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[FindMyFarms]

I play a (horrible) Chun Li, but I can't help not walking all the way back there. How else can I charge for a fireball? What's the min time for charge anyway? I'd like to get closer to the enemy!

The min. time for charge is 2 sec I believe. Also, if you want to charge without moving back, hold back and down (b/d) at the same time. This allows you to hold back to charge, while crouching to stop her from moving back.

 

[Darkman M]

I don't buy the argument that extreme turtling isn't scrubby.

(This isn't in reference to anyone here, just a general thought.)

I played a Chun-Li the other day that literally walked all the way to the back of the screen and didn't move.

That's not a fight. It's hiding.

So about 20 seconds in, I say, 'fuck it,' I'll come at them and if I lose, I lose.

So I come at them, we fight for a moment, and I take a little more damage then they do.

What do they do?

Run back to the other corner and dodge for the rest of the match.

NEVER attacking me on their own.

So in essence, if I did what they did to start the match and NEVER attacked, the match would have expired in a tie.

That's scrubby.

pressure and throw their asses in the corner learning boxer now so i iove when you get in the corner.

 

[Teknopathetic]

"I play a (horrible) Chun Li, but I can't help not walking all the way back there. How else can I charge for a fireball? What's the min time for charge anyway? I'd like to get closer to the enemy!"


Technically, you can charge for a fireball by holding down-back instead of just back. But a lot of Chuns choose to walk back and get some space anyway (so they have more time to recover and walk up behind it, I guess, I don't play chun!).

 

[Tain]

That's scrubby.

lol you lost

 

[blackadde]

you cannot combo akuma's ultra, and to the best of my knowledge you can't even kara it for a guaranteed hit. it's startup frames are longer than crouch->jump, so people can escape it after the superflash by just holding up.

 

[PhatSaqs]

I don't buy the argument that extreme turtling isn't scrubby.

(This isn't in reference to anyone here, just a general thought.)

I played a Chun-Li the other day that literally walked all the way to the back of the screen and didn't move.

That's not a fight. It's hiding.

So about 20 seconds in, I say, 'fuck it,' I'll come at them and if I lose, I lose.

So I come at them, we fight for a moment, and I take a little more damage then they do.

What do they do?

Run back to the other corner and dodge for the rest of the match.

NEVER attacking me on their own.

So in essence, if I did what they did to start the match and NEVER attacked, the match would have expired in a tie.

That's scrubby.

I'd say not being able to beat them, or at least influence the match so that he's not sitting in the corner the entire time, is just as scrubby.

 

[taku]

you cannot combo akuma's ultra, and to the best of my knowledge you can't even kara it for a guaranteed hit. it's startup frames are longer than crouch->jump, so people can escape it after the superflash by just holding up.

Seriously? I'm sure I've combo'd into it several times. Oh well, maybe I'm wrong. I never play Akuma anyway >_>

 

[BotoxAgent]

can someone explain to me how to do an instant air teleport with Sim?

 

[omgimaninja]

can someone explain to me how to do an instant air teleport with Sim?

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=176154

 

[-COOLIO-]

your avatar is hilarious.

So when is the blanka costume pack coming out?

thanks it's almost better than the real thing mirite?!

 

[CartridgeBlower]

Well, he beat me because some players are VERY VERY GOOD at turtling.

But my point is he never made an offensive move.

And you can say "Oh, well he plays defensive. That's his game and he used it against you."

But it's unfair in the sense that if I did the same as him, time would run out.

He's not engaging a fight.

"Oh, but he's forcing you to play his game and by that blah blah blah"

That's just it. I HAVE to play his game now if I want to even have a fight. I HAVE to come at him in the corner. Either that or I say, "You know what, you come at me and I'll wait in the corner too until time expires."

It's not an equal fight now. NO MATTER WHAT I DO I'M PLAYING ON HIS TERMS (because he'd keep dodging and running to the other side of the screen). And he didn't out skill me to get to that place or something like that, either. That's why it's scrubby. He didn't turn the match in his favor -- it STARTED in his favor.

 

[Won]

My point is he never made an offensive move.

And you can say "Oh, well he plays defensive. That's his game and he used it against you."

But it's unfair in the sense that if I did the same as him, time would run out.

He's not engaging a fight.

"Oh, but he's forcing you to play his game and by that blah blah blah"

That's just it. I HAVE to play his game now if I want to even have a fight. I HAVE to come at him in the corner. Either that or I say, "You know what, you come at me and I'll wait in the corner too until time expires."

