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[Davidion]

Are you talking about the PC? I'm Smoker to start a level a huge percentage of the time. And because it was happening so often, I started paying attention and noticed the first infected to load gets Smoker.

That's weird. I've noticed that I have a tendency to get repeated boomers, PARTICULARLY when I vomit on at least two people before dying. I've gotten a boomer up to three-five times in a row with some normal frequency this way.

I'm not complaining because I love the boomer, but I thought it was just chance.

Don't really think the Boomer needs changing, though. He's good enough as it is, and if give him even more crap to do, he'll be a little overpowered. But as it stands right now, he's probably the most important infected. Without a decent Boomer, the survivors will just breeze through the level. And yeah, I do expect the autoshotty to be nerfed in the next major patch.

I mean, there's is absolutely no point in picking an Assault rifle over an Autoshotty in versus. It's not like you can't just blast away at your teammate with the shotgun when he/she is being pounced on/smokered, and the autoshotty can still kill special infected from long distances. As it stands now, the autoshotty has way too many uses and it totally gets rid of the need for players to use other guns.

Spoiler

BUFF THE WITCH(campaign)

Boomers are key. I also agree with the Witch needing a buff, at least in versus. Right now they are absolutely no threat whatsoever to even two people if the higher-end weapons are involved.

 

[Brannon]

Make it so that the three weapons on the table are the ONLYL three weapons on the table; how are four people getting auto shotguns from one auto shotgun? Now for sure, at the beginning, somebody's going to get stuck with just a pistol, but won't that make it more intense? Protect the weak link until better weapons show up. And as a bonus, every person will have a unique weapon. Well, maybe two people will have auto shotguns if the AI Director is generous but it would still be a blast.

 

[shintoki]

Boomers are definitely the key to winning for infected unless the team is terrible. Then its just pounce and kill.
The problem with the smoker as a few mention is, Its far too situational in its current state. It does have some problems also like zombies getting in the way. I think they should make the smoker by giving it a secondary that makes it the anti bunch of in a corner and just melee. Make it like produce a gas cloud that damages them based on how many are near. Hits one person? Not too much. 2, bit more damage, 3, going to feel it, all 4 and its going to hurt.

 

[1up]

Don't really think the Boomer needs changing, though. He's good enough as it is, and if give him even more crap to do, he'll be a little overpowered. But as it stands right now, he's probably the most important infected. Without a decent Boomer, the survivors will just breeze through the level. And yeah, I do expect the autoshotty to be nerfed in the next major patch.

I mean, there's is absolutely no point in picking an Assault rifle over an Autoshotty in versus. It's not like you can't just blast away at your teammate with the shotgun when he/she is being pounced on/smokered, and the autoshotty can still kill special infected from long distances. As it stands now, the autoshotty has way too many uses and it totally gets rid of the need for players to use other guns.

Spoiler

BUFF THE WITCH(campaign)

God forbid you are a tank and you go in the kitchen of BH5. Four autoshottys takes you down before you even get a swipe in.

::EDIT:: Also, lol at Javaman and everyone else learning the hard way about tanks and cars. :lol

 

[Pop On Arrival]

That's weird. I've noticed that I have a tendency to get repeated boomers, PARTICULARLY when I vomit on at least two people before dying. I've gotten a boomer up to three-five times in a row with some normal frequency this way.

I'm not complaining because I love the boomer, but I thought it was just chance.



Boomers are key. I also agree with the Witch needing a buff, at least in versus. Right now they are absolutely no threat whatsoever to even two people if the higher-end weapons are involved.

Witches can be useful in versus if you're up against an infected team that knows how to take advantage of her. PillowKnight already went into detail about the various ways you can use the witch to your advantage as infected. In campaign though, I usually find myself going out of my way to get to the witch and shoot her dead. They should do something to her that would put the fear of God into your team if you disturb her. Maybe instead of just killing the person that disturbed her, she goes for the entire team?(expert difficulty only)

 

[Tremis]

The problem with the smoker as a few mention is, Its far too situational in its current state. It does have some problems also like zombies getting in the way. I think they should make the smoker by giving it a secondary that makes it the anti bunch of in a corner and just melee. Make it like produce a gas cloud that damages them based on how many are near. Hits one person? Not too much. 2, bit more damage, 3, going to feel it, all 4 and its going to hurt.

i posted this idea on the steam forums and found out that many people have been independently suggesting it, which makes me think that it will hopefully be implemented in some form. cross your fingers!

