RedHoodedOwl
Member
Kuroto Dan is a combination of Ryoma Sengoku and Masato Kusaka.
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TokuGAF 2017 |OT| Playing Trauma Center in Space and Hollywood
- Thread starter BatDan
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Also some Tenjuro Banno.
Which reminds me, one of Kamen Sentai Gorider's few flaws was the missed opportunity to bring back both Ryoma and Banno for a villainous scientist teamup with Dan.
RedHoodedOwl
Member
Banno and Dan both enjoy torturing their own creations.
Edgy Kiriya is literally the worst.
Guessing Kiriya's a double agent and whispered his true allegiance into Emu's ear; Emu's angry reaction was just an act. Otherwise, why hide the dialogue from the audience?
Also, it's now getting comical how every fucking episode there's a new Ride Player victim who doesn't matter to the plot and is cured at the end of the episode. I wish they would dump the victim of the week format, there's no purpose when they don't even bother trying to flesh out the victims or involve their plight in the story.
Guessing Kiriya's a double agent and whispered his true allegiance into Emu's ear; Emu's angry reaction was just an act. Otherwise, why hide the dialogue from the audience?
Also, it's now getting comical how every fucking episode there's a new Ride Player victim who doesn't matter to the plot and is cured at the end of the episode. I wish they would dump the victim of the week format, there's no purpose when they don't even bother trying to flesh out the victims or involve their plight in the story.
Kamen Rider Amazons Season 1
I've gotta be honest guys, I thought this was completely awful. Like, man, I'm so disappointed. It started off well enough. Some small problems. The series chose the boring of the two riders to follow as its protagonist for one. The direction is also pretty damn awful. Fight scenes feel like they were put together by Micheal Bay with quick cuts that make it nearly impossible to distinguish the fight choreography. But, it had some good things. The supporting cast is well drawn and interesting, it has some neat concepts, Jin is a great and interesting Rider and the suit designs are great. It continues to get better for 5 or 6 episodes and almost find its footing, but then the
episode happens.
From here, the show completely focuses itself on a moral ambiguity that is completely undeveloped and laughable. Even in that same episode, it contradicts any hope of getting viewers on board with that ambiguity.
. The show continues to push and push and push on this forced ambiguity until it has an even more laughable plot with Momoru near the end where we find out
We then cap it off by one of the most sudden and hilariously bad end twists I've ever seen in a rider show
and once again, the show wants us to have any sympathy for all this.
I'll watch season 2 still, partly because I love the suit designs, partly because I hope they can salvage this mess and partly to see just how awful it can get and mostly because I still do really like the supporting cast. Man. When this was announced I had such hope. Free from the constraints of TV, I was hoping they could do something interesting with the KR concepts. Instead we get lazily written drivel that plays at being adult without doing the work to back it up. This is honestly the worst Kamen Rider I've ever seen I think.
Jin was right. He should've been the hero this whole time. What a far more interesting and better show this would've been.
I've gotta be honest guys, I thought this was completely awful. Like, man, I'm so disappointed. It started off well enough. Some small problems. The series chose the boring of the two riders to follow as its protagonist for one. The direction is also pretty damn awful. Fight scenes feel like they were put together by Micheal Bay with quick cuts that make it nearly impossible to distinguish the fight choreography. But, it had some good things. The supporting cast is well drawn and interesting, it has some neat concepts, Jin is a great and interesting Rider and the suit designs are great. It continues to get better for 5 or 6 episodes and almost find its footing, but then the
Amazon Restaurant
From here, the show completely focuses itself on a moral ambiguity that is completely undeveloped and laughable. Even in that same episode, it contradicts any hope of getting viewers on board with that ambiguity.
The amazons are 'trying to live a peaceful life' and yet they do so by murdering and eating innocent people. Why should we have any sympathy for them?
even our hero amazons are doomed to give into their animalistic desires to hunt and kill humans. Thus, destroying any possible sympathy we could possibly have for them all together.
Our hero decides hey I'm totally OK with eating humans and goes and lives with a colony of other vermin
I'll watch season 2 still, partly because I love the suit designs, partly because I hope they can salvage this mess and partly to see just how awful it can get and mostly because I still do really like the supporting cast. Man. When this was announced I had such hope. Free from the constraints of TV, I was hoping they could do something interesting with the KR concepts. Instead we get lazily written drivel that plays at being adult without doing the work to back it up. This is honestly the worst Kamen Rider I've ever seen I think.
Jin was right. He should've been the hero this whole time. What a far more interesting and better show this would've been.