It's not an equal fight now. NO MATTER WHAT I DO I'M PLAYING ON HIS TERMS (because he'd keep dodging and running to the other side of the screen). And he didn't out skill me to get to that place or something like that, either. That's why it's scrubby. He didn't turn the match in his favor -- it STARTED in his favor.

Well, anticipate what he is going to do during your attack, block/dodge it, punish it, sit back in the other corner and let the time run out.
If he really is able to outdamage you, then it is a problem on your end.

 

[CartridgeBlower]

Like I said, he was a good player.

He was GOOD at turtling and moving when I came at him. That was his game, after all. He had around 3800 BPs.

It's just that turtlers FORCE YOU to play their game, hence why they always have an advantage. START with an advantage, like a handicap. That was the point I was trying to get across.

 

[FindMyFarms]

Well, he beat me because some players are VERY VERY GOOD at turtling.

But my point is he never made an offensive move.

And you can say "Oh, well he plays defensive. That's his game and he used it against you."

But it's unfair in the sense that if I did the same as him, time would run out.

He's not engaging a fight.

"Oh, but he's forcing you to play his game and by that blah blah blah"

That's just it. I HAVE to play his game now if I want to even have a fight. I HAVE to come at him in the corner. Either that or I say, "You know what, you come at me and I'll wait in the corner too until time expires."

It's not an equal fight now. NO MATTER WHAT I DO I'M PLAYING ON HIS TERMS (because he'd keep dodging and running to the other side of the screen). And he didn't out skill me to get to that place or something like that, either. That's why it's scrubby. He didn't turn the match in his favor -- it STARTED in his favor.

EVERYONE forces you to play their game to an extent. If someone attacks you, they're playing offensively and you have to play by his game regardless. This other person is simply doing the opposite. Any why does it matter if it's "his game?" If I'm playing basketball and my opponent leaves the lade wide open for a lay up on purpose, it's his "game" but I'm sure as hell taking the easy 2!

At the end of the day, if someone hides into a corner, that should be an easy W for you.

 

[BotoxAgent]

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=176154

thanks!

 

[AndresON777]

thanks it's almost better than the real thing mirite?!

http://i43.tinypic.com/2qlrbwy.png[IMG][IMG]http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u129/COORIO/crimsonava2.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]



hardly lol, but you look like travis touchdown

[img]http://www.siliconera.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/nmh0002.jpg

 

[Won]

Like I said, he was a good player.

He was GOOD at turtling and moving when I came at him. That was his game, after all. He had around 3800 BPs.

It's just that turtlers FORCE YOU to play their game, hence why they always have an advantage. That was the point I was trying to get across.

It is a fighting game. One guy attacks, the other guy defends.....

What is your character anyway? If you see what he is doing, don't let him do it. Catch that guy.

 

[Mr Jared]

NO MATTER WHAT I DO I'M PLAYING ON HIS TERMS

Being able to control a match to the point where the opponent feels they have no other option than to play their terms == scrubby?

Right..

 

[BitchTits]

Seriously? I'm sure I've combo'd into it several times. Oh well, maybe I'm wrong. I never play Akuma anyway >_>

If you hit them as you're inputting the Ultra, doesn't that count as part of the hits for the combo? I dunno how many hits the Ultra is on it's own, but loads of times I've hit an opponent as I'm inputting the Ultra/Super.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

Being able to control a match to the point where the opponent feels they have no other option than to play their terms == scrubby?

Right..

I eat fireballs and shories at the start solely so that idiots feel more comfortable throwing them.

 

[levious]

I don't buy the argument that extreme turtling isn't scrubby.

(This isn't in reference to anyone here, just a general thought.)

I played a Chun-Li the other day that literally walked all the way to the back of the screen and didn't move.

That's not a fight. It's hiding.

So about 20 seconds in, I say, 'fuck it,' I'll come at them and if I lose, I lose.

So I come at them, we fight for a moment, and I take a little more damage then they do.

What do they do?

Run back to the other corner and dodge for the rest of the match.

NEVER attacking me on their own.

So in essence, if I did what they did to start the match and NEVER attacked, the match would have expired in a tie.

That's scrubby.

more likely achievement/trophy whoring, probably needed that win with time expired medal...

 

[arstal]

The thing with turtles, is that they want you to stick out something unsafe to punish it.

You need to stick out something safe, see their reaction, then punish that.

Note: this becomes less effective as skill levels rise, you'll need better tactics there.

