Jack Scofield
Member
The game has really dragged ever since arriving on this pirate island. So far I'd have to say its my least favorite Uncharted game. It just feels so different from all the other ones, and not in a good way.
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Uncharted 4: A Thief's End |OT| You're gonna miss this ass
- Thread starter BaraSailey
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midasmulligan
Member
It's iteresting cause I must be losing it. I am definitely not getting the vibe of the general consensus. Really hoping it picks up
Mr.Fletcher
Member
Input lag killed the combat in ROTR for me. It's a shame too, as you have lots of options - more than any Uncharted game.
It was a step up from the 2013 reboot in ever single department but I preferred the latter for some reason.
Jack Scofield
Member
It almost feels like a soft reboot that removes everything I loved about Uncharted 1-3. The grounded, more realistic tone is my number one gripe with the game so far. Not sure why Naughty Dog decided to drastically change this series four games in, but it's their prerogative, I suppose.
Ascenion
Member
The story to me is part of the experience. I concede that Uncharted 4 is the better experience. TR2013 and ROTR had collectibles that fleshed out the environment so you could try to understand more what had happened on the island same as Uncharted 4. Uncharted 4 came across as heavy handed with these as some of them seemed necessary for character development not just additional exposition.
I agree Lara does feel floaty but I prefer that to auto platfroming that uncharted has. I actually feel in control of Lara not just along for the ride. Location wise I felt ROTR and Uncharted 4 were on par it just depends what you look for.
I agree with the comment about Uncharted being streamlined and tight, which is exactly why UC4 is disappointing because that's all of the things it isn't. Uncharted 4 has far too much wasted space where there is nothing really propelling the plot forward which kills momentum and pacing. ROTR honestly does a better job of this in context with TR2013 leading to my better sequel comment and better Uncharted comment. ROTR has slow moments but they aren't heavy handed, the puzzles that fill them are better, Lara feels like a genuine explorer and I never felt lost or aimless in these areas. I never questioned why they were the way they are. ROTR and Uncharted both introduce new gameplay mechanics but only one truly lets them shine. Uncharted 4 is the antithesis to Uncharted 3. Where UC3 put set pieces and bombast above all to its detriment I'd say UC4 utilizes narritive to the same negative effect.
And here's a post where I completely agree with you. I found RoTR genuinely bad. It had a bad story, bad acting, bad level design, bad art design, bad writing and worst of all worse combat than the previous entry.
It's pacing is non existent since CD were happy to dump you in an area then throw a thousand collectable icons on your map and call it a day.
The guns all felt like pea shooters, even the shotgun was disappointing, and the stealth was about as robust as Uncharted 4s.
Traversal is dull and its rope swing mechanic is so limited it might as well only be there to open doors which in real life could be burned or exploded open because they're wood (these are also mechanics in the game, making this even more ridiculous).
The only interesting thing it has going for it is the bow.
In my opinion it's not even trying to be Uncharted anymore. It's trying to be Batman meets The Last of Us with some crap story that takes itself way too seriously. I can't think of a single area in which the game combines traversal with combat in any meaningful way so you basically end up with horizontal shooting galleries and relatively flat zones with small peaks to climb and collect some junk that somehow transforms into a new stock for your beebee gun assault rifle.
We all know TR's story is a joke compared to Uncharted but I think he meant it plays better like its game mechanics are more evolved but idk.
These are great but they are really rare and IMO don't justify the unbalanced proportion of moments where you're tossed into an empty level with paths that have nothing. The game design doesn't succeed at making this type of gameplay worth entire chapters of scavenging small empty rooms.
This is absolutely agreeable, but climbing with pretty animations on pretty mountains and cliffs can get very old and dry if entire chapters are based on it instead of the more thoughtful U4 action game mechanics IMO.
You're right but those moments in U4 are really small, short and infrequent in proportion to the time spent wandering around, which is why I am feeling like TR handles exploration better overall right now (TBD upon completion).
The vision is optional. It actually came in handy at times when I was lost but that just speaks to how TR is not quite as good at a sense of organic level direction as Uncharted.
I would agree except I wouldn't say what you are doing is much more fun when it comes to non-action gameplay. For all the reasons I described.
Bear in mind when I said 'favorably' re RotTR, I didn't mean 'it's as good as/better than'. I just meant it doesn't come out completely fucked up by Uncharted 4.
