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[IrishNinja]

maaaaan i'm doing the research & i just need to try it for myself, cause i might have to plug the WU into my XRGB just for lack of HDMI's when the PS4 drops...can't find anyone talking about settings though. i still can't imagine why 480i/p Wii games woudln't look better though! argghh

I don't know if this has been posted but the Universal PPU (NES/Famicom RGB PPU) is scheduled for release 19th of October! More info here:
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617

HOLY CRAP YES
okay so that's about $85 US just for the part, which isnt bad...might be time to ask around for modders! awww yiss...wait is this the same guy though? cause right now the Universal PPU site is down for me, and he mentions having a site soon...damn, hope he gets those SCART cables in quick too, this might sell out fast!

*edit wow the impressions sound really promising as well, as far as interference/etc goes...damn @ $100 installation offer but i guess that's about right for the amount of work? not really familiar with this scene too much, i imagine this is a bit more effort than just modding other systems

 

[sixteen-bit]

I don't know if this has been posted but the Universal PPU (NES/Famicom RGB PPU) is scheduled for release 19th of October! More info here:
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617

neat, I'm gonna post this in the NES thread

 

[Beckx]

I don't know if this has been posted but the Universal PPU (NES/Famicom RGB PPU) is scheduled for release 19th of October! More info here:
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47617

Oh, HELL YEAH.

This is great. Wonder if the installation is as hard as the old PPU method?

damn @ $100 installation offer but i guess that's about right for the amount of work? not really familiar with this scene too much, i imagine this is a bit more effort than just modding other systems

$100 seems to be the going rate for the mod work with a Playchoice10 PPU, and it's damn fiddly, I'd never even attempt it. A $90 part instead of the $250 ebay PPU brings this into the more reasonable realm. Want to see if it's reliable first, I guess.

also, buyer beware on modding services: read the thread linked on page 2 of the shmups thread, it seems the guy offering to mod consoles doesn't really do good work. (however, lots and lots of praise for this new chip/board, which is a great sign)

 

[antibolo]

I'm pretty sure that's not the Universal PPU project, it's another thing entirely.

 

[IrishNinja]

^yeah you're right, just noticed that site's back up, small hurdle posted back on 9/22 but i do wish we knew more details on it. think im gonna forward the SHMUPs page to the guy who modded my saturn & N64 and see what he thinks, it does seem a bit daunting but he does good work.

 

[gryz]

finally got a XRGB mini and genesis scart cable, holy shit

 

[plc268]

also, buyer beware on modding services: read the thread linked on page 2 of the shmups thread, it seems the guy offering to mod consoles doesn't really do good work. (however, lots and lots of praise for this new chip/board, which is a great sign)

Who, Drakon? If so, yea, he's the butt of many jokes all over various forums. He encases all his mods in a mountain of hot glue and he has a terrible attitude overall.

If you want someone to do a good job on installing NES related mods, check out the guy over at game-tech.us . He modded my NES for RGB and did a great professional job. I'd bet that he'll be actively looking into installing these boards as well.

 

[BocoDragon]

maaaaan i'm doing the research & i just need to try it for myself, cause i might have to plug the WU into my XRGB just for lack of HDMI's when the PS4 drops...can't find anyone talking about settings though. i still can't imagine why 480i/p Wii games woudln't look better though! argghh

Cuz the Wii U already upscaled them. There's literally nothing for the XRGB to do. But maybe you know that

 

[baphomet]

Wow at the NES ppu up there. Ill be getting one as soon as they start taking orders. Fucking psyched.

Ill buy one as soon as he starts taking orders. It doesnt look too difficult so i might start doing them for anyone interested. I want to do my own first before i decide though.

 

[IrishNinja]

^lemme know, bapho! debating just buying one & holding off till i see what my options are but if you're down that'd be cool man!

Cuz the Wii U already upscaled them. There's literally nothing for the XRGB to do. But maybe you know that

*sigh* cant even just use it as a pass-through, then? wish i could disable the WU upscaling them just to have it done on the unit like the wii plugged in would've

 

[Sixfortyfive]

*sigh* cant even just use it as a pass-through, then? wish i could disable the WU upscaling them just to have it done on the unit like the wii plugged in would've

Just pick 480p from the system menu if you're so inclined.

I'd wager that the Wii U's scaler is faster than an XRGB, though.

 

[IrishNinja]

i could try that...what would you put for WU games though?

