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Vancouver-Age |OT| 125 Years
- Thread starter Firestorm
- Start date
When I was kid, Oakridge mall had an awesome play area. Made going there a treat.
It's gotten too fancy now.
No, I'm saying you can't compare Vancouver to NY and London from a shopping, restaurants, etc perspective. We're not in that tier of city, but we are in the world-class tier. I think everyone but Subpar would agree with that here.
I agree with those 3 things being an issue in this city. Of course a lot of north american cities have the same kind of rules around their nightlifes so it's about expectations and perspective.
I'm combating someone who's saying Vancouver's shopping has "shit shopping" to try to give this person perspective.
Ah, well that's what world-class shopping brings.
Shopping in Tokyo and New York was people everywhere around me.
yes! that's what it was called. I considered it "south" of new west since it's across the bridge. I guess technically it's southwest.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
See the great thing about Vancouver is it combines a very live-able culture in a beautiful environment, yet still has shopping and restaurants in the same vein as world class cities - of course not directly compare-able because the cities you listed are mega cities where everything originates from.
Enjoy your walmart and board games though. You should just move to a city like Omaha, Nebraska because you can enjoy your Walmart and board games for significantly cheaper price and don't need to whine about everything.
For the rest of us that want that world-class like experience but in a more live-able environment, Vancouver is amazing.
I have a feeling a lot of people saying things like our shopping is out of date either are comparing directly to cities like NY or London where we will never compare, or have an outdated opinion - the amount of luxury retail that has opened up in Vancouver over the last decade is staggering. Even in the last couple of years with the airport mall and Nordstroms.
EDIT - You never answered my question on where you've traveled. As for time spent thinking about it? I like to debate. It's a passion of mine, and I get to do it while taking breaks between working. You seem aggro by the way, you should take a break so you don't get too stressed out. Do some Yoga maybe
Livable =/= not boring
You're not exactly listing out things that make Vancouver fun. You're trying to argue that Vancouver is livable and accessible so it has to be fun. This makes your argument meaningless because you're not detailing anything "fun" but that living here, without activities, is fun.
beat
Member
Liberty4all
Banned
I have to say that at my age (39), Vancouver is perfect. Smaller, safe for families, no traffic, great transit, great shopping, lots of jobs, lots of things to do.
The only shit thing is property prices but I wont be buying for a long time after learning the huge value of being mobile making all of Canada your job market.
The only shit thing is property prices but I wont be buying for a long time after learning the huge value of being mobile making all of Canada your job market.
What activities is Vancouver missing to be fun?
The Last Emperor
Member
Anyone else here part of the start-up scene in the city? As a founder?
It's likely I'm gonna have to leave to the states soon, there's just so much more venture capital available there. But I don't want to live in murrica lol
It's likely I'm gonna have to leave to the states soon, there's just so much more venture capital available there. But I don't want to live in murrica lol
I'm at a startup. Most of our funding is from the US though and our founding team went through an LA-based accelerator. Our CEO usually visits SF and LA on average once a month at least.
Ah Woodword's. My mom used to get my clothes from there.
I miss getting the Consumer Distributive catalogs in the mail. I could eat up an entire afternoon just looking at all the pictures of toys.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
Better beaches, museums, attractions, events, etc.
I would prefer those, but those aren't coming any time soon.
The Last Emperor
Member
I'm based out of SFU accelerator, but I think we're gonna be leaving them soon. We got bigger fish to fry....
Like, what is it about the current ones that aren't interesting to you as a resident of Vancouver? Shit like the Eiffel Tower or Empire State Building aren't interesting as a resident. They are tourist attractions.
I guess maybe it's because I grew up with video games and have a lot of friends with similar interests but I really enjoy living in a city that has places like the Rio Theatre and Stormcrow Tavern. Businesses like Exp Bar can't exist in a lot of cities so I'm glad they can in ours -- especially with local groups who'll organize viewing parties for esports events and whatnot.
I also enjoy living in a city with multiple beaches that are definitely awesome relative to the rest of the country if not as good as say what's in Sri Lanka. I haven't had less fun at the beach than I have at beaches in other cities? I like hanging out at the beach and BBQing lazing around more than swimming so that might be the issue. I appreciate that I can go for a hike up a mountain then have lunch by the water on the same day (which feels amazing by the way).
beat
Member
Even in a city with truly world-class museums, how many hours a year do most people spend at them? Gotta be awfully low.
The beaches might not be great, but the parks are pretty nice.
As for events, the jazz festival's great, the fireworks are fun, there's smaller-scale stuff that's fun like Parade of Lost Souls (RIP Public Dreams Society though)...
Subpar Spatula
Banned
Yes, and what does this have to do with me finding Vancouver boring? Vancouver isn't the only boring city. Trying to compare and say, "well other cities are boring too" means nothing overall.