 

[TurtleSnatcher]

Not sure if this has been posted before, but perhaps this song will help you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e42UQy9vNKE

Okay.. So you do the EX move and if it can absorb you then do the ultra right after the absorb to cancel? Or you have to predict they will hit you and be close then do the EX and a split secnd later they hit then you do the ultra?

If they don't hit it just does the EX move. That is what I'm getting off that..

So what in the case of Feurte he charges at you with EX.. you hit him with a fireball and he cancels that into an Ultra..

That would be.. insane?

 

[sixteen-bit]

Can you throw an opponent who is in a crouching state? Does it depend on the character's height?

 

[PhatSaqs]

Can you throw an opponent who is in a crouching state? Does it depend on the character's height?

Yes to the first no to the second. Throw ranges can vary by character tho. And then there're kara throws....

 

[sixteen-bit]

Yes to the first no to the second. Throw ranges can vary by character tho. And then there're kara throws....

That's so strange, I swear I've ducked under throws, I'm probably just barely out of range then.

 

[TurtleSnatcher]

That's so strange, I swear I've ducked under throws, I'm probably just barely out of range then.

Its that.. you will see them whiff because they either have a horrible throw range (the character they have) or you were just barely out of their range.

Happens pretty often. If I see that I usually stand right back up and throw them

 

[keanerie]

I've started parody-playing, choosing Ken and using only DP, choosing Akuma and standing in the corner flailing jabs and shorts even if I don't have meter...actually won a few matches with Ken, sadly enough

 

[Mr.Squirrel]

Well, he beat me because some players are VERY VERY GOOD at turtling.

But my point is he never made an offensive move.

And you can say "Oh, well he plays defensive. That's his game and he used it against you."

But it's unfair in the sense that if I did the same as him, time would run out.

He's not engaging a fight.

"Oh, but he's forcing you to play his game and by that blah blah blah"

That's just it. I HAVE to play his game now if I want to even have a fight. I HAVE to come at him in the corner. Either that or I say, "You know what, you come at me and I'll wait in the corner too until time expires."

It's not an equal fight now. NO MATTER WHAT I DO I'M PLAYING ON HIS TERMS (because he'd keep dodging and running to the other side of the screen). And he didn't out skill me to get to that place or something like that, either. That's why it's scrubby. He didn't turn the match in his favor -- it STARTED in his favor.

lol i dont think the match started in his favor, i just think he was that much better than you and it burrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrns

 

[bob_arctor]

This is the best explanation that I've seen. It's sort of an armored EX option-select startup-cancel.

But you can't even see the hint of an armored EX move being done in that link that was posted--are all the frames nullified as soon as you cancel to the Ultra?? It looks instantaneous:

http://www.versuscity.net/2009/03/05/missing-parries-in-sf4/

 

[iam220]

That's so strange, I swear I've ducked under throws, I'm probably just barely out of range then.

If while you're ducking, you do a medium or fierce attack then the throw will connect. That's what I've noticed.

 

[bob_arctor]

lol i dont think the match started in his favor, i just think he was that much better than you and it burrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrns

:lol You guys are brutal. But I feel his pain. It's annoying as fuck to fight against moon-walkers: soon as the round starts, they're sliding their asses backwards. The worst is when they use big types like 'Gief and still play keep away. Like I've mentioned on here before--just gotta mess with them. Bait them into attacking. Mimic them until they get annoyed. Or just use Abel and make quick and easy work of them.

 

[CPS2]

CartridgeBlower, which character were you using? For the moment I've found that if Blanka has EX meter vs Chun, she can't really move forward very easily. If I have a lead I'd rather wait for them to fuck up, and if the time runs out then I let it happen.

 

[gutter_trash]

more likely achievement/trophy whoring, probably needed that win with time expired medal...

NO!
FindMyFarms is a very composed patient player and plays it smart and he is very good.

Players need adapt to the situation that you are put in character match-ups and styles.

I can't spam HP Sumo Headbutt his Balrog because I am easy to punish on block.
I can't full screen Bison Headstomp his Sagat when he not doing any Tiger Shots.

Adapting is part of the fight.

Honda needs to inch closer without spamming a Balrog with diligence.
Bison needs to psych out with fake outs, Devil Reverse, poke and blabla

people should be more adaptive

 

[levious]

NO!
FindMyFarms is a very composed patient player and plays it smart and he is very good.

Players need adapt to the situation that you are put in character match-ups and styles.

I wasn't referring to FindMyFarms... I was talking about Cartridge's story.

