Support NeoGAF

[Jado]

Don't be misleading simply because you are getting emotionally riled up

LOTR ref, which you mistook as something serious in your emotional rage.

Really curious to hear your interpretation of the ad.

You don't really care. You've made up your mind and have a pre-determined answer that rips into whatever I say, along with a stack of unrelated crime stats.

I find it interesting that art is not meant to encourage or inspire though. Do tell, what is art meant to do?

Anything. Take a photography class instead of being smarmy and intentionally dense. Never said art never, ever serves to inspire, only that in many cases that's not the point. And enough with the fake politeness. What is it with you condescending types and the fake sorries, sirs, and other phony-respectable language?

So I am going to take a photographic picture which depicts a black man being hanged from a tree with some people standing around and looking up at him, and I am going to have this picture hit circulation and reach as many viewers as possible. I mean this is an ad for rope, so it is not a big deal.

Okay. You do that. I'll continue looking at that ad of that woman not-being-raped with no concern and mild admiration at the expert composition.

Curious about the bolding of the 'you' there, you would not happen to be directing that slight at me would you?

Yeah, you.

 

[OttomanScribe]

Are you disagreeing with the implications of the veil?

Clearly. Not just me though, there is a huge volume of literature on the subject. Muslim women's voices should not be ignored, or discussed by Western feminists in their absence. There is a colonial mindset to the whole thing, with Muslim women as subjects, objects to be discussed, without agency.

 

[CoconutTank]

Anything. Take a photography class instead of being smarmy and intentionally dense. Never said art never, ever serves to inspire, only that in many cases that's not the point. And enough with the fake politeness. What is it with you condescending types and the fake sorries, sirs, and other phony-respectable language?

Well, I think I will continue doing what I like to do, and you continue doing what you like to do. Clearly there is no politeness to be had here, but you already know that right?

Okay. You do that. I'll continue looking at that ad of that woman not-being-raped with no concern and mild admiration at the expert composition.

I think you missed a part here:

Would that be art and would it be okay to distribute such an image in as many places as possible?

I mean art can do anything right? So I guess by the answer you have given that picture would count as art and it would be okay for me to distribute that content.

Yeah, you.

That is interesting. First you accuse me of being confused (so I do not know any better), and then later you accuse me of being intentionally dense (so I do know better?). Neither of these accusations are useful for this particular subject, but it is odd that you interpreted my earlier post of implying certain content not being okay as "thinking this ad is commanding us into some abhorrent actions like literally attacking another person".

 

[Jado]

I mean art can do anything right? So I guess by the answer you have given that picture would count as art and it would be okay for me to distribute that content.

Sanky (or his gf?) already pulled the race card with the exact same question 1 or 2 pages back. Yes, it's art assuming it demonstrates some level of skill in the medium used -- although I would question why you feel the need to blatantly rip off an existing piece of photographic history, and whether you're sincere in trying to convey something meaningful or simply being a snarky asshole.

That is interesting. First you accuse me of being confused (so I do not know any better), and then later you accuse me of being intentionally dense (so I do know better?).

They're not mutually exclusive behaviors. You're confused in thinking you can decide so broadly what defines art and what is admissible in public, then you're pretending to be dense in order to feign sincerity and pose loaded questions.

 

[CornBurrito]

since natural breasts are beautiful, no matter their shape,

This is just untrue. Picking up an old issue of National Geographic shows natural breasts that are in no way beautiful. And simply saying that they are beautiful does not make them so.

 

[CoconutTank]

Sanky (or his gf?) already pulled the race card with the exact same question 1 or 2 pages back. Yes, it's art assuming it demonstrates some level of skill in the medium used -- although I would question why you feel the need to blatantly rip off an existing piece of photographic history, and whether you're sincere in trying to convey something meaningful or simply being a snarky asshole.

Nope, I am quite sincere about the concern I am putting forth, and am just curious about where you draw the line (and how you have interpreted that ad). Like I said earlier, if people want to make art like this, that is great for them and I am in no position to stop them (but I doubt that means I am not allowed to question whether it is a good idea or not). I am not concerned with someone having to explain to someone else about any kind of misinterpretations. I am concerned with people somehow taking this in stride and thinking that a marginalizing situation of that exact appearance is okay and letting that sentiment continue to grow. You admitted that there is submission introduced in the ad, I am just curious if there could be too much (for an ad).