I'd give TR2013 a 6/10 with highs of 9/10. I'd give RotTR an 8/10 with highs of 10/10. Uncharted 4 is a through-and-through 9.5/10 (I hate giving decimals but I can't quite give UC4 a straight 10) with a lot of its time at 10/10.
The thing about RotTR is that you can lose yourself in the adventure quite often - like it's not so much about the yarn as Uncharted 4, but just adventuring adventuring adventuring, with a lot more challenge built into the moment-to-moment gameplay (fighting wolves in a forest, escaping traps in tombs, a bit more risk in the platforming - eg 'oh you got that ledge - but your grip is slipping, press X) and it all gels far better than it did in TR2013. RotTR is a far better game.
That is just crazy. You are just talking crazy now. Tomb Raider 2013, and Rise of, basically have no stealth. Stealth is a temporary state you're in at the very beginning of a level/area, there is practically no cover/hiding mechanic, it's so rudimentary, and usually you're spotted and in gunfights for the next 20 minutes/rest of the level.
I can boot up the Jungle fight in Uncharted 4 and play for literally two hours (literally because I did this exact thing last night and had a blast) toying with the AI and stealth, losing them, ambushing them, attacking them, flanking them, etc, and enjoying a surprising amount of mobility and 'sneaking' from them, too. That's right - if an enemy in Uncharted 4 sees you while you haven't seen them, they will creep up without raising an alert and grab you from behind with a 'stealth attack'. Happened to me in Uncharted 2, happened to me in TLoU, happened to me in UC4.
To compare Uncharted 4 and RotTR's combat - especially re stealth - is an absurd thing to do. RotTR's general combat is serviceable but has nothing on Uncharted at all.
Effigenius
Member
Obviously opinions are going to differ. I'm only at chapter 10 so far in UC4, so not far enough to make a full comparison, but SO FAR, both games have qualities that are superior to the other game.
Uncharted 4: Superior:
Graphics
Story
Cinema - really feels like a playable movie
Little details - things like that easter egg
Better characters
Rise of the Tomb Raider Superior:
Combat
Open World - Great fun just running around, hunting animals, while the levels in Uncharted 4 are more like Call of Duty, in that they are a series of set pieces that you are walked into.
Don't get me wrong, I'm enjoying U4 quite a bit, but more for the story and cinema than the actual gameplay. I think Gameplay wise I prefer RotTR, but I love the other elements going on in U4.
ROTR and Uncharted 4 are both great games with very different strengths. Uncharted 4 is an orchestrated thrill ride of a totally different nature once you get past the similar-ish jumping and climbing. Because it's more linear it also allows for more tightly scripted plot. But I feel the TR writing is quite solid
The 2013 TR got too much criticism for the fact that you slaughtered 300 people after breaking down post- first kill. That just comes with this sort of game. In fact I thought it worked well as a revenge fantasy of sorts, where you got the shit knocked out of you for the first hour and then raged back. The game had other issues though and felt a little sluggish at parts.
ROTR is a lot better than TR 2013 - every system is tighter, the exploration better, the world more interesting, the tombs more substantial, and it approaches Uncharted-level presentatons in certain aspects. Of course UC4 is the king of polish, but ROTR offers a much more real type of exploration and far superior puzzles.
No reason to fight over them, but rather to applaud the maturation of the single player-focused, linear action adventure - and to observe how two surface-similar games do it quite differently. I definitely hope the TR series lives on now that UC seems to be gone for a while.
(On another note - I wish once you finished UC4 you could choose to replay levels without the gunfights)
The 2013 TR got too much criticism for the fact that you slaughtered 300 people after breaking down post- first kill. That just comes with this sort of game. In fact I thought it worked well as a revenge fantasy of sorts, where you got the shit knocked out of you for the first hour and then raged back. The game had other issues though and felt a little sluggish at parts.
ROTR is a lot better than TR 2013 - every system is tighter, the exploration better, the world more interesting, the tombs more substantial, and it approaches Uncharted-level presentatons in certain aspects. Of course UC4 is the king of polish, but ROTR offers a much more real type of exploration and far superior puzzles.