 

[Oreoleo]

Boomers are definitely the key to winning for infected unless the team is terrible. Then its just pounce and kill.
The problem with the smoker as a few mention is, Its far too situational in its current state. It does have some problems also like zombies getting in the way. I think they should make the smoker by giving it a secondary that makes it the anti bunch of in a corner and just melee. Make it like produce a gas cloud that damages them based on how many are near. Hits one person? Not too much. 2, bit more damage, 3, going to feel it, all 4 and its going to hurt.

Giving smoker a poison cloud attack is so obvious. It would be perfect to slow really skilled groups down in corridors since they wouldn't know what's on the other side, rather than just be able to charge through a level by avoiding the boomer bile and sticking together.

Doing this, the auto-shotty nerf and witch buff, along with fixing some of the worse exploits (Forklift in front of elevator on NM4, barn loft in BH finale) would definitely be a breath of fresh air for the game. Though knowing Valve, when the patch hits there will be way more fixes than just this.

Witches can be useful in versus if you're up against an infected team that knows how to take advantage of her. PillowKnight already went into detail about the various ways you can use the witch to your advantage as infected. In campaign though, I usually find myself going out of my way to get to the witch and shoot her dead. They should do something to her that would put the fear of God into your team if you disturb her. Maybe instead of just killing the person that disturbed her, she goes for the entire team?(expert difficulty only)

I read in some Valve blog or something that that is what the Witch originally did, go after the whole team until she was dead but Valve took it out because it made her too powerful or something. A compromise with her going after 2 or maybe 3 people would be nice.

 

[Blizzard]

There seem to be some good suggestions here. Yes, smoker tongue not working if there are any zombies in the away is super-annoying. Another thing that drives me nuts is being a boomer and vomiting on a survivor who's on the ground, but the vomit apparently TOTALLY misses because a hunter was covering part of that survivor. Maybe it's too hard to implement vomit going on/around the hunter, but still, if there's anything even partly obscuring the survivor, the vomit totally fails.

Regarding buffing smokers, does everyone know there's a cv_cheat variable that lets smokers right click or turn away to disconnect the tongue? Apparently Valve thought that was too powerful, but I'm pretty sure it's there.

Yeah, autoshotguns are overpowered (though I have shot a smoker like 3-4 times and still got pulled to him). I like using the hunting rifle in vs., but it's probably not as useful.

Ooh, one idea, maybe autoshotguns could have less wall-penetrating power. It's one thing for people with sniper rifles (me) to spam all the walls and explode any boomer within 50 feet, but it's another thing for everyone to be SPAMMING AUTOSHOTGUNS AND KILLING ALL NEARBY SPECIAL INFECTED.

...ok, I'm done.

 

[Pop On Arrival]

i posted this idea on the steam forums and found out that many people have been independently suggesting it, which makes me think that it will hopefully be implemented in some form. cross your fingers!

Yup, the infected desperately need a skill that will punish survivors from turtling in one spot for a prolonged period of time. I'm no game designer though so I'll it to the wizards over at valve to figure that shit out. But yeah, punish people turtling in closets, and you've got yourself more balance. It's pretty stupid that all four survivors can hide in a small closet and instantly render everything the infected throw at you useless.

 

[StriKeVillain]

So, when the SDK is released are we going to see full custom campaigns available to play? I'm not a big fan of Versus, I would much rather play a campaign.

I saw this carnival inspired campaign last night and almost shit myself. I can't wait until the SDK is released, if I'm understanding it correctly.

 

[Javaman]

Witches can be useful in versus if you're up against an infected team that knows how to take advantage of her. PillowKnight already went into detail about the various ways you can use the witch to your advantage as infected. In campaign though, I usually find myself going out of my way to get to the witch and shoot her dead. They should do something to her that would put the fear of God into your team if you disturb her. Maybe instead of just killing the person that disturbed her, she goes for the entire team?(expert difficulty only)

Maybe something as simple as increasing her activation/irritation range by 2x or 3x would help out. As it is, even without the right weaponry witches aren't scary at all since 99% of the time you can just bypass her or sneak up for a quick head kill. Heck, I've run into a room with a witch and picked up a pipebomb next to her without her even activating. That's just not right.

