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[Minsc]

What's always confused me a bit about the pinball emulation scene is the apparent lack of copyright enforcement over the ROMs. Normally, I'd equate it to piracy, but I'm just not 100% sure that's correct. You have hugely popular, well-known sites like IPDB.org distributing the ROMs, and I'd think the copyright holders would go after them... but they don't.

It's obviously NeoGAF policy to ban discussion about piracy, and with FarSight selling the licensed tables for money, and IPDB.org giving them away for free... I'm a little confused. But there seems to be no action by anyone to actually enforce any copyrights and take down content, so I'll just remain neutral for now, at least.

I do know people use the two programs for custom table creation, and that's at least a legal use. From what I've tried of the programs myself, I never really found them too impressive. They crash like crazy, have a horrible amount of options to setup, and are generally a huge pain in the ass compared to PinballFX or Pinball Arcade. I guess if you spend 100s of hours setting them up on $1000+ custom tables there's a good payoff, but for casual play, I really couldn't ever be bothered, and I'm fairly versed with modding games too.

 

[nicoga3000]

What's always confused me a bit about the pinball emulation scene is the apparent lack of copyright enforcement over the ROMs. Normally, I'd equate it to piracy, but I'm just not 100% sure that's correct. You have hugely popular, well-known sites like IPDB.org distributing the ROMs, and I'd think the copyright holders would go after them... but they don't.

It's obviously NeoGAF policy to ban discussion about piracy, and with FarSight selling the licensed tables for money, and IPDB.org giving them away for free... I'm a little confused. But there seems to be no action by anyone to actually enforce any copyrights and take down content, so I'll just remain neutral for now, at least.

I do know people use the two programs for custom table creation, and that's at least a legal use. From what I've tried of the programs myself, I never really found them too impressive. They crash like crazy, have a horrible amount of options to setup, and are generally a huge pain in the ass compared to PinballFX or Pinball Arcade. I guess if you spend 100s of hours setting them up on $1000+ custom tables there's a good payoff, but for casual play, I really couldn't ever be bothered, and I'm fairly versed with modding games too.

Should we be more careful about speaking on virtual pinball? We're not discussing pirating tables for TPA or Pinball FX, but like you said, it CAN be confusing. The better question might be what CAN we discuss so we don't get ourselves in trouble?

 

[Shaneus]

Yeah, I'm happy to ease up on pinball emulation discussion (or at least, ROMs and where to get them) if you like. I certainly don't want to tread on any toes in the slightest.

I believe the ROMs posted on IPDB and such are less for emulation purposes and more if people want to burn the EPROMs for themselves. I know there are some cases where copyright has been enforced, specifically for the P2K titles SWEP1 and RFM.

 

[twinturbo2]

Basically, its coming, but its on the back burner as they push to get things fixed and do the Xbone port. They said closer to the end of the year is when you'll see Pinball After Dark, the pinball arcade for the digital pinball table systems, and other such projects

As long as they get the Playboy tables (the 2002 Stern one has actual nudity even!), then this endeavor will be worth it.

 

[snaffles]

Has anyone got all the wizard goals for High Speed yet? The only one that has been giving me trouble is the 250K for one ramp. The rest of them I just got from normal play, I didn't seem to have to target them.

 

[twinturbo2]

Has anyone got all the wizard goals for High Speed yet? The only one that has been giving me trouble is the 250K for one ramp. The rest of them I just got from normal play, I didn't seem to have to target them.

I have the same problem here.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Basically, its coming, but its on the back burner as they push to get things fixed and do the Xbone port. They said closer to the end of the year is when you'll see Pinball After Dark, the pinball arcade for the digital pinball table systems, and other such projects

Pinball After Dark is coming guys, it's coming! And so is the DirectX 11 patch, and, and so is the TAF Kickstarter, and it's going to be awesome!

 

[eggwolio]

This is probably pretty far off topic, but I sold a PS4 and The Pinball Arcade today to Mike Modano who used to play for the Dallas Stars and the Detroit Red Wings. That was pretty neat. Working retail is weird sometimes.

 

[Shaneus]

Huh, that's bizarre! No idea who that is, but if he used to play pro hockey, why wouldn't he just buy the real machines?

Edit: Thinking about it, hockey isn't too dissimilar to pinball. There you go.

 

[vg260]

Pinball After Dark is coming guys, it's coming! And so is the DirectX 11 patch, and, and so is the TAF Kickstarter, and it's going to be awesome!

I've been pretty patient, but am getting really frustrated waiting for tables (season 2) on the PS4 and PS4 overlooked issue fixes like rumble and sound and DX11 PC (mostly). It sucks them pushing out the Xbox One port is delaying things even more.

I did get a PS4 update last night though. It just said "various fixes" in the update history on the PS4 dash option menu. Gee, thanks guys.

