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[ClosingADoor]

I can see why Farage didn't feel like working today. Juncker wasn't very nice when talking about him.



Has to be fun, to be able to further the European Union and its inhabitants by being vindictive.

Have you seen the way Farage talks about other people and especially against the EU leaders? No reason to be nice to Farage. If he dishes it out, he should be able to take it also.

 

[Zafir]

Same here. Though I get the point. You don't really learn too much about the wider world, but then I assume this is the case for most places.

Growing up I don't need to know about the Monroe Doctrine. Doesn't affect me and is nothing really all that important to Europeans.

Yeah. I imagine so.

I mean it's difficult really. You only have a finite amount of time to teach history and history is such a vast subject. It's only natural topics will be chosen which are more relevant to your country.

 

[blu]

1£ to 1.807€ thats the lowest right ?

Time to go shopping!

Not yet ..Stay on target.

 

[Beefy]

May 130
Leadsom 40
Gove 26
Crabb 22
Fox 7

http://www.conservativehome.com/par...mps-supporting-each-leadership-candidate.html

 

[Monty Mole]

Every UK school I've ever either studied at or worked in, at least at secondary level, begins and ends their history education with World War II. It's like the rest of british history, let alone European or wider-world, just doesn't exist. If you want to learn about that sort of stuff you need to catch it on BBC Four!

Utter bullshit. Complete and utter bullshit.

I didn't go to private school, and obviously WWI & WWII were covered early on, but also did Russian history including Tsar Nicholas, Lenin, Stalin, and American history too. Even covered Marxism and Ku Klux Klan.

Stop making things up.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

Every UK school I've ever either studied at or worked in, at least at secondary level, begins and ends their history education with World War II. It's like the rest of british history, let alone European or wider-world, just doesn't exist. If you want to learn about that sort of stuff you need to catch it on BBC Four!

Why are you lying? I went to a regular state school and from day 1 right up through GCSE's I studied everything from Vikings, to the Romans, to the North Atlantic Slave Trade, to the British Empire, to Prohibition America, to the cold war, to Vietnam, Nixon and Watergate...I could go on. We barely even touched WWI & II, relatively speaking.

Edited slightly because it appears I'm at outlier here. Damn.

 

[Carl2291]

Why are you lying?

I don't think he is.

We spent literally weeks, with a single lesson a week, discussing how hard it was to live on rations in the war.

 

[ferrasvansen]

In my school, history lessons went up until ww2 and stopped. Modern studies was the subject that covered the period 1945 onwards but that was in the 80s.

 

[Harmen]

Maybe there is a generational gap between some of you? I know over here (the Netherlands), our primary/secondary education tends to change fairly frequently in terms of subjects.

 

[GamerMax73]

obviously WWI & WWII were covered early on, but also did Russian history including Tsar Nicholas, Lenin, Stalin,

While I was obviously exaggerating slightly, and speaking from person experience (as noted in my very first sentence there) - please try and pick better examples that don't kind prove my point if your gonna jump down my throat

Just saying UK education, from my direct experience, can be a little narrow. I'll add to that by suggesting politics and economics should be mainstream subjects.

 

[daviyoung]

Why are you lying?

he is and he isn't

if you look at the curriculum for key stages 2 and 3 (secondary school), you'll see that every programme is based around Britain

teachers are allowed to pick certain subjects and examples in those that are not solely about Britain though

once you get to GCSE then you start to study "20th Century history" which brings about the Soviet Revolutions and the Cold War, but up until that point it's all very UK-centric

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

I don't think he is.

We spent literally weeks, with a single lesson a week, discussing how hard it was to live on rations in the war.

My school must be an outlier then. Jesus Christ. I shit you not when I say I studied all of the things listed in my last post between Year 7, right through to GCSE's. We even touched on the Tudors and Stuarts in Primary school.

he is and he isn't

if you look at the curriculum for key stages 2 and 3 (secondary school), you'll see that every programme is based around Britain

teachers are allowed to pick certain subjects and examples in those that are not solely about Britain though

once you get to GCSE then you start to study "20th Century history" which brings about the Soviet Revolutions and the Cold War, but up until that point it's all very UK-centric

Even before GCSE, I was learning about things like the North Atlantic Slave trade for over 3 months. I dunno. I guess I was just extremely lucky.

 

[itxaka]

There's no point in a re-vote as it's pretty much just forcing a vote to get the "right" answer, maybe the Government should jsut fess up say " we never had the intention to leave the EU because it's a terrible idea that would destroy our country.

eat the fucking humble pie.

lol meant to post this in the farrage thread...