You've found things you enjoy. That's good. Other people may not enjoy those things.
I love museums. Traveled places to visit them as well.
This is the problem with these arguments: "Vancouver has all these fun places, it's totally fun". You're not accepting people don't find Vancouver fun. Not every one will like going to Storm Crow and the Jazz Festival. People will have varied interests and not all of it will be doing the Grouse Grind or going to Playland. The problem isn't solved by going "but we ARE fun look at all this stuff". It's, "what can Vancouver do better to be more enjoyable and fun for people who dislike it?" I've said I liked museums and the beaches here are terrible but I'm countered with "how many hours do you spend there" and "we got beaches but I don't swim". You're not doing yourselves any favors by framing your argument this way.
I didn't say "well other cities are boring too." When I hear the word "attractions" I think of tourist draws like that. I don't think they have an effect on the fun you can have as a resident.
You're correct that Vancouver doesn't have a world class museum that attracts world-class exhibits -- which I think is more important than merely existing. There's only so many times you can go back and see the Rosetta Stone. You need to have something interesting in town to go back to a museum. That's why I will often go to a museum to see something when traveling but haven't been back to the Vancouver Art Gallery since university.
What would you do at a "better beach" that would give you a better experience than at Wreck Beach or Jericho? You sound angry because we didn't understand the vagueness of "better events."
Vancouver has variety as you obviously realize from the four of five widely different activities and hangouts you listed in your rebuttal. I think that's what's nice about Vancouver. I'm not saying it's perfect and I definitely think it can be better and I already went over that earlier. I think our liquor laws need to be updated to allow for responsible adults to enjoy our booze in more ways. I think our restaurants/bars/clubs need to stay open later. I think our transit system needs to do a better job of getting people home at later times. These are similar critiques my friends from places like Taiwan, Hong Kong, Seoul, etc. have. I think it's a lot more constructive than "better attractions, etc."
Edit: I guess my tl;dr is: What do you not like about these things? You say they all suck or are shit but not really what it is that makes them sucky or shitty so I'm not seeing it?
You're correct that Vancouver doesn't have a world class museum that attracts world-class exhibits -- which I think is more important than merely existing. There's only so many times you can go back and see the Rosetta Stone. You need to have something interesting in town to go back to a museum. That's why I will often go to a museum to see something when traveling but haven't been back to the Vancouver Art Gallery since university.
What would you do at a "better beach" that would give you a better experience than at Wreck Beach or Jericho? You sound angry because we didn't understand the vagueness of "better events."
Vancouver has variety as you obviously realize from the four of five widely different activities and hangouts you listed in your rebuttal. I think that's what's nice about Vancouver. I'm not saying it's perfect and I definitely think it can be better and I already went over that earlier. I think our liquor laws need to be updated to allow for responsible adults to enjoy our booze in more ways. I think our restaurants/bars/clubs need to stay open later. I think our transit system needs to do a better job of getting people home at later times. These are similar critiques my friends from places like Taiwan, Hong Kong, Seoul, etc. have. I think it's a lot more constructive than "better attractions, etc."
Edit: I guess my tl;dr is: What do you not like about these things? You say they all suck or are shit but not really what it is that makes them sucky or shitty so I'm not seeing it?
Subpar Spatula
Banned
If you construe anger from my statements then you're not going to understand my position because you and Tabris seemed to have made your mind up.
beat
Member
Yeah, but "better events" is terribly vague and that's all you said*, so what kind of events do you want then? Cause sometimes, yes, you can't get the thing you want in this place, but sometimes you can and just weren't going to get the thing for yourself and in those latter cases, the complaint is really not the place's fault.
* wrt events, that is
Subpar Spatula
Banned
Better and more frequent museum events that aren't recycled, better night life (hours), less dirty beaches, better restaurants (themed ones are always a bonus), better amusement park and events surrounding holidays there (Fright Night is horrible). Science World is doing good so it'd be nice to see other places change it up like them.
Less dirty beaches? I'm not going to bother with you anymore as you are so off base now. Doesn't matter anyways you can enjoy Walmart and board games anywhere so you should just go to a cheaper city so you don't need to complain for high prices.
The real answer is Vancouver is fun to me.
The real answer is Vancouver is fun to me.
That's sort of what I was going for as far as wanting to know what would make Vancouver "more fun" for you. Like, I'm not trying to change your mind nor do I need my mind changed from "Hey, I enjoy living in Vancouver and have things to do" to "Wow! Vancouver sucks!" I'm just interested in hearing what you think is actionable in Vancouver.
I like what Science World is doing too. I went to their Mystery Night event last year and it was pretty cool. Unfortunately it got a lot more expensive this year
I see where you're coming from with the rest (just isn't stuff I care about) but with restaurants I think we just disagree as there are plenty of places in the city and I'm always up for finding more. I think we live in an awesome spot for food variety tbh.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
And that's good. Other people don't find it fun.