 

[BobTheFork]

Well I got waxed in the main tournament. I still did 3rd in the solid state tourney, so a few bux and some ranking points.

Honestly, the difference was me buying pinbot on PBA and getting my rules down. I ended up winning several games on Pinbot because I knew the best way to get quick easy points. So big thanks to the devs for that.

I know I've been down on PBA in general because I play so much real pinball and it feels off to me. However, you can really see the love going into recreating the tables. I love that it's popular and more people are learning not just about that tables but the people who make them. It has increased interest and that always welcome in such a niche hobby. I'm very passionate about pinball and I hope they can continue making famous table and rare classics available to everyone.

IFPA world championships are in a month. I'll be starting a new job by then so I don't know what I will be able to do. There will be tournaments every day the week before, culminating with a huge tournament in Lyons, and then IFPA.

I plan on getting use of a video camera to show the locations and some of the World's best players.

 

[nicoga3000]

I wish there were more tourneys locally. Or even places to play near me.

Having said that, even though virtual tables are not a good substitute for the "real feel" of a pin, they're fantastic for learning rules and scoring tricks. Smart move to buy Pin*Bot on TPA before playing. I love that table, even if I have no idea how to approach it!

Unrelated to TPA, I'm now at the 3 week or less window for my TRON Pro to arrive.

Mods included:

- Cointaker LED's throughout the entire machine
- Speaker pro sound system
- Shaker Motor
- Tron Light up "Flynn's" sign
- Blue LED kickout flasher
- Buckwerkz Pinball audio adapter
- Cliffy ramp, kickout and select switch slot Protectors
- Play field Plastic protector set
- Flipper bat mods
- UV proof cover
- Tron metal keychain
- Pinball life Mirror balls
- Hallmark Lightcycles (not installed)

Mods purchased:
- Eli's Ramp Kit
- Laser cut rails and hinges (will be powdercoated this week)
- New legs (will be powdercoated this week)
- New Pop Bumper caps
- Chick translite (which means I will have all 3)
- 3.1 Arcade Mod on order
- DK Pinball’s FTS-8 splitter board on order

The build up is frustrating yet exciting. I've been watching so many play videos and listening to so much TRON Legacy music. I've already started reading up on how to change the music, too. The only mod I have to still buy (eventually) is the ColorDMD. Since that runs $400, I'm going to wait a while before I pull that trigger. I'll also have to work on wiring the Lightcycles since I'm not entirely sure how to do that.

Gawd damn, TRON.

 

[Gillian Seed]

This is probably pretty far off topic, but I sold a PS4 and The Pinball Arcade today to Mike Modano who used to play for the Dallas Stars and the Detroit Red Wings. That was pretty neat. Working retail is weird sometimes.

That's pretty cool. He must enjoy some Pinball. We need that sound fix asap!

 

[Shaneus]

Decided what colour to get the rails, nicoga? If it was me, I wouldn't get them coloured.. have a feeling that blue ones would make it look overly blue. I'd stick with black, and light the cutout logo blue

I had another idea as well: I saw a photo of someone's machine and they had that light-blue colour flipper rubbers to match the game. Better idea: Get one blue and one orange to match the corresponding lightcycle (I think there's one blue and one orange right near the flippers, yes?). Hopefully it'd look good and of course, be damn cheap.

Still deciding on whether to get that RBION or not. I think I have room in my flat if I do some serious arranging (ditch the TV in my bedroom that I never watch), but I just don't know if the feel of the table comes close to resembling current Stern titles (at least, moreso than 90s WMS tables) for me to practise on... because that's the primary reason I'm getting it.

I do think it'll hold it's value though as a sleeper TZ-kinda clone, so worst case is I sell it for what it costs. Feels like $3k-ish (should be able to talk him down to that, it's been advertised for a few weeks now) is a good price for a HUO one even though it does have a bit of wear around the scoop and magnet.

 

[nicoga3000]

Decided what colour to get the rails, nicoga? If it was me, I wouldn't get them coloured.. have a feeling that blue ones would make it look overly blue. I'd stick with black, and light the cutout logo blue

I had another idea as well: I saw a photo of someone's machine and they had that light-blue colour flipper rubbers to match the game. Better idea: Get one blue and one orange to match the corresponding lightcycle (I think there's one blue and one orange right near the flippers, yes?). Hopefully it'd look good and of course, be damn cheap.

Still deciding on whether to get that RBION or not. I think I have room in my flat if I do some serious arranging (ditch the TV in my bedroom that I never watch), but I just don't know if the feel of the table comes close to resembling current Stern titles (at least, moreso than 90s WMS tables) for me to practise on... because that's the primary reason I'm getting it.

