it because he is a narcissist. He wanted them to love him but he didn't do anything nice because he actually cared. Kira calls him out on it all the time in earlier seasons but we don't actually confirm it until the cave scene with Sisko.

Geordi was also a skilled shuttle pilot so its not as if warp engines and propulsion were totally new concepts to him.

 

[Henchmen21]

In earlier season they descriped Dukat more lenient then other Kardashians, he showed some mercy. At some point they did a complete reversal in his thinking and behavior but didn't care explain his "lenient" attidude during the ocupation. I have to admit I haven't seen the later seasons for a long time but IIRC his change came as somewhat big surprise for me.

Hehe. I know you didn't do this intentionally but lol.

 

[industrian]

The Ferengi are godawful comedy characters in DS9, and elsewhere.

It's a better fit than what the TNG writers originally had in mind for them.

Speaking of which, the TNG writers had a hard time replacing the Klingons as the Federation's main bad guys. "The Ferengi! Oh wait, no-one finds them threatening because we wrote them to act like monkeys. The Borg! Wait, no, they're waaay to powerful to be regulars." They eventually got round to creating the Cardassians though, so they deserve a bunch of respect there.

 

[DrForester]

The Ferengi are godawful comedy characters in DS9, and elsewhere.

DS9 had some great Ferengi episodes. Fem-Quark was terrible, but things like "The Magnificent Ferengi" were very entertaining.

 

[Lucky Forward]

All spots should go to J.J. Trek. Total Abortion of a movie and a disgrace to the name trek and considering that has to go up against Voyager & Enterprise, that's saying alot.

This man understands. I saw Abrams' "Trek" once in the theater, and never again. When I watched the Plinkett review, he made a lot of good points about why it couldn't be like the old TV shows and why it needed to change, and I thought, "Maybe I should give it another chance." But when Plinkett went into all of the stupid shit that filled that movie, he reminded me all over again why I hated it.

 

[Slayven]

All of Shatner in Generations was bad.

Not as bad as the novels Shatner puts his name on that takes place after Generations. They were so bad that novel canon that is pretty loose to begin outright, says they take place in a different universe.

 

[Escape Goat]

It's a better fit than what the TNG writers originally had in mind for them.

Speaking of which, the TNG writers had a hard time replacing the Klingons as the Federation's main bad guys. "The Ferengi! Oh wait, no-one finds them threatening because we wrote them to act like monkeys. The Borg! Wait, no, they're waaay to powerful to be regulars." They eventually got round to creating the Cardassians though, so they deserve a bunch of respect there.

They made a big stink over the Romulans having been quiet for 80 years. Then they come out of hiding when the Borg start destroying colonies in the Neutral Zone.

 

[Henchmen21]

They made a big stink over the Romulans having been quiet for 80 years. Then they come out of hiding when the Borg start destroying colonies in the Neutral Zone.

Yup. The Romulans were the big heavies of the TNG years. Especially from Season 3 on. And it really suited TNG well since it was more about brinkmanship than straight up action like TOS.

 

[The Librarian]

DS9 had some great Ferengi episodes. Fem-Quark was terrible, but things like "The Magnificent Ferengi" were very entertaining.

"I saw we weren't going to rescue her so I put her out of her misery."

 

[industrian]

They made a big stink over the Romulans having been quiet for 80 years. Then they come out of hiding when the Borg start destroying colonies in the Neutral Zone.

...And Romulan Dukat is all "we're baaaaaaaaaack!"

The Romulans ended up being good villains on TNG. But they kept building up to a war that was obvious would never happen.

 

[Henchmen21]

...And Romulan Dukat is all "we're baaaaaaaaaack!"

The Romulans ended up being good villains on TNG. But they kept building up to a war that was obvious would never happen.

I think you misunderstood those episodes. It was about keeping a war from breaking out.

 

[Koomaster]

The worst use of the Voyager reset button was the Tuvix episode. So a transporter/botanical accident basically merges two characters together and he's now his own person. He's got feelings, wishes, etc. But we can't have that, so let's use the transporter to kill him at the end of the episode so we can have our two characters back. The end.

 

[The Technomancer]

Great OP and great thread

I just kind of mentally ignore most of season 1 of TNG

 

[Escape Goat]

The worst use of the Voyager reset button was the Tuvix episode. So a transporter/botanical accident basically merges two characters together and he's now his own person. He's got feelings, wishes, etc. But we can't have that, so let's use the transporter to kill him at the end of the episode so we can have our two characters back. The end.

That was the only time where Voyager had a true emotionally charged conflict. Janeway made the right decision because theres no way to know if Neelix and Tuvok were consenting or if Tuvix was acting out of self preservation. Was Tuvix more interesting than either Tuvok or Neelix? Fuck yeah, but the way the story played out was great.