NeonZ
Member
Why did so many people misunderstand that? He wasn't saying that eating humans wasn't evil. He was saying that just because they had hunger for humans it doesn't mean they're evil. He still will stop and kill them if they actually go eat humans.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Rewatch the whole scene again and read the subs.
There is nothing inherently wrong with wanting to eat. And he is right. It's a biological need above morality. To this day I am surprised people everywhere mistake that line. Haruka is not saying "it's okay to eat", he's saying to Mamoru that "it's normal to want to eat something" and even then it didn't strike much to Mamoru. That thing he did haunted him (and you'll see later in season 2 that it's not just him). Even the extermination team saw this - they saw Mamoru's suffering and they saw his genuine feeling.
Also another thing people often forget. Haruke is the designated executioner. He wanted the Amazons to live in peace away from civilization. And when they finally give in, he will kill them. People use the "the scout team got killed!" excuse, but they forget that they were already far from Haruka's designated area, and that those were already turned Amazons. This is the rider who wants to protect everyone but has to kill the ones that couldn't. That's their end-game, they want to live in peace and die peacefully through Haruka.
When I go through forums and such, even in tvtropes, I see somehow those two focal points are forgotten, mostly because they all just look at Jin. And some are even going for a "character apologist" route especially if you watch Season 2.
Jin is not right at all. While there are moral greys in the show, his position isn't a clear heroic one. His motivations are all pure selfish with humanity only benefiting just a bit, and he even ignores a lot of things for the sake of looking "impartial". All the stuff he does leads to something even worse.
If anything Haruka does the early Heisei rider conundrum. He doesn't want anyone to suffer and he tries his best protect everyone. It's just that in a typical rider show this is rewarded, in this show it's more cynical.
Tiu Neo
Member
Todd is Masamune. He'll leave the game to the modders (Kuroto) and then come back when it's ready. It makes sense.
Next week, Sentai and Kamen Rider's worst enemy is back. GOLFGOM.
I would believe in the moral grayness if the show did any decent job at all building sympathy for the amazons. It doesn't. Like, sure it plays upon 'yo we don't want to eat humans', but even the 'good' amazons give into that urge without that much fight outside of Haruka. Like, the show puts up the whole restaurant thing like we should be cool with it or at least accept that it is morally ambiguous when it is in fact, not. Like, those amazons might not be going on a rampage but they're still killing and eating people.
The show wants amazons to be these horrible wild monsters we delight in seeing killed, and it does a decent job with that, but then it also wants us to see them as innocents trying to live their lives and that's completely incongruous with what the show has built up and unbelievable. That's why I came away with Jin is right and there really isn't an ambiguity. The amazons exist to eat people, plain and simple. You don't protect something that's gonna bite your head off.
60EffPeeEss
Member
What the hell, yami4ct? You've seriously blinked understand anything about Haruka's point of view.
Haruka wants to protect the Amazons until they go feral, then he'll execute them himself. He doesn't believe in executing them outright because they're, for all intents and purposes, normal people living their lives. They can love, feel fear, enjoy things. They're not outright monsters who deserve to be executed, and it wasn't their fault they were even born anyway.
That's why he decides to shepherd them in the end, because encounters with Amazons like the one in the restaurant who is trying to feed others to stave off their feral state, and people like Mamoru, he sees that some of them are at least attempting to fight their nature and do some sort of good.
Jin is just a nutjob who wants to kill them all without reasoning that they can be helped. He's not right in the slightest. Just an extremist.
Haruka wants to protect the Amazons until they go feral, then he'll execute them himself. He doesn't believe in executing them outright because they're, for all intents and purposes, normal people living their lives. They can love, feel fear, enjoy things. They're not outright monsters who deserve to be executed, and it wasn't their fault they were even born anyway.
That's why he decides to shepherd them in the end, because encounters with Amazons like the one in the restaurant who is trying to feed others to stave off their feral state, and people like Mamoru, he sees that some of them are at least attempting to fight their nature and do some sort of good.
Jin is just a nutjob who wants to kill them all without reasoning that they can be helped. He's not right in the slightest. Just an extremist.
You can do that without doing the same setup every time. Like why not show a group of Ride Players instead of a single one every single time? Why is every single Ride Player either "I want to save a family member" or "I'm just a suicidal asshole for no reason"? Why do we even need a subplot about saving someone if it has nothing to do with the main plot points of an episode? Why don't they show other ways of saving people?
I get Haruka's point but it's completely unsupported by the rest of the show. The non feral ones in the resteraunt are still murdring innocents. Momomoru isn't feral and yet he bites his teammate's arm off. The show makes it pretty clear that amazons will always default to being a threat in the end and it doesn't support the idea that I should have any sympathy for them. Jin is actually protecting people while Haruto continues to make poor decisions that get innocents hurt. If the show wanted me to feel for the amazons at all it did a piss poor job of it especially with the choices it made around Mamoru. It's a big part of why I think the show is just terrible.