I do think it'll hold it's value though as a sleeper TZ-kinda clone, so worst case is I sell it for what it costs. Feels like $3k-ish (should be able to talk him down to that, it's been advertised for a few weeks now) is a good price for a HUO one even though it does have a bit of wear around the scoop and magnet.

These are the flippers he has installed already - standard flippers with neat flipper tops. I kind of like them.

And yeah, I really like the blue. This is what it will look like:

Blue DMD will come!

And regarding RBION, I think it's always been perceived as a really great machine for the value. If it's a table you enjoy, it's a killer deal - DMD era game with a super deep ruleset and challenging but fun layout. I can't think of many other pins that have all of those for that price. Hell, most DMD games run ~$3k. If you've got space and like the game, $3k is a really great deal (even for the states).

E: Upon reading your post again, the idea of the pin being similar to newer Sterns...That's tough. I feel like newer Stern titles play a lot faster and more "in your face" than older titles do.

Look at games like TRON, Star Trek, MET. Hell, even Mustang to an extent (from what I've seen...). They all play with an arcade-y edge. Something like X-Men plays more like the older Sterns I think - LotR style game. A little slower, much deeper, involved...Kind of like an RPG I guess? RBION is probably more on that level.

That's my opinion of course. If you're in a position to find a newer Stern for a fair price, it wouldn't be a terrible idea to force yourself to set aside a few hundred bucks a week until you've got that extra. Also, most newer Sterns will probably hold their value in the current market. I think the exception would be Mustang Pro. Give that one some time to level out and see more play...Once that happens, I'm sure we'll have a better feel for the market value on it.

 

[Shaneus]

Hm, thanks for that... gives me something to think about. I know the new Sterns are a lot faster overall, but I'm thinking solely in terms of the flipper mechs and the ability to live catch, post-pass, that sort of thing. The old ones use the same rebuild kits as the new ones, so I hope it's safe to assume they have the same snappiness/response.

But depth shouldn't be an issue, though. I know newer Sterns have a habit of excessive depth with fewer shots (look at AC/DC, that intimidates the hell out of me) but I think RBION's depth is from having a variety of shots *and* stuff to do with them. There's depth, but far less confusion/complication compared to what Lyman's pushing out these days. Just a shame I can't get anything even a little bit newer without having to fork out heaps... even Batman is something I wouldn't mind, but it's about $2k more at least and feels a lot more like current Sterns than RBION does (from what I can gather).



I like what's been done with the LED colours under the ball guides... really nice look. But still, don't go past getting some of these puppies. Blue on the left, orange on the right.

PS. Why stick with a blue-only DMD? Synched with Eli's ramp mod or just matched with the speakers.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Played some Tron in Vegas at the Hall of Fame there. Beautiful table. Was somewhat beat up (like most of their tables) but the ramps are awesome to hit.

 

[nicoga3000]

Hm, thanks for that... gives me something to think about. I know the new Sterns are a lot faster overall, but I'm thinking solely in terms of the flipper mechs and the ability to live catch, post-pass, that sort of thing. The old ones use the same rebuild kits as the new ones, so I hope it's safe to assume they have the same snappiness/response.

But depth shouldn't be an issue, though. I know newer Sterns have a habit of excessive depth with fewer shots (look at AC/DC, that intimidates the hell out of me) but I think RBION's depth is from having a variety of shots *and* stuff to do with them. There's depth, but far less confusion/complication compared to what Lyman's pushing out these days. Just a shame I can't get anything even a little bit newer without having to fork out heaps... even Batman is something I wouldn't mind, but it's about $2k more at least and feels a lot more like current Sterns than RBION does (from what I can gather).



I like what's been done with the LED colours under the ball guides... really nice look. But still, don't go past getting some of these puppies. Blue on the left, orange on the right.

PS. Why stick with a blue-only DMD? Synched with Eli's ramp mod or just matched with the speakers.

I should have said I'm getting a ColorDMD (which is what's used in those videos). It's sick awesome...Just expensive at the moment. Soon!

And yeah, you're in a tough spot. TRON is not a deep game, but most people have only been to Portal a handful of times, and fewer have completed it (Pinsiders were talking about in the 1000+ games they have, 2 or 3 of those have been a full Portal Multiball completion, haha). AC/DC is similar - I don't think it's a deep game, but it's (as you said) super intimidating. Star Trek and MET are climbing the ranks quick, too.

A newer Stern is going to feel the most like newer (and future) Sterns than older titles will. I know that sounds dumb, but you know what I mean. RBION will feel much more like a newer Stern than say, your High Speed...But it won't feel like you're playing MET.

Back to your first statement...Can you do a flipper rebuild to give them more snap? That might actually help speed up the game a bit (as well as pitching it a bit closer to 7 vs 6 degrees).

