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[Airola]

There's even a user on here who admits to being friends with Skin Heads,

Back in the day I was friends with everyone that didn't scoff at being friends with me. I still try to be like that. If you are a skinhead and want to talk with me and hang around with me, go ahead. If you are an antifa member and want to talk with me and hang around with me, go ahead. It's not as if a certain belief or ideology makes it completely impossible for us to have something in common and something to talk about. Not that I'm actively seeking friends from all kinds of groups, as a matter of fact I very rarely seek friends anywhere because I am very much socially awkward in that sense, but if a situation arises that I meet someone and we come along with each other I'm not going to look at his ideologies or religion or race or gender or anything and stop talking to that person or completely leave the friendship because of that.

 

[Snoopycat]

There's even a user on here who admits to being friends with Skin Heads,

I've got a bunch of mates who are skinheads. I go to their Trojan record nights and drinking sessions. Never had or seen any bother except for the time some old fogey tried to relive his Livi punk glory days.

 

[DietRob]

That doesn’t change the fact that he made an accusation and didn’t provide evidence to back it up.

It’s been a tactic used excessively since the GAF enema, where an old member pops in for the first time and then takes a jab at the posters here with broad and insulting generalisations and very little to no proof.

It is totally understandable that some of us have no patience for it anymore and call it out immediately.

It’s quite simple. If someone wants to come in here and label our userbase as predominantly “alt-right”, as a veiled insult, then they can pony up with the evidence. That is more courtesy than what they would be afforded at their usual hangouts.

I USED THE WRONG GOD DAMN WORD. GET THE FUCK OVER IT.

But nah it's easier for you to dogpile me and dismiss my concerns about the way we talk to each other if you don't.

 

[Scopa]

I USED THE WRONG GOD DAMN WORD. GET THE FUCK OVER IT.

But nah it's easier for you to dogpile me and dismiss my concerns about the way we talk to each other if you don't.

I find it hard to believe that you don’t understand the connotations that come with being labeled alt-right in todays political climate. Especially since you used it yourself in an “Alt-right vs left” example. Heck, I’m Australian and I know exactly what it is intended to mean, you can’t avoid this shit. Which is what my original question to you was about.

If you thought the term “alt-right” simply meant that you were a person who uses derisive acronyms to label and mock people like you claim, then why did you leave out the “alt” prefix on the left part of your statement? Because the left does that too. Strange omission.

I think it’s highly likely you posted what you posted, maybe expecting a few likes and pats on the back, but it didn’t go that way. People requested you prove your claim and as a result you have been trying to walk it back ever since.


EDIT: And in the very unlikely event that you genuinely had no idea what the term “alt-right” means in 2018, then I suggest in future you don’t use words you don’t understand. It’s unintelligent.

 

[DietRob]

I find it hard to believe that you don’t understand the connotations that come with being labeled alt-right in todays political climate. Especially since you used it yourself in an “Alt-right vs left” example. Heck, I’m Australian and I know exactly what it is intended to mean, you can’t avoid this shit. Which is what my original question to you was about.

If you thought the term “alt-right” simply meant that you were a person who uses derisive acronyms to label and mock people like you claim, then why did you leave out the “alt” prefix on the left part of your statement? Because the left does that too. Strange omission.

I think it’s highly likely you posted what you posted, maybe expecting a few likes and pats on the back, but it didn’t go that way. People requested you prove your claim and as a result you have been trying to walk it back ever since.


EDIT: And in the very unlikely event that you genuinely had no idea what the term “alt-right” means in 2018, then I suggest in future you don’t use words you don’t understand. It’s unintelligent.

As I said the thought the "alt-right" designation was used similarly to the way the "tea party" uses that word to describe themselves.

If you don't believe me even though I made several posts explain why I thought what I thought then you are useless to communicate with because you are hell bent on your victim complex pitty party. So goodbye.