 

[Pop On Arrival]

Maybe something as simple as increasing her activation/irritation range by 2x or 3x would help out. As it is, even without the right weaponry witches aren't scary at all since 99% of the time you can just bypass her or sneak up for a quick head kill. Heck, I've run into a room with a witch and picked up a pipebomb next to her without her even activating. That's just not right.

She should be more unpredictable, I think. Sometimes, I just run up straight to her, use my spray where she's sitting just for shits and giggles. If they made that sometimes when you get anywhere near her she'd flip the shit out and murder you, that would make things a lot more interesting. As she is now, she's way too mechanical.

It would also give those people who are extremely good at cr0wning something to be afraid of.

 

[Davidion]

Maybe something as simple as increasing her activation/irritation range by 2x or 3x would help out. As it is, even without the right weaponry witches aren't scary at all since 99% of the time you can just bypass her or sneak up for a quick head kill. Heck, I've run into a room with a witch and picked up a pipebomb next to her without her even activating. That's just not right.

You see Valve? She's so easy even the new guy isn't taking her seriously.

 

[Blizzard]

She should be more unpredictable, I think. Sometimes, I just run up straight to her, use my spray where she's sitting just for shits and giggles. If they made that sometimes when you get anywhere near her she'd flip the shit out and murder you, that would make things a lot more interesting. As she is now, she's way too mechanical.

It would also give those people who are extremely good at cr0wning something to be afraid of.

Hahaha. Anyone seen that "Zoey startles the witch" picture? I'd post it here but it's vaguely suggestive, so I will instead try to learn how to make a spray with it. :lol

Also, when my team went to hide in an elevator one level, we found the zombies had apparently sprayed a big cheese logo with SAY NO TO CLOSET CHEESE on it, right in front of the door.

 

[Panda Bear]

Hahaha. Anyone seen that "Zoey startles the witch" picture? I'd post it here but it's vaguely suggestive, so I will instead try to learn how to make a spray with it. :lol

Also, when my team went to hide in an elevator one level, we found the zombies had apparently sprayed a big cheese logo with SAY NO TO CLOSET CHEESE on it, right in front of the door.

Yes it's a bit NSFW so here's a link.

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/2535/zoeystartledawitchwi5.jpg

 

[Shake Appeal]

I think the witch would be fine if a) they made her a little unpredictable, as Pop On Arrival says, and b) if she went after the whole team one by one (which on Expert would be fucking terrifying). The problem with a) as Valve (and most game developers) would see it is that random elements are frustrating to players because their consistent actions yield inconsistent results.

 

[poweld]

Off the witch topic, I have a different gripe about L4D- Infected spawn times. I realize I'm not the only person to have said this before. I've taken to playing FFIX during spawn times :lol

Yahtzee made a rather poignant suggestion on how to resolve this relatively minor flaw in an otherwise great game: allow players to take control of a lesser infected during spawn times.
Now, I can already see some issues with this. The lesser infected can climb almost anything, and are supposed to be predictably stupid.

What about the ability to cause the survivors to be a little more wigged out? To be able to set off some audio or world cue that, while not affecting gameplay, affecting the player's moods.

Any other suggestions, or am I alone in my plight?

 

[1-D_FTW]

Yup, the infected desperately need a skill that will punish survivors from turtling in one spot for a prolonged period of time. I'm no game designer though so I'll it to the wizards over at valve to figure that shit out. But yeah, punish people turtling in closets, and you've got yourself more balance. It's pretty stupid that all four survivors can hide in a small closet and instantly render everything the infected throw at you useless.

That would be the perfect counter for that. Since the right-click pound is almost worthless, giving them a secondary feature that would spray a cloud of smoke would be great.

It doesn't even have to be useful in 99 percent of situations, just effective enough to eliminate turtling. Not that I'd expect anything that logical for at least 12 months.

EDIT: Can you imagine a boomer getting a horde of zombies rushing the closet and then a poison cloud? The zombies rush would be blocking their escape and they'd just choke. Would make that tactic a real suicide risk.

