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[Ev1L AuRoN]

Somehow, ND became the total antithesis of what Uncharted is. I rather see the franchise rest than butchered by their creators.

But in the event they deliver, That will be absolutely awesome. I really miss Uncharted...

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Find me any sales numbers that suggest it did well. The game sold 4 million copies and then fell of the charts. It didn't do well.

They absolutely want to reform the game and give it a second lease on life but much of these plans were in motion before the game even came out.

What?
The game was the #5 biggest selling game in the USA in 2020. The biggest PlayStation seller in there that year. It sold over 4M copies at full price in 3 days. It broke even on day one and was printing money by the time that first weekend ended...

The game was just last month inside of Europe's top 20 best sellers...almost 2 years after release and ahead of games like Spider-Man Miles Morales and just behind the latest Call of Duty. You constantly find it inside the UK's charts, Germany, etc...

Did Ghost of Tsushima flopped even more badly even after Jim mentioning it as a huge success story?
Cause that one got a re-release exactly a year after release...sounds like they were in a hurry there

Imagine still trying to paint this game as a failure, lmao.

 

[StateofMajora]

No thank you, not from present day naughty dog.

 

[Valt7786]

As much as I'd love another one, even one playing as the daughter would be pretty cool, but...if Druckmanns at the helm of it I'd be very very wary of it ngl.

 

[Amiga]

Should never be over. Drake is a pulp character that can go on in perpetuity. forget about the family drama and make the stories about the characters in the adventure itself.

 

[yurinka]

I do believe the next Uncharted will go in one of the two directions
1. we play as Sir Francis Drake or someone close to him
2. we play as the

Spoiler

daughter

of Drake and Elena

The good direction would be to play with Nathan Drake as main protagonist. Either all the game or a majority of it, and then in the other part to play some of these characters or Sully.

There is absolutely no reason to don't use Nathan Drake. To replace Nate would be a bad idea, like to make a Super Mario without Mario, a Halo without Master Chief, or a God of War without Kratos. It would be worse and would perform worse, as we saw when that happened in these series.

Nate is an icon of the videogames industry, and he must continue there. If in terms of lore they don't want to bring him back again to the action for new adventures after the events of Uncharted 4 (it's easy to give him an excuse to go back to the action), they can always make prequels where they explain additional adventures Nate and Sully had before Uncharted 1 or between the Uncharted games.

 

[Neolombax]

Are they going to make Chloe cave Drake's head in on a rock or something...yea I'd rather not have this kind of sequel thanks. Just give the series a rest.

 

[Topher]

I'd love to see more like Uncharted: Lost Legacy. That was a damn good game.

 

[kyliethicc]

Tell me what happened after.

The game fell off the charts immediately. It had no legs. Go look up npd charts for the time period and PSN downloads.

Was probably outsold by ghost of Tsushima.

Nope lol

Find me any sales numbers that suggest it did well. The game sold 4 million copies and then fell of the charts. It didn't do well.

They absolutely want to reform the game and give it a second lease on life but much of these plans were in motion before the game even came out.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Nope lol

Only people that don't follow sales will say this was a flop, lmao

 

[kyliethicc]

Only people that don't follow sales will say this was a flop, lmao

Yeah the game literally still charted last month lol

 

[realcool]

I'll save you $70 (tax not included):

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

[0neAnd0nly]

I'm in the hard pass camp.

Uncharted series in top 10 gaming series for me... heck, maybe even top 5. Was instrumental in turning the tides of Playstation 3 around.

BUT yeah, ND and the industry today are very different than when UC premiered. This series will be ruined, and will do the opposite of appeal to it's former base.

I would imagine the game would start off with Nathan being killed, and whatever transpires won't be very... great.

 

[saintjules]

I think a Sam/Sully adventure was the most I've heard being wanted by fans. Or maybe a backstory of Sully when he was younger.

The Daughter was also one, but it sounds like something far into the future.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I'm in the hard pass camp.

Uncharted series in top 10 gaming series for me... heck, maybe even top 5. Was instrumental in turning the tides of Playstation 3 around.

BUT yeah, ND and the industry today are very different than when UC premiered. This series will be ruined, and will do the opposite of appeal to it's former base.

I would imagine the game would start off with Nathan being killed, and whatever transpires won't be very... great.

Sadly, I think you're right. Prove us wrong, Neil. Please!

 

[Pilgrimzero]

IMO, New game will be half Cassie and half Nathan.

Probably, Cassie is off on her own adventure and things go sideways. Nathan comes out of retirement to go after her.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

What?
The game was the #5 biggest selling game in the USA in 2020. The biggest PlayStation seller in there that year. It sold over 4M copies at full price in 3 days. It broke even on day one and was printing money by the time that first weekend ended...