 

[Redneckerz]

Where did I ever said GAF is a terrible and racist vile place? I’m not sure where that is coming from but it’s not from me. I don’t know why the posts I linked aren’t a good enough indicator for you that the place gives cover to people by allowing them to use that sort of divisive rhetoric. I didn’t link the posts throwing disparaging names at conservative posters but those certainly exist as well and I know that because a few of the ones I could find would be mine (as I’ve already admitted a few times) and I need to be better.

You weren't saying that, however (And as is now painfully clear) we were discussing different issues: I was referring to specific examples pertaining to posts that would showcase that this site is problematic, you were highlighting posts around the term alt-right.

Its funny how you can see where the flaw is occurring, but your mind isn't registering it as such. In any case, my apologies (Your explanation later highlights this perfectly.)

I feel like maybe we are misunderstanding each other. The only thing I’ve been trying to communicate is that divisive rhetoric is not conducive to good communication because it immediately puts the attacked party on the defensive and shuts down productive conversation in favor of more bomb throwing. Allowing a community that kind of rope only strangles it and decreases the status of the board.

Bullshit. You are just a nazeh. /s.

I feel like you are trying to talk on the level with me so I want to make sure we aren’t talking past each other based on a misunderstanding perpetuated by other members who aren’t trying to engage on the level.

That i did, and that is sadly what happened, unfortunately. To be fair: I was not influenced by the other posters here - I made the mistake myself of not registering properly what you were talking about, and the fact the comments are open enough to be interpretable to both sides of the coin just made it worse.

It seems the problem here comes from the clash of annoying terms.

I was referring to a different issue when i was asking for examples, but admittely, we were discussing sideways, and for a long time! So an apology is in order.

That being said, i am disappointed that P Pavaloo once more liked a post (from you this time) but has not taken up the offering to shed his own views regarding this site.

 

[bitbydeath]

There's even a user on here who admits to being friends with Skin Heads,

I have friends who are christians. Doesn’t mean I am a bad person nor do I support any religion.

 

[Chittagong]

It’s been exactly a month now since I decided to return to GAF to see how things are here. I decided I would only participate this forum for a month, to see whether it can once again become my main destination.

My observations:

1 - I have had a really fun month. I can’t remember when I have last laughed this hard on a forum. The atmosphere is much more relaxed than it was just over a year ago. People joke and are not afraid to be silly.

2 - The amount of content and updates seems fine. All the main news gets posted in gaming. Threads progress in a good enough pace.

3 - Calling GAF an “alt right forum” seems really dishonest. There seems to be people who lean left and who lean right, and they seem to be able to coexist.

4 - People actually write quality posts. Someone actually used scientific journal citations to debate my post, that was awesome.

5 - People liked a post I made over 30 times, crazy! Feels good man

6 - I could use a Pokemon Go / Lets Go community

7 - I am happier and much less stressed!

Overall, unless things suddenly take a turn to the worse , I think is’gonna be GAF for me dawg

 

[Antoon]

Ive been visiting both Resetera and this place for a while now, and I guess I can see that this place leans more towards the right and Resetera is mainly leftwing. Quite an interesting split.

 

[EviLore]

It’s been exactly a month now since I decided to return to GAF to see how things are here. I decided I would only participate this forum for a month, to see whether it can once again become my main destination.

My observations:

1 - I have had a really fun month. I can’t remember when I have last laughed this hard on a forum. The atmosphere is much more relaxed than it was just over a year ago. People joke and are not afraid to be silly.

2 - The amount of content and updates seems fine. All the main news gets posted in gaming. Threads progress in a good enough pace.

3 - Calling GAF an “alt right forum” seems really dishonest. There seems to be people who lean left and who lean right, and they seem to be able to coexist.

4 - People actually write quality posts. Someone actually used scientific journal citations to debate my post, that was awesome.

5 - People liked a post I made over 30 times, crazy! Feels good man

6 - I could use a Pokemon Go / Lets Go community

7 - I am happier and much less stressed!