They're not mutually exclusive behaviors. You're confused in thinking you can decide so broadly what defines art and what is admissible in public, then you're pretending to be dense in order to feign sincerity and pose loaded questions.

Really? As far as I can tell I have been fairly open ended about art. When I first posted I had questioned what kind of messages people would get out of seeing pictures like that in public (as an ad). Doing so broadly defines art?

In any case, it seems there is at least one interpretation of the ad which makes it impervious to criticism, or impervious to my criticism at least. Since I am in no position to do so, would you like to define what is art (and maybe if invulnerability to criticism is part of that)? Considering that I never really questioned whether the ad is art to begin with, why does the defining of art by either of us matter in this case?

As for the sincerity and the "loaded questions", I said earlier that there is no politeness to be had here. You already know that right?

 

[Brian Griffin]

This is just untrue. Picking up an old issue of National Geographic shows natural breasts that are in no way beautiful. And simply saying that they are beautiful does not make them so.

Those breasts have probably fed more than a few infants in their lifetime. Is giving nourishment to a baby not a beautiful thing?

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. You can hold the opinion that they aren't beautiful, but stating it as a fact is wrong.

 

[CornBurrito]

Those breasts have probably fed more than a few infants in their lifetime. Is giving nourishment to a baby not a beautiful thing?

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. You can hold the opinion that they aren't beautiful, but stating it as a fact is wrong.

Giving nourishment is beautiful in a way, but the breasts aren't.

And yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Which is why the statement "all breasts are beautiful" is just wrong, and I'd argue that making people feel bad for not being naturally attracted to all breasts they see is wrong.

 

[Lionheart1337]

This is just untrue. Picking up an old issue of National Geographic shows natural breasts that are in no way beautiful. And simply saying that they are beautiful does not make them so.

Well this thread took a strange turn.

 

[Brian Griffin]

Giving nourishment is beautiful in a way, but the breasts aren't.

And yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Which is why the statement "all breasts are beautiful" is just wrong, and I'd argue that making people feel bad for not being naturally attracted to all breasts they see is wrong.

Agreed. I also agree that the world is a minefield of advertising and media messaging that really do some real damage to kids who aren't led through said minefield properly. I have an infant daughter and since she was born I've been contemplating the future and started paying more attention to ads aimed at girls and women. I'm gonna have my work cut out for me if things keep going as they are, which they will.

 

[Sanky Panky]

How do you think the issue be addressed? Not trying to be condescending here, genuinely curious.

Sorry for the interlude. Busy work. The author of the youtube video posted in the OP, is going around schools teaching seminars about the very same subject. I remember being shown videos on drunk driving in school, but I think we need to tell kids about date rape, domestic violence, objectification of women in the media, etc. I think on a national basis, it is a start.

Parents alone won't be able to fight it for long, and the government sure won't counter-act on all those advertising dollars. We need to find ways to raise awareness.

You don't really care. You've made up your mind and have a pre-determined answer that rips into whatever I say, along with a stack of unrelated crime stats.

I honestly do care. I want to see what goes on in your mind when you see that ad (the action depicted, not the composition).

This is just untrue. Picking up an old issue of National Geographic shows natural breasts that are in no way beautiful. And simply saying that they are beautiful does not make them so.

You just proved my point of media shaping our views of what a "beautiful" woman should look like. Travel back to the early 1900's, and tell me if you find breasts appealing. Travel forward back into 2013, and women have to jeopardize their ability to nurture children, cut open their chests, and insert silicon fun-bags in order to fit today's standards.

 

[jon bones]

Violence against husbands does exist, too, but men are often too ashamed to talk about it.

if i made a crusade to 'end violence against white people,' i feel that i would be rightly called out for not including everyone.

Ugh, this whole shtick is embarrassing.

 

[BobbyRobby]

Ugh, this whole shtick is embarrassing.

bumping a thread just to feign disgust is a pretty tired move too.

 

[Sanky Panky]

Just found this documentary in Netflix/Hulu. It basically re-enforces everything in this thread.

Really good watch.