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[Rodelero]

I can see the argument that council tax is itself unfair, but I don't really get how this is any fairer...

At the very least it is far more progressive. The numbers being bandied around not by Labour but by the Conservatives are quite heavy handed and so sound like a massive jump, but if you look at who pays most it is going to be those at the upper end of the wealth spectrum. The numbers in the article are based on a concept of a 1.65% tax on the value of the property plus a 3% tax on the value of the unimproved land. Those sound very high, but then, they aren't from Labour. I'd imagine the tax take on that basis would be enormous compared to the current council tax take.

Reduce those percentage figures down a bit and it becomes a very sensible, progressive, effective system in my eyes.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

Thanks for the info Crab. One more question though, if this is replacing CT does that money go to the council or to central govt? There was a bit in that article with McDonnell saying "it'll give us the money we need" or something.

No idea. All Labour's manifesto says is that they'll conduct a review and issue a White Paper on it - it wouldn't be something happening in the next Parliament even if they were elected, it sounds like a second-term goal. The way I'd do it would be for the money to be reserved for councils but divided on a more proportional basis, but that's just me.

It's a great policy, though. LVT and UBI are like my dream things for the UK government to enact. Anyone seriously looking at LVT has my vote! Lloyd George almost introduced it in 1909, but the Lords, composed mostly of Conservative rentiers, killed it off, and the idea has never seemed to get a second chance. If it was down to me, it would be the most important source of revenue we had. Do you realise how much of the UK's land is owned by a few small groups of people and large corporations? It's the most significant cause of wealth inequality by literally factors of 10.

 

[liquidtmd]

Is Scotland the dino and England the boy?

I assumed the Dino was Brexit, but I'll take it

 

[Hazzuh]

Michael Howard?

The 2005 campaign is actually a good example of the left's blindspot on antisemitism. Some of Labour's attacks of Howard were definitely rather questionable, I think people on the campaign will admit that now, even if they say it was unintentional.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Guido Fawkes article is hilarious...

https://order-order.com/2017

 

[Pandy]

Is Scotland the dino and England the boy?

I'd go with old voters screwing over the young.

 

[deadduck]

Guido Fawkes article is hilarious...

https://order-order.com/2017

It's not.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

It's not.

It's hilarious in how ridiculous it is they were able to write an article from what happened.

And that headline...Corbyn self-destructs on women's hour. How can you not laugh at how absurd it is.

 

[Huw_Dawson]

LVT is fully supported by the Lib Dems, fwiw. It is probably our oldest policy.

The major issue with it is ultimately the short term shock - it takes a bit of time for the economy to rebalance to take advantage. But otherwise it is solid policy.

There is even a song about it.

 

[deadduck]

It's hilarious in how ridiculous it is they were able to write an article from what happened.

And that headline...Corbyn self-destructs on women's hour. How can you not laugh at how absurd it is.

I wasn't sure where you were coming from.

Yeah Guido is a hardcore Tory. I think they call it libertarian to sound better. Ridiculous that the May can produce no numbers at all, yet they jump on this.

 

[Xun]

Seriously fuck the BBC.

A small mistake has been blown completely out of proportion, unsurprisingly.

I feel so incredibly powerless in this country.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

No idea. All Labour's manifesto says is that they'll conduct a review and issue a White Paper on it - it wouldn't be something happening in the next Parliament even if they were elected, it sounds like a second-term goal. The way I'd do it would be for the money to be reserved for councils but divided on a more proportional basis, but that's just me.

It's a great policy, though. LVT and UBI are like my dream things for the UK government to enact. Anyone seriously looking at LVT has my vote! Lloyd George almost introduced it in 1909, but the Lords, composed mostly of Conservative rentiers, killed it off, and the idea has never seemed to get a second chance. If it was down to me, it would be the most important source of revenue we had. Do you realise how much of the UK's land is owned by a few small groups of people and large corporations? It's the most significant cause of wealth inequality by literally factors of 10.

Not a clue. I vaguely recall something like this mentioned in the Scottish Indyref thread though. Like 12 people own 80% of Scotland or something daft.

Edit:

Breaking! Mrs Quiche is voting Labour ;_; where did I go wrong??

 

[Faddy]

BBC six o'clock news lead with Corbyn forgetting a number. National News and they didn't even put out what the figure was.

Now Kuenessberg on the doorstep with average voters who like May but don't like Corbyn, surprise!!

edit: The propaganda gets worse as Laura asks a softball question. Theresa are you a strong or weak leader? FFS. Seems the infection of partisan hacks running BBC news has spread from Scotland to the UK.