 

[CPS2]

I've started parody-playing, choosing Ken and using only DP, choosing Akuma and standing in the corner flailing jabs and shorts even if I don't have meter...actually won a few matches with Ken, sadly enough

I did this to Nemesis and he didn't get it :lol

 

[gutter_trash]

I wasn't referring to FindMyFarms... I was talking about Cartridge's story.

ooops sorry

 

[GalacticAE]

I got a message last night from a guy complaining that I'll I do was wait for him to attack then hit him. My Balrog can be pretty patient so a lot of people get angry when I play defensively. I just don't see why people want me to jump around and get hit by their attacks. I don't really take big risks with charge characters and try to stay safe most of the time.

 

[PhatSaqs]

I got a message last night from a guy complaining that I'll I do was wait for him to attack then hit him. My Balrog can be pretty patient so a lot of people get angry when I play defensively. I just don't see why people want me to jump around and get hit by their attacks. I don't really take big risks with charge characters and try to stay safe most of the time.

Some people are just sore losers and think the game should be played by some house rule they thought up. Dont make excuses for the way you play.

 

[Dave Long]

You can't really complain about people playing charge characters turtling up on you because part of playing those types of characters is always pushing down, down-back or back all the time. Good ones will be using down-back or back all the time and constantly blocking you and counter-attacking.

That's how I get a lot of wins with my Bison (Dictator). I'm waiting for all you Shoto scrubs to start fireballing so I can stomp your heads.

 

[Killa Sasa]

You can't really complain about people playing charge characters turtling up on you because part of playing those types of characters is always pushing down, down-back or back all the time. Good ones will be using down-back or back all the time and constantly blocking you and counter-attacking.

That's how I get a lot of wins with my Bison (Dictator). I'm waiting for all you Shoto scrubs to start fireballing so I can stomp your heads.

Exactly. The only time most charge characters let go of their charge is when jumping up or forward, or the instant their attack starts. After that, it's b or db. Gotta keep combos going somehow. If you can't beat a turtle, you aren't doing it right. Every gameplan has a weakness.

 

[bob_arctor]

You can't really complain about people playing charge characters turtling up on you because part of playing those types of characters is always pushing down, down-back or back all the time. Good ones will be using down-back or back all the time and constantly blocking you and counter-attacking.

That's how I get a lot of wins with my Bison (Dictator). I'm waiting for all you Shoto scrubs to start fireballing so I can stomp your heads.

Although if I could have ever gotten charge-partitoning down in 3rd Strike, it would have opened up a whole new level of terror on my opponents. *sigh*

 

[sixteen-bit]

Although if I could have ever gotten charge-partitoning down in 3rd Strike, it would have opened up a whole new level of terror on my opponents. *sigh*

Actually, there is no CP in SF4.

Spoiler

charge partitioning you pervs

 

[haunts]

Sooo not sure if any of you live in the South East and are going to attend Final Round next weekend, but I interviewed ShinBlanka, the dude who organizes it and who ultimately got me into competitive play in the first place. Check it out!

Final Round 12: Interview with ShinBlanka

 

[bob_arctor]

Actually, there is no CP in SF4.

Spoiler

charge partitioning you pervs

Yeah, figured there wasn't. Just as well for my non-partitioning ass. It's like the one thing
that I can't do in SF in any consistent manner. Bah.

 

[Freshmaker]

Like I said, he was a good player.

He was GOOD at turtling and moving when I came at him. That was his game, after all. He had around 3800 BPs.

It's just that turtlers FORCE YOU to play their game, hence why they always have an advantage. START with an advantage, like a handicap. That was the point I was trying to get across.

Depends on how you look at it. A criminal barricaded in a house is hard to root out. However, from his perspective, it's only a matter of time until the cops break in. He's there because he has no other options from his perspective. Not because it's the preferred place to be.

 

[Spy]

A bit off topic but this is why I love you GAF.

Street Fighter IV thread on GameFAQs:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.php?board=943711&topic=48448600

 

[kuYuri]

I've run into one guy (a Ken) who uses kara-throws. Ugh. :/

 

[slidewinder]

But you can't even see the hint of an armored EX move being done in that link that was posted--are all the frames nullified as soon as you cancel to the Ultra?? It looks instantaneous:

http://www.versuscity.net/2009/03/05/missing-parries-in-sf4/

Basically. There's a small window between when an EX move begins and when the game actually deducts a stock for it. An opponent's hit as to land within this window for the cancel to happen at all.

I don't think anybody knows for sure exactly how big that window is, but it sounds like it's just the first couple or maybe few startup frames.

 

[GalacticAE]

I wish I could make it to FR this year. Shinblanka is cool people.