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Undertale |OT| Indie RPG with determination and spider bake sales
- Thread starter Earthpainting
- Start date
Yeah, I really enjoyed it. Things took an...interesting turn when they revealed Storm Heroes.
holy shit, that's the best
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
It did not gain love, but LOVE?
Earthpainting
Member
Reading this and looking at the votes, Mercy truly does not seem to be an option.
toastyToast
Member
Undertale the game was the real final boss
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
the good part of this is dumb nerds getting mad at internet polls
In my way...
Everytime a classic falls...that's me.
I'm surprised it isn't nominated for best music. I think it deserves that one more than Best RPG or Most Innovative, IMO.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Finished the "first" ending. Currently in the middle of
.
I'll need to digest my thoughts on it more once I've fully finished it, but my overall opinion is mixed. I think it earns its reputation fairly through its overall inventiveness in presentation and integration of game systems, along with its very strong writing (particularly the characters) and soundtrack. It's all very authentic in its commitment to the vision, and genuinely unique as an experience.
But I'd be lying if I said I was blown away with the pacing and game systems themselves. Honestly, by the end of that first run (and why I'm taking a break mid
) I found myself a combination of bored and frustrated by the various bullet hell and twitch pattern recognition encounters. Admittedly if I were much better skilled at these the experience would be more appealing, but ultimately I found myself pushing onwards to see the story unfold and not because I actually gave a shit about playing it. There's some amazing ideas there in the game systems themselves, but yeah, I just stopped giving a fuck due to the repetition (particularly highlighted on death), the dull gameplay loop, and general monotony of encounters.
And while I seem to be in a minority with this opinion, for my personal taste this represents a problem with the overall design, or at least a direction that doesn't appeal to me. Undertale relies too strongly on the stuff outside of playing the game in order to make you play the game, and while that stuff is excellent, I find that type of design uninteresting and a bit flat. It's not always like this, and the game is at its best when it's accomplishing both, I just feel where it's extremely consistent and wonderful in its inventive scenarios, characters, sequences, and overall presentation it is not even half as so in the game design itself, which has glimmers of genuine brilliance padded by too much mediocrity. And that makes me sad, because it's like playing one of the most wonderfully engrossing and interesting and hilarious RPGs with one of the least appealing encounter/die/repeat feedback loops I've experienced in awhile.
Maybe that's deliberate. Maybe my shitty bullet hell / rhythm game skills are at fault. Maybe Game Maker is a shitty engine for integrating those kinds of systems. Maybe I'm missing the point. I don't know. But Undertale is definitely a game experience I really, really like, but in no way love despite wishing I could.
Time for bed me thinks. I'll finish the rest tomorrow.
true pacifist
I'll need to digest my thoughts on it more once I've fully finished it, but my overall opinion is mixed. I think it earns its reputation fairly through its overall inventiveness in presentation and integration of game systems, along with its very strong writing (particularly the characters) and soundtrack. It's all very authentic in its commitment to the vision, and genuinely unique as an experience.
But I'd be lying if I said I was blown away with the pacing and game systems themselves. Honestly, by the end of that first run (and why I'm taking a break mid
true pacifist
And while I seem to be in a minority with this opinion, for my personal taste this represents a problem with the overall design, or at least a direction that doesn't appeal to me. Undertale relies too strongly on the stuff outside of playing the game in order to make you play the game, and while that stuff is excellent, I find that type of design uninteresting and a bit flat. It's not always like this, and the game is at its best when it's accomplishing both, I just feel where it's extremely consistent and wonderful in its inventive scenarios, characters, sequences, and overall presentation it is not even half as so in the game design itself, which has glimmers of genuine brilliance padded by too much mediocrity. And that makes me sad, because it's like playing one of the most wonderfully engrossing and interesting and hilarious RPGs with one of the least appealing encounter/die/repeat feedback loops I've experienced in awhile.
Maybe that's deliberate. Maybe my shitty bullet hell / rhythm game skills are at fault. Maybe Game Maker is a shitty engine for integrating those kinds of systems. Maybe I'm missing the point. I don't know. But Undertale is definitely a game experience I really, really like, but in no way love despite wishing I could.
Time for bed me thinks. I'll finish the rest tomorrow.