I dunno, seems that the damage is already done to both the EU and UK. Should go for the exit and readmission asap. Going back now will mean probably a lot of political turmoil in the UK.

Would going back help people vote remain in the next referendum (Im assuming that if they go back, the 52% that voted will flock to any party that promises a referendum) or will it fuck up and divide things more in the UK?

 

[EdwardTeach]

Why are you lying? I went to a regular state school and from day 1 right up through GCSE's I studied everything from Vikings, to the Romans, to the North Atlantic Slave Trade, to the British Empire, to Prohibition America, to the cold war, to Vietnam, Nixon and Watergate...I could go on. We barely even touched WWI & II, relatively speaking. As Monty Mole says above, you're talking absolute bullshit.

Your school was unusual.

 

[Palculator]

Spoiler

Not sure I'd trust the FDP, though.

 

[7aged]

Spoiler

Not sure I'd trust the FDP, though.

I hear Berlin is a cool place. I might have to learn German

 

[GamerMax73]

My school must be an outlier then. Jesus Christ. I shit you not when I say I studied all of the things listed in my last post between Year 7, right through to GCSE's. We even touched on the Tudors and Stuarts in Primary school.



Even before GCSE, I was learning about the North Atlantic Slave trade for over 3 months. I dunno. I guess I was just extremely lucky.

From what I've seen primary school tend to be very good with short bursts of history around things like Saxons, Vikings, Stuart's, Tudors, etc - which is very good. Most take a very very local approach to history at this point.

But I've found a lot of secondary schools to be much more narrow. And especially at GCSE the focus becomes almost exclusively on the early 20th century with a major focus on the second war.

While I'm not suggesting it shouldn't be studied, I do think that nearly 100 years later it takes up a little too much curriculum time. Hell I'd like to see more focus on more recent history, not just the Romans, et al.

 

[ReplacementPelican]

My school must be an outlier then. Jesus Christ. I shit you not when I say I studied all of the things listed in my last post between Year 7, right through to GCSE's. We even touched on the Tudors and Stuarts in Primary school.



Even before GCSE, I was learning about things like the North Atlantic Slave trade for over 3 months. I dunno. I guess I was just extremely lucky.

I did too, and we learnt about Native North American history. It's weird seeing people say if was all British history.

 

[8bit]

I hear Berlin is a cool place. I might have to learn German

You could get by in Berlin for a while without knowing any German these days.

 

[Maedre]

Spoiler

Not sure I'd trust the FDP, though.

More trustworthy than every UK party.

 

[Palculator]

Here's the article about that truck, by the way:

A van displaying a large billboard is driving through London in a bid to tempt startups to move to Berlin.

Several well-known London technology startups — including the likes of business checker DueDil and customer service software provider Conversocial — have said they're considering opening up overseas offices following the result of the EU referendum, while the CEO of fintech firm TransferWise said Ireland, Switzerland, and others have contacted him about a potential move.

Berlin is widely regarded as one of the leading startup hubs in Europe. It is considerably cheaper than London and home to a growing number of young technology companies, including the likes of Rocket Internet, Wunderlist, and SoundCloud.

http://www.businessinsider.de/a-van...t-startups-to-move-to-berlin-2016-7?r=UK&IR=T

I hear Berlin is a cool place. I might have to learn German

Pretty sure you could "function" on English. By which I mean most of Berlin's businesses should be used to English speaking customers. The point where it becomes a problem, I think, is when you want to make some friends and hang out with actual native residents, the language barrier will be a bit of a hurdle.

 

[Monty Mole]

While I was obviously exaggerating slightly, and speaking from person experience (as noted in my very first sentence there) - please try and pick better examples that don't kind prove my point if your gonna jump down my throat

Just saying UK education, from my direct experience, can be a little narrow. I'll add to that by suggesting politics and economics should be mainstream subjects.

I'd love to know your reasoning behind why politics should be a mainstream subject at school.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

From what I've seen primary school tend to be very good with short bursts of history around things like Saxons, Vikings, Stuart's, Tudors, etc - which is very good. Most take a very very local approach to history at this point.

But I've found a lot of secondary schools to be much more narrow. And especially at GCSE the focus becomes almost exclusively on the early 20th century with a major focus on the second war.

While I'm not suggesting it shouldn't be studied, I do think that nearly 100 years later it takes up a little too much curriculum time. Hell I'd like to see more focus on more recent history, not just the Romans, et al.

