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The Official Street Fighter IV Thread of FADCing a Stranger in the Alps

K

Kimosabae

Banned
Rentahamster said:
I find it a little hard to see how pressing "right" on the d-pad is any faster or "more immediate" than flicking your wrist to the right on a stick.
Click to expand...


You don't see how "pressing right" - pressing a button designated "right" - can be faster than moving something to the right, or to an input designated "right"?

Well, that leaves me flabbergasted.

I think we all may be a little too indoctrinated in our preferences to dissociate our theories from experiences.

I'm done mucking up this thread.

Awww, Daigo - and all that.


FindMyFarms said:
But you can't limit the definition of precision to one action. There are a lot of input combinations out there, and the majority of them can be performed faster and more accurately on a stick.

I think what you're arguing is which control method presents an easier means to activate a single direction with no regard to the plethora of other motions out there, and then basing precision off of that one facet alone. A fallacy in argument if I may say.
Click to expand...


I was more trying to formulate a premise through deduction. I'm not limiting precision to just one action. I figured if I could get us to agree on a core principle, we'd get somewhere - i.e. explore the complexities based off that principle.
 
-COOLIO-

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
Kimosabae said:
You don't see how "pressing right" - pressing a button designated "right" - can be faster than moving something to the right, or to an input designated "right"?

Well, that leaves me flabbergasted.
Click to expand...

pressing a button down and moving a stick right takes the same amount of time.
 
K

Krackatoa

Member
Kimosabae said:
But in principle, at the core, is that not almost literally the difference? When I still have to move the lever to the 6 position, before 6 can activate, if I want to move forward (6), because the lever itself rests at 5?

On a D-Pad, 6 is directly beneath a button that I can press, to activate more immediately. How is this not the same in principle?
Click to expand...

If this was "Press Down Fighter IV" then maybe you'd have an argument (Even then, I can press down faster on a stick repeatedly than I can a D-pad with my thumb). But this game revolves around repetitive rotations and movements in some very obtuse directions. Using only your thumb to depress buttons that are spaced relatively widely apart does not grant the same amount of dexterity and speed that you could achieve using a stick.

You can't really argue it, the evidence is there. Talk to anyone who's bought a stick. Read reviews. Et cetera. People do better and have an easier time performing moves with arcade sticks.

If you really want "How fast I can hit a direction" as the litmus for how good a controller is, then keyboards win forever, because I can alternate between back, down and forward without having to traverse my finger across a D-pad or stick across a gate. But that's not what makes a good controller.
 
Rentahamster

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
Kimosabae said:
You don't see how "pressing right" - pressing a button designated "right" - can be faster than moving something to the right, or to an input designated "right"?

Well, that leaves me flabbergasted.

I think we all may be a little too indoctrinated in our preferences to dissociate our theories from experiences.

I'm done mucking up this thread.

Awww, Daigo - and all that.





I was more trying to formulate a premise through deduction. I figured if I could get us to agree on a core principle, we'd get somewhere - i.e. explore the complexities based off that principle.
Click to expand...
When both actions can be performed within about 20ms, there really isn't any difference.

The difference comes in that it is easier and more precise to execute a series of inputs using a joystick in any given input window.
 
F

FindMyFarms

Member
Kimosabae said:
I was more trying to formulate a premise through deduction. I'm not limiting precision to just one action. I figured if I could get us to agree on a core principle, we'd get somewhere - i.e. explore the complexities based off that principle.
Click to expand...

So I'm guessing that your premise is activating a single direction is more precise on a pad than a stick?

What does agreeing on that accomplish? Said core principle is applicable to that alone as motion maneuvers require a different means of input.
 
F

fresquito

Member
I can't believe someone is saying sticks aren't better for fighting games than d-pads. I don't know how you put your hands on the controller, but that's like saying playing four button with triggers is better than playing six face buttons with the hands in arcade style. When playing with a stick you can use all the parts of your left hand to perform moves, be it wrist, fingers, palm... while on the d-pad you can only use one single finger, which btw isn't know for its high precision input.

That's not to say you can't play great on a d-pad, of course.
 
D

dragonballjoseph

Member
So far, comparing my stick to pad (or 360 thumbstick), my charge characters have improved, but my QCF characters seem to be worse, which could be the result of not playing them as much but whatever. But some people are better off using their thumbs than hands for movement. Just because you and others have better performance on a stick and pad, it doesn't mean that it's canon.