Overall, unless things suddenly take a turn to the worse , I think is’gonna be GAF for me dawg

 

[Viserio]

Ive been visiting both Resetera and this place for a while now, and I guess I can see that this place leans more towards the right and Resetera is mainly leftwing. Quite an interesting split.

I would say this place leans more towards the middle with moderate (and a few extreme) opinions from both right and left. Era is simply a looney bin of toxicity and political propaganda.

 

[petran79]

Ive been visiting both Resetera and this place for a while now, and I guess I can see that this place leans more towards the right and Resetera is mainly leftwing. Quite an interesting split.

Difference is that there they use the word "fascist" quite often.

 

[Nelsin]

I registered just to see how things going.

Im in love with this place as opposed to 1 year ago.

It just needs a little more members things kinda slow in here.

 

[Eotheod]

It’s been exactly a month now since I decided to return to GAF to see how things are here. I decided I would only participate this forum for a month, to see whether it can once again become my main destination.

My observations:

1 - I have had a really fun month. I can’t remember when I have last laughed this hard on a forum. The atmosphere is much more relaxed than it was just over a year ago. People joke and are not afraid to be silly.

2 - The amount of content and updates seems fine. All the main news gets posted in gaming. Threads progress in a good enough pace.

3 - Calling GAF an “alt right forum” seems really dishonest. There seems to be people who lean left and who lean right, and they seem to be able to coexist.

4 - People actually write quality posts. Someone actually used scientific journal citations to debate my post, that was awesome.

5 - People liked a post I made over 30 times, crazy! Feels good man

6 - I could use a Pokemon Go / Lets Go community

7 - I am happier and much less stressed!

Overall, unless things suddenly take a turn to the worse , I think is’gonna be GAF for me dawg

 

[The Giant]

I would say this place leans more towards the middle with moderate (and a few extreme) opinions from both right and left. Era is simply a looney bin of toxicity and political propaganda.

That's because America only sees left or right, while the rest of the world sees left, right and everything inbetween, which Americans don't seem to understand at all.

 

[brap]

That's because America only sees left or right, while the rest of the world sees left, right and everything inbetween, which Americans don't seem to understand at all.

Jesus christ you mention americans in like every one of your posts. Obsessed much?

 

[Wings 嫩翼翻せ]

Ive been visiting both Resetera and this place for a while now, and I guess I can see that this place leans more towards the right and Resetera is mainly leftwing. Quite an interesting split.

I can't say I have any political ideals (ever since we've got the big man in office, I have chose not to follow this left/right stuff) but though I tend to have "left" thoughts (I say this very loosely), this forum is significantly less judgmental and more comfortable than Reset. Like, it's appalling.

 

[blanchot]

I like it, it's definitely slower but there's less hot takes and more informed posts. And it's easier to keep up with the bigger threads.

 

[The Giant]

Jesus christ you mention americans in like every one of your posts. Obsessed much?

That's cause most people here and on resetera are american.

 

[Saruhashi]

Ive been visiting both Resetera and this place for a while now, and I guess I can see that this place leans more towards the right and Resetera is mainly leftwing. Quite an interesting split.

I've been the same and I would disagree to be honest.

Most posters here do seem to be left leaning. I haven't seen anything that makes me think the site in general is "right leaning".

The difference I would point to is that ResetEra takes itself WAY too seriously when it comes to certain things.

As an example, I thought it was funny the folks were referring to the new Battlefield as "Genderfield". Immature? Sure. Funny to me though.
What I mean is that it should be possible to poke fun at games and make jokes.

You wanna refer to Battlefield V as "Genderfield" on ResetEra and see how long you last?

The advantage of NeoGaf is that conversation is actually allowed. Jokes are actually allowed.

I feel like if a poster here disagreed with me then we'd be able to go back and forth on it and at the very least improve our debate skills without on of us eating a ban over something daft.

I'd rather post on a quieter site where I feel free to say what I want than be forced into feeling like any given post could be my last because I don't agree with the status quo.