Sorry I doubted you. I'll take your word for it, especially seeing as other people are saying the same thing. I just find it so surprising considering the breadth of subjects we studied in depth during my time at secondary school.

For all the shit people give the USA for being so American-centric in their historic education, sounds like we're just as bad over here. Damn.

I did too, and we learnt about Native North American history. It's weird seeing people say if was all British history.

Seriously, it's cray.

 

[Hasney]

I'd love to know your reasoning behind why politics should be a mainstream subject at school.

...The current situation we're in now? Some basic political and economic knowledge could have helped people to see how bad of an idea leaving the EU actually would be.

 

[War Peaceman]

I'd love to know your reasoning behind why politics should be a mainstream subject at school.

Civics is probably a more accurate term for what I suspect he means.

 

[Linkstrikesback]

I'd love to know your reasoning behind why politics should be a mainstream subject at school.

... You don't think it could benefit people in any way to have some understanding of politics, given the current situation?

 

[Orniletter]

Spoiler

Not sure I'd trust the FDP, though.

Look who is trying to be relevant again.

Seems...kind of...in poor taste.

 

[Fantastapotamus]

Sweet.

The school in England I applied for sent me an e-mail saying they won't accept any EU/EEA students this year or early next year while they are working out how to deal with Brexit. This is because the EU/EEA paid 10-15% of student fees and the school works with many schools around Europe.

They probably made that up. That's what you get for kicking England out of the Euro.

But seriously, that sucks. Sorry to hear that.

Has to be fun, to be able to further the European Union and its inhabitants by being vindictive.

Why is that vindictive?

 

[War Peaceman]

Look who is trying to be relevant again.

Seems...kind of...in poor taste.

Poor taste and uses the horribly embarrassing keep calm slogan. German humour I suppose

Sweet.

The school in England I applied for sent me an e-mail saying they won't accept any EU/EEA students this year or early next year while they are working out how to deal with Brexit. This is because the EU/EEA paid 10-15% of student fees and the school works with many schools around Europe.

Damn! Sorry about that!

I know at Nottingham they've promised to cover any costs for the forthcoming years if the circumstances change due to the referendum.

 

[Blue Lou]

Leadsom speaking in 2012:

The third issue on which I urge the Government to go further is regulation and red tape for businesses. The absolute, top priority, as Her Majesty said, is to get our economy going again, and nowhere more so than in the very small business sector. We must give young people and others who cannot find a job a direct and clear incentive to create one for themselves by starting a business. I urge the Government to look carefully at scrapping the entire burden of regulation on micro-businesses with, say, three employees or fewer. I envisage there being absolutely no regulation whatsoever—no minimum wage, no maternity or paternity rights, no unfair dismissal rights, no pension rights—for the smallest companies that are trying to get off the ground, in order to give them a chance. That would all change, however, as soon as the number of employees increased.

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2012-05-10b.208.0

 

[Monty Mole]

... You don't think it could benefit people in any way to have some understanding of politics, given the current situation?

Yes. But that doesn't mean it should be a mainstream subject. Doing Politics means less time doing mathematics and sciences - or even learning other languages. You can't just add a subject without taking something away, unless you way to extend learning hours but that's for another thread.

...The current situation we're in now? Some basic political and economic knowledge could have helped people to see how bad of an idea leaving the EU actually would be.

It shouldn't have been a decision for the people, it should have been a decision for the elected government. UKIP was the 'get out of the EU' option. And it should have ended there. But Cameron took a gamble to pull in UKIP voters. Prat.

 

[Orniletter]

Poor taste and uses the horribly embarrassing keep calm slogan. German humour I suppose

I missed the hitchhiker's reference.

Just eye-roll worthy.

 

[Joni]

Why is that vindictive?

Just seeing how the media will spin it.

 

[kmag]

Junior Doctors reject contract deal. So there's another crisis brewing.

 

[Mindwipe]

Junior Doctors reject contract deal. So there's another crisis brewing.

Luckily a strong government will deal with thi... oh.

 

[*Splinter]

Yes. But that doesn't mean it should be a mainstream subject. Doing Politics means less time doing mathematics and sciences - or even learning other languages. You can't just add a subject without taking something away, unless you way to extend learning hours but that's for another thread.

It shouldn't have been a decision for the people, it should have been a decision for the elected government. UKIP was the 'get out of the EU' option. And it should have ended there. But Cameron took a gamble to pull in UKIP voters. Prat.

We did Geography at secondary school. 3 years of coastal erosion.