E: I love that the ColorDMD uses an LCD-style panel vs actual dot display. The smooth lines are sort of incredible. Also, I get so pumped when Quorra multiball starts and everything goes purple for a minute. Siiiiick.

Played some Tron in Vegas at the Hall of Fame there. Beautiful table. Was somewhat beat up (like most of their tables) but the ramps are awesome to hit.

With the Eli kit (or the LE with pre-lit ramps), hitting a ramp and seeing them flash or change color or whatever...So clutch. And like Shaneus posted, if you tie the ColorDMD into the ramps, you can get some CRAZY effects! TRON plays fast and buttery smooth. The music just makes it that much better.

 

[Shaneus]

Back to your first statement...Can you do a flipper rebuild to give them more snap? That might actually help speed up the game a bit (as well as pitching it a bit closer to 7 vs 6 degrees).

Before I close the deal on RBION (should I decide to get it), I'm thinking I might do my flipper rebuild on HS this Easter weekend. I bought a Fliptronic (as in, flipper mechs from early-mid 90s WMS games) rebuild kit which is supposed to be awesome as shit for System 11 titles, maybe that'll make enough of a difference to improve my play. Bit of effort, but it's certainly cheaper than buying a whole machine!

But if you're talking about rebuilding the flippers on the RBION, I'd probably wind up doing that. People on Pinside have mentioned using LotR coils on it for a bit of extra kick, so maybe they'll have that feel I'm looking for. Problem is, it's hard to say exactly what it is that contributes to said "feel". Is it the coil strength? Type of buttons? Mechs? Age? Software/hardware (as in, SAM or Whitestar)?

Fake edit: Just found a thread on Pinside advertising a HUO Ripley's for $3300 *US*. So guessing that basically the same price for one in Australia is at least a somewhat decent deal. And it has similar wear around the saucer with ~500 plays, so that puts some fears to rest at least that it *wasn't* HUO.

 

[nicoga3000]

Yeah, HUO RBION for $3k is a great deal it sounds like.

In honor of you, I just put 5 games of RBION on TPA to try and get a feel for it in relation to the physical pins I've played. RBION feels more like X-Men in the layout and "stuff". However, it definitely doesn't flow like a Borg or other modern Stern. It feels a little bit more segmented. Take that how you will.

I bet superbands would give some snap to the ball which may speed the game up a little. But really, I'm not sure that's what's missing. RBION certainly gives more than an older Bally/Williams title will in terms of preparation for Stern based tourneyments.

If you want to play a modern Stern, buy a more modern game. But since we all know that tourney play revolves around a lot more than just Borg era Stern games, RBION is a great game to compliment your HS.

 

[Shaneus]

If you want to play a modern Stern, buy a more modern game. But since we all know that tourney play revolves around a lot more than just Borg era Stern games, RBION is a great game to compliment your HS.

Bang on with pretty much your entire post, but unfortunately, tourney play in Australia (at least, in Melbourne) for the time being pretty much does revolve around Borg-era Stern titles But speaking of machines in general, I think RBION would be a great game to compliment HS. It's not quite as tricky or confusing as TZ, and the depth doesn't come from baffling the shit out of people and crowding a playfield with IMO too much stuff to hit (or the same amount, but not making it clear enough).

Am I right in my assessment? I'm saying this having played TZ a number of times in Texas (I really tried to like it, mostly because Nate was there) but didn't think to fire up Ripley's until recently so I've only played that on PC.

Brings me to another conundrum: The only two games I don't own for TPA on iOS is RBION and HD. Can't buy RBION individually, need to buy it with the other three base tables... for $10.99AUD :/ Might see if someone on the forums can get me a free code or something.

 

[Mutagenic]

I've been too busy to play lately, but does anyone knwow what the PS4 patch addresses other than 'various bug fixes'?

 

[nicoga3000]

Bang on with pretty much your entire post, but unfortunately, tourney play in Australia (at least, in Melbourne) for the time being pretty much does revolve around Borg-era Stern titles But speaking of machines in general, I think RBION would be a great game to compliment HS. It's not quite as tricky or confusing as TZ, and the depth doesn't come from baffling the shit out of people and crowding a playfield with IMO too much stuff to hit (or the same amount, but not making it clear enough).

Am I right in my assessment? I'm saying this having played TZ a number of times in Texas (I really tried to like it, mostly because Nate was there) but didn't think to fire up Ripley's until recently so I've only played that on PC.

Brings me to another conundrum: The only two games I don't own for TPA on iOS is RBION and HD. Can't buy RBION individually, need to buy it with the other three base tables... for $10.99AUD :/ Might see if someone on the forums can get me a free code or something.