 

[Madao]

when i connected the Wii U to the XRGB, games looked a bit weird and some things looked strange in it. i decided to keep it plugged elsewhere because of this. it seems to lack the ability to pass the signal without any modifications.

i ended up getting an HDMI switch and it works good. it switches automaltically between the Wii U and XRGB once one of them is active. if both were active, i'd have to switch with the remote it came with but i never have both of them active so this HDMI switch is practically invisible. it also doesn't affect signal quality or input lag at all.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

i could try that...what would you put for WU games though?

Why would you be using an upscaler for current-gen games in the first place?

I mean, I guess you could use it for 720->1080 instead of relying on the system for that, but even then...

 

[IrishNinja]

yeah, its mostly just cause of lack of HDMI ports...maybe it was my old receiver, but switches i tried (non powered) never worked for me. might try 480p on wii games just to see though!

 

[BocoDragon]

Just pick 480p from the system menu if you're so inclined.

I'd wager that the Wii U's scaler is faster than an XRGB, though.

Wii U doesn't do 240p on VC games, I assume? Unlike the Wii.

yeah, its mostly just cause of lack of HDMI ports...maybe it was my old receiver, but switches i tried (non powered) never worked for me. might try 480p on wii games just to see though!

I'm sure there's got to be some cheap monoprice powered HDMI switcher or something.

 

[Shining]

I'm pretty sure that's not the Universal PPU project, it's another thing entirely.

Yeah, sorry about the mix-up. I'm editing my post.

The guy i hired in doing my RGB Famicom (he resides in Germany) has ordered two of these kits. I'm eagerly awaiting results on how they work with his already RGB modded systems.

 

[Beckx]

If you want someone to do a good job on installing NES related mods, check out the guy over at game-tech.us . He modded my NES for RGB and did a great professional job. I'd bet that he'll be actively looking into installing these boards as well.

Yeah, he's in that thread suggesting that he might want to place a batch order. Getting a fully tricked out NES from him would be just the thing.

 

[DracoBlade]

I have a genuine question: Is there really a significant difference/ motivation to play non-hd/retro consoles on CRT's/artificial scan-line mediators? Aside from the "authenticity" approach to playing the game in its most accurate release era form-whats the benefit to me playing on a tube TV rather than my flat-screen?

sincerely a new collector

 

[Beckx]

The old consoles sending out a 15khz signal look dreadful on a modern tv. You don't need crt though, Framemeister converts and upscaler the signal.

Sometime I'll do some before/after for how games look with a straight composite connection vs Framemeister (you can already see my crappy comparison of the difference between using composite and rgb with the Framemeister in the last page or so - the difference between a straight connection is even more pronounced).

 

[IrishNinja]

authenticity aside, its 99% so-they-don't-look-like-booty-buttcheeks, for me

YMMV (unless its N64 which i think totally looks like poop via composite on HDTV)

 

[Sixfortyfive]

I have a genuine question: Is there really a significant difference/ motivation to play non-hd/retro consoles on CRT's/artificial scan-line mediators? Aside from the "authenticity" approach to playing the game in its most accurate release era form-whats the benefit to me playing on a tube TV rather than my flat-screen?

sincerely a new collector

Depends on what you specifically have and what you want out of the experience, honestly. Even disregarding scanlines and other filters, a lot of moderns sets are just bad at deinterlacing and scaling. It can really do a number to both image quality and latency depending on what exactly you're hooking up and how.

Personally, I don't make a big stink about IQ in general (although I do make a point to calibrate all the equipment I do have to the best of my ability), and I sometimes think scanline fetishists might suffer from some kind of illness, but I value responsiveness in games above almost everything else and wouldn't pay a cent for an HDTV in the first place. That applies to modern systems just as much as retro, though. (All of my current-gen systems are played on computer monitors.)

 

[DracoBlade]

Ah I see. Too my peasant eyes I just currently cant see a difference but a side by side would probably allow me to see it. Thanks for letting me know!


EDIT: @Sixtyfortyfive, I mainly collect PS1 games/SNES and GBA (via Gamecube gameboy player).So would you suggest me using an older non-hd tv If I'm currently without an upscaler?

 

[IrishNinja]

Draco - what type of games? i ask this because playing PS1 games on my PS3 - with its lag coupled to whatever my plasma introduces - there's many games i don't rightly notice. but say Um Jammer Lammy, it's practically unplayable for me. fighters & high intensity SHMUPs likely the same, but i don't mind so much for say square JRPGs or less demanding stuff like that.