 

[Stumpokapow]

Well in the novels at least they explained why Geordi went from conn officer to chief engineer. The Enterprise is such a wanted posting that people apply for any spot that is open and they are qualified for, and then try to work their way to where they really want to be.

Unions *shakes head*

 

[DrForester]

Well, the Enterprise did have, I think, at least two different chief engineering officers that first season of The Next Generation. One was a woman and the other was that Argyle guy... neither was particularly interesting, and were only mentioned/shown in passing.

EDIT: http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Argyle (This seems to indicate there may have been four chief engineers on Enterprise before LaForge.)

It's not so much in-universe confusion, as production confusion. People loved Scotty, and they cast their new Star Trek show without a chief engineer having any meaningful part of the story. He was a background character with almost no lines.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Actually the actor is pretty cool. Wasn't there some podcast where he makes fun of crusher, or did I dream that?

I have nothing against the actor (other than he's bad at acting). I understand he's on shows (big bang theory and whatnot) making fun of himself every other week. Wesley is just the most shitty thing ever in the whole stat trek universe, and making it worse is hes so frequently in it. Yeah salamander evolution sex whatever. It's one episode. Wesleys in like a bajillon.

According to imdb he was in 86 episodes of tng, not counting the movies. 86 ruined episodes.

There were only 176 episodes. Using math this means that only 90 ever even got a chance to be good! He ruined almost half the entire show!

 

[MC Safety]

There's that one episode where the Klingons give the "town people" muskets to fight the "hill people" and Kirk is adamant about giving the "hill people" the same guns to keep the status quo. I don't think they could bash us over the head harder with Vietnam even if they tried.

Well, Star Trek was always about people and ideas. I enjoyed that the show commented on the issues of the day, even if it did them in roundabout fashion.

When you look at Voyager and see how all the episodes are about almost nothing, and how they cloak themselves in this endless, poorly done technobabble, I think the original Star Trek episodes are pretty darn inspired -- even the "bad" ones.

 

[freenudemacusers]

Great that J.J is all about the story

There's not a gay character in star trek? I'll make sure to shove one in!

Wow canuck76 is offended be the idea of gay characters in trek stop the presses

 

[MisterHero]

#1 should be Shatner's death in Generations.

This!!!

This thread and Star Trek itself needs more Shatner!!

I don't really have a problem with Wesley Crusher. Being a kid on Star Trek can be awesome.

Chekov was a kid on Star Trek. He was awesome.

 

[Escape Goat]

This!!!

This thread and Star Trek itself needs more Shatner!!

I don't really have a problem with Wesley Crusher. Being a kid on Star Trek can be awesome.

Chekov was a kid on Star Trek. He was awesome.

Because he never did anything besides say "Shields up."

 

[SteveWinwood]

Because he never did anything besides say "Shields up."

But it was in a russian accent!

 

[MisterHero]

Kirk's death was somewhat poetic. Even though he himself said in The Final Frontier, that he believed that he would die alone. He even fell off a cliff in that movie, but Spock was there to catch him.

I doubt they considered his death that much though. The original scene in Generations had Soran shooting Kirk in the back.

It fired mini-photon torpedoes that blew up rocks, but Kirk didn't even explode in a gory mess. That's how underwhelming it was.

Because he never did anything besides say "Shields up."

He also found the nuclear wessels

Chekov was so much younger than the others on TOS but he got old like everyone else in the movies o_o

But it was in a russian accent!

Worf should've been more Russian, he was raised by Russian parents

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

In earlier season they descriped Dukat more lenient then other Kardashians, he showed some mercy. At some point they did a complete reversal in his thinking and behavior but didn't care explain his "lenient" attitude during the ocupation. I have to admit I haven't seen the later seasons for a long time but IIRC his change came as somewhat big surprise for me.

Yeah, he went from "bad but somewhat ambiguous" to "haha just kidding I'm evil". He could've been meant to be that way all along and was just hiding it better, but it makes him less interesting.

Fem-Quark was terrible

I wonder what Quark bartered to Dr. Bashir to convince him these extensive-yet-reversible gender reassignment surgeries were worth his time.

Not as bad as the novels Shatner puts his name on that takes place after Generations. They were so bad that novel canon that is pretty loose to begin outright, says they take place in a different universe.

They're entertaining in their own way, but definitely completely built around the premise that Captain Kirk is the most important man in the universe. I also doubt Shatner had much to do with them other than putting his name on them; I don't think Shatner has even watched much non-TOS stuff so there's no way he was thinking of a lot of the other characters and situations pulled in. Maybe he was tossing in ideas like "Make sure Kirk is sleeping with a much younger woman!" and "Make sure Kirk can beat Klingons with their own weaponry!"