NotDreamcast
Member
Yet here I am in the midst of a genocide run. The desire for a bad time was too much to shake off. Let's see how this goes.
These are my feelings as well. I dont see what the fuss is all about.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
As a person who is somewhat into stg games I thought they were fine if a little easy. Bad pacing for some of the fights though, especially in pacifist.
What made me love the game definitely existed outside of the battle system, but I do like the battle system and feel like it can be refined to something incredibly good. Plus it is pretty amazing with the way it is used to tell a story/expand on the personality of the characters you're fighting. More engaging than your standard RPG menu gameplay anyway.
What made me love the game definitely existed outside of the battle system, but I do like the battle system and feel like it can be refined to something incredibly good. Plus it is pretty amazing with the way it is used to tell a story/expand on the personality of the characters you're fighting. More engaging than your standard RPG menu gameplay anyway.
Seems like you can do more with encounters even after the point of Mercy. I only heard this, but
. I've never seen that because I just mercied as soon as I could, but I'm unsure how many monsters get that kind of effort.
if you keep humming with Shyren and lots of other monsters join in
To really get Icecap Yellow named in the credits you have to do a bunch of wacky stuff you wouldn't think of if you try to spare them as soon as possible.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Keep petting lesser dog.
Just keep petting him.
Just keep petting him.
Isn't playing Undertale now a bit like playing Fez months after its launch? I'm sure by now half the surprise factor is gone.
Panthalassic
Member
I personally really liked the battle system. It pretty much guarantees no grinding needed whatsoever which is always one of my biggest complaints in any RPGs. Plus figuring out and just messing with different monsters' dialogue choices was incredibly entertaining. Did pacifist my first run through and I found the difficulty curve almost perfect. I can see why it might be a problem for others though, I had a friend who despised the battle system and got more enjoyment watching a playthrough on youtube.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
The battle system is very clever, I love how its used to somewhat tell a story and link to the characters. It's a mix of the SMT demon conversations and a shmup and I think they mix very well.
I never found it all that difficult except for the bosses in Genocide.
I never found it all that difficult except for the bosses in Genocide.
Panthalassic
Member
I also loved the battle system. As someone who dislikes turn-based RPG fights, getting to do something to have to avoid damage was really cool. Also I loved figuring out different ways to win and exploring the enemies, so to speak.
i would laugh but after reading his feed he seems seriously unstable. He needs help.
EDIT: Found this though lol
TurboLibre
Member
Like everyone else in the genocide run, I'm having a bad time. I've got pretty far into the last fight but I don't know if I'm invested enough to finish it. I'll mess up often for sure, but I feel like I'm frequently getting hit because of clunky controls. I just can't carefully navigate through a jump cutting bullet hell with a keyboard, and I couldn't get my PS4 controller to work all that great in the earlier runs either.
And honestly, I think it's a better story if he did win. That SOB has earned it.
M0nochromatic
Member
My friends also had a difficult time having never played Bullet Hell style games before. Switching to a pad instead of KB and playing defensively(healing with bicycles when uncertain if they could handle the next pattern) helped alleviate some of the challenge.
I can see where some would get frustrated with the combat system. I'd be lying if I said I didn't like it a lot. I'm doing all these dumb self imposed challenges after all. But watching some lets plays, some people would die on a random encounter and get kicked back pretty far as the last save point was kinda far back and that seems pretty frustrating. I feel like there is kind of a skill threshold that some people don't quite cross that's the difference between almost or never dying on random encounters to dying enough that it's pretty annoying. Depending on which side of that you are, it heavily impacts the way one would feel about the battle system. As I feel like for most people, seeing an encounter take place a couple of times is enough to get the jist of that monster and see what it has to offer and past that it becomes a bore. People that are able to not worry about dying on those encounters are continually exposed to new content in the game and it keeps things fresh.
The bullet hell gameplay is a nice getaway from turn based combat, but the real meat in Undertale's combat is the extensive dialogue. It makes every single monster unique and compelling, and you need to figure out their personalities to overcome them.
Unlike say, Earthbound, where the monsters can be silly and cartoonish, but are ultimately still just packets of numbers you attack with your numbers so you can acquire numbers to make a bigger number.