Tiu Neo
Member
Mamoru became a treat just after he had his first taste of human meat - that piece of human meat he ate to recover his energies at the restaurant. We can't really know if he would become a treat if that didn't happen.
Of course, I see your point, but I can also see it from the Amazons POV: they can't really control the hunger, they just want to live.
I don't think there's anything conceptually wrong with what amazons tried to do, but it didn't put the effort in to back it up. It wants to have the moral ambiguity of the non-feral amazons living their lives, but the horror shock of CANNIBAL RESTAURANT and those two concepts clash in a way that makes any moral ambiguity just feel so forced an laughable. I can't help but root for 'kill em all' Jin at that point.
If you want an example of those ideas done well, just look at Ex-Aid's Burgermon episode. Ex-Aid did a billion times more work in humanizing a villain who's existence means ill for humans than amazons did in its entire first season and Amazons is about those concepts.
If you want an example of those ideas done well, just look at Ex-Aid's Burgermon episode. Ex-Aid did a billion times more work in humanizing a villain who's existence means ill for humans than amazons did in its entire first season and Amazons is about those concepts.
Tiu Neo
Member
New post so people who still haven't watched Amazons Season 2 can ignore it.
Amazons 2 - 10
Chihiro really is the worst character. I kinda see what they are doing with his drama, but it's... eh. At least his backstory is interesting.
Wait, wait. My guess from last episode was right? LOL, I think it's the first time this happens with Amazons.
Good ending for this episode. 3 to go, still lots to happen.
Ex-Aid 35
Yeah, Masamune reminds me quite a lot of Banno. A bit less crazy and more powerful, I guess.
And yeah, they could just stop doing the victim of the week thing. They feel as just a checkbox to fill right now. Well, they kinda work to make the plot move, I guess.
I wonder what's Kiriya's plan. I bet that was just Emu playing along with his plan, but we'll know next episode.
And what are they saying? Kiriya was exaclty like that, he didn't tell anyone of his motives until it was needed, lol.
Next episode, ultimate form. And Emu will not even have to die for it! Unfortunately, not next week, that will be Golfgom.
Amazons 2 - 10
Chihiro really is the worst character. I kinda see what they are doing with his drama, but it's... eh. At least his backstory is interesting.
That Fuku mother part came out of nowhere, but wtf. Good use of a character that was pretty much just background for another character before?
About Chihiro... yeah, he's a boring character, but everything around him is very well done. Iyu is also not a very good character, but the way they use her against Chihiro is good, and I wouldn't be surprised if he dies because of her. His conflict with Jin is interesting. The whole Nanaha story is a good background. They just needed to tone down the Iyu love airtime just a little a bit, and maybe make him a bit less whinny, and he would be more likeable.
I had completely forgotten about the old man boss character, lol.
AND NANAHA IS THAT AMAZON. CALLED IT.
About Chihiro... yeah, he's a boring character, but everything around him is very well done. Iyu is also not a very good character, but the way they use her against Chihiro is good, and I wouldn't be surprised if he dies because of her. His conflict with Jin is interesting. The whole Nanaha story is a good background. They just needed to tone down the Iyu love airtime just a little a bit, and maybe make him a bit less whinny, and he would be more likeable.
I had completely forgotten about the old man boss character, lol.
AND NANAHA IS THAT AMAZON. CALLED IT.
Wait, wait. My guess from last episode was right? LOL, I think it's the first time this happens with Amazons.
Good ending for this episode. 3 to go, still lots to happen.
Ex-Aid 35
Yeah, Masamune reminds me quite a lot of Banno. A bit less crazy and more powerful, I guess.
And yeah, they could just stop doing the victim of the week thing. They feel as just a checkbox to fill right now. Well, they kinda work to make the plot move, I guess.
I wonder what's Kiriya's plan. I bet that was just Emu playing along with his plan, but we'll know next episode.
And what are they saying? Kiriya was exaclty like that, he didn't tell anyone of his motives until it was needed, lol.
Next episode, ultimate form. And Emu will not even have to die for it! Unfortunately, not next week, that will be Golfgom.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
The restaurant Amazons are mostly dead, so their "comeuppance" has been dealt with. You're judging the ambiguity only towards that scene. It is true that Haruka got his resolve there, but he wasn't condoning their actions at all. Hell, he killed the cook who hasn't even turned.