No reason to fight over them, but rather to applaud the maturation of the single player-focused, linear action adventure - and to observe how two surface-similar games do it quite differently. I definitely hope the TR series lives on now that UC seems to be gone for a while.
(On another note - I wish once you finished UC4 you could choose to replay levels without the gunfights)
What? RotTR definitely has stealth. It has cover, tall grass, stealth kills, travelling above and below enemies via trees and water, respectively. I don't know if you can return to stealth after being detected, though. If I did that I can't remember doing it.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Yea No. There are many encounters in the game that can be completely with pure stealth with a variety of tools.
I need video footage of this because every time on the off chance I haven't spotted an enemy the detection meter will start to get raised and you'll hear an audible "Hmmm? Huh? Saw something." if they see me and I don't see them. That coupled with mechanics like being able to distract enemies with multiple items including enemies themselves. And TR did the whole conveniently tall grass thing before UC, it has contextual stealth. Did you not play TR/ROTR?
MAX PAYMENT
Member
Just caught up to the opening sequence with the boat in the storm. How much is left?
I'd say you're at the less than half left mark. Maybe 60% through?
MAX PAYMENT
Member
Willing to bet money that this isn't a thing.
Huh. It was a few weeks a go I played it last and all I remember was the rudimentary cover system and being able to climb trees. Don't remember long grass and certainly haven't experienced any water stealth.
You 100% can't lose enemies after being detected, though, and that's my biggest grievance. It's huge. You get spotted in one of the larger arenas, then you double back and lose them and sneak around different buildings/cover, you can literally see the enemies' guns tracking you through the walls. It's agonising.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I liked ROTR, its a good game
But its not on the same level on UC4 except puzzles. Like, lets be serious here. Combat, storytelling, visuals, art design, controls, music...like c'mon now fam.
But its not on the same level on UC4 except puzzles. Like, lets be serious here. Combat, storytelling, visuals, art design, controls, music...like c'mon now fam.
I agree, but I'm trying to figure out exactly why.
It's not close to being a drastic change.
Ascenion
Member
You know I would agree but Uncharted 4 has too little of the game part for me to. As I said Uncharted 4 is a better experience but I can't call it a better game. ROTR is the better game to me.
I'm sure I've got footage of it happening. Will have a root around. If it happens to me again I'll get footage.
I'm 100% confident it happens in TLoU (they even shout 'I've got him! He's here!'), I'm about 80% confident it happens in UC2, and I'm about 50% confident it happens in UC4 - a slightly fuzzier memory - but why would they remove it? It's not like the most complex AI behaviour. These AI already do far more complex things.
Hah, yeah, I obviously rarely/never used it in my playthrough. None of the stealth struck me as being compelling - clearly not enough for me to even remember the mechanics.
I think they're just each very good at doing very different things, but UC4 has an unprecedented level of fidelity and polish, giving is a powerful edge.
Finished the game this afternoon and loved it. I'm going to miss these characters. The nostalgia has already kicked in. Glad there's Blood & Wind coming in 2 days to avoid the infamous post-great-game-depression.
The slight shift to more narrative/exploration was expected since the Druckmann and Straley takeover. I get the disappointment coming from those who are more into the gunfights and explosions, but as much as I love the series, I've always found the gunfights a bit boring and tedious. Egoistically, I'm perfectly happy with the balance of this episode.
Loved the setting, loved the story, loved everything Naughty Dog does well, like making you feel the adventure, making you laugh, hitting you right in the feels, the level of detail, objectives always being perfectly clear, and so on. We're always asking authors to let their series rest before it's to late and it begins to suck, but man, it hurts when they do. I'm truly gonna miss this ass.
The slight shift to more narrative/exploration was expected since the Druckmann and Straley takeover. I get the disappointment coming from those who are more into the gunfights and explosions, but as much as I love the series, I've always found the gunfights a bit boring and tedious. Egoistically, I'm perfectly happy with the balance of this episode.
Loved the setting, loved the story, loved everything Naughty Dog does well, like making you feel the adventure, making you laugh, hitting you right in the feels, the level of detail, objectives always being perfectly clear, and so on. We're always asking authors to let their series rest before it's to late and it begins to suck, but man, it hurts when they do. I'm truly gonna miss this ass.