That's the interesting part here - the AU scene is so different from the US scene in terms of competitive play. You've watched the PAPA tourneys and would agree that the spread is HUGE. It makes sense that AU stuff is more modern as it's probably easier to get those games as they come out (easier now than it ever has been I imagine).

And yeah, TZ is a weird game. I don't hate it, but I don't love it. I don't melt at the site of a gorgeous TZ like I would a pimped out TOTAN or TOM (both of which I find more enjoyable to play than TZ). I personally feel like RBION has more going on than TZ, but that's partially because I don't fully understand all of TZ (or RBION for that matter). I like the number of shots available in RBION, though. I think I've visited all the continents once on TPA, and it felt sort of awesome!

And how do you have the other tables on TPA but not RBION? Seems all sorts of weird how that worked out!

 

[Plinko]

Not quite understanding the "Pinball After Dark" push.

Are there really THAT many pinball games that contain questionable material? Are they saving stuff like Tales from the Crypt for it to increase the library? It just doesn't make much sense, I guess.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Not quite understanding the "Pinball After Dark" push.

Are there really THAT many pinball games that contain questionable material? Are they saving stuff like Tales from the Crypt for it to increase the library? It just doesn't make much sense, I guess.

I'd settle for the uncensored versions of MM and Scared Stiff. The playboy table is awful. Beyond that who knows, they probably need to meet a lot of content restrictions to stay on Nintendo/Apple platforms.

 

[plagiarize]

I'd settle for the uncensored versions of MM and Scared Stiff. The playboy table is awful. Beyond that who knows, they probably need to meet a lot of content restrictions to stay on Nintendo/Apple platforms.

we have the uncensored version of MM. the one that actually has the swearing in it, is a mod, not how the original table is. I love having Scared Stiff uncensored in pro mode. no regrets buying that!

 

[Gentleman Jack]

we have the uncensored version of MM.

Oh, we have the saucy damsel's lines intact? Because I thought that was cut.

(saucy wench) "That dragon is big! But I bet you're bigger!" (sheesh)
"Is that a sword in your pocket?"
"I've got a reward for you..." "Now, now, now!" "Go, go, go!"
"Take me, I'm yours." (boy oh boy)
"Not now, I have a headache!" (oh darn)
"I always knew that someday my prince would come."

 

[Shaneus]

That's the interesting part here - the AU scene is so different from the US scene in terms of competitive play. You've watched the PAPA tourneys and would agree that the spread is HUGE. It makes sense that AU stuff is more modern as it's probably easier to get those games as they come out (easier now than it ever has been I imagine).

And yeah, TZ is a weird game. I don't hate it, but I don't love it. I don't melt at the site of a gorgeous TZ like I would a pimped out TOTAN or TOM (both of which I find more enjoyable to play than TZ). I personally feel like RBION has more going on than TZ, but that's partially because I don't fully understand all of TZ (or RBION for that matter). I like the number of shots available in RBION, though. I think I've visited all the continents once on TPA, and it felt sort of awesome!

And how do you have the other tables on TPA but not RBION? Seems all sorts of weird how that worked out!

Not only is the AU scene different from the US scene, the Melbourne (Victoria, southern state) scene is positively tiny compared to the NSW (where Sydney is, Victoria's northerly neighbour) one. Look at the IFPA scores between the top Vic and NSW players... and the number of tournaments (if possible). Melbourne only has one and a bit (the "bit" isn't an IFPA-approved one) a month, and that main one is at a pub where they only have two machines. NSW has stacks (from what I can gather) AND they have several locations with a wide variety of machines. I'm pretty sure that outside of one place that sells/repairs machines as a business (so it's not really an arcade, they only have an open floor once a month) there are zero locations that have more than four machines.

Only reason I can think of is that because of their relative scarcity down here, people just buy them and have them in their homes. But yeah, I think NSW is a lot closer to US-levels of comps and locations compared to where I live now.

As for having all the tables but not RBION, that stems from my initial shunning of Stern tables on TPA (back when we could buy individual tables). I doubt there'll ever be a case where I want to buy HD ever, but RBION I really should've ponied up for in hindsight.

It's interesting, reading the rules/instructions in TPA for RBION... it comes off a LOT easier to grasp the concept of than TZ. You hit that vari-target to start a country, each country has different goals and if you complete those goals you get a RIPLEYS letter. Get all the letters, light the "?" location (Spoiler alert: Atlantis). Some modes have multiballs, some don't. There's stacking involved somehow, but beyond that I don't understand how it's supposedly more complicated than TZ. At least it's infinitely more inviting and easier to grasp the basic concepts to start with than TZ.

There's probably a LOT more to it than that (I'd put my life on it) but that the core of it can be explained that easily yet TZ is still confusing as hell (to me) says a lot.

