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[IrishNinja]

I'm taking it that you can simply count the pins on the connectors to identify if it's euroSCART or j21?

not to add to the confusion, but: as i understand it, this may not necessarily work. having no SCART reference, i can't tell one from the other & am totally reliant on the seller's ability to do so, which given the stakes you mentioned about frying ports, leaves me entirely running with retro_console. she's yet to let me down there: i just plug in whatever EU SCART she sends into the adapter (which i also bought from her i recall) for the RGB slot and boom, it's done.

currently i'm trying to figure out the most elegant velcro-like situation to keep all of said RGB cables neat & tidy when not in use/near the terminal. for now i just let them kinda hang & put logos or mascots on them to identify em, haha.

 

[Shining]

Anything I can do about image noise with the framemeister? I've had one for a while now but everything seems to have some noise. It's not noticeable unless I am super close to the TV or there is a dark color on a decent part of the screen but it is pretty annoying. Maybe my brightness settings aren't right? I really don't know.

If you experience a noisy picture you can try to lower or raise the A/D setting found under the "special" menu. It eliminates almost all the noise i get with my SNES.

 

[Peagles]

It seems like people are even getting the euro cables from Japanese sellers that say the cables are for Super Famicoms, but I suppose they are saying that because they are compatible with them just as a j21 connector would be.

Right. Interestingly, within RGB SCART (ie ignoring JP21) you need a different cable for SFC/US SNES to what you need for PAL SNES, so NTSC U/J takes a different cable to the PAL consoles. That's probably why they say SFC, because SNES would mean something different to customers around the world and people would need to specify to get a PAL SNES compatible cable.

The wiring is actually the same, but NTSC has capacitors and PAL doesn't. I actually took the capacitors out of my NTSC one so I could use it on my PAL SNES.

Both those cables work on my PAL GameCube though strangely. It's like it doesn't care whether the capacitors are there or not. If I don't take them out for my PAL SNES, it fades to black and never returns, lol.

 

[ColonelSkills]

When shopping about for a mini, I found an XRGB3 for a similar price.

I know that the 3 has two modes and more inputs, along with a few finer points for adjustibility and so on, but my question is, with all the firmware updates that the mini has recieved so far, is there anything that the 3 does better than the mini anymore? Any reason to consider it overtop of the other device?

 

[Sixfortyfive]

When shopping about for a mini, I found an XRGB3 for a similar price.

I know that the 3 has two modes and more inputs, along with a few finer points for adjustibility and so on, but my question is, with all the firmware updates that the mini has recieved so far, is there anything that the 3 does better than the mini anymore? Any reason to consider it overtop of the other device?

The XRGB3 has considerably less input lag, but only in linedoubling mode (480p VGA output only). It also handles input resolution changes faster because it doesn't have to renegotiate an HDMI handshake when it happens.

 

[ColonelSkills]

The XRGB3 has considerably less input lag, but only in linedoubling mode (480p VGA output only). It also handles input resolution changes faster because it doesn't have to renegotiate an HDMI handshake when it happens.

Yeah, the VGA output mode I am aware of, but the lag that my TV would add would negate any bonus that mode would give me anyway. I don't have the monitor setup to take advantage of that specific feature anyway.

I was more concerned about the scanline generation (unless that got fixed in a firmware update?) or a few of the other issues I've heard it handles "worse". From the sounds of it, that's all been cleaned up?

 

[Voliko]

If you experience a noisy picture you can try to lower or raise the A/D setting found under the "special" menu. It eliminates almost all the noise i get with my SNES.

I recall reading about this setting at the shmups.system11 forum in the past and I tried fiddling around with it but I couldn't get a good result then. Thanks for reminding me about this. You really have to observe what each number setting up or down does to the noise because it's not as intuitive as a simple setting like brightness. I was able to significantly reduce the noise with a suitable A/D setting.

 

[Rich!]