On on that note, I decided to open up my stick and see why my RB button wasn't working (Madcatz site said there was a 4-6 week processing wait or something, but I didn't want to wait that long), and did not see any wires unplugged or anything. So I pushed the crap out of the wire for my RB button and it works quite nice now. Didn't want to mess with my stick's insides and mess up my warranty, but I knew Madcatz wouldn't send me a stick that would go out in 2 weeks. Hooray brute force! ^_^
 
B

BotoxAgent

Member
I love using stick. I can play hours upon hours without my hands hurting that much. Plus, collecting sticks is damn fun! :D



And I apologize to AZ Greg for my connection constantly dropping friday night. It must have been a bit annoying. It was happening all weekend and getting a lot of hate mail because people thought I was rage quittting :'-( My internet was whacked all weekend that I couldn't even watch the God's Garden 2 stream.
 
S

sixteen-bit

Member
i am shocked you are able to type with an exploded head!

Got to play some SFIV this weekend. I've been playing less and less though :(
leading up to the tourney on the weekend before last i hadn't played in like 3 weeks.

I'm not bored; just school and work and other obligations.
 
B

BitchTits

Member
For me the advantage of a stick over a pad is not necessarily the directional input, but the buttons. With a pad you are much more limited in pressing multiple buttons than you are with a stick. Using your whole hand vs one thumb is a no brainer.

I know people hold the pad another way to enable them more access to the buttons, but I find then you are limited in the use of your left hand with the d-pad.
 
L

LakeEarth

Member
I faced someone in G1 semi's last night with 14700k. I felt bad beating him, he finally got pretty far and I crushed his dream of working his way out of the hole.

I'm slowing down on playing the game too. I'm tired of my mains, but my secondaries are just not up to par for G1 level competition. Which brings me to ranked mode, which is just a series of many +1s and a couple -128s.
 
B

BitchTits

Member
LakeEarth said:
I'm slowing down on playing the game too. I'm tired of my mains, but my secondaries are just not up to par for G1 level competition. Which brings me to ranked mode, which is just a series of many +1s and a couple -128s.
Click to expand...
Plus you have to remember to keep an eye out for the 1 round 30 second brigade. I always forget to look and then realise once the match starts.
 
T

Threi

notag
Kimosabae said:
Main Entry: an·a·log
Pronunciation: \ˈa-nə-ˌlȯg, -ˌläg\
Function: adjective
Date: 1946
1 : of, relating to, or being an analogue
2 a : of, relating to, or being a mechanism in which data is represented by continuously variable physical quantities b : of or relating to an analog computer c : being a timepiece having hour and minute hands

Bolded definition is the essence of the stick's physical design, no? The stick can be moved analogous to 360 degrees, but only reads data from 8 digital inputs.

Playing SF4 with an arcade stick is akin to playing any 2D fighter with a Gamecube analog stick.
Click to expand...
You are off in your reasoning. A stick is still only activating 4 microswitches. It is digital by all accounts. You can move a pad in a smooth 360 degree motion but are still only pressing combinations of digital microswitches, just like an arcade stick

Analog versus digital doesn't pertain to the type of mechanism used to activate the switch, but rather if the switch itself has finite stages of activation or not. The four switches in a stick are exactly the same as the four switches in a pad; an on state or an off state. There isn't anything analogous about it, either you hit the direction or not. How much effort it takes to enable the digital switch varies from stick to stick, which they call "engage" and "throw" IIRC

I think the point you are trying to make (the extremely small engage distance of a pad is beneficial for a reaction-based genre like fighting games) makes sense (however you could argue the benefit is negated by the physical strain on your thumb) but you are getting arcade sticks and analog sticks confused. Arcade sticks are 100% digital.
 
B

black_vegeta

Member
I'm currently grinding my way up to G1 status and so far I'm loving the competition that I'm getting from "most" of my opponents. There are the occasional scrubs here and there. Yesterday, I fought and a number of Sagats. Two of them were pretty good, but I beat them both. I even EX-Armor cancel>ultra'ed one of their EX tigershoots for the win.

I doubt that I 'll actually reach G1 before SSF4 comes out because I can't play it as much as I would like to, but I'm having fun.
 
L

LakeEarth

Member
the_log_ride said:
Such a grind... I feel you on that
Click to expand...
Well I don't really care about those points, but if I did I could see how that would frustrate the crap out of me. Right now the highest people in ranked mode is about 4500bp and they're few and far between. I even recognize some of them from G1.

I pretty much goof around in ranked, hitting random and trying new strategies. Last night I spent about an hour just going around trying to practice raging demon setups. I lost like 1000bp, but it was fun.
 
S

Spiderjericho

Member
I could care less about the points in Rank or championship. I'm still 2000+ on Live and 3000+ on PSN. I think I have 3000BP. It's just so pointless.

I'd probably play online more if it was like HD Remix where we could have rooms and play quarter matches. Those were fun. N3ss, Mox, CO Andy, Yeb, Eggo, etc. Good times.