Me playing TZ:

More I think about it, more I think I'll take the plunge on RBION. Drop in the LotR coils, put it on a stupid-steep angle and then it should serve as something good to practice both my stop-go game and Stern games in general.

I'd settle for the uncensored versions of MM and Scared Stiff. The playboy table is awful. Beyond that who knows, they probably need to meet a lot of content restrictions to stay on Nintendo/Apple platforms.

Tables we're likely to get in After Dark (stemming from theories I've read on PAF):
* Jack*Bot (Gambling theme)
* Xenon (Dem pop bumpers)
* Family Mode off for Scared Stiff, MM (if it isn't already, not sure)
* Swearing ROMs, if they're official (I know they were made for T2, STTNG and Demo Man in-house, but not sure if they're condoned by WMS) (They were made especially for the machines when they were given to the actors who appeared on/in them a la Wesley Snipes and Stallone for DM, Patrick Stewart et. al. for TNG, Arnie for T2 and so on)
* Playboy machines (again, not great, but could be a possible target for them)
* Diamond Lady (Gambling)
* Night Moves (Disco, picking up women maybe) (I just want this game in there!)
* BIG BANG BAR!!!
* Future Spa?
* South Park
* Flipper Football has an "adult" mode. Likely uses same CPU/MPU as BBB, could be a contender.
* Woah Nellie!/Big Juicy Melons (A boutique game but definitely adult-themed)

My guess is that they wouldn't do PAD if they didn't have at least one or two *massive* tables to announce for it. And if I had to bet, I'd say Big Bang Bar is one of them. Jack*Bot is possibly another... but more obvious is the Playboy ones.


Fuck. Apols for the wall of text, guys.

 

[nicoga3000]

Walls of text are awesome in this thread...It's fun to read about pinball.

The AU scene sounds crazy. It sort of makes sense, though. The scarcity of games drives the scene. And the cost of older machines drives the competitive scene. At this point, the only way to get older games is almost exclusively through private sales. It's a BITCH to ship overseas unless you're familiar with it (particularly with large items like pins). Stern has that down to a science, so it only makes sense that a majority of the pins that will be popping up will be newer Sterns. The exception to this is, of course, container ships...But you've got no real way of dealing with what shows up on those.

I've been to Atlantis on RBION once. It was a weird moment where I wasn't entirely sure what just happened, ha. I think the game is growing on me in terms of what's going on. If I could find a cheap one, I would probably consider adding one to my collection some day. The rules are deep enough, the game flows in it's own special way, and I really dig the modes. It only dawned on me yesterday how many multiballs there are in that game. I don't know the exact number, but I feel like there are at least 3?

Also, still trying to figure out what Pinball After Dark is.

 

[Endo Punk]

This game is a delight to play, got it free on PS4 and thought I'd mess about with it. 2 hours laters and I was still playing and that's just with the free table you get. Any other tables you guys recommend I check out?

 

[nicoga3000]

This game is a delight to play, got it free on PS4 and thought I'd mess about with it. 2 hours laters and I was still playing and that's just with the free table you get. Any other tables you guys recommend I check out?

Completely my own opinion, but these are my suggestions. Before I continue, I am an advocate of buying the Season Passes (not the Pro upgrades). The bang for your buck is killer. But just in case you want to cherry pick...And assuming you already have the Core Pack (which it doesn't sound like you do, and you should because Theater of Magic and Ripley's are both a blast)...

Season 1

• Medieval Madness
• Bride of Pin*Bot
• Taxi
• Twilight Zone
• Star Trek: The Next Generation
• Attack from Mars

Season 2

• Cactus Canyon
• White Water
• Pin*Bot
• The Champion Pub
• Terminator 2

Those are tables I would suggest to someone who isn't a huge pinball nut. Obviously something like Cirqus Voltaire, Fun House, and Creature would be up there, too...But if you're just looking to dabble, you can't go wrong with any of those listed in Season 1. For what it's worth, if you ARE looking to just grab a few tables...

Medieval Madness and Attack from Mars should be the first two you grab. They're fantastic. From there, TZ and ST:TNG would be the next choice for deeper games, while BoP and Taxi would be your more "score based" players.

For Season 2, the only one I think a non-pinhead REALLY needs to consider would be T2, mostly because it's a classic movie and pin. The ones I listed would be what I consider fun for non-pinheads. White Water (WH20) is an interesting table with tons of ramps, loops, twists, and turns. Cactus Canyon is on there mostly because it's considered to be one of the rarest games out there...The fact that it was remade for TPA is great. It means mere plebs like myself can play it. I don't LOVE the table, but it's just one of those pieces of history things.

To be completely honest, I would pick a few from Season 1 first. Or just buy the Season 1 pass. Everything about S1 is great (except maybe Big Shot or Harley Davidson, but even those I can play for a few hours and still enjoy). S2 is definitely geared towards pinheads, though. I wouldn't really delve much into it unless you REALLY like S1.