 

[DaFish]

EDIT: Can you imagine a boomer getting a horde of zombies rushing the closet and then a poison cloud? The zombies rush would be blocking their escape and they'd just choke. Would make that tactic a real suicide risk.

Yes, that sounds money!

 

[Elhandro]

Suggestions Needed

I just picked up L4D for the PC but I am mainly a console player. I would have bought it for my 360 but some of my extended gaming friends are swearing by the PC version and refuse to buy a X360.

So I am Left towing the line and I am hoping that playing the PC version with the X360 control pad is a possibility. I understand that I will be playing with a much inferior set up, my question is, How inferior / broken / abused will I be if I get online and try to compete.

Also if anyone is currently using this setup some testemonials would be nice.

Thanks in Advance for the help

 

[Twig]

Playing with a 360 controller is... possible. I suppose in campaign you'd be fine... ish. Certainly wouldn't be able to keep up with any good players using a mouse!

Honestly, I don't think it would be a problem unless you wanted to play versus. Which seems to be what everyone loves. But you should get used to KB+M anyway, wot for it's superior. O:

I think the witch would be fine if a) they made her a little unpredictable, as Pop On Arrival says, and b) if she went after the whole team one by one (which on Expert would be fucking terrifying). The problem with a) as Valve (and most game developers) would see it is that random elements are frustrating to players because their consistent actions yield inconsistent results.

In Left 4 Dead? The touted AI Director?

I think we can all agree that more random is better. At least in campaign. I don't really give two fucks about versus, to be honest.

 

[poweld]

In Left 4 Dead? The touted AI Director?

I think we can all agree that more random is better. At least in campaign. I don't really give two fucks about versus, to be honest.

The power of Christ compels you! The power of Christ compels you!

 

[Oreoleo]

Suggestions Needed

I just picked up L4D for the PC but I am mainly a console player. I would have bought it for my 360 but some of my extended gaming friends are swearing by the PC version and refuse to buy a X360.

So I am Left towing the line and I am hoping that playing the PC version with the X360 control pad is a possibility. I understand that I will be playing with a much inferior set up, my question is, How inferior / broken / abused will I be if I get online and try to compete.

Also if anyone is currently using this setup some testemonials would be nice.

Thanks in Advance for the help

There's a setting to adjust stick sensitivity and with a little know-how you can configure your own controls to whatever you want. And RB is the quick 180 turn so I think all in all you should be okay.

I think we can all agree that more random is better. At least in campaign. I don't really give two fucks about versus, to be honest.

I wondered why I never see you playing anymore.

 

[LunaticPuma]

Playing with a 360 controller is... possible. I suppose in campaign you'd be fine... ish. Certainly wouldn't be able to keep up with any good players using a mouse!

Honestly, I don't think it would be a problem unless you wanted to play versus. Which seems to be what everyone loves. But you should get used to KB+M anyway, wot for it's superior. O:

Keyboard is inferior.

Mouse is superior.

<3 360 controller (Though I play on console pretty much exclusively.)

 

[Pop On Arrival]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93IOL_pYkp4&fmt=18

 

[Walshicus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93IOL_pYkp4&fmt=18

Music is rubbish.

 

[Elhandro]

Thanks to everyone that replied so far. Ill check it out tonight. Any Newb Gaf servers?

 

[Goreomedy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93IOL_pYkp4&fmt=18

Hilarious. Hope to never see this in Vs.

 

[Twig]

Keyboard is inferior.

Mouse is superior.

<3 360 controller (Though I play on console pretty much exclusively.)

Wrang.

Note: I am joking. I don't give two shits. If anyone actually responds to this pissed because "lol pc gamers have a superiority complex" they deserved to be shot.

It annoys me that I have to say this because I know if I don't...

 

[Red Scarlet]

Don't really think the Boomer needs changing, though. He's good enough as it is, and if give him even more crap to do, he'll be a little overpowered. But as it stands right now, he's probably the most important infected. Without a decent Boomer, the survivors will just breeze through the level. And yeah, I do expect the autoshotty to be nerfed in the next major patch.