I think what you say sums up tomb raider well, it's a blend of many different flavours trying to find a voice whereas uncharted is confident at what it is so it doesn't add what isn't necessary
RetrospectiveLamb
Member
Just finally finished the game. It was definitely my favorite of the Uncharted series. The exploration and story felt so personal. Gonna miss this series, characters, and world Naughty Dawg created, but I can't wait to see what new IP they will create next.
Net_Wrecker
Member
I haven't played Rise of the Tomb Raider yet (I'll pick it up later this year when the PS4 edition comes out), but I will say that Uncharted 4 is making me look back on Tomb Raider 2013 more favorably. Obviously the narrative is garbage tier compared to UC4, but damn man, I was more satisfied from a gameplay standpoint with that game than I was with UC4, even with TR'13's ultra linear encounters and not knowing when to calm the hell down with all these explosions and falling, holy hell.
It kills me how UC4 never sustains its momentum with combat. That's the most mechanically deep part of the experience, and they constantly cut it off for near-passive traversal and/or narrative. TLOU absolutely had better and more involved pacing than UC4. How can chapters 11-16 have so few small/medium size encounters that help keep the intensity going at a steady clip? How can Ch. 16 be so slow? How can Ch. 19 be so bad? How does Ch. 21 have the only interesting platforming in the game?Why is Jadakiss as hard as it gets? Why is the industry designed to keep the artist in debt?
Speaking of Tomb Raider
tbh
tbh....
Tomb Raider Anniversary >>> all of these games being mentioned except for UC2
It kills me how UC4 never sustains its momentum with combat. That's the most mechanically deep part of the experience, and they constantly cut it off for near-passive traversal and/or narrative. TLOU absolutely had better and more involved pacing than UC4. How can chapters 11-16 have so few small/medium size encounters that help keep the intensity going at a steady clip? How can Ch. 16 be so slow? How can Ch. 19 be so bad? How does Ch. 21 have the only interesting platforming in the game?
Speaking of Tomb Raider
tbh
tbh....
Tomb Raider Anniversary >>> all of these games being mentioned except for UC2
No, the supernatural twists suck.
You always start at the beginning, so you can't pick other checkpoints later in the chapter. There is no cutscene viewer. I'm guessing it's because they're realtime now and it would take a while to load?
btw, on RotTR: I was fully expecting that game to be better than TR13, but it really wasn't. Was kinda disappointed with it, since there was so much stuff they could improve on. Upgrading and exploring felt just as useless as it did in the original. The story and characters are somehow even worse than TR13 too.
Spring-Loaded
Member
Not as much as these long-ass climbing segments though
Mr.Fletcher
Member
I might have said it earlier in the thread, but I'm intrigued to see how people feel about Uncharted 4 by the end of the year.
I think opinions might sour.
It's my favourite Uncharted but I don't think it's the best one.
I think opinions might sour.
It's my favourite Uncharted but I don't think it's the best one.
Wrong. They are great.
And I was really disappointed at the lack of any supernatural twist in this game.
Ascenion
Member
How? They only add to the pulpy nature of the series.
Jawbreaker
Member
I was hoping for grey aliens, personally.
So I've been wondering about this game. I played Uncharted and Uncharted 2 and enjoyed them. I wouldn't say I was crazy about them, but I had fun. I skipped 3 despite having it on PS+, but then along came Last of Us and I loved the shit out of that game. Top 5 all time material for me. Did they take anything from Last of Us, or is it more of the same Uncharted, which like I said isn't bad, but I felt like I had my fill of what the series has to offer after 2.
Dang, she's not taking Drake's absence well.
Lys Skygge
Member
I would say it's a good balance of Uncharted and The Last of Us. If you enjoyed the exploration and narrative of TLoU, then you'll likely enjoy Uncharted 4. If you like your games to feature a lot of combat, you'll likely be disappointed. But what combat UC4 does have is MUCH better than previous entries.
Isn't there encounter select?
If I had to pick something I would say the combat is what I got tired of in the older entries so if it's limited in UC4 then maybe I am more interested in it.
By the same respects, is UC3 worth playing? I could always throw it on the PS3 but I figured it was more of the same from 1 and 2 and just never got around to it.
Lys Skygge
Member
If you like the characters then I'd say play UC3. It has some great moments. It might make you appreciate the story in UC4 more.
Spring-Loaded
Member
You should try it out to see what it's like.
