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The UK votes to leave the European Union |OUT2| Mayday, Mayday, I've lost an ARM
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Monty Mole
Member
Labour (surprisingly) and LD both in calls for a General Election.
I understand why, especially after the Gordon Brown fiasco.
BUT.. we don't elect a prime minister at a general election, we elect an MP to take a government seat for our local constituencies. And a majority, or coalition, forms a government. Again, we do not elect a prime minister.
Also, David Cameron had already made it clear prior to last year's election that he would not be serving a third term - so we knew he had to be stepping down at some point during his second term regardless of this referendum result, to allow a successor to lead the party in the run-up to a general election in 2020. OK, we're 3-4 years earlier than that new leader would have likely taken place, but still, I don't think a general election is absolutely necessary. It'll just create more delays and uncertainty.
I understand why, especially after the Gordon Brown fiasco.
BUT.. we don't elect a prime minister at a general election, we elect an MP to take a government seat for our local constituencies. And a majority, or coalition, forms a government. Again, we do not elect a prime minister.
Also, David Cameron had already made it clear prior to last year's election that he would not be serving a third term - so we knew he had to be stepping down at some point during his second term regardless of this referendum result, to allow a successor to lead the party in the run-up to a general election in 2020. OK, we're 3-4 years earlier than that new leader would have likely taken place, but still, I don't think a general election is absolutely necessary. It'll just create more delays and uncertainty.
Ugh get over it. If they want to drag some infighting into the public eye at the worst possible time (sounds like we're heading for a GE after all) then I think the Labour party are still accepting new members.
In regards to the renewed possibility of a GE: lol
But they wrapped those policies in basically a distilled super pure version of Ed's anti-austerity measure to the point where it basically glossed over any actual policy they had. Outside of perhaps the rail nationalisation, ask anyone about Labours current policies they couldn't give you specifics in almost all cases but they'd probably say anti-austerity, as to the layman the odd time they hear Corbyn it's all he ever bangs on about.
It was a failed message when Ed was delivering it, Corbyn is somehow less personable and less comfortable in the spotlight and it's no surprise the polling is dire. Ed's Labour was at 40% at this point in the cycle, Corbyn didn't even get a post election bump.
We don't know. What we do know is he is polling at historic lows, with large numbers of labour voters unwilling to vote for him. That people trust him on the economy even less than Ed Miliband. The membership seems to forget sometimes that labours MPs have a democratic mandate of their own that's a lot broader than the labour leadership contest.
Huw_Dawson
Member
She'd do no worse than Milliband. If she gained maybe one or two seats back and the LDs managed a successful reclamation of a number of seats that should never have been lost in 2015 (Cambridge, Brecon and Radnorshire, many SW seats) which flipped to Tory, the Conservatives would be forced from power.
Bear in mind that the reason this government exists at all is because the LDs lost extremely badly to the Tories in their marginals, when they were expected to do relatively well in them. Much like the Leave surprise victory, the Tories hit on a nerve with their Labour-in-through-the-back-door fear campaign in the final week.
Good Lord, the cringe is unbearable. I feel badly for her
Then another alternative needs to be found (or the messaging needs to be changed), but that's not the same as saying there was never one to begin with.
May today outlined something which is pretty much a 180 on the current Tory economic manifesto. While we vote for MP's, we vote for MP's standing for a particular party manifesto. No one voted for May's vision. If she was just offering a continuation of the Cameroon/Osborne policies then that's one thing, she's not though. She's actually making a pretty pronounced pitch for the centre.
Peston gapped to watch Leadsome step down.
This is hilarious. The Labour party has been rotten for so long, it deserves this. Hopefully a good clean out ensues and it actually becomes a decent left wing party a la the US Democrats.
I know they would be closer to the Tories in our system, but you know what I mean
Sure, maybe if we get rid of Corbyn we can do that
To add to the discussion of Corbyn's economic policy, some polling from November:
Lmao. Another amazing moment in this current chapter of UK politics.
I think this is a problem that Labour is going to have for some time anyway, since they let the Tories get away with sticking them for the economic meltdown of 2007. The idea that the Tories are a safe pair of hands compared with Labour--despite the piling of evidence to the contrary--is going to take more than a replacement leader to get rid of.
Refusing to stand because they don't think they can win.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Raise the centre-left progressive signal!
*A giant image of a Costa coffee cup is projected over London*
ultratruman
Banned
Labour have always been so spectacularly bad at organising succession.
Are Corbynistas now saying charisma is a requirement for being leader of the Labour party?
That's true and it's been an issue for Labour for most of the party's history. That doesn't change the fact that Corbyn is less credible than Miliband.