 

[DracoBlade]

JRPGS almost exclusively so all the FF's. Chrono Cross, Vagrant Story (essentially anything Squaresoft) etc. also MGS/SOTN and Capcom classics

 

[STG!]

I have a genuine question: Is there really a significant difference/ motivation to play non-hd/retro consoles on CRT's/artificial scan-line mediators? Aside from the "authenticity" approach to playing the game in its most accurate release era form-whats the benefit to me playing on a tube TV rather than my flat-screen?

sincerely a new collector

My motivation in going the CRT route was to not only to play many of the systems/games that you mention while getting the best picture quality, but also get into PCB's using a supergun. Then again, when I decided to go RGB/CRT-only for my setup back in 2000/2001 the only upscaler I recall hearing of was the XRGB2, and even back then I was reading mixed reviews about using arcade games with the device. It wasn't for me.

So it varies from person to person and what you need and want, but honestly, I'll always own a couple CRT's for gaming. Upscalers are really cool, I've played with the tech over the years and it's an interesting solution for modern displays but I prefer the image quality and lagless performance of a CRT.

I was watching my younger brother play Secret of Mana in RGB on the SNES yesterday, the game just looked phenomenal on his PVM. I haven't played that game since it came out using the cables that came with the system, so it was like I was seeing it for the first time. It's a stunning picture.

 

[Beckx]

viletim has updated the NES PPU thread. Says he plans to have lots of stock & is working on the website update now, plus lots of other details.

Kamiya is tweeting about it but only in Japanese.

 

[kitschykitty]

I've kept a slight eye on this thread after I plugged my N64 in to my LED and had it look like crap, so I'm looking for a way to fix that but this thread just confuses the hell out of me, if I wanted to improve N64 games as the priority but wanted to look at snes and nes in the future what should I do? Ideally I'm not looking to go overboard $100-$200, but do I need to buy a modded n64 like the first page suggests?

 

[Beckx]

No, without buying a box like a Framemeister there's no real point.

The problem is that the N64 is sending out a signal that your LCD TV isn't really made for, so it's going to convert it and everything goes to hell.

Getting a modded n64 (and then getting a SCART to component converter) won't fix the problem.

Go to retroRGB.com - there's a great guide that explains all of this. But here's the basic conclusion: Virtual Console on Wii is going to be your better option for direct connection to modern TVs if you don't want to drop $400 on an upscaler.

 

[drhankmccoyphd]

Wii U doesn't do 240p on VC games, I assume? Unlike the Wii.


I'm sure there's got to be some cheap monoprice powered HDMI switcher or something.

There is. I got one once and it was a POS. constant flickering.

 

[GayForMaster]

On my CRT with rgb mods:

Camera quality isn't the best but shit man. It looks outstanding! I bet it'll look even better with an upscalar but for now it looks great and I've not the cash for an upscalar.

 

[Soulhouf]

Is there a special setting for the GameCube plugged via the XRGB Mini?
So far my PS1 and SNES were doing spectacularly but I'm not impressed with the image quality of my GC.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Is there a special setting for the GameCube plugged via the XRGB Mini?
So far my PS1 and SNES were doing spectacularly but I'm not impressed with the image quality of my GC.

What cables are you using for the gamecube?

 

[Soulhouf]

What cables are you using for the gamecube?

S-Video.
RGB isn't an option since I need the sound to be separate.

 

[Dwayne]

S-Video.
RGB isn't an option since I need the sound to be separate.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0007XQA8Q/

Maybe a breakout box would work for you?

 

[Lambda Pie]

i know it's not retro "retro", but one of my neighbours is probably giving me his PS2 (Slim PAL) and i wanna know how can i get the best picture quality possible when hooking it to a LED LCD.

 

[IrishNinja]

by the weird standard of 2 gens past, PS2 might be retro soon! heh....doesnt slim take a component cable?

 

[Shadow Hog]

Probably component cables. The official PS3 ones will work; I believe they use the same connector. Heck, the cheapo ones on Monoprice are probably good enough (I just got these in the mail, will be able to confirm at some point).

 

[Lambda Pie]

ok, component cables. my neighbour's kinda tech savvy, he probably has them. i'll ask.

 

[Shadow Hog]

ok, component cables. my neighbour's kinda tech savvy, he probably has them. i'll ask.

Just don't get it confused with composite cables. Composite is red, white and yellow; component is red, white, another red, blue and green (the first red and white being stereo audio in both cases).

