Jezbollah
Member
That would be quite something. I'd love to see it happen.
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UK PoliGAF |OT2| - We Blue Ourselves
- Thread starter Jezbollah
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That would be quite something. I'd love to see it happen.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
That'd be nice, even many DUP members want her to step aside for stability.
Well, UK law can be read into the EU law the Good Friday Agreement mentioned, but Northern Ireland has a significant agricultural component to its economy that is going to be hurt badly by Brexit and losing the European market access. It's a bigger deal for Northern Ireland than it is for Scotland economically, in actual fact.
It also has a huge, meandering border that will become an external EU border and require customs checks. That's complicated. Yes, it's just ~2 million people and has a significant public sector (which doesn't make money nor is expected to make money) that won't be affected per se, but the overall economic effect will be large. Hopefully everything I've just mentioned doesn't cause significant problems.
CyclopsRock
Member
What would happen if they just.... Didn't man the border?
The WTO would penalise the EU who would penalise Ireland.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Not if we WTOxit.
The timing of this grammar schools business baffles me. I understand May wants to get the focus back on the domestic side of things but 1) it's a stupid policy, which you can find out by asking anybody in the teaching profession, which leads to 2) there might even be enough Tory MPs opposed to it to harpoon it in the Commons.
Edit: Oh, and William Hague is calling for a snap election - for some reason.
Edit: Oh, and William Hague is calling for a snap election - for some reason.
CyclopsRock
Member
Well... sorry Ireland, I guess!
phisheep
NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
This is something I'm rather in two minds about, particularly comparing the schools round here with the education that I had (got into grammar school, which then turned comprehensive a year later - so essentially had best of both worlds, grammar school education and social mix of a comp - though the social mix wasn't that big a thing being as it was in South Wales).
The negative side is of course selection at a young age, and the correspondent branding of people as successes/failures at about 11. The positive side is that, for those selected especially in poorer areas, it can be a huge and effective engine for social mobility.
I think much of the opposition to grammars, and it is sensible opposition I don't deny it, is that they favour the children of rich pushy parents who bang up house prices in the catchment areas and exacerbate social divisions. That's true in much of the South East I guess, and was so even in the southern suburbs of Manchester in the 70s and 80s.
Where I see things much more positively is in the predominantly poorer areas where there really aren't enough rich pushy parents around to monopolise the grammars. South Wales, South Yorkshire, West Lancashire, Cornwall, much of the old industrial Midlands and the urban South West and probably more.
A lot comes down to what selection is based on, and on how narrow the selection is.
This policy seems to be being pushed as "supporting the top 10%", and that seems to me just misguided and built to attract pushy parents. Where I grew up i was more like 50%. It seems to me that really what's happening is being able to exclude the bottom 10-20% of disruptive blighters who spend their lives fucking up teachers. If classroom discipline is occupying 80% of teachers' energy then there is something seriously wrong - and that is more or less what is happening in my town now. And it saps the ambition from otherwise smart kids who are keen to learn.
(Sorry if this sounds like an incoherent rant. It probably is - just trying to work my thoughts out. To try and clarify, there are four comprehensive schools here sharing the same catchment area and if I had a wish I would not turn one of them into a grammar, I would turn three of them).
For mandate for Brexit to scupper the Lords possibly? Or it could be just for pure political advantage ...
Audioboxer
Member
Labour is wasted, and they didn't do much to increase their popularity north of the border either.
............
The problem is is that all the evidence suggests grammars are ridiculously poor at promoting social mobility and overall standards for the education, and just end up severely punishing those who aren't selected (the unworthy poor hence why Tories love the notion) They're basically private schools for the middle classes who can't afford private schools, but even the middle classes end up hating them when little Jill and Jack can't get in despite the coaching.
No one can come up with any decent non-anecdotal evidence of grammars actually raising attainment across the system. Typically the concentration of resources into grammars simply lowers standards elsewhere in the system.
It's really more like the only interesting stuff in Labour is behind the scenes. But the PLP seem to have given up on their strategy of leaking every bit of bad news possible so we don't get to hear any of it.
I'd love to know how the foam-flecked Hard Brexiters managed to twist May's arm into flinging herself into the worst possible Brexit too.
The complete lack of pressure on May's left flank. I think those expecting a pivot post-Article 50 are going to be disappointed.
Queen's Sapphire Jubilee should be marked with a bank holiday.
Finally a Tory proposal I can get behind.
Finally a Tory proposal I can get behind.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Farage has top men working on Earthxit.
Top men.
Like astrophysicist and Nobel Laureate Paul Nuttall.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Also somebody pointed out to me today that Tim Farron is an anagram of Minor Fart. Once this knowledge goes viral, the Liberal Democrats will be finished.
I find it unfair that his name isn't Tim Farnon; it's just that one substitution away from being an anagram of "informant".
CyclopsRock
Member
I think the whole grammar thing works better in the tripartite system it was originally presented in (and in the time, admittedly). We only see grammar schools as doing very well and comps doing comparatively badly because there's absolutely no provision for those who aren't academically minded (and granted, not many are academically minded at the age of 10, but still).
If it were actually a system that, for want of a slightly better term, "sorted" people into appropriate schools for whatever aptitude they had thus far shown (with some room to manouvre afterwards for those incorrectly sorted), then I don't think the siphoning off of the upper middle classes into the more academic sphere would actually be a problem. That said, expecting a school system to keep in step with the job needs of the next ~50 years is unreasonable. I say all this as a grammar school boy.