When SSFIV comes out, if you're not my friend, befriend me so we can get in on the SF Orgy fun.
 
T

the_log_ride

Member
BitchTits said:
Plus you have to remember to keep an eye out for the 1 round 30 second brigade. I always forget to look and then realise once the match starts.
Click to expand...
bahaha... That shit used to piss me the hell off. But now I can say I've improved just enough that I actually look for these bastards and beat them despite their trickery.

I'd say I'm slowing down with SF4, too, but only because everyone else have stopped playing. There's no way in hell I can make it into G1 before SSF4 drops. Hard as hell to get through a G2 Championship with at least 3 bar connections.
 
K

Kimosabae

Banned
Threi said:
I think the point you are trying to make (the extremely small engage distance of a pad is beneficial for a reaction-based genre like fighting games) makes sense (however you could argue the benefit is negated by the physical strain on your thumb) but you are getting arcade sticks and analog sticks confused. Arcade sticks are 100% digital.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I realized my premise was flawed, so I dropped it. As I said before, I was attempting to stretch the concept of analog to motion, but I see now that doesn't work.
 
P

PhatSaqs

Banned
SephirothRK said:
Luffy vs Daigo Winner Bracket
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iXnPd7POao
Daigo vs Luffy Loser Final
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a12Rq2LIqPY

EDIT: the 2nd vid is cuts off during the first round of the 2nd set. :(
Click to expand...
Rose bitches!

Rose___Street_Fighter_by_shi_tenshi.jpg


:lol
 
I

inphinite

Neo Member
so... Kimosabae came in here with one of the dumbest arguments i've ever witnessed. There was no point to it or was it relevant to anything.
 
X

XenoRaven

Member
inphinite said:
so... Kimosabae came in here with one of the dumbest arguments i've ever witnessed. There was no point to it or was it relevant to anything.
Click to expand...
It was almost as irrelevant as this post! Crazy!
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
inphinite said:
so... Kimosabae came in here with one of the dumbest arguments i've ever witnessed. There was no point to it or was it relevant to anything.
Click to expand...
and yet, pad Rose beats daigo.
 
S

Sir Garbageman

Member
MIMIC said:
Good shit. I had no idea that Rose's Ultra could go through fireballs. But Daigo is scary good though. It takes a damn non-shoto player to beat him.
Click to expand...

Yea, that backdash into Ultra through the fireball was the hotness. Also clutch Ex Soul Reflect of the Ex Fireball.

Question from a noob, Luffy kept on sliding under Diago's jumpin attempts, going for a throw and getting them teched. Was there a way for him to land some damage afterward the slide outside of going for the throw?
 
P

PhatSaqs

Banned
Sir Garbageman said:
Question from a noob, Luffy kept on sliding under Diago's jumpin attempts, going for a throw and getting them teched. Was there a way for him to land some damage afterward the slide outside of going for the throw?
Click to expand...
He could have chosen to s.mk into combo instead and he knows that shit so not sure why he went for a throw everytime.
 
R

Rice-Eater

Member
MarkMan said:
Official GODSGARDEN 2 photos! Check em' out! http://web.me.com/tohoho/GODSGARDEN2/

KayoPOLICE is so cute <3
Click to expand...

Convince her, Choco, and Mepu(aka girl Sagat) to come to Evo for the Ladies tourney.


And as president of the Daigo fan club, I must apologize for our members absurd messages. We take it real hard when the Beast loses so sometimes members can't control themselves and go out in hordes to defend our messiah. I'll talk to the guys and try to keep them in check, again my apologies.
 
M

Majestros

You can't handle the truth!
Maybe Rose's damage is higher in the French version of SF4? I know for a fact that her slide recovers faster based on how many times Daigo was unable to punish it. There's no other explanation because we all know Daigo is tool-assisted.
 
T

the_log_ride

Member
Next time there's a major event, someone hire me to shoot the photos. 'Guarantee I can do a better job ;) I'll do it for free, as long as you cover my travel expenses...
 
D

dragonballjoseph

Member
the_log_ride said:
I'd say I'm slowing down with SF4, too, but only because everyone else have stopped playing. There's no way in hell I can make it into G1 before SSF4 drops. Hard as hell to get through a G2 Championship with at least 3 bar connections.
Click to expand...
I had nothing important to do winter break, and went from 2400 to about 14400 in about a 2.5 week period. So it's possible.... if you really have nothing else to do...
 
B

BotoxAgent

Member
man it must be nice to be Daigo, to be universally beloved like that



With Final Fantasy XIII and GoW3, i will probably be playing a bit less SFIV for the time being.
 
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