 

[RadarScope1]

by the weird standard of 2 gens past, PS2 might be retro soon! heh....doesnt slim take a component cable?

Yep, we are about to hit that point. The first PS2 games are now 13 years old. Wow.

My own personal standard, however, is that retro constitutes everything before Gen 6. So that's everything pre-Dreamcast. After that, we have a pretty solid handle on 3D gaming and the software just doesn't have an old-school charm. They're just worse versions of current games. I'm going mostly going by the overall tech here, as obviously the popular styles and diversity of games changed quite a bit from Gen 6 to Gen 7.

 

[Bog]

Can any framemeister owners help? For some reason everything works and runs great at 1080p/60, but I want to run at 720p/60 for the more authentic look/scanlines. But during most games (SNES/Genesis/whatever), the picture continually drops out. I'll see the image for a second then it'll drop for a few seconds, then it comes back for a second... rinse/repeat. Is there a way to fix this, or am I stuck running everything at 1080? I've got them hooked up via RGB but I believe this was happening even before I bought the cables.

 

[IrishNinja]

see, i'd like to debate that point, but...it's tricky. you take an early PS2 title with the polish of say MGS2 and it totally embodies what you're saying (sylistically just looking like a lesser version of current stuff), whereas the chunky pixels of 32 bit era MGS1/growing pains of going 3D represent a clear line in the sand of hailing from a different era.

a short time later, GC & xbox show up and look even sharper, and launch titles like Luigi's Mansion - played via component especially - i mean you're looking at 480 SD content but i honestly don't see that gap. obviously i think most of us would love it if, by the twilight of this new gen, we're at a point where the bar's so much higher as to actually create that distance - it can totally be done just graphically, i don't think may today argue the clear 8 to 16 bit gap, for example - but sometimes i wonder if it's gonna be some lateral move like input device that really marks the paradigm, like some Oculus Rift type've experience somehow being more standard down the road.

Can any framemeister owners help? For some reason everything works and runs great at 1080p/60, but I want to run at 720p/60 for the more authentic look/scanlines. But during most games (SNES/Genesis/whatever), the picture continually drops out. I'll see the image for a second then it'll drop for a few seconds, then it comes back for a second... rinse/repeat. Is there a way to fix this, or am I stuck running everything at 1080? I've got them hooked up via RGB but I believe this was happening even before I bought the cables.

what other modes/settings do you have going, and what's happening during the game when drops occur? for one, its not uncommon (well, okay maybe it is during that era, but) for menus or other screens to slightly change resolution, and that'll cause the readjust period.

 

[baphomet]

So stoked for the NES RGB board. Ive got the money for at least 2, hopefully 3. A guy in the UK is having me do one for him, and the other is for myself. Cant wait to get one of these so I can check them out. I think the selectable palettes is pretty awesome as well.

 

[IrishNinja]

^wait ive been skimming & clearly missed that bit, what's that about selectable palettes?

 

[DCharlie]

I think the selectable palettes is pretty awesome as well.

wait - are we talking PAL/NTSC/NTSC-J/Flipper here? That's pretty awesome if so


btw - not that it matters, but when i was actively collecting - i considered PS2 retro

 

[BocoDragon]

I believe you are able to choose one set of colors that is like the original NES, one set of colors that is like the playchoice 10 or RGB NES mods that used its chip, etc.

Most of us will set it to the former and call it a day.

btw - not that it matters, but when i was actively collecting - i considered PS2 retro

PS2 is absolutely retro. I think some people are fighting that fact because more of us remember the console's heyday.

Think of how we thought of the NES in 1996-1998. It was retro as hell when it was 13 years old.

 

[Dice]

Why on earth would you turn scanlines off?

 

[baphomet]

^wait ive been skimming & clearly missed that bit, what's that about selectable palettes?

Yup, its got 3 different ones that will be selectable by a 4 way switch.

Original - composite's pallette in rgb
Improved - a more colorful palette taken from some emulator.
Garish - the playchoice 10 ppu's palette
And then off which just outputs the original signal.

Seriously cannot wait to get these things.

 

[DCharlie]

I believe you are able to choose one set of colors that is like the original NES, one set of colors that is like the playchoice 10 or RGB NES mods that used its chip, etc.

cool - correcting myself here but i put Flipper when i meant Titler and even then i was thinking of the Playchoice

Why on earth would you turn scanlines off?

some upscaler's scanline modes introduce lag.