 

[plagiarize]

Medieval Madness and Attack from Mars should be the first two you grab. They're fantastic. From there, TZ and ST:TNG would be the next choice for deeper games, while BoP and Taxi would be your more "score based" players.

personal opinion, don't grab MM and AFM first, just because they're so similar. Get one of those two, and then grab something else that plays differently, like ST:TNG, TZ or Creature.

 

[nicoga3000]

personal opinion, don't grab MM and AFM first, just because they're so similar. Get one of those two, and then grab something else that plays differently, like ST:TNG, TZ or Creature.

Yeah, I should have put MM or AFM. That would make more sense. I guess my implication was that those two games are wonderful and you can't go wrong with either!

 

[Gentleman Jack]

This game is a delight to play, got it free on PS4 and thought I'd mess about with it. 2 hours laters and I was still playing and that's just with the free table you get. Any other tables you guys recommend I check out?

Season 1: Table Packs 1,3,7,8,9.
Season 2: Table Packs 13 and 17.

Beyond that is probably 100% personal preference. If you really enjoyed Medieval Madness there's no reason to avoid getting Attack from Mars. I'm not a huge fan of most of the tables from Season Two, padded with overrated tables like Cactus Canyon, historical curiosities like Goin Nuts and genuinely bad tables like El Dorado.

 

[Shaneus]

Walls of text are awesome in this thread...It's fun to read about pinball.

The AU scene sounds crazy. It sort of makes sense, though. The scarcity of games drives the scene. And the cost of older machines drives the competitive scene. At this point, the only way to get older games is almost exclusively through private sales. It's a BITCH to ship overseas unless you're familiar with it (particularly with large items like pins). Stern has that down to a science, so it only makes sense that a majority of the pins that will be popping up will be newer Sterns. The exception to this is, of course, container ships...But you've got no real way of dealing with what shows up on those.

Yeah, the AU scene kinda sucks, unfortunately. I think mid-90s it was similar in popularity to the US (relatively), but machines would be more likely to fall in a state of disrepair (or at least lack of maintenance). Fast forward a few years, and these machines might get restored, but are more likely to wind up in private collections than back on route. End result: Less machines out in public, more in collectors homes or rotting away in sheds. Containers really are our best bet at getting more machines on our shores, but again... no-one's going to buy a shipped pin to put on route... 90% chance it'll go to a private buyer. So the situation stays the same, except there's one household of people who are less likely to hunt out/put coins into routed pins.

And like I said, it's stranger because NSW in particular seems to be quite different than other Australian states, like Victoria.

FWIW, the Pinheadz episode where Rod goes to the crate opening is in Victoria. Chances are, those pins are going to private owners. I'd love to see someone who makes money out of those shipping crates put a few of the "spare" ones out on route, but there's no way they'd make more money doing that than selling the machine to a single person for a moderate amount.

 

[nicoga3000]

Yeah, that Pinheadz episode was a lot of fun to listen to. I really enjoyed hearing the process of crate opening and the enthusiasm he had (it sounded like the other guys weren't AS enthusiastic, haha).

When they do a crate, is everything spoken for before it arrives, or can you go with cash and grab a game?

Also, RBION is REALLY growing on me...

 

[Gunstarheroes]

Season 1: Table Packs 1,3,7,8,9.
Season 2: Table Packs 13 and 17.

Beyond that is probably 100% personal preference. If you really enjoyed Medieval Madness there's no reason to avoid getting Attack from Mars. I'm not a huge fan of most of the tables from Season Two, padded with overrated tables like Cactus Canyon, historical curiosities like Goin Nuts and genuinely bad tables like El Dorado.

That may be my least favorite table in Pinball Arcade thus far. Its up there with Flight 2000 and Firepower.

 

[nicoga3000]

That may be my least favorite table in Pinball Arcade thus far. Its up there with Flight 2000 and Firepower.

Older tables are NOT for everyone. Goin' Nuts is pretty terrible...But some of those other ones (like El Dorado and Flight 2000) are neat games to play for basic point and shot control.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

That may be my least favorite table in Pinball Arcade thus far. Its up there with Flight 2000 and Firepower.

I like Firepower. If I had to be crushed to death by either a Flight 2000, Firepower or El Dorado machine, I'd choose Firepower. The sounds are really great.

El Dorado is just an uninteresting turd with awful, awful sound.

 

[BigWeather]

I wish they'd fix the cabinet art of Firepower.

 

[Gunstarheroes]

Older tables are NOT for everyone. Goin' Nuts is pretty terrible...But some of those other ones (like El Dorado and Flight 2000) are neat games to play for basic point and shot control.