 

[daviyoung]

BBC six o'clock news lead with Corbyn forgetting a number. National News and they didn't even put out what the figure was.

Now Kuenessberg on the doorstep with average voters who like May but don't like Corbyn, surprise!!

edit: The propaganda gets worse as Laura asks a softball question. Theresa are you a strong or weak leader? FFS. Seems the infection of partisan hacks running BBC news has spread from Scotland to the UK.

With Abbott bungling police costs on LBC a few weeks ago it's not a great look for Labour when they can't answer those questions.

 

[D4Danger]

With Abbott bungling police costs on LBC a few weeks ago it's not a great look for Labour when they can't answer those questions.

they answered both and this one was in the manifesto. Apparently the election is now Dragon's Den.

 

[empyrean]

https://twitter.com/SocialistVoice/status/869565478053834756

Well isn't he quite the "small businessman".

 

[daviyoung]

they answered both and this one was in the manifesto. Apparently the election is now Dragon's Den.

Just because they get there in the end doesn't make it less embarrassing

 

[Faddy]

Just because they get there in the end doesn't make it less embarrassing

Why is forgetting a number a hanging offence? The numbers are in the manifesto.

Unlike the Tories where Theresa May can't give the social care cap or the winter fuel cuts because the Tories haven't actually decided what the number is yet. And where they do have numbers, like the school breakfast program, they are clearly wrong.

 

[Theonik]

With Abbott bungling police costs on LBC a few weeks ago it's not a great look for Labour when they can't answer those questions.

He didn't remember the figure off the top of his head. And he shouldn't be expected to. Theresa May was afforded this several times just in this campaign. The data is made available as part of the manifesto, and that is what aides are for. It's an entirely irrelevant and arbitrary requirement that seems to be specifically targetting Labour because 'The Conservatives are good with the Economy' (despite their record showing anything but.)

 

[daviyoung]

Why is forgetting a number a hanging offence? The numbers are in the manifesto.

Unlike the Tories where Theresa May can't give the social care cap or the winter fuel cuts because the Tories haven't actually decided what the number is yet. And where they do have numbers, like the school breakfast program, they are clearly wrong.

It's not a hanging offence. It's just one where Abbott makes some shit up on the spot then tries to blag a lie (great look) and another where Corbyn tries his best to move on from it because he's forgotten his manifesto. They can't answer the questions and would be held to task regardless of what that question is.

 

[D4Danger]

Just because they get there in the end doesn't make it less embarrassing

at the end of the day it's the difference between not remembering a number and not having one.

the complete overreaction to this is so transparent.

 

[Theonik]

It's not a hanging offence. It's just one where Abbott makes some shit up on the spot then tries to blag a lie (great look) and another where Corbyn tries his best to move on from it because he's forgotten his manifesto. They can't answer the questions and would be held to task regardless of what that question is.

There is a big difference between the two. Abbott's blunder stems for her attempts to hide that she doesn't have the figures by making herself look like an idiot. Corbyn stated that he did not remember the figure but wished to give an accurate figure, which he was provided. One is 'Corbyn can't remember a simple figure! Rage!' the other is '2+2=1.4'

The real story here would have been that the policy had not been costed which is not the case.

 

[Rodelero]

It's not a hanging offence. It's just one where Abbott makes some shit up on the spot then tries to blag a lie (great look) and another where Corbyn tries his best to move on from it because he's forgotten his manifesto. They can't answer the questions and would be held to task regardless of what that question is.

I think you're being obtuse in regards to Corbyn's 'gaffe'. It's being blown out of all proportion. The Prime Minister literally sat there and smiled last night while she explained that there are no numbers - not on the social care cap, nor on the threshold for the winter fuel allowance - and this is passed over by the media as totally normal. Jeremy Corbyn doesn't know one of a great number of different values off by heart, and searches to find it to answer the question and it's now the biggest story of the day.

https://twitter.com/helenlewis/status/869499741335322624

"Burn me as a heretic, but is turning every interview into a pub quiz on figures testing the right qualities in a politician?"

Let's be quite clear here. We are living in a political climate where a candidate not knowing a number off the top of his head is headline news, but another candidate, who literally smiles as she explains that there are no numbers at all pretty much gets away with it scot-free. So while we now know the important information in regards to Labour's policy, and while we have no idea of the key details in regards to the Conservatives' policy, it is Labour who are getting raked over the coals.