The game was just last month inside of Europe's top 20 best sellers...almost 2 years after release and ahead of games like Spider-Man Miles Morales and just behind the latest Call of Duty. You constantly find it inside the UK's charts, Germany, etc...

Did Ghost of Tsushima flopped even more badly even after Jim mentioning it as a huge success story?
Cause that one got a re-release exactly a year after release...sounds like they were in a hurry there

Imagine still trying to paint this game as a failure, lmao.

Seems like you're trying to create a straw man argument.

I never said the game was a failure. I said it underperformed, which is relative.

Ghost of Tsushima almost certainly met or exceeded expectations and there is evidence though vague that both games sold about the same amount, which doesn't make them both successful, which comes down to expectations based on strength of IP, budget, e.t.c.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

We don't have numbers past 4 million. Obviously the game sold more than that at this point, but how much more we do not know. Regardless, there is nothing suggesting the game didn't sell as well as ND hoped.

That we don't have numbers is a good indicator of that...

Can you share some data to back up your claim?

After 12 months it only outsold GoT and Miles Morales that come after it. After 13 months it drops out of the top 10, meaning after it's first month GoT outsold out, which isn't to say it outsold it overall, but it does speak to the game not having legs.

 

[Topher]

That we don't have numbers is a good indicator of that...

No, it isn't. See kyliethicc 's post. TLOU 2 was the fourth top-selling game in the US for the 12 months after it launched. NPD called it a "massive sales success".

 

[kyliethicc]

No, it isn't. See kyliethicc 's post. TLOU 2 was the fourth top-selling game in the US for the 12 months after it launched. NPD called it a "massive sales success".

Don’t waste your time lol

 

[GymWolf]

I mean, it can't be more boring and shitty paced than u4...right?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

No, it isn't. See kyliethicc 's post. TLOU 2 was the fourth top-selling game in the US for the 12 months after it launched. NPD called it a "massive sales success".

I didn't realize that NPD was the arbiter of whether games were successful or not. I concede. /s

 

[DeepEnigma]

I didn't realize that NPD was the arbiter of whether games were successful or not. I concede. /s

Prove it wasn't a success. The onus is on you.

 

[Topher]

I didn't realize that NPD was the arbiter of whether games were successful or not. I concede. /s

When it comes to video game sales in the US, yeah they absolutely are. So yes, you should concede. Because you are wrong.

 

[Salty Popsicle]

Now that a proper Indiana Jones game is being made, the Uncharted franchise can take a long break.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Prove it wasn't a success. The onus is on you.

When it comes to video game sales in the US, yeah they absolutely are. So yes, you should concede. Because you are wrong.

I surmise that the game didn't perform to expectations because

#1 Sony hasn't released numbers for what amounts to their biggest original IP (debatable with God of War) and the game came out nearly 2 years ago.
#2 The game dropped off the charts precipitously after its launch month
#3 The game was seemingly overshadowed by GoT in sales performance and totally outsold from July 2020 to June 2021.

That we don't know the number of units sold is a big reason for concern. If you think the game was successful, tell me how many units sold and how many units is successful for a game of this level. I don't think the onus is on me at all. The only number we received was 4 million units initially. We know that GoT has gone on to sell over 8 million copies. If it has sold more than LOU2, I'd say that LOU2 was a disappointment from a sales perspective. Also note that UC4 sold over 16 million copies. I'd assume that LOU2 expectations would be in the ballpark of UC4 if not higher.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I surmise that the game didn't perform to expectations because

#1 Sony hasn't released numbers for what amounts to their biggest original IP (debatable with God of War) and the game came out nearly 2 years ago.
#2 The game dropped off the charts precipitously after its launch month
#3 The game was seemingly overshadowed by GoT in sales performance and totally outsold from July 2020 to June 2021.

That we don't know the number of units sold is a big reason for concern. If you think the game was successful, tell me how many units sold and how many units is successful for a game of this level. I don't think the onus is on me at all. The only number we received was 4 million units initially. We know that GoT has gone on to sell over 8 million copies. If it has sold more than LOU2, I'd say that LOU2 was a disappointment from a sales perspective. Also note that UC4 sold over 16 million copies. I'd assume that LOU2 expectations would be in the ballpark of UC4 if not higher.

None of that is proof.

 

[SlimySnake]

Find me any sales numbers that suggest it did well. The game sold 4 million copies and then fell of the charts. It didn't do well.

They absolutely want to reform the game and give it a second lease on life but much of these plans were in motion before the game even came out.