That's true and it's been an issue for Labour for most of the party's history. That doesn't change the fact that Corbyn is less credible than Miliband.
haha
I think people against Corbyn say that more and a lot of those people aren't exactly going to back Angela. Just a terrible option.
At this point, I honestly would vote for Eagle for Labour leader just so that we can move on from this 18 month cycle of Labour dysfunctionality. I sincerely doubt that she could win an election, and I think that the PLP knows that too, but perhaps if they could take a few months out from thinking of ways to topple their leader they might actually have some time to think of an alternative to the Tory party that a) works and b) isn't just copying them.
Surely no more hypocritical than a PLP who insisted that electability is key putting her forward as their replacement candidate.
Surely no more hypocritical than a PLP who insisted that electability is key putting her forward as their replacement candidate.
Coriolanus
Banned
Angela Eagle has the charisma and public speaking skills of Jeb.
That's all that needs to be said, really.
QuicheFontaine
Member
This doesn't even feel real any more.
As a Corbinite, of those I'd only consider switching to Dan Jarvis (and no way in hell I'd vote for David Miliband)
shinra-bansho
Member
I honestly believe that Eagle is so bad that we'll just get a different flavour of dysfunction. I'll actually put money on her not lasting until the next GE (as long as an early one isn't called!) if she gets the nod.
My prediction for what will happen:
- Corbyn will win the leadership election
- At least 50 Labour MPs will either create a new party or join the LDs
- An election will be called between 2018-20
- Conservatives will win by an absolute landslide (100+ majority) because the LD and Labour votes will be split
- The Conservative government will have over 70% of the seats but around 30% of the votes
- There will be marches on London to introduce PR or another voting system
- The Conservatives will be forced to give in due to national unrest, strikes from unions etc, but it won't be full PR
- The UK will actually have a better political system that allows Corbynistas/UKIPers to exist without polluting the centre of UK politics like they have for the past 6 years.
- Corbyn will win the leadership election
- At least 50 Labour MPs will either create a new party or join the LDs
- An election will be called between 2018-20
- Conservatives will win by an absolute landslide (100+ majority) because the LD and Labour votes will be split
- The Conservative government will have over 70% of the seats but around 30% of the votes
- There will be marches on London to introduce PR or another voting system
- The Conservatives will be forced to give in due to national unrest, strikes from unions etc, but it won't be full PR
- The UK will actually have a better political system that allows Corbynistas/UKIPers to exist without polluting the centre of UK politics like they have for the past 6 years.
He ain't coming back to the party that chose his dorkier brother over him. Bitterly, He's been working in charity since he got defeated and I haven't seen him come out of his shell since.
As a Corbynite you are an extremely small sub-section of the electorate
Big difference, the PM has to be an elected MP.
ok, thank you for your input. I had no idea
/s
I was just making the point that he would be the only choice I'd consider voting for in a leadership contest
David Miliband couldn't beat Ed, and we all saw how well Ed did (I love Ed, I think he'd have been a great PM, and we wouldn't be going through all this shit if he'd won, but come on).
Chuka couldn't hack ONE DAY of media scrutiny when he was in the running last time.
Jarvis has been AWOL for so long they might as well declare him MIA.
The saviours of the Labour "moderates" ladies and gentlemen.
PJV3
Member
I like the idea that being left wing makes someone a frothing lunatic polluting the political well.
He wants one more round of "that's really for the next leadership to decide"
David got stitched up, despite the fact he was clearly a better candidate
Chuka I agree with, such a shame
Jarvis, yeah, but he could unite our country, as the military worshippers would get behind him as he's a vet, but he has good policy ideas too. I think his wife dying and then his new family situation stalled his career a few years. Shame.
Or one more "For heaven’s sake man, go!"
"Oh, and one last thing from me... SNAP ELECTION"
*confetti and balloons fall from the sky as symbolic voting buckets are wheeled into the room"
Yup correct. Out of all the Labour MPs during the Blair days, he was the only one that should've succeeded him.
I have to say that the PLP putting forward Eagle as their candidate makes me rather certain of my earlier hunch that their lack of support for him had nothing to do with his electability and everything to do with his policies. To his credit, at least Blair admitted that fact.
You're kidding, right?
Of course Corbyn wouldn't resign if Labour got blown out. He specifically said he's not in this to win elections.
Likewise, I'm personally pretty fond of the idea that being right wing is symptomatic of some sort of pathologic stupidy and xenophobia.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
Pompus wank at its finest.
JonathanEx
Member
Would just push the blame to everyone else for not backing him, and keep on until they back him damn it
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