Unlike say, Earthbound, where the monsters can be silly and cartoonish, but are ultimately still just packets of numbers you attack with your numbers so you can acquire numbers to make a bigger number.
TurboLibre
Member
I was thinking about bicycles for the last genocide fight since I don't need bigger heals, I just need more of them. Not sure how that will play out though. Also, do sea teas stack?
Went into this nearly blind. Came out with a serious contender for GOTY. I've played the OST on my walk to work and back again every day since I finished it.
It even inspired me to get a copy of FL Studo 12 and get back into developing again. You could say if filled me with...determination.
It even inspired me to get a copy of FL Studo 12 and get back into developing again. You could say if filled me with...determination.
M0nochromatic
Member
I don't think so, but that speed boost could potentially be helpful, given it dosen't mess up your timing.
Silvawuff
Member
Got the "Flowey" version of the Undertale merch. It's all high-quality stuff. I can now dress like a proper goatmom.
The "extra" stuff for the "discounted" package is just a postcard with all the characters' faces rubbed off in red with Chara grinning in front, and an extra pin. Clever nod to the fans!
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
I like the battle system plenty and wouldn't want it removed. It's hard to explain. I guess I just don't feel it compliments the pacing and play loop of a pacifist run because I never really felt pressure to "do good" nor felt the game systems held themselves up in complexity that I was excited to "try again" and better my skills on loss. So where I might die against a boss in another game, I know throwing myself up against them again requires mastering the game systems and adapting to changing scenarios. The "fight" in its nuances is different every time, and I get better as I learn and adapt. The difference in Undertale is the the "fights" on a pacifist run are basically the same every time due to the heavy scripting in patterns and fight development. So instead of feeling like I'm adapting to a dynamic battle, every death is just asking me to play pattern recognition, remembering the exact order of events as before and repeating them. And if you're shit like me (which I don't fault the game for) it leads to really monotonous, repetitious battles, almost like playing Simon over and over; repeat the same patterns, dodge the same shit in the same order, complete the same triggered mini-game, etc. Get a little further, die due to unpredictability, restart and do the same shit all over again.
So yeah, in my brain that just leads to a boring gameplay loop where I'm gruelling through patterns just to see the story unfold.
This isn't entirely true though. Well, it is, but more often than not on a very simple level. It's one or two ACTION options out of 3 or 4 choices followed by a dodge-the-thing minigame and then mercy/spare. It gets more interesting with the bosses and mini-bosses as more inventive approaches and richer understanding of the game systems is required, but even then the simplicity and endure-mini-games formula can unfold.
The concept is there and I love it, but yeah. Needs a bit more variety for my taste.
So yeah, in my brain that just leads to a boring gameplay loop where I'm gruelling through patterns just to see the story unfold.
This isn't entirely true though. Well, it is, but more often than not on a very simple level. It's one or two ACTION options out of 3 or 4 choices followed by a dodge-the-thing minigame and then mercy/spare. It gets more interesting with the bosses and mini-bosses as more inventive approaches and richer understanding of the game systems is required, but even then the simplicity and endure-mini-games formula can unfold.
The concept is there and I love it, but yeah. Needs a bit more variety for my taste.
Quote
Member
Wait, what is it supposed to be?
CALLED IT!
Quote
Member
NotDreamcast
Member
Got dunked on exactly 30 times, but made it through the Genocide Route.
Overall though, that was actually... really fun and satisfying.
Also I didn't expect Tsunderplane's defeat animation, lol.
The final attack where sans' blasters circle around rapidly shooting at you was true suffering. I could consistently get through the fight until I would get killed by that attack. Had to take a deep breath when I finally survived it, heh.
Overall though, that was actually... really fun and satisfying.
I wasn't really unnerved by killing everything, but rather more subtle things liking taking pieces from the snowman, or the sudden instances of red dialogue. I really liked the slowed music. Quiet Water in particular struck a chord with me. Would have loved if there were more crazy bosses like Undyne and sans. Those were awesome fights. Though, I suppose that could go against showing how powerful you become in the genocide route. It was a cool effect when the game window shakes around when the world is destroyed. Looking back at pacifist, the mood is so different in genocide, it doesn't even feel like the same game at times.
Also I didn't expect Tsunderplane's defeat animation, lol.