Just a few more images of RGB goodness from my 29" Sony CRT (if anyone cares, lol)

I'm still having trouble taking images of N64 titles though. SNES, Mega Drive, PS1...all fine via my HTC One, but the N64? fucking hell is it hard to get a clear image via camera with that - and I have no idea why. Problem is, it's the one that could do with showing off the most, considering it's RGB modded and all.

I'll try using my dslr at some point.

 

[Borman]

Alright so Ive decided to go with the XCapture-1. What should I be picking up for Euro Scart compatibility, plus I think I need a d-terminal to component adapter as well, right? I know there is the Xsync, but if I could avoid paying almost 100$ more that would be nice

 

[IrishNinja]

i keep meaning to update the FW on my mini, no idea why i'm putting it off...guess it's just general nervousness doing this for any pricey device, even when it's known to be stable.

 

[Beckx]

i keep meaning to update the FW on my mini, no idea why i'm putting it off...guess it's just general nervousness doing this for any pricey device, even when it's known to be stable.

If you're still on the original FW, yeah, you need to update. A lot of good changes. But I haven't heard of any critical updates in the last couple of months.

 

[IrishNinja]

yeah, i'm doing it soon! what all was added?

 

[Bog]

I'm getting these jumpy almost static-looking lines at 720p. They're not there at 1080 though (Framemeister, multiple sources/connection methods).

Any ideas?

 

[Shining]

I'm getting these jumpy almost static-looking lines at 720p. They're not there at 1080 though (Framemeister, multiple sources/connection methods).

Any ideas?

Hm, are you trying to connect a 480i/480p source? If so, in the menu "VISUAL_SET" there is an option called "AUTO_SCALER". Set that to "OFF" and then manually adjust the H_scaler and V_scaler settings. I don't remember the correct settings, but they both should be around the value 5-6. Like this (or vice versa):

H_Scaler: 6
V_Scaler: 5

EDIT* Might not be the problem you are refering too.

 

[Rich!]

As I've posted in the retro gaming thread, I'm moving to the parents for a few months before I move into a new place and I've got to fit a sofa, a bed, a chest of drawers, 9 games consoles, a PC, a 42" LCD and a 29" CRT TV into a 3.4m x 2.5m bedroom. It will either be the greatest room ever or a fucking mess.

Regardless, I may have to store the CRT at another location if my plans don't work out. I'm scared, guys

I don't want to spend £250 on a framemeister - not yet

 

[Peagles]

NESRGB kit just turned up!

 

[IrishNinja]

Hm, are you trying to connect a 480i/480p source? If so, in the menu "VISUAL_SET" there is an option called "AUTO_SCALER". Set that to "OFF" and then manually adjust the H_scaler and V_scaler settings. I don't remember the correct settings, but they both should be around the value 5-6. Like this (or vice versa):

H_Scaler: 6
V_Scaler: 5

EDIT* Might not be the problem you are refering too.

thanks for this, by the way - ive been having some weird effects with some of my scanlines & gonna give this a try.

NESRGB kit just turned up!

awwww shit

 

[baphomet]

NESRGB kit just turned up!

Good to hear theyre showing up. Hopefully they will be here soon as well.

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

I haven't got my RGB cables in, but in the mean time I think s-video on Framemeister looks really great! Still need to play with settings.

Ooohhh! My scanlines looked weird (one thin, one thick) but I set my output to 720p (TV is 1080p) and now everything looks right! Wowwwww~~~~ <3 <3

I'm in love with this thing.

 

[sixteen-bit]

no kidding, that looks excellent for s-vid.

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

I can't even believe this. DOA was always one of those games that ran at a weird looking resolution which made it look sharp, but less detailed or something. It looks awesome on here!

Someone also said that it doesn't do much for games with prerendered backgrounds and I don't think that's the case. I've played though most of FFVII on PS3 with the filtering off and it looked good, but a bit messy. The addition of scanlines makes it look fantastic! All artifacts are gone from FMV and backgrounds. Remember when there's a potion or an elixer in a room and you can't see it unless it flashes? Even then you couldn't make it out. I can clearly see what items are in a room without it looking like a blurry mess. This thing is the shit! You don't need RGB in my opinion. This looks leagues better than my own CRT and whatever cruddy inputs your HDTV has for older game consoles.