It's time to wake up. The media is having a fucking laugh - this is ridiculously manipulative and completely irresponsible. I'm not even voting for Corbyn, but it is blindingly obvious he is getting an unfair time, not just with the right wing press but now with the publicly funded broadcaster.

 

[excowboy]

Make a complaint to the BBC here.

 

[sasliquid]

https://twitter.com/SocialistVoice/status/869565478053834756

Well isn't he quite the "small businessman".

Utter scum, how many people could he employ with that on the new minimum wage? Plenty

 

[King_Moc]

With Abbott bungling police costs on LBC a few weeks ago it's not a great look for Labour when they can't answer those questions.

The Conservatives can't answer literally any questions on costings.

 

[Mr. Sam]

Breaking! Mrs Quiche is voting Labour ;_; where did I go wrong??

My girlfriend threatens to vote Tory when she's cross with me. Maybe it's a similar situation?

 

[Theonik]

Breaking! Mrs Quiche is voting Labour ;_; where did I go wrong??

Time for you to embrace unity and get behind Labour in the national(personal) interest!

The Conservatives can't answer literally any questions on costings.

May on Andrew Neil was answering those questions with variations 'You know the Conservatives are good with the economy come on now'

 

[papercan55]

https://twitter.com/SocialistVoice/status/869565478053834756

Well isn't he quite the "small businessman".

So he owns multiple businesses, rakes in a fortune and doesn't want to pay his staff £10 per hour.
utter scum, making a fortune from others hard work yet he hates the idea of paying them a penny more.

 

[CCS]

Not a clue. I vaguely recall something like this mentioned in the Scottish Indyref thread though. Like 12 people own 80% of Scotland or something daft.

Edit:

Breaking! Mrs Quiche is voting Labour ;_; where did I go wrong??

Oh dear, I hope your marriage is strong and stable enough to endure

 

[Lego Boss]

Seriously fuck the BBC.

A small mistake has been blown completely out of proportion, unsurprisingly.

I feel so incredibly powerless in this country.

Yeah, WTF is it with the BBC this time around? Are they that afrraid of speaking truth to power? Is it really that the Tories will slash the royal charter?

They are just a mouthpiece for the right, it's been awkward watching Laura purse her lips to May's ringpiece in the name of 'balanced' reporting.

 

[Breakage]

https://twitter.com/SocialistVoice/status/869565478053834756

Well isn't he quite the "small businessman".

I knew something was up with this guy.

 

[Audioboxer]

"Don't make shit up because that is pathetic!"

"Don't take time to get your figures right by being honest about forgetting/needing a quick read of notes!"

Take your pick. I'd rather there weren't lies or misinformation. It's not clean and squeaky to forget, but if the figure exists and you get there that's what counts most.

4000 comments? BBC task completed.

 

[Monty Mole]

Jezza currently on The One Show.. without any family members. But he's very relaxed and not awkward at all, night and day compared to when Theresa was on it.

The more I see of Jeremy the more I like him. That's also a complete parallel to Theresa.

 

[WhatNXt]

Yeah, WTF is it with the BBC this time around? Are they that afrraid of speaking truth to power? Is it really that the Tories will slash the royal charter?

They are just a mouthpiece for the right, it's been awkward watching Laura purse her lips to May's ringpiece in the name of 'balanced' reporting.

The BBC and the papers have been awful in terms of propaganda.

One reason to hope Corbyn wins is that he'll fully implement the recommendations of the Leveson inquiry and probably look for more plurality in our media. Our media has proven to be much much more corrupt than what they have in the United States. And that takes some doing.

 

[Plasma]

I'm not sure how May can keep getting away with saying strong and stable over and over again without a journalist actually pushing her to answer a question but as soon as Corbyn slips up they're straight on him.

 

[Thornton Reed]

Corbyn is the only human politician I've ever seen. Stick the one show on

 

[BossDarkseid]

Jezza currently on The One Show.. without any family members. But he's very relaxed and not awkward at all, night and day compared to when Theresa was on it.

The more I see of Jeremy the more I like him. That's also a complete parallel to Theresa.

I'm still unconvinced about him as a PM...but the way he talked about getting to know people, and even if you disagree you can still find the time to learn something from them...he seems like a good guy :/

I feel like I could chat to Corbyn - either about Arsenal, my weak political knowledge or whatever - but for May it'd be...I feel if you said "Oh, how are you?" she'd bring out Strong *& Stable without a *hint* of irony or self deprecation.