Worf should've been more Russian, he was raised by Russian parents

Apparently a TNG episode idea that never got off the ground involved a guest appearance by Chekov, and would've had him and Worf bonding over shared Russian heritage.

 

[Henchmen21]

Apparently a TNG episode idea that never got off the ground involved a guest appearance by Chekov, and would've had him and Worf bonding over shared Russian heritage.

Probably would have been to fanwankery. Besides, didn't Worf's mom say that she tried to give him as much of a traditional klingon heritage as she could?

 

[MisterHero]

Probably would have been to fanwankery. Besides, didn't Worf's mom say that she tried to give him as much of a traditional klingon heritage as she could?

They did it with Spock and Data and it was amazing.

Fair enough about Worf's mom though

 

[Cheebo]

All of Shatner in Generations was bad.

I recently rewatched that TOS episode where these plant spores gave everyone total bliss and perfect health. The entire crew got infected, and they all beamed down to the planet to go party with the spores. All except Kirk. He's alone and helpless to operate the ship. Finally even he gets hit with the spores. Now he can rejoin his crew! He happily calls Spock with the good news. He goes to pack his bags, and he hesitates. He goes to beam down. No no NO! A part of him gets so fucking pissed at his pansy-assed self that his Super Saiyan anger burns the spores clean out of his body.

Not one person from the colony or his entire crew had that kind of a reaction. In order to trigger the same response in the now-emotional Spock, he had to start talking the most horrible shit about Spock's mother and father, and how Spock himself is such a filthy piece of half-breed shit that he defiles the woman he loves every time he touches her.


Now picture Kirk in the Nexus, stuck in an infinite loop of wood-chopping and egg-frying and horsey rides.

Yes yes yes a thousand times yes. Kirk was a badass, acting purely on instinct with no rules to hold him back and in the end was always right. Generations didn't get that Kirk at all.

Although TOS era Trek doesn't fit with TNG/DS9/VOY/ENT era Trek well in the slightest so it makes sense. They are basically two completely different franchises.

Kirk's Star Trek was the wild west, wandering into space no idea what the hell you would find and it was all on Kirk to make the right choice and save the day by whatever means he deems viable.

This is something JJ Abrams got 100% right for that period it was set in. The wild west more serial action adventure style Star Trek that is far more fitting with TOS.

 

[Henchmen21]

They did it with Spock and Data and it was amazing.

Fair enough about Worf's mom though

Spock and Data was all of one scene. He spent most of the episode with Picard (lol I love how Spock isn't showing up on the spellchecker but every other character name save Data is).

I have a feeling it would have been more like "Relics" which I found way too annoying.

 

[Bloodbeard]

I didn't think Quark's boobs were that out there as the OP suggests. It completely fit within the arc of the sexual revolution on Ferenganar. Quarks mother was to meet with Brunt, the grand nagis, to demonstrate her business acumen but was delayed and wouldn't make it to the meeting on DS9 in time. Brunt only reluctantly agreed to the meeting in the first place and likely would not allow for another. Quark had to step in, because if he didn't the entire movement would take a huge step back.

Clearly humanity has found a cure for homosexuality in the future!

But wait... wasn't there some hot female trill on trill action in ds9?

Ohhhh yeah

I immediately thought of that episode as well. So much sexual tension.

 

[MisterHero]

Spock and Data was all of one scene. He spent most of the episode with Picard (lol I love how Spock isn't showing up on the spellchecker but every other character name save Data is).

I have a feeling it would have been more like "Relics" which I found way too annoying.

Yeah angry old Scotty was kind of annoying, but he's Scotty. I was upset that he just flies off into space; he should've beat Geordi up for leadership or something

Now I'm wondering how they would've worked Chekov into TNG. Maybe just really really old like McCoy?

 

[ScientificNinja]

My compliments to Mama Robotnik. That was an awesome OP.

 

[BigDug13]

Yes yes yes a thousand times yes. Kirk was a badass, acting purely on instinct with no rules to hold him back and in the end was always right. Generations didn't get that Kirk at all.

Although TOS era Trek doesn't fit with TNG/DS9/VOY/ENT era Trek well in the slightest so it makes sense. They are basically two completely different franchises.

Kirk's Star Trek was the wild west, wandering into space no idea what the hell you would find and it was all on Kirk to make the right choice and save the day by whatever means he deems viable.

This is something JJ Abrams got 100% right for that period it was set in. The wild west more serial action adventure style Star Trek that is far more fitting with TOS.

Kirk was retired. He was just riding along on the maiden voyage of Enterprise-B. I'm sure his reckless abandon was tempered with age. But I do agree that overall Generations was a poor showing for his character.