TLOU2 outsold Ghost of Tsushima in 2020. It also stayed ahead of Ghost of Tsushima by the end of March. That's 9 months after GoT's launch.

 

[Topher]

I surmise that the game didn't perform to expectations because

#1 Sony hasn't released numbers for what amounts to their biggest original IP (debatable with God of War) and the game came out nearly 2 years ago.
#2 The game dropped off the charts precipitously after its launch month
#3 The game was seemingly overshadowed by GoT in sales performance and totally outsold from July 2020 to June 2021.

That we don't know the number of units sold is a big reason for concern. If you think the game was successful, tell me how many units sold and how many units is successful for a game of this level. I don't think the onus is on me at all. The only number we received was 4 million units initially. We know that GoT has gone on to sell over 8 million copies. If it has sold more than LOU2, I'd say that LOU2 was a disappointment from a sales perspective. Also note that UC4 sold over 16 million copies. I'd assume that LOU2 expectations would be in the ballpark of UC4 if not higher.

You are claiming lack of evidence as evidence. That's not how it works. NPD called it "massive sales success" in the US. And yes, the onus is entirely on you to back up your own arguments. So far, you only have assumptions and conjecture.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I surmise that the game didn't perform to expectations because

#1 Sony hasn't released numbers for what amounts to their biggest original IP (debatable with God of War) and the game came out nearly 2 years ago.

Sony also didn't share sales data for God of War or Horizon Zero Dawn. But when they did announce, those games had hit 20 million sales. Could we have dubbed them as failures just because Sony didn't announce the numbers although the games had sold 20 million copies?

#2 The game dropped off the charts precipitously after its launch month

Um, no. As Kylie mentioned, the game charted really well and was even the 6th best-selling game in the U.S, above Ghost of Tushima. You should show the data that contradicts this or accept this.

#3 The game was seemingly overshadowed by GoT in sales performance and totally outsold from July 2020 to June 2021.

That we don't know the number of units sold is a big reason for concern. If you think the game was successful, tell me how many units sold and how many units is successful for a game of this level. I don't think the onus is on me at all. The only number we received was 4 million units initially. We know that GoT has gone on to sell over 8 million copies. If it has sold more than LOU2, I'd say that LOU2 was a disappointment from a sales perspective. Also note that UC4 sold over 16 million copies. I'd assume that LOU2 expectations would be in the ballpark of UC4 if not higher.

But the onus is on you. Nobody made any assumptions; you did.

You said that the game hasn't sold as well as the studio wanted it to, implying that you know the sales numbers as well as the studio's expected sales figure. I pointed out that you're assuming. You said you're not assuming, again implying that you have access to insider data.

Now you're not sharing anything. Of course the onus is on you.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You are claiming lack of evidence as evidence. That's not how it works. NPD called it "massive sales success" in the US. And yes, the onus is entirely on you to back up your own arguments. So far, you only have assumptions and conjecture.

NPD can't determine what is or isn't a success anymore than anyone else can. Is NPD gauging what sony would have expected the game to sell? Are they taking the budget into consideration? You're also basing it off their initial response to the games early success.

TLOU2 outsold Ghost of Tsushima in 2020. It also stayed ahead of Ghost of Tsushima by the end of March. That's 9 months after GoT's launch.

Now do May and June 2021.

 

[SlimySnake]

NPD can't determine what is or isn't a success anymore than anyone else can. Is NPD gauging what sony would have expected the game to sell? Are they taking the budget into consideration? You're also basing it off their initial response to the games early success.




Now do May and June 2021.

Why? What happened in May and June?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Sony also didn't know the same with God of War.

Or Horizon Zero Dawn. But when they did announce, those games had hit 20 million sales. Could we have dubbed them as failures just because Sony didn't announce the numbers although the games had sold 20 million copies?

Um, no. As Kylie mentioned, the game charted really well and was even the fourth best-selling game in the U.S. You should show the data that contradicts this.

But the onus is on you. Nobody made any assumptions; you did.

You said that the game hasn't sold as well as the studio wanted it to, implying that you know the sales numbers as well as the studio's expected sales figure. I pointed out that you're assuming. You said you're not assuming, again implying that you have access to insider data. Now you're sharing anything. Of course the onus is on you.

My assumption is that the studio would have wanted LOU2 to perform as well as UC4 or nearly as well. All evidence points to that not being the case.

We know that GoT did 8 million, with a lot of that probably coming from the director's cut. After Month 1 of LOU, it's been pretty much neck and neck with GoT. for the first 12 months it is ahead of GoT but as of Month 13 it falls off entirely.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Why? What happened in May and June?