China don't care about affordable housing
"Clark relied on a report from the B.C. Real Estate Association that claimed foreign cash accounts for less than five per cent of Greater Vancouver home sales" lol
"Clark relied on a report from the B.C. Real Estate Association that claimed foreign cash accounts for less than five per cent of Greater Vancouver home sales" lol
Then I recommend you move. Vancouver is made for people more like me then you and it's not going to change.
The only valid comments re no fun city here was firestorms about liquor laws, and bars / transit closing early
Edit - oh and I would rather live in an actual closet in downtown Vancouver then most other North American cities.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
I don't want to move.
You call them valid but don't want to consider the other side. You came into this discussion believing you are right. You were never going to listen to what anyone else said, your post history indicates this.
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
I emailed the mayor of Surrey a couple days ago complaining that the only entertainment in Surrey is a couple of filthy Hells Angel run crackden strip clubs.
Long story short, I'm the reason why Surrey is going to get a symphonic orchestra in the next couple of years.
Long story short, I'm the reason why Surrey is going to get a symphonic orchestra in the next couple of years.
I don't consider your complaints valid, I am saying firestorms are.
You are using the capitals of the world as reference to complain about our tourist attractions, shopping, and restaurants. Well spoilers, we will never compare directly against them until maybe we become the capital of the world in Mass Effect 3.
The unique thing about Vancouver is it combines a level of shopping, restaurants, and amenities that are in the same realm as other world-class cities - with some of the best surround able and immediate nature available to us, a unique cultural demographic, and some of the best urban design and transportation options for a city our size. You complain about beaches, parks, etc - Stanley Park is considered one of the best urban parks in the world.
Here is a national geographic article that has Vancouver as the 10th best city beach in the world and the only beach in the world marked with this kind of climate (non-tropical / colder):
http://travel.nationalgeographic.co...-vancouver-british-columbia_21764_600x450.jpg
This is why I find your statements invalid and clueless. When you make statements like we have "shit dirty beaches", I don't see what you are expecting. Your argument is basically asking for the following:
1) Hawaii beaches
2) NY Museums
3) LA Shopping
4) London Restaurants
5) And none of the live-able issues that being in an absolute mega city or heavy tourism area provide.
This city does not exist in the world.
The issue is you don't listen to anything I say. I re-adjusted my stance after firestorm came in and mentioned the valid complaints against us as a fun city - we are conservative in our nightlife environment and laws. You've never adjusted your stance or taken in. So who's the one that's not listening?
Speaking on subjects other then me and Subpar's dumb argument.
I am loving the new architecture coming into the west end and end of coal harbour. Give it 20 years and that area is going to be really nice. I wish it had a skytrain station. I wonder what the possibility of extending the skytrain underground is?
I am loving the new architecture coming into the west end and end of coal harbour. Give it 20 years and that area is going to be really nice. I wish it had a skytrain station. I wonder what the possibility of extending the skytrain underground is?
That last one looks ugly though.
Also I laughed at the article of the the woman protesting a new west end high-rise because it means ONE tree has to be cut down. "It's the neighborhood tree!" Fuck that, unless this woman is willing to solve the housing scarcity herself that tree needs to go, stop being so selfish
Also I laughed at the article of the the woman protesting a new west end high-rise because it means ONE tree has to be cut down. "It's the neighborhood tree!" Fuck that, unless this woman is willing to solve the housing scarcity herself that tree needs to go, stop being so selfish
I always thought you had good modern European architecture taste. Guess not.
There's going to be a huge problem with anti-Chinese sentiment in this city in a few years (some would say there is already)
It's easy to fix. You just tax vacant homes and real estate speculation. You just need to ensure balance so the investment continues, but we can use the revenue to invest into affordable housing in other parts of Vancouver and also ensure that these places are at least rented out instead of vacant. The vacant home tax should be very high with a 3 month grace period in 3-5 years for things like renovations.
Also this is just for West Vancouver, the demographics are radically different for the GVA. They are just using Vancouver real estate as income shelters from Chinese mainland + ensuring they are able to give their children / wives / etc the great living standards that Vancouver brings.
We don't want to push that away as it's a boon to our economy, it's just about profiting more on it and diverting that profit towards affordable housing projects. And also ensuring that these homes are rented out instead of being vacant.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
Those ultra-rich Chinese buy Ferraris for their kids and pay for their exorbitant tuition (which is why universities are falling over themselves catering to international students). A vacancy tax is chump change to them. They'll probably find a loophole anyway: fly in once a month for a couple days, get a relative to live there, etc.
Oh yes that one in West End with the roof top swimming pool is beautiful. I'd love to live there if I can afford it.Speaking on subjects other then me and Subpar's dumb argument.