If it were actually a system that, for want of a slightly better term, "sorted" people into appropriate schools for whatever aptitude they had thus far shown (with some room to manouvre afterwards for those incorrectly sorted), then I don't think the siphoning off of the upper middle classes into the more academic sphere would actually be a problem. That said, expecting a school system to keep in step with the job needs of the next ~50 years is unreasonable. I say all this as a grammar school boy.
Jezbollah
Member
Just happened (the Lords vote). Government lost again.
Nice. Fuck May
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Pretty significant loss, too.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
Well if the PM can wait a year, this hasn't been the end of the world in over 100 years. It can delay the timetable completely which is big, but still.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliament_Acts_1911_and_1949
The Lords can only delay things 1 year at maximum if the House of Commons won't budge.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Right, but if the Lords hold out for a whole year and negotiations take the expected two years, you're smack bang on a general election just a month or two after the deal is concluded. That could put May in a really difficult position.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
Well, that's the problem with running referendums that will have enormous consequences are aren't remotely evenly supported between levels of government and across the sovereign state in general.
It can potentially work, but it will be incredibly challenging. This is just the start, this is nothing.
CyclopsRock
Member
They're asking for a snap general election wherein she will win a majority of sufficient size that they can't readily oppose it. Hard to see what their goal is at the mo.
Pancake Mix
Copied someone else's pancake recipe
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-rejects-snap-election-calls-as-not-in-countrys-interests-a3483441.html
Seems like the perfect time as it would allow her to wait out the House of Lords comfortably with plenty of time to spare, as well as gaining more seats due to Labour's poor leadership right now.
But really, all for a couple more years they will probably get anyway and a few extra seats from a Labour that is relatively tolerant of Brexit at the moment? I can see why it may not be wise.
killer_clank
Member
Due to Hammond moving it to November there's going to be 2 budgets again this year so I'd imagine the November one will be more substantial.
Bony Manifesto
Member
FlammableD
Banned
Glad to hear the tories latest standup routine will save the economy
It was pretty brief. Barely got any buzz words in there too.
Biggest surprise for me was taking a few bob from company directors. That's Tory heartland isn't it?
Not really a fan of the Guardian not only sticking the gif on their front page (first time ever they've used a gif) but repeating the gif 5 times in a row in one article.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/mar/08/philip-hammond-best-budget-jokes
nofunallowed.jpg
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/mar/08/philip-hammond-best-budget-jokes
nofunallowed.jpg
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
They've actually had a few gifs now. Spotted one last week.
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/solar-industry-budget-2017-800-per-cent-tax-increase-green-renewable-energy-a7618191.html?amp
Britains solar industry is facing devastation and consumers could see energy bills rise after the Chancellor Philip Hammond refused to listen to pleas to cancel a planned tax hike of up to 800 per cent on rooftop solar schemes.
The Solar Trade Association described the Governments refusal to bend over the increase due to come into force in April as nonsensical and absurd.
Bizarrely, state schools with solar panels will be forced to pay, while private schools will remain exempt.
Britains solar industry is facing devastation and consumers could see energy bills rise after the Chancellor Philip Hammond refused to listen to pleas to cancel a planned tax hike of up to 800 per cent on rooftop solar schemes.
The Solar Trade Association described the Governments refusal to bend over the increase due to come into force in April as nonsensical and absurd.
Bizarrely, state schools with solar panels will be forced to pay, while private schools will remain exempt.
CyclopsRock
Member
That is crazy because it is the cheapest and most popular source of energy."
Maybe you should pay some tax then?
Maybe you should pay some tax then?
Fernando Fernandez
Member
Print medias headlines for tomorrow are not impressed with the budget at all. You do not cut the brakes on the White Van Man.
Jezbollah
Member
This Guardian article seems to sum up nicely the feelings I had with regards to yesterday's Budget and Corbyn's "response"
killer_clank
Member
You have to think this govt has gotten so full of itself that they could avoid critical headlines from the Brexit loving right wing papers.
Also shows the utter idiocy of their pledges at the last election, because they're having to break their own manifesto they're getting bad headlines from something that economists say makes sense.
Like I've said before, May's government is borne aloft by a total lack of opposition from the left rather than any relationships it's cultivated with the press or any particularly broad support from Tory MPs, and her grasp on power is therefore more tenuous than one might think. Unfortunately for, well, the country, that means she's more likely to pander to the far right to keep that wing of her party - and the right wing press - onside (as we've seen with her nonsensically prioritising a "clean Brexit").
CyclopsRock
Member
Exactly. Despite her tiny majority, she's hardly against the ropes. Given the Tory poll lead, Corbyn's ineffectiveness and Labour's fear of a general election, there's really no better time to do the things that they think are "unpopular but necessary". Save the giveaways and good headlines for when they need it, I guess.
The image of laughing Tories while they announce a National Insurance increase, thereby breaking a manifesto pledge, should be a nightmare for them. The front pages of the papers today should have them panicking.
But instead they'll be fine. 'White Van Man' won't vote for Corbyn even if he promised the world.
But instead they'll be fine. 'White Van Man' won't vote for Corbyn even if he promised the world.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
Didn't you hear? Raising NI for the self-employed is fair!
Let's ignore the fact that they don't get any job security, sick pay, pension scheme, or maternity / paternity leave.
Fairness for all!
Let's ignore the fact that they don't get any job security, sick pay, pension scheme, or maternity / paternity leave.
Fairness for all!
Not wanting to jump to their defence, but not all of this accurate right? They specifically said that they believed this was warranted precisely because some of those benefits are now available to the self-employed (a pension at least).
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