In May LOU2 is one spot ahead of Miles Morales and two spots ahead of GoT for the last 12 months of sales (meaning including LOU2's launch) Miles Morales and GoT did not launch in June.

In June 2021, Miles Morales and GoT remain, but Last of Us drops off the list entirely, meaning that a great percentage of its sales came in its launch month and the game didn't have tremendous legs if you look at the NPD list for each month since its launch.

 

[DukeNukem00]

Sony also didn't share sales data for God of War or Horizon Zero Dawn. But when they did announce, those games had hit 20 million sales. Could we have dubbed them as failures just because Sony didn't announce the numbers although the games had sold 20 million copies?

They did show numbers for both of those, numerous ones. First weeks, month, year and so on.

Also, was just wondering how the flying fuck does NPD have any clue about sale data. Googled a bit:

"NPD uses sales data, such as checkout tracking from retailers and distributors as well as consumer-reported purchasing behavior, and offers consumer panel and retail sales tracking services, special reports, analytic solutions, and advisory services."

consumer reported purschase behaviour ? Consumer panels ? Special reports ? Advisory services ? Basically they're pulling shit out from their ass and inventing EVERYTHING that doest come from a retail box in a store. Jesus christ, i had no idea

 

[Flutta]

I'm in the hard pass camp.

Uncharted series in top 10 gaming series for me... heck, maybe even top 5. Was instrumental in turning the tides of Playstation 3 around.

BUT yeah, ND and the industry today are very different than when UC premiered. This series will be ruined, and will do the opposite of appeal to it's former base.

I would imagine the game would start off with Nathan being killed, and whatever transpires won't be very... great.

Agreed. ND is sadly run by agenda driven individuals that care more about delivering a message than making a puré gaming experience.

I fear that the GOW franchise is headed the same direction.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

This is probably solely because of the movie's sales.

I see it like this (I like Uncharted, btw)

3 games, 4 technically.
U4 releases under the helm of Druckman. Drk n srs.
Epilogue leaving a door stop for future games with strng wmn.
LL comes out, testing the formula with a duo of strng wmn.
UNCHARTED IT TOTES THE DONEORZ.
Movie is filmed
U4&LL Remaster released to promote movie
Movie sells Tom Holland gangbusters
Hollywood Druckman sees $
UNCHARTED IT TOTES NOT THE DONE
Sequels with strng wmn and possible old Drake cameo, but he had a terrible accident that made him look identical to Tom Holland.

 

[Topher]

NPD can't determine what is or isn't a success anymore than anyone else can. Is NPD gauging what sony would have expected the game to sell? Are they taking the budget into consideration? You're also basing it off their initial response to the games early success.

You didn't make any reference to Sony's expectations or their budget when you said it wasn't the success they wanted it to be. So by your own criteria for NPD, you are not qualified to deem the game a success or not.

And no, I'm referencing the tweet that was over a year after the game was released. Not their early game success at all.

They did show numbers for both of those, numerous ones. First weeks, month, year and so on.

Also, was just wondering how the flying fuck does NPD have any clue about sale data. Googled a bit:

"NPD uses sales data, such as checkout tracking from retailers and distributors as well as consumer-reported purchasing behavior, and offers consumer panel and retail sales tracking services, special reports, analytic solutions, and advisory services."

consumer reported purschase behaviour ? Consumer panels ? Special reports ? Advisory services ? Basically they're pulling shit out from their ass and inventing EVERYTHING that doest come from a retail box in a store. Jesus christ, i had no idea

NPD has been a trusted source of video game sales numbers (and other industries) for many many years. You can call it "pulling shit from their ass" if you want, but that's a really silly take to be honest.

 

[kyliethicc]

None of that is proof.

And none of it true

 

[DukeNukem00]

NPD has been a trusted source of video game sales numbers (and other industries) for many many years. You can call it "pulling shit from their ass" if you want, but that's a really silly take to be honest.

its the default from when retail boxes were purchased from stores which is easy to get numbers from. Like it says there, retail tracking and checkout. But in a world dominated by digital, their sources are guess work, estimations and projections. They are without question innacurate, as they dont actually have a clue how much what sold. Only publishers know in the digital space

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You didn't make any reference to Sony's expectations or their budget when you said it wasn't the success they wanted it to be.

And no, I'm referencing the tweet that was over a year after the game was released. Not their early game success at all.



NPD has been a trusted source of video game sales numbers (and other industries) for many many years. You can call it "pulling shit from their ass" if you want, but that's a really silly take to be honest.