 

[Leatherface]

It's good to see this forum starting to come around again. I love the new layout. I bailed out for awhile because all the Gaming news screeched to a halt here, but things seem to be coming around. I never quit you GAF. We just needed a break. Resetera is decent enough of a forum as well but sensitivity is a bit off the charts there, where it turns into mob mentality on sensitive subjects and differing opinions immediately get banned. I basically stay out of those discussions all together now because it's not worth it. Anyway, it looks like there have been some positive changes here so I will definitely be stopping by more often. Cheers!

 

[The Elite]

I

7 - I am happier and much less stressed!

Overall, unless things suddenly take a turn to the worse , I think is’gonna be GAF for me dawg

I am starting to wonder if I should make December a GAF only month to see if it relieves any stress.

Strange to think that a video game forum could provide so much stress but I think it might be part of the issue. It's almost embarrassing, really.

 

[cryptoadam]

I hope I don't derail this thread, but the other place just did an update and I will say GAF update is way nicer and better looking. And GAF update was done very quickly and worked right away, ERA is still having issues and is going up and down.

So as far as aesthetics and having the board running after major maintenance I would give GAF a huge thumbs up.

 

[Dunlop]

Haven't posted in a while as my account is linked to a ISP email that I am no longer a part of and just found my password lol.

New layout here is nice.

 

[SpokkX]

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

 

[Musky_Cheese]

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

Really. Heard good majority left that site. Just like they left here.

They are on Twitter and Reddit in case you were wondering.

 

[TrainedRage]

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

I'm sure you are outraged.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

I'm sure you are outraged.

And being dishonest
And trolling imo

 

[TrainedRage]

Gott

And being dishonest
And trolling imo

Gotta virtue signal and get those points.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

Gott

Gotta virtue signal and get those points.

After 99 does it reset to 0 and grant a 1 up?

 

[Lady Bird]

I am starting to wonder if I should make December a GAF only month to see if it relieves any stress.

Strange to think that a video game forum could provide so much stress but I think it might be part of the issue. It's almost embarrassing, really.

When anyone spends too much time on any given platform that is constantly hating the world, they'll likely feel depressed about the world as well. So, coming to a different, more relaxed place is revigorating. Your December plan seems sound, especially since we're around christmas.

 

[thief183]

ONLINE STATISTICS
Members online354
Guests online1,700
Total visitors2,054

According to the stats we are growing really fast lately (1 month ago there were 200 online ppl and around 1200 visitor at the same hour)

 

[Lady Bird]

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

How many game developers does resetera have, in reality? There was that Skyrim poster, who said once that he/ she and other co-workers thought that place was very hostile, before being dogpiled by the community and losing their verafied status.

As a sidenote it seems you can express full-on racist and sexist views against white men at resetera without a ban - if that is your thing.

 

[Dr. Claus]

I am starting to wonder if I should make December a GAF only month to see if it relieves any stress.

Strange to think that a video game forum could provide so much stress but I think it might be part of the issue. It's almost embarrassing, really.

Mate, if a forum is making you stressed out - that isn't a *good* thing. Forums should be go to where you can relax, shoot the shit, and talk about things you enjoy.

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

The majority had left GAF prior to the split and the few that made the jump are either far-left themselves (Jason Schreier, Austin Walker, Patrick Klepek) or have stated openly that the site and their actions have pushed developers away (Skyrim, before he was unverified).

Also provide receipts for these "semi-racist" views that you seem to be finding.

 

[Lady Bird]

ONLINE STATISTICS
Members online354
Guests online1,700
Total visitors2,054

According to the stats we are growing really fast lately (1 month ago there were 200 online ppl and around 1200 visitor at the same hour)

The average is usually 160-260 users. We're getting a members spike because resetera is/ was down, which attracts unusual interest.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

The average is usually 160-260 users. We're getting a members spike because resetera is/ was down, which attracted unusual itnerest.