I mean, there's is absolutely no point in picking an Assault rifle over an Autoshotty in versus. It's not like you can't just blast away at your teammate with the shotgun when he/she is being pounced on/smokered, and the autoshotty can still kill special infected from long distances. As it stands now, the autoshotty has way too many uses and it totally gets rid of the need for players to use other guns.

Spoiler

BUFF THE WITCH(campaign)

Yeah, when this is the most preferred special to run into in a grey expert situation, you know that special infected doesn't do much anymore.

Please fix her and the Smoker for vs.

 

[Crab Milk Mickey]

Tank needs to be buffed for Versus as well. I'm mostly playing the campaign on Expert and - after being used to that difficulty for so long - it's ridiculous how easy it is to kill a Normal Tank. You know something's wrong when one guy can take a Normal Tank down with ease (without a Molotov even), assuming none of the other Special Infected are bothering him as well. They should just give him his Advanced settings: that way he's not too hard but not too easy either.

And I agree with those who are saying that the Witch needs to attack more than one person, coupled with a health increase. She's still a threat on Expert thanks to her one-hit-one-kill capabilities (+ I don't condone of people running up to a Witch to cr0wn her as well), but it's kind of tame how she runs off like that after she killed her original target, even when the other Survivors are still shooting at her.

Oh, and melee needs to be nerfed. Stamina (only for melee attacks) would be more than welcome.

 

[Nabs]

i don't like the tank in versus mode

 

[zsswimmer]

I recently got this game, very fun but I was wondering about the custom maps. Is it because no SDK has been released? I was really looking forward to some of the maps people make.

 

[Blizzard]

I recently got this game, very fun but I was wondering about the custom maps. Is it because no SDK has been released? I was really looking forward to some of the maps people make.

I think so, basically. Botolf is a poster here who is working on a custom map, but he doesn't want to get too into the textures because he isn't sure if it will be compatible with whatever the actual SDK update uses whenever Valve releases it.

 

[Brannon]

A Smoker should give out a 10% chance of random status effects upon death due to the toxic spores if you spend more than three seconds in the smoke cloud...

- 1 point of damage per second for 10 seconds (duh)
- Boomervision 10 seconds (blurry vision)
- Faint 5 seconds (you just lay there)
- Slowed movement 10 seconds (at least you're not just laying there)
- Critically weaker melee 10 seconds (zombies aren't repelled by your punches but they still take some damage)
- Heathpack/pills contaminated (they'll toss it away)
- Flammable 15 seconds (the vapors will linger and fire will stay on you until time is up)
- Deafness 10 seconds (Hunters will have their way with you)
- Witch Lure 5 minutes (the Smoker stank will make you lure a witch to you from 10x normal distance if a witch is alive on the level and it does more damage, and it's faster)
- Hallucination 5 seconds (suddenly you're the only survivor and you do more damage to everything that moves. Everything)

Of course the only message you will get is that you've been affected by the fumes, not what the affliction is...

SDK can't come soon enough; the Smoker could become the worst griefing son of a bitch in the game if it's implemented. It could also break the game so here's hoping.

 

[firex]

It always goes Hunter, Hunter, Boomer, Smoker, repeat.

I agree with your comment in regards to picking a Survivor, though.

I've never seen any real pattern to it yet so maybe that's true. it always seems like the pattern is the infected team is limited to 1 boomer/smoker at a time, and 2 hunters (though sometimes 3, which I have no idea what it is that causes it). I just think it could be helpful/more fun for players who hate playing a specific infected, or new players or something to be able to tell the game they want to be a hunter/smoker/boomer. I mean, I understand the class limits (right now if you had more than 1 smoker your team would suck, if you had more than 1 boomer you'd probably be able to keep the survivors bottled up somewhere indefinitely) but it would be nice to set up a sort of priority system so you'd at least spend every other spawn as your preferred class.

also lol I had no idea until vs/doing some single player on normal how weak the witch is before she's startled. on expert I'd always sneak past her because she instagibs you if she's startled, so I never bothered trying for crowned. expert tanks are pretty ridiculous, but I can't imagine playing vs on a difficulty like expert and the survivors getting too far.