Goin' Nuts and I are currently rivals, so i'm not ready to shit on it yet, lest karma come back to haunt me. Trying to finish up the last goal on that right now so that we are done forever. I do enjoy older tables like Gorgar a lot though.

 

[snaffles]

I really like El Dorado, I think it is just that i enjoy shooting down drop targets, same reason I enjoy playing Big Shot. I am not very good at either of them but find it really satisfying when I do manage to clear all the targets, more so than making ramp shots in the more modern games.

 

[Shaneus]

That may be my least favorite table in Pinball Arcade thus far. Its up there with Flight 2000 and Firepower.

You're a bad person and you should feel bad. Firepower is great! Especially considering the era, it was the first solid-state game to have multiball and also the first game ever to have lane-change via flipper.

There's something really weird about a lot of those early model games where they were setup on angles closer to EMs than modern-day machines. I've played some games on both and the older tables just don't work well at all when played slower. Both FP and Centaur are disappointing when setup like that, but when closer to newer angles (6ish degrees) they're infinitely more fun.

Yeah, that Pinheadz episode was a lot of fun to listen to. I really enjoyed hearing the process of crate opening and the enthusiasm he had (it sounded like the other guys weren't AS enthusiastic, haha).

When they do a crate, is everything spoken for before it arrives, or can you go with cash and grab a game?

Also, RBION is REALLY growing on me...

I think very few are spoken for, and rarely advertised publicly before they've been serviced and ready for sale. I mean, if you know the guy and the packers/senders have the game you're looking for then it's all good, but I don't think just anyone can ask (or maybe they can, but have to pay a fee on top of whatever).

I also believe there's no prices for any one machine when ordering... I believe it's just something like "$40k will get you X 1st-rate games (TAF, JP, Demo Man etc.), Y second-rate games (Flintstones, Who Dunnit blah blah)" and so on. Sometimes you choose, sometimes you don't.

Oh, and I'll be speaking to Rod pretty soon and likely making a small appearance on Pinheadz due to my trip to Texas

PS. I'm going to be buying Ripley's, aren't I? I feel bad for not bothering to even try it for this long, it's surprisingly good considering some of those woeful Stern games of the era.

 

[nicoga3000]

Yeah, RBION is fun. Just managed 92m, but never made it to Atlantis. I'm slowly starting to figure it out. The rules are still a bit confusing. I guess I could read about it...But the discovery is a blast!

 

[Shaneus]

Woo! The guy just bumped the thread and there's been (apparently) zero interest in the last week. Bargaining down to a flat $3k (or even $2800) should be a cinch Bit of a steal for a HUO pin, I reckon.

 

[nicoga3000]

Woo! The guy just bumped the thread and there's been (apparently) zero interest in the last week. Bargaining down to a flat $3k (or even $2800) should be a cinch Bit of a steal for a HUO pin, I reckon.

Hell yeah - a DMD HUO Stern for sub $3k? That would be sick!

 

[Endo Punk]

Thanks for the recommendations I'll be sure to give a few of those tables a try, if I can get myself away from the Arabian Knights one that is. BTW I bought the Twilight Zone ball but can't find it anywhere in the extras menu. Anyone know where it could be?
edit: nevermind I found it. Thought it would have a name on it, lol.

 

[nicoga3000]

Thanks for the recommendations I'll be sure to give a few of those tables a try, if I can get myself away from the Arabian Knights one that is. BTW I bought the Twilight Zone ball but can't find it anywhere in the extras menu. Anyone know where it could be?
edit: nevermind I found it. Thought it would have a name on it, lol.

TotAN is a great table. Once you save the princess, it sort of loses it's magic, though. It doesn't help that the bazaar can move you through the table goals so quick (collect 2 gems is insane). I LOVE the table, but I don't play it too much anymore. I find that you'll either have a mediocre run or an absolutely insane run. Like, once you dial in, there's a good chance you're going to hit wizard mode. It's not often I have a BAD run on TotAN.

Make sure you check out some of the other tables, though. You'll love them if you're having fun already!

 

[Endo Punk]

TotAN is a great table. Once you save the princess, it sort of loses it's magic, though. It doesn't help that the bazaar can move you through the table goals so quick (collect 2 gems is insane). I LOVE the table, but I don't play it too much anymore. I find that you'll either have a mediocre run or an absolutely insane run. Like, once you dial in, there's a good chance you're going to hit wizard mode. It's not often I have a BAD run on TotAN.

Make sure you check out some of the other tables, though. You'll love them if you're having fun already!

I have yet to save the princess. I get to 4-5 jewels and then choke every time.

 

[Shaneus]

Saving the princess is super easy once you remember that you literally have unlimited balls. Just don't worry about losing any balls down the middle and go nuts