250 seems to be the number peak Monday thru Friday. It was under 100 9 months ago iirc

 

[Reckheim]

ONLINE STATISTICS
Members online354
Guests online1,700
Total visitors2,054

According to the stats we are growing really fast lately (1 month ago there were 200 online ppl and around 1200 visitor at the same hour)

the ERA site has been having issues this afternoon, I wouldn't read into it too much.

i haven't posted here in a while, site looks and runs really well.

 

[Hobbesian]

The influential, inner circle sect of moderators, admins and celebrity posters at Resetera are largely a stockpile of absurdities and man-children but I don’t find NeoGAF coming back to its former prominence by positioning itself as an “anti-ResetERA”, which is what it seems to be doing.

The fact that this site seems to be little more than a reactionary clique reacting against reactionaries makes it a bit off-putting and kind of petty. You’ll never be able to shuck the label of being an alt-right mirror image of that other site if ResetERA-bashing is continued to be allowed on this forum to this degree. I don’t suggest soft-banning discussion regarding the site completely like those Orwellian idiots over there do regarding this site (the mods don’t actually censor the name, but there are literally people there that are scared to type “NeoGAF” on that website due to anxious uncertainty) but there seems to be more than enough topics that are pages and pages long of people just reacting to the circus show that that website provides, and while I enjoy the circus as much as anyone, it becomes a petty malice if you’re conscious that the participants aren’t consciously trying to put on The Greatest Show on Earth.

GAF has already been through the “Destroy” phase. Now it’s time to Rebuild. It needs to move and forget about those people, or at the very least, stop giving them prominence here that they don’t deserve. A large part of what made GAF great was its courting of industry insiders and there’s zero chance that those types of people come back and interact with this community if they aren’t convinced this community has grown passed The Great Schism, beyond its general previous imperfection, and beyond the narratives that hostile forces have created to oppose it on other website.

So, as a lurker, and as someone that has been part of this community a decade now (my old account was banned over some BS before The Great Schism) I don’t think GAF is in a good place right now.

 

[Quonny]

I like the layout, look, and overall 'feel' of this site more than ERA, but honestly, communities are completely dead. Like not just 'eh, less people', but dead. Since I basically only join forums for their communities, it really kills GAF for me.

I was hoping that after a year the communities would start to fill out, but it really doesn't seem to be the case. Maybe in one more year! And I mean this sincerely, not sarcastically.

 

[notkeylime]

H Hobbesian

For what it's worth, NeoGAF isn't trying to be an anti-RE or anything along those lines. We've had to create a thread to house all the RE discussion given the nature of how RE was created and the cross-pollination of users between sites as a result...but at the end of the day, we're not worrying about what RE is doing or trying to counter-program to try and catch eyeballs.

We're focusing on making this place an engaging place to have discussions, without the moderators scaring the shit out of everyone that they aren't able to speak freely.

It's a tough balancing act of letting people speak freely, and letting people get away with being trolls or exhibiting extremist/dangerous views...but we're fine tuning that as best we can, and always have a group discussion whenever there's a question as to what may be going on.

The last thing we want to do is put our noses into a conversation. We just want the users to feel comfortable posting here and knowing that they aren't going to be removed for not following some common opinion.

That's what GAF was, and always supposed to be...and things are finally back to that after all that nonsense.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

I like the layout, look, and overall 'feel' of this site more than ERA, but honestly, communities are completely dead. Like not just 'eh, less people', but dead. Since I basically only join forums for their communities, it really kills GAF for me.

I was hoping that after a year the communities would start to fill out, but it really doesn't seem to be the case. Maybe in one more year! And I mean this sincerely, not sarcastically.

Everyone is waiting for someone else to get communities going : (

 

[Redneckerz]

Haven't posted in a while as my account is linked to a ISP email that I am no longer a part of and just found my password lol.

New layout here is nice.

Contact a staff member or EviLore to get this fixed if you can't do this yourself for some reason

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.

Please, name me a few - I know one Skyrim developer got piled on and aside of Stinkles, you don't see them post a lot at all.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

As a sidenote, can you kindly supply a list of a minimum of 5 independent posts that support your theory, since multiple people have said this, but none brought forth evidence to have a honest conversation about this.