I am loving the new architecture coming into the west end and end of coal harbour. Give it 20 years and that area is going to be really nice. I wish it had a skytrain station. I wonder what the possibility of extending the skytrain underground is?
I'm in a good mood today because of the beautiful morning. I walked the Cambie bridge to get to work and I see people cycling, walking their dogs and what not with the fresh morning smell. I went by the VDP station by the Cambie bridge and saw a number of police coming out all smiling and laughing. That made me think about how fortunate I am to be in this city because of these small little things. Despite all the short coming of this city, it is young and growing. You don't face extreme oppression, lawlessness and discrimination here. It is not NYC for its shopping, but I don't shop every weekend. It is not London for its cultural museums, but I am not an history/art critic and frequent museums every weekend. This is a city that offers a little bit of everything and I make due with them. I can do my hobbies here such as hanging out with friends, do nerdy stuff, eating out great food and generally have a good time. I am rarely bored here because I am not one who demands great night life and party every weekend. Maybe it is because I am old, but I like the comfortable life here and I balance my experience here with travels abroad. Having just come back from Mexico City, I think I would rather have the tranquility here than the dynamics yet chaotic vibe of a big city like Mexico City even though it was a fun visit. But to me, I want to live in a city with well run infrastructure and public transportation that you won't see in a big city like Mexico City. Not to only use Mexico City as an example, as I am an immigrant from East Asia, so I know a little bit about those dynamic and chaotic big Asian cities as well.
Again, Vancouver is not a city without its shortcoming, but that will change as the city grows and more people want to do what they want here. This is a city about balance and it shows. Now, if only the real estates here will go down
I'm gonna go with "how is that modern European architecture". I can imagine that kind if building in London or maybe Frankfurt but not many other cities.
Just reading up on CMHC (Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation) step by step list to home ownership, it recommends that your housing monthly payment (Principle + Interest + Heat) should not exceed 32% of your gross monthly income. I think I can do it and I am researching more for affordable places, but I went went like this when I read that:
LOL
LOL
My rent right now makes up... Let's see...34% of my income. Close enough? LOL.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
Probably more than half of people in the lower mainland spend 40 or 50%+ of their income on rent. CMHC seems out of the loop.
Well two points here. Doesn't matter whether it's chump change to them or not, it won't be chump change to the municipality & provincial governments that can use that tax revenue for affordable housing. But yeah, you need to ensure the regulation has careful rules to ensure it's not easy to abuse.
Also if they are buying Ferrari's in Vancouver stores and paying UBC for these students much higher tuition which helps subsidize the education cost for other Canadians, then that's a good thing.
You don't want to push that money away. That Chinese money flowing into Vancouver is part of what has turned us from a budget city that was barely comparable to Seattle into the world-class kind of city we are now.
So it's about balancing trying to minimize vacancy by encouraging rental practices for those income sheltering real estate investments, and also trying to get as much tax revenue as possible from them without pushing them away.
I once at one time in my life had my rent take like 60% of my net salary in the beginning of my career.
I think you're Swedish right? Look to a building like Victoria Tower.
What are the chances governments use that money for meaningful affordable housing? Close to zero, especially since the provincial government will never let municipalities do anything anyway. Not to mention how much affordable housing will be needed for even average families to afford anything inside Metro Vancouver.
And the issue with international students is the system is completely dependant on them now. I work in several school districts and they all fight over who can get the Chinese or Koreans to send their kids here. You have classes where 20 out of 30 can't speak English but they get pushed through because they're paying big bucks to vacation here. Coquitlam, for instance, had their big budget fuck up a few years back partially because they relied so heavily on international ed money that ended up going to other districts. The universities are no different.
Letting people shelter all their money in real estate, fucking up things for people here isn't going to make Vancouver a better place. It'll turn it into San Francisco minus the high-paying employment.
I like the "digital fade" where the top of the building just stops existing, but it doesn't blend well with the rest of the building. It's not like the building just fades away when you go high enough, it's like the building's hat fades away.
7/10
Mr Nash
square pies = communism
The thing to watch in the future will probably be China's own capital controls. Money's been flowing out of there well beyond these limits for years, largely through Macau and to a lesser extent Hong Kong, through loopholes (Linky, linky).
With the problems the Chinese economy has been having since the summer, they're already working on strengthening their capital controls with it impacting the Australian housing market. It could impact Vancouver's as well in that aspect, as well as other cities seeing large amounts of speculation from China. We're still a ways off before we'll see enough data for this, though.
There's still a lot of local buying going on right now because of how insanely low interest rates are, though, and I don't see Poloz raising interest rates any time soon given how weak the Canadian economy is, not to mention Canadian personal debt to income is around 164 percent. Even a small increase in interest rates would financially cripple a sizable chunk of the population. At this point, we'll probably just see most locals get enough rope to hang themselves debt-wise and let the bubble burst naturally.