I've literally mentioned that left and right, but you've made huge assumptions otherwise and excluding Sony's likely expectations is not coherent in making an argument about this games' performance.

We can't know for sure that Sony would expect better than UC4, but LOU outperformed all previous uncharted games and the remaster did even more so. Add the larger userbase and this game probably should have outsold UC4 and I think we can all agree that it certainly didn't.

NPDs numbers used to be a gold standard and realistically theyre all we have, but they can't say whether a game is successful or not. That's patently ridiculous given that they also don't track amazon or digital. Not knocking them, but it isn't their place to determine "success"

 

[SlimySnake]

In May LOU2 is one spot ahead of Miles Morales and two spots ahead of GoT for the last 12 months of sales (meaning including LOU2's launch) Miles Morales and GoT did not launch in June.

In June 2021, Miles Morales and GoT remain, but Last of Us drops off the list entirely, meaning that a great percentage of its sales came in its launch month and the game didn't have tremendous legs if you look at the NPD list for each month since its launch.

You mean this chart? Of course, TLOU2 drops off entirely if you dont include its first big month of sale. ALL games are top heavy and sell the most in their first month. The fact of the matter is that in the 12 month rolling period from its launch and 11 months since GoT's launch, it was outselling GoT.

If the game didnt have legs, it would not have kept up with GoT for literally 11 months after its launch. The difference between TLOU2 and GoT's first three day sales was only 1.6 million. TLOU2 sold 4 million units, GoT 2.4 million. That's a $100 million. The fact that GoT couldn't make up $100 million in the next 10 months is proof that TLOU2 had legs.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You mean this chart? Of course, TLOU2 drops off entirely if you dont include its first big month of sale. ALL games are top heavy and sell the most in their first month. The fact of the matter is that in the 12 month rolling period from its launch and 11 months since GoT's launch, it was outselling GoT.

If the game didnt have legs, it would not have kept up with GoT for literally 11 months after its launch. The difference between TLOU2 and GoT's first three day sales was only 1.6 million. TLOU2 sold 4 million units, GoT 2.4 million. That's a $100 million. The fact that GoT couldn't make up $100 million in the next 10 months is proof that TLOU2 had legs.

GoT got new legs with the directors cut which let it reach 8 million. That GoT is still in line with LOU2 for this period prior to the directors cut release, suggests that LOU2 didn't sell much more than 8 million, if it even reached that much at all...

 

[kyliethicc]

GoT got new legs with the directors cut which let it reach 8 million. That GoT is still in line with LOU2 for this period prior to the directors cut release, suggests that LOU2 didn't sell much more than 8 million, if it even reached that much at all...

1 month later and Ghost falls off the chart too genius

 

[Mibu no ookami]

1 month later and Ghost falls off the chart too genius

And gets another boost with the release of the directors cut... keep up...

 

[Topher]

Don’t waste your time lol

I should have listened to you.

 

[DeepEnigma]

So back on Uncharted. Not going to lie, I am Jonesin for another one right about now.

Hopefully with Nolan North and Richard McGonagle, etc, and keep the films separate.

 

[kyliethicc]

And gets another boost with the release of the directors cut... keep up...

 

[SlimySnake]

GoT got new legs with the directors cut which let it reach 8 million. That GoT is still in line with LOU2 for this period prior to the directors cut release, suggests that LOU2 didn't sell much more than 8 million, if it even reached that much at all...

So GoT needed DLC and a PS5 only re-release that was literally $70 to take over TLOU2, and somehow that means TLOU2 didnt have legs?

8 million in one year isnt that bad to me. It doubled its 4 million initial sales which is pretty respectable. Most games are top loaded including GoT. I think your overall opinion might have some merit, and its entirely possible that the sequel didnt meet Sony's projections or Joel's death or the poor user response cost them sales, but the data unfortunately doesnt prove it definitively. I do think ND and Sony are probably having internal discussions about the response to this game, and they might end up changing a few things about the themes and dreary hopeless nature of the game. Even Game of Thrones had some moments of levity and had good guys get a win or two every season.

 

[Hezekiah]

I'm in the hard pass camp.

Uncharted series in top 10 gaming series for me... heck, maybe even top 5. Was instrumental in turning the tides of Playstation 3 around.

BUT yeah, ND and the industry today are very different than when UC premiered. This series will be ruined, and will do the opposite of appeal to it's former base.

I would imagine the game would start off with Nathan being killed, and whatever transpires won't be very... great.

Naughty Dog might be more inclined to make a more woke gane, as is the case with a lot of game companies, but gameplay wise ND have improved significantly - look at TLOU2 versus the original.