 

[Spaghetti]

Stick the one show on

I was gonna, but physical revulsion for the One Show stopped me from doing it.

 

[Beefy]

Kind of disgusting how much the press and other news outlets have spun everything.

 

[Pandy]

I'm not sure how May can keep getting away with saying strong and stable over and over again without a journalist actually pushing her to answer a question but as soon as Corbyn slips up they're straight on him.

Simples:

A free media

At a time when the internet is changing the way people obtain their news, we also need to take steps to protect the reliability and objectivity of information that is essential to our democracy and a free and independent press. We will ensure content creators are appropriately rewarded for the content they make available online. We will be consistent in our approach to regulation of online and offline media. Given the comprehensive nature of the first stage of the Leveson Inquiry and given the lengthy investigations by the police and Crown Prosecution Service into alleged wrongdoing, we will not proceed with the second stage of the Leveson Inquiry into the culture, practices and ethics of the press. We will repeal Section 40 of the Crime and Courts Act 2014, which, if enacted, would force media organisations to become members of a flawed regulatory system or risk having to pay the legal costs of both sides in libel and privacy cases, even if they win.

EDIT: As for the One Show, I'll always cut it a bit of slack for not dumping Matt Baker after the, "how do you sleep at night?", question.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbcACpriZ9s

 

[QuicheFontaine]

My girlfriend threatens to vote Tory when she's cross with me. Maybe it's a similar situation?

I don't know what I'm supposed to have done!

Spoiler

Doesn't mean she's not cross with me though.

No I think she's serious. She says we need to end austerity :-/

 

[jelly]

What is going on with the news reporting. I thought he made something up on the spot and lied but he just had to check to be sure. I don't want to sound crazy but is there an agenda against him?

The Tories haven't costed anything and coasting on a made up Tories are better with the economy ........... narrative, okay. What.

May saying we better get a good deal from Brexit otherwise public services are screwed yet she says no deal is better than a bad deal. What fucking planet are we living on. Are people just morons, is there a secret society who will reap great benefits from Brexit and are crushing the opposing narrative. I just can't.

 

[JonathanEx]

I wonder if this wasn't on the BBC, they wouldn't lead with it. Still cover it, but it'd not be no 1 top story of the day.

 

[Theonik]

No secret society but there is a lot of Tories and friends that see Brexit as a glorious opportunity to suck out even more wealth out of the lower classes while everyone else is occupied with nonsense.

 

[Huw_Dawson]

Corbyn on the one show. Painted manhole covers, allotments. Shows off a jar of jam.

Is jam his equivalent of Heath's boats, I wonder?

 

[Uzzy]

After Brexit: the UK will need to renegotiate at least 759 treaties just to stand still.

It poses a formidable and little-understood challenge for Britain’s prime minister after the June 8 election. While Brexit is often cast as an affair between Brussels and London, in practice Britain’s exit will open more than 750 separate time-pressured mini-negotiations worldwide, according to Financial Times research. And there are no obvious shortcuts: even a basic transition after 2019 requires not just EU-UK approval, but the deal-by-deal authorisation of every third country involved.

“The nearest precedent you can think of is a cessation of a country — you are almost starting from scratch,” says Andrew Hood, a former UK government lawyer now at Dechert. “It will be a very difficult, iterative process.”

Britain finds itself at the diplomatic starting line, with the status quo upended and all sides reassessing their interests.

FT putting in the work again. Lets hope that Boris and Fox are up to the task, cause if they aren't..

 

[Deleted member 231381]

Not a clue. I vaguely recall something like this mentioned in the Scottish Indyref thread though. Like 12 people own 80% of Scotland or something daft.

Edit:

Breaking! Mrs Quiche is voting Labour ;_; where did I go wrong??

98% of the land in the UK is owned by 4.5% of people, Quiche. It's disgusting.

Now come vote Labour like your wife. You know you're tempted.

 

[jelly]

Does anyone think the UK will just accept the EU in everything but name and act like they are the Free Empire Snowflake. It's stupid to leave right, really stupid and anything but a really soft exit, basically nothing changes except you have zero say in any EU matters is the wise move that doesn't result in a shit show?

I just can't get my head around it, how does the UK come out good in any way without the shit hitting the fan?

 

[Uzzy]

Not a clue. I vaguely recall something like this mentioned in the Scottish Indyref thread though. Like 12 people own 80% of Scotland or something daft.

Edit:

Breaking! Mrs Quiche is voting Labour ;_; where did I go wrong??

Who can possibly resist.