 

[RadarScope1]

Gah, you're gonna get me lusting after a Framemiester again! Don't have the money or space for retro setups right now...

 

[IrishNinja]

^that does indeed look great for s-vid man!

argh i had the scanlines a bit closer to how i wanted em, then of course updated from 1.08 to stable release of 1.10 FW which of course reset everything, haha. auto-scaler was again disabled, but i forget what i need to turn off to adjust hue & saturation? i'm on normal, natural, 720px60 over HDMI, can't recall what other setting i messed with prior to unlock that.

Saturn stuff again looking gorgeous, and with my NES off to get RGB modded, this house is finally clear of awful composite cables! what's more, retro_console hit me back up & said adding a headphone jack cable to a 32X RGB cable (like her model 1 genny has) would be no trouble, i think i might grab a Master System one along with that & be done, assuming i can find the PSX one. again: anyone got more elegant ideas for bundling RGB SCART cables together when not in use?

 

[Yes Boss!]

Yeah, Framemeister is my absolute favorite way to play classic games. Love the colors, dark blacks and huge image you can get on an HDTV. Beats my CRTs any day of the week. My only gripes are that it is a little sluggish to initially turn on, can take some time to setup at the get-go, and it's crummy 480p PS2 playback. Other than those minor greivences, love the machine.

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

Tons of AES through s-video pictures incoming

Art of Fighting 2

KOF 98

 

[sixteen-bit]

lol, Irish I see you got a TNL account.

If you go back far enough you'll see decade-old threads of folks extolling the virtues of RGB even back then.

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

lol, Irish I see you got a TNL account.

If you go back far enough you'll see decade-old threads of folks extolling the virtues of RGB even back then.

Aww, I miss TNL a little.

Here's how shitty composite looks compares to s-video:

 

[RoninChaos]

What's a good way to play PS2games? Should I look into one of these framemeisters?

 

[patrickthehedgehog]

What's a good way to play PS2games? Should I look into one of these framemeisters?

I'll try it out and let you know either tonight or sometime tomorrow. I've been dragging out consoles all day long. Gamecube looked pretty good through s-video.

 

[RoninChaos]

What are you looking for?

There can be minor differences between specific models when it comes to a number of factors. Varying input resolutions (240p/480i/480p) in particular are common for that era of games and could be something to consider; not all scalers handle interlaced content competently, and some are not a good fit for games that frequently switch resolution on the fly. Some are perfect just for getting 15khz sources to display on 31khz monitors/TVs but won't upscale all the way to 1080p or at least not do it very well. Some scalers lag a little more than others. The types of inputs/outputs vary, although that can be addressed with proper transcoders or converters.

Most people settle on a Micomsoft box of one kind or another, and this page is a pretty good breakdown for those. The main site has a lot of useful information on other processors as well.

Hey man. We met at final round. I'm just looking to be able to play my SNES, genesis, PSOne and PSTwo games on my regular TVs and not have it look like shit. Playing on a CRT isn't going to work with the setup I have unfortunately.

 

[IrishNinja]

AES is such hot shit, look at that man...and yeah, look at all the awful effects composite creates that it rids you of. such a great format just for that distancing.

Yeah, Framemeister is my absolute favorite way to play classic games. Love the colors, dark blacks and huge image you can get on an HDTV. Beats my CRTs any day of the week. My only gripes are that it is a little sluggish to initially turn on, can take some time to setup at the get-go, and it's crummy 480p PS2 playback. Other than those minor greivences, love the machine.

amen! i still don't get the PS2 complaints though, i settled on RGB over component for my feelings on general IQ, but what specifically strikes you as crummy? what does component/RGB over say a CRT do that the xrgb lacks?

lol, Irish I see you got a TNL account.

If you go back far enough you'll see decade-old threads of folks extolling the virtues of RGB even back then.

haha yeah, Mzo got me on there & i should've joined back on that classic Gamefan reunion thread, holy crap is that one cool. ill have to dig up that thread, SHMUPs forum one is the only one i refer to at the moment!