And pottery. Fucking pottery.

 

[The Friendly Monster]

Pretty sure you could "function" on English. By which I mean most of Berlin's businesses should be used to English speaking customers. The point where it becomes a problem, I think, is when you want to make some friends and hang out with actual native residents, the language barrier will be a bit of a hurdle.

Not really, the younger generation is so multicultural that English is ubiquitous when socializing. There aren't actually as many "native residents" as you might think with most of the younger Germans here having grown up outside Berlin and moving here later.

 

[GamerMax73]

... You don't think it could benefit people in any way to have some understanding of politics, given the current situation?

This in a nutshell. In some ways I don't think education is properly focused in this country. We've struggled to break out of the Victorian mould. Uniforms, desks in rows, teacher led lectures, prescribed subjects - maths, English, history, geography, science.

When you have low voter turnout among the 18-24s, you've got to ask what exactly are they being taught about the world the live in?

 

[BGBW]

My secondary school history lessons had topics like the Watergate Scandal and communism in Russia and China.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

I did Russia 1855-1922 and America 1739-1783, but both of those were at A-level. Otherwise, I think all the history I did was British, and I went to a pretty good school, as well.

 

[Theonik]

I hear Berlin is a cool place. I might have to learn German

It's quite cool I heard. Rent is quite cheap too. You should be able to get by with just English for a while.
Frankfurt was quite nice in that regard though I heard Berlin is even better.

 

[StayDead]

Junior Doctors reject contract deal. So there's another crisis brewing.

The tories have finally done it. They've killed all hope the NHS ever had of succeeding again.

The migrant workers who keep it running will leave, no new blood will join as UK people don't seem interested and the ones that are get screwed by the government.

Thatcher finally got what she wanted.

 

[War Peaceman]

Junior Doctors reject contract deal. So there's another crisis brewing.

Smart move. Their negotiating position has just strengthened enormously in a number of ways. Good for them.

 

[GamerMax73]

But Cameron took a gamble to pull in UKIP voters.

Blaming Cameron for this vote is as disingenuous as blaming Brown for US sub-prime mortgage lending. The vote has been promised since the Blair government failed to deliver on it. Between UKIP, and his own backbenchers what choice did he have?

 

[The Friendly Monster]

Blaming Cameron for this vote is as disingenuous as blaming Brown for US sub-prime mortgage lending. The vote has been promised since the Blair government failed to deliver on it. Between UKIP, and his own backbenchers what choice did he have?

Seems crazy but maybe he could've shown some spine for once? Even if remain had won it wouldn't have made this referendum a good idea.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

Blaming Cameron for this vote is as disingenuous as blaming Brown for US sub-prime mortgage lending. The vote has been promised since the Blair government failed to deliver on it. Between UKIP, and his own backbenchers what choice did he have?

Ignore them. Threaten to call a GE if they did anything stupid. Wait until the economy was in a better position/more boomers were dead, hold a referendum then. Average life expectancy from 65 is only 16, you do this referendum even 5 years later and a third of that demographic is dead (I mean not quite because it isn't even distributed, but you get my point).

This was literally the worst time to hold this referendum. Had you done it before 2007, you'd have walked it. Done it after maybe 2017 even, you'd have walked it. There was a 10-year gap where people were hurting and looking for something to lash out at, and you do it then? Madness.

 

[Hasney]

Junior Doctors reject contract deal. So there's another crisis brewing.

Pictured: Jermey Hunt, envisioning how he could possibly hold all these L's

 

[ss1]

https://mobile.twitter.com/patrickwintour/status/750275084447846400

This is very interesting. To secure an EEA deal will need the approval of not just the 27 in the EU, but also the countries in the EEA and the Swiss. So that makes it very unlikely that we will get better terms than what other EEA countries have got already.

 

[kmag]

Smart move. Their negotiating position has just strengthened enormously in a number of ways. Good for them.

Wasn't even particularly close. 58% to 42%

 

[GamerMax73]

Seems crazy but maybe he could've shown some spine for once? Even if remain had won it wouldn't have made this referendum a good idea.

Would the Tories have done as well at the ballot box last time had it not been an election promise?

Could he have kept his job had he not called it?

He was cornered. He had no choice but to hold the referendum and win. He's only fault really is that he lost.

I'm no fan of his, and certainly never voted Tory in my life, but I wouldn't lay the blame of this mess at his door.

Boris Johnson, Jeremy Corbyn, Nigel Farrage - all have more to answer for than Cameron does.