So, can you be that one exception? You have to understand that reading this same argument over and over and with no back and forth interaction is tedious. You are voicing this argument - Now give it the credibility that you obviously want it to have.

Without it, how else should that statement be interpreted then?

 

[Papa]

Jesus christ you mention americans in like every one of your posts. Obsessed much?

He’s right tho

 

[Quonny]

Everyone is waiting for someone else to get communities going : (

Yeah, it's a chicken-and-egg thing. Unfortunately, I don't really want to spend the time and effort making an OT and posting in a thread no one else is posting in or will even care about.

It is what it is. Sucks.

 

[Musky_Cheese]

Yeah, it's a chicken-and-egg thing. Unfortunately, I don't really want to spend the time and effort making an OT and posting in a thread no one else is posting in or will even care about.

It is what it is. Sucks.

I understand. Maybe in time.

 

[Interfectum]

The thing that made neogaf unique was that it had LOTS of game developers/ journalists/insiders that broke lots of stories FIRST

Guess where they are now? Yep Resetera.
Neogaf is just like any gaming forum today - takes its news from other sources (including from Resetera)

As a sidenote it seems you can also express semi-racist views here without a ban - if that is your thing

Ignoring the last bit I agree with the rest. I don't come to these forums for right/left politics, I mainly come for sales threads, sales data, insider tidbits and hype for games and that seems to happen a lot more on ERA than here now.

I still love GAF's eye for forum design though. This place has always had a knack for simplicity and ease of use whereas Era has been pretty messy.

 

[SpokkX]

As a sidenote it seems you can express full-on racist and sexist views against white men at resetera without a ban - if that is your thing.

Ok, noted

 

[Hobbesian]

H Hobbesian

For what it's worth, NeoGAF isn't trying to be an anti-RE or anything along those lines. We've had to create a thread to house all the RE discussion given the nature of how RE was created and the cross-pollination of users between sites as a result...but at the end of the day, we're not worrying about what RE is doing or trying to counter-program to try and catch eyeballs.

We're focusing on making this place an engaging place to have discussions, without the moderators scaring the shit out of everyone that they aren't able to speak freely.

It's a tough balancing act of letting people speak freely, and letting people get away with being trolls or exhibiting extremist/dangerous views...but we're fine tuning that as best we can, and always have a group discussion whenever there's a question as to what may be going on.

The last thing we want to do is put our noses into a conversation. We just want the users to feel comfortable posting here and knowing that they aren't going to be removed for not following some common opinion.

That's what GAF was, and always supposed to be...and things are finally back to that after all that nonsense.

I mean, it really wasn't. The forum became so popular that it got up its own ass and treated members like fungible abstractions. New members especially became disposable because it was the website full of industry insiders and celebrities that often got suggestions in the gaming press - it was the hard-to-get-into forum everyone wanted to join, so there was never a lack of new members waiting in the wings if the mods decided they felt like ending tens of accounts on a particular day on a whim. The 2016 election exacerbated the issue to comical levels - but to be fair -the election almost literally put entire globe on tilt to the point that it might have shifted the axis of the planet. That might have been the expressed ideal, but it wasn't close to meeting it as long as I've been here.

All that said, it was still one of the best websites on the internet, in spite of that, and for some reasons, because of it.

I'll admit that my perception of this place might not be very accurate, since I haven't interacted much since the schism. Most of the threads that I pay attention to are the ones that are talking shit about the other forum because I like to compare and contrast how both tribes are handling the aftermath of the former fallen state. But in any case, I wasn't really suggesting that the "anti-ResetERA" sentiment was happening at a structural, administrative level, but more on the community level. That's just the general sense I get when I compare and contrast the same topics and nature of the discourse on similar topics on each forum.

 

[Hobbesian]

I'm sorry, but... how the hell do I edit my posts??

 

[dorkimoe]

I'm sorry, but... how the hell do I edit my posts??

Have to be member i think.