 

[IrishNinja]

okay, went looking into what my options were for DC to framemeister, since the XRGB wiki had this notation about my setup:

New Framemeister users often ask if they should use a VGA to HDMI adaptor to connect the Dreamcast. This is not recommended. While this may seem the most simple way to connect the console, in practise this never produces results as good as the above method and introduces many other potential problems.

so, the Hanzo is $60 before shipping, and as far as i can tell, the one advantage it offers is a 15 khz switch (?) to get around titles not liking VGA, which is neat but then i'd have to sell my current one & still get an adapter. that wiki link has a 2nd option with Arcadeforge, which is a VGA to SCART adapter...but after the enclosure, said switch (assuming i'm understanding correctly & that'd work the same as the hanzo one?), power supply & US adapter it's about $90 before shipping.

I really don't know what the best/cheapest option i have here is, but i do know i should have a powered VGA to HDMI converter for sale soon, heh.

 

[meanspartan]

So my CRT finally crapped out on me after years of service dating back to the 90s when I was a kid. I have a SNES, a Genesis, a Ps2, and a Dreamcast.

When I feel like playing some old games, I usually just suck it up and go composite. Which obviously isn't as good as S-Video, but that now deceased CRT didn't have an S-Video port, just Composite RCA and a Coaxial.

But on a CRT, composite wasn't sooo bad. Now though that my only option is my 39 inch HDTV, I can't really do it anymore. It just looks gross.

My question therefore is where I should go from here. I am toying with the idea of coughing up a bunch of money to buy up a framemeister, as even over composite I was impressed with how much it improved video quality (and I could buy S-Video cables I guess to go even better).

But then, Retron 5 is coming out and that ALSO appears to greatly improve video quality, the difference being that it is going to be $100, not over $300. If the prices were equal, I'd go with the framemeister probably since upscaling > emulation I'd assume. But with THAT much in savings, I don't know. I'm leaning Retron 5. Any reason why I shouldn't be?

 

[sixteen-bit]

There is no way we can answer that without the thing being commercially available. Ask again in April.

 

[meanspartan]

There is no way we can answer that without the thing being commercially available. Ask again in April.

Fair enough, I guess I should of figured that out on my own lol.

 

[antibolo]

So my CRT finally crapped out on me after years of service dating back to the 90s when I was a kid. I have a SNES, a Genesis, a Ps2, and a Dreamcast.

When I feel like playing some old games, I usually just suck it up and go composite. Which obviously isn't as good as S-Video, but that now deceased CRT didn't have an S-Video port, just Composite RCA and a Coaxial.

But on a CRT, composite wasn't sooo bad. Now though that my only option is my 39 inch HDTV, I can't really do it anymore. It just looks gross.

My question therefore is where I should go from here. I am toying with the idea of coughing up a bunch of money to buy up a framemeister, as even over composite I was impressed with how much it improved video quality (and I could buy S-Video cables I guess to go even better).

But then, Retron 5 is coming out and that ALSO appears to greatly improve video quality, the difference being that it is going to be $100, not over $300. If the prices were equal, I'd go with the framemeister probably since upscaling > emulation I'd assume. But with THAT much in savings, I don't know. I'm leaning Retron 5. Any reason why I shouldn't be?

Have you also considered replacing your dead CRT with a Sony PVM?

 

[IrishNinja]

are sony PVM's more prevalent out by some of you guys? ive a few buddies dying to find one but they just don't seem to turn up here, maybe not looking in the right places though

 

[sixteen-bit]

Yes Boss recently posted on IG how he stumbled on another pair of PVMs for $30 each. Some people have all the luck, lol.

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

are sony PVM's more prevalent out by some of you guys? ive a few buddies dying to find one but they just don't seem to turn up here, maybe not looking in the right places though

There is a new one posted on craig's list like once a month where I live. Granted, most of the time they are too small or overpriced. I've never seen these crazy cheap ones. I need to do more flea market shopping

 

[Maxrunner]

What about N64 does it support RGB with no modifications?