 

[vertopci]

Since a bunch of you are talking about fixing certain things, I'll throw in my two cents:

1. Obviously fix the exploits (speed melee, hunter cloning, etc)
2. Make the animation for when the boomer gets meleed by a survivor 20% quicker/shorter. The stun time is wayyyy too long.
3. Make the smokers smoke cloud thingy a shitload more dense so survivors have trouble seeing in it. Essentially make the smoke cloud USEFUL
4. Buff Witch only in versus
5. Nerf autoshotty, Increase assault rifle damage a tad bit, Increase sniper rifle by a bunch and make its rate of fire slow, like once every 4 seconds. I hate how all the tier 2 weapons are fast as shit to shoot.

 

[Blizzard]

Since a bunch of you are talking about fixing certain things, I'll throw in my two cents:

1. Obviously fix the exploits (speed melee, hunter cloning, etc)

What is "speed melee" and "hunter cloning"?

 

[Epiphyte]

What is "speed melee" and "hunter cloning"?

speed melee is when you rapidly switch weapons while meleeing

It speeds up how fast you strike and makes it nigh impossible for anything to touch you

 

[Xdrive05]

What about hunter cloning?

I ask because I just played a VS match where hunters just kept on coming, literally as soon as you kill them they spawn around the corner, without respawn time penalty. I'm pretty sure that was cheating and not a glitch but I couldn't prove it. All I know is we killed about 20 hunters in a minute and no other special zombies during that time.

 

[Blizzard]

What about hunter cloning?

I ask because I just played a VS match where hunters just kept on coming, literally as soon as you kill them they spawn around the corner, without respawn time penalty. I'm pretty sure that was cheating and not a glitch but I couldn't prove it. All I know is we killed about 20 hunters in a minute and no other special zombies during that time.

Someone else reported playing on a server like that. It -might- have been a stupid server setting, if you were playing PC...

 

[Panda Bear]

Since a bunch of you are talking about fixing certain things, I'll throw in my two cents:

2. Make the animation for when the boomer gets meleed by a survivor 20% quicker/shorter. The stun time is wayyyy too long.

I think the boomer's stun time is quite appropriate. The point of the boomer is to be stealthy and strategic. If you are not playing it the right way you get fucked. I think if you made the stun time shorter the boomer would just become overpowered.

 

[Blizzard]

The point of the boomer is to be stealthy and strategic.

Burble burble
burble burble
burble burble

GARBBBFLELEFE *gets shot through wall 30 feet away*

 

[Twig]

I think the boomer's stun time is quite appropriate. The point of the boomer is to be stealthy and strategic. If you are not playing it the right way you get fucked. I think if you made the stun time shorter the boomer would just become overpowered.

What Blizzard said.

 

[Houston3000]

Most of your guy's suggestions for Smoker changes seem overpowered. They really are useful in their current state, it's just that their vastly more effective at certain points in the game than they are in others. Hunters get knocked out easily, even in boomed groups because of all the melee spam and their knock back, while effective, alerts survivors that a hunter is near them even if they can't see. As a Smoker, pulling a single survivor out of a boomed group is much easier.

That being said, I think they would be a good candidate for some sort of ability that counter's closet camping. A smoke cloud seems a fair fit but I don't think it should do damage, maybe just disable them somehow... like drastically slow down melee and firing speed (because they're coughing) as well as stay cloudy for a while so it's almost impossible to see. Maybe another option is the Smoker can "Smoke" one specific survivor, that survivor would them emit smoke for 10 seconds or so that wouldn't hurt him but instead damage and blind anyone too close to him temporarily.

 

[TommyT]

Good time tonight guys! I got ninja kicked from steam as soon as we went back to the lobby.

 

[DaFish]

Good time tonight guys! I got ninja kicked from steam as soon as we went back to the lobby.

Nuh Uhh, you rage quit even though you won...

gg

 

[Volcynika]

Did I really just read someone saying that the Boomer needs to be stealthy?

Really?

 

[behem0th x]

Lots of good suggestions... especially the smoker stuff, that character is gimped for all except for the snag on the rooftop. besides that on most levels the loud sound of him coughing, the green smoke flying above him and the randomly missing tounge are very annoying.

I'd say leave the witch as-is though, it's up to the actual players on versus to trick them survivors into setting her off.

 

[DaFish]

Did I really just read someone saying that the Boomer needs to be stealthy?

Really?

Only as stealthy as a Hunter I guess...