Mamoru only went feral after accidentally eating the burger, gave into his urges once, and then immediately regretted it so much that it still haunts him to this day. That's something you forgot - he cried so much about eating his friend, that it immediately turned him off from eating flesh.
It's not about whether "Amazons are innocent!" or not, the whole ambiguity is from the fact that the Amazons are fighting their instincts, and that Haruka already found a way to deal with it and yet you get an extremist trying to rustle the whole thing off due to a perceived selfish redemption. Again, the whole point of them fighting their urges, the ambiguity is on whether we should let them live isolated where they are killed off by Haruka, or let a madman kill them all who is quite unstable and actually let bad things happen.
The show doesn't even dwell on "is it not right for them to eat" or anything. Like if there's one thing the show is transparent about, it's that "eating humans is wrong" is hammered repeatedly even in Season 2. the moral ambiguity is instead elsewhere.
In fact, your viewpoint of Jin will shatter once you start Season 2, which adds more to his actions in 1.
The next series is called Kamen Rider Build. My assumption based on the name is that the concept was inspired by Minecraft.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
It's called Kamen Rider Build.
Seems the gimmicks are "bottles", some speculate chemical compounds or something like that---the silhouette (this was confirmed right?) makes it seem like it'll be a split-suit like W that mixes.
Apparently alleged toy listings I've seen being reported mention the Driver is the "World Driver", the gimmicks are Material Bottles, the main weapon is the "Saibatto Blade", and there is a "Kamen Rider Pain" and "Kamen Rider Roots".
RedHoodedOwl
Member
Name a supporting character from any Kamen Rider series that you couldn't stand.
Kamen Rider Decade - Natsumi
Kamen Rider Decade - Natsumi
RedHoodedOwl
Member
I didn't care for Natsumi's mopey personality.
You'd be mopey too if you saw your best friend killing off all those riders. Actually, did she ever tell anyone about that?
RedHoodedOwl
Member
Tsukasa isn't worth being that upset all the time.lol!
BudokaiMR2
Member
hmmm....
Kamen Rider Fourze - Ohsugi
Bottom of the barrel JP talent with a stupid gimmick.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
The worst supporting character is Shizuka from Kiva.
There's like no contest there.
There's like no contest there.
I put my expectations for Kyu 18 way too high, they had an awful lot of Nyu Gavan and not nearly enough Deka. I thought I remember seeing Sen and Umeko suited up in last week's preview and seeing Doggie always makes me want Master. The only time they showed the Non-Red Dekas transformed was in a quick flash from inside DekaWingRobo, and to see Tetsu in their for no reason was a big tease. JUDGEMENT TIME this episode.
I'm in the not liking camp for Amazon's as well, couldn't get through the first episode.
Can't remember his name but Wizards apprentice guy was really bad, worst part of a really bad Kamen Rider. Girls like Natsumi and Akiko aren't even close to his level of bad.
I'm in the not liking camp for Amazon's as well, couldn't get through the first episode.
Can't remember his name but Wizards apprentice guy was really bad, worst part of a really bad Kamen Rider. Girls like Natsumi and Akiko aren't even close to his level of bad.
RedHoodedOwl
Member
Who doesn't love Raptor? She's awesome.
and she disappeared for no reason
shaowebb
Member
Same. I haven't watched seriously since Drive and even then I was just sorta there for Chaser. I tried watching older ones but I never finish any even though I really liked some. Saw Ghost and heard it may as well have been wizard 2.0 in quality. Then Ex-Aid hit and I'm sorry I barely made it through Fourze with the goofy looks of its main dude. Had it not been for Meteor I'd have likely fell off. I can't get into anything goin on in Ex-Aid. They look TERRIBLE.
I am eager for whatever comes next. Im hoping we get the next Gaim or OOO's level thing here. Lately its like Kamen Rider has ran closer and closer to the pacings of Sentai than Toku and its been off putting for me.
RedHoodedOwl
Member
I don't know who was worse, Mai being the cliched mother figure or Micchy and his creepy nice guy routine.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
Like I said, Shizuka combines BOTH of those together.
To be the worst supporting character, first you need to be a character.
RoryDropkick
Member
Poor Rina Koike. She's at least moved on to a somewhat successful gravure career, but she's not that good of an actor. She was in Ultraman Ginga S as well, and she wasn't all that good either. :/
ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
This is true. I didn't realize she was gone until I did a rewatch of Kiva.
I saw a clip of a Super Sentai-esque show, but it was 3D CG instead of live action, similar style to Green Lantern The Animated Series, and had similar helmet design to Gekiranger. Anybody know the name of it?
https://youtu.be/EAtznSFclTA?t=8m35s
https://youtu.be/EAtznSFclTA?t=8m35s