 

[Rich!]

What about N64 does it support RGB with no modifications?

Nope.

 

[IrishNinja]

There is a new one posted on craig's list like once a month where I live. Granted, most of the time they are too small or overpriced. I've never seen these crazy cheap ones. I need to do more flea market shopping

you sure it's the right kind? Mzo was telling me he found one out here, but it didn't support RGB.

 

[antibolo]

I paid 200$ for my 20 inch PVM, which according to a lot of people online was not a good deal at all. But beggars can't be choosers.

Found it from a Kijiji ad.

 

[Jamix012]

Now that I have a DVDO VP50 that has all the inputs I really need, is there any advantage in having a LCD/Plasma Screen over a Monitor for my gaming-only screen?

 

[goldenpp72]

Something that kind of confuses me about the OP, it says he believes Xbox 1 has RGB support but doesn't mention the other consoles from that generation.. Isn't Component basically the same? As in, if I use Gamecube/Wii/Ps2/Xbox Component cables shouldn't it be the same as RGB?

Also, I have interest in trying to go this route and money isn't a big issue but, what about Lightguns? Do any retro gamers care about those and have a solution?

 

[Peagles]

Something that kind of confuses me about the OP, it says he believes Xbox 1 has RGB support but doesn't mention the other consoles from that generation.. Isn't Component basically the same? As in, if I use Gamecube/Wii/Ps2/Xbox Component cables shouldn't it be the same as RGB?

Also, I have interest in trying to go this route and money isn't a big issue but, what about Lightguns? Do any retro gamers care about those and have a solution?

Component and RGB are not the same thing.

As far as I know, the PS2 also supports RGB along with PAL Gamecubes.

I solved the lightgun thing by getting a PVM instead of an upscaler.

 

[goldenpp72]

Component and RGB are not the same thing.

As far as I know, the PS2 also supports RGB along with PAL Gamecubes.

I solved the lightgun thing by getting a PVM instead of an upscaler.

So the expensive component cables for the US gamecube are inferior to RGB cables?

 

[Beckx]

So the expensive component cables for the US gamecube are inferior to RGB cables?

No. For anything 480p or above, component is superior. (But at this point, Wii + component is better than paying through the nose for Gamecube + component.)

As always: retrorgb.com:

If you want the best quality from your GameCube, you'll need the official component video cables. They're extremely expensive, but produce a really high quality image and can even be modified to output VGA.

- If you're only a casual GameCube user and don't use the GameBoy Player Adapter, I'd strongly recommend just using a Wii, as it's fully backward-compatible, including the actual controllers. Also, the Wii opens up an amazing door of opportunity, as described in the Wii section of this site.

- The S-Video (for NTSC) and RGB (for PAL) outputs should be good enough for anyone that's not a die-hard GameCube or GBA fan. It's worth giving them a try before dropping a lot of money on a component cable. For PAL consoles, I recommend the same RGB cable linked on the SNES page. For NTSC, try eBay and look for a cheap S-Video cable.

 

[Shadow Hog]

So the expensive component cables for the US gamecube are inferior to RGB cables?

Not exactly. RGB color separation is better (marginally, anyway), but component supports 480p-1080i (Gamecube only using the 480p part of that range), while RGB maxes out at 480i.

 

[antibolo]

RGB and component are two similar but separate things, some consoles may support one but not the other.

Generally speaking, RGB is "better" than component because:
1) All console GPUs natively work in the RGB colorspace, so there is no color conversion process between the console and monitor that can deteriorate image quality.
2) The composite sync is on a separate signal, while in component it is mixed with the green signal (ie. "sync-on-green"). As per SCART convention this signal is mixed with composite video though, so unless you get a raw sync signal from the console this may not be entirely true.

With that said! RGB does not support 31kHz, which means it doesn't support 480p or higher resolutions. So if both your console and your output device can use these resolutions, component becomes the better option.