Support NeoGAF

[DeathoftheEndless]

Its been confirmed to be false. Surprise, surprise: http://www.vulture.com/2016/10/fans-dont-want-a-mulan-with-a-white-male-lead.html

Edit. By false, I mean the leads are confirmed to be Chinese.

 

[Zoe]

Its been confirmed to be false. Surprise, surprise: http://www.vulture.com/2016/10/fans-dont-want-a-mulan-with-a-white-male-lead.html

That doesn't say the description of the spec script is false.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

Pretty sure I never said what you are implying, but ok? lmfao

Your whole point was in fighting among Asians. Again, what planet do you live on where that isn't common among all types of people's? Just answer the question. I didn't ask a difficult question.

 

[nukedeggs]

im all about embracing differences. Asian folk dont do that tho. and I just have that perspective that we are all the same. the cultural differences are definately there. thai girls are like fucking aliens to me culturally (but I love em) but deep down. we the same.

What do you mean by 'we are all the same'? You then go on to talk about cultural differences, but that's pretty big. What are you saying is the same here?

 

[jerry113]

I'm curious but what is the distinction between China and Taiwan, I know that Taiwan split off from China, but I don't believe that was very long ago so there really shouldn't be any ethnic difference, I know that this is a pretty sensitive topic for some Taiwanese folk, when they get mixed up, or especially when they use China's version of their flag. Or maybe thinking on this a little more China just claimed the island of Taiwan as part of China so they were considered "Chinese" but ethnically have not much to do with each other?

In very rough terms:

After the Qing Dynasty fell and during and after WW2, there was a long term power struggle over control of China by two factions: The Republic of China (led by the Kuomingtang Party) and the Communist Party.

The Kuomingtang Party initially had a heavy advantage, and was supported by US arms deals and training. The Kuomingtang party, led by Chiang Kai-Shek, also represented China abroad in international diplomatic relations. For example, at the United Nations, they held China's seat (and not the Communists).

However, over time the tides turned, and the Communists eventually prevailed over the Kuomingtang over the mainland China. At the last moment, however, the Kuomingtang Party and Chiang Kai-Shek - along with millions of Kuomingtang supporters and affiliates - fled to the nearby island of Taiwan. From there, the Kuomingtang re-established Taipei as their new capital and continued to represent the Republic of China.

The Communists consolidated control of the mainland China and formed the People's Republic of China.

So now, you effectively have two Chinas - one is called the Republic of China (based in Taiwan) led by the KMT party and the other is the People's Republic of China led by the Communist Party. Both claim to be the "legitimate" China.

A funny detail is even after the Communists won like 99% of China's land, the Republic of China (based only in Taiwan) continued to represent ALL OF China at the United Nations for like 20 more years until 1978 when the Republic of China finally got ousted in favor of the People's Republic China. Since 1978, the government in Taiwan and its 25 million citizens have no representation at the UN.

The PRC uses their economic and military might to pressure every other nation into refusing to recognize the ROC as a legitimate sovereign nation to this day.

Since the ROC actually prexists the PRC, one could argue that it's not so much that Taiwan split from China, but almost rather the other way around. Technically, the current government in Beijing started out as the splitting rebel faction that kicked out the former dominant government. It's kind of like if during the US Civil War, the United States got defeated by the Confederate States - but at the last moment, the US quickly evacuates to Hawaii and continues their governance there, leaving the rest of the continent to the CSA.

 

[Kimaka]

Secondly, your posts are full of sweeping generalizations about Asians. Shitty ones. Okay, you don't want a white lead in Mulan. Okay, you want the parts in the movie to go to Asians. Cool. But I like to think that there's diversity among the diverse, yeah? What's the point of adapting a uniquely Chinese story if you're not going to strive to cast those of Chinese descent? I mean, you even agree to that as much, yet you're... fighting against that and yourself in such a sidewinding, demeaning way with your use of language and the way you express yourself, and your opinions. It's weird.

And why take "baby steps" with the casting? This is Disney. They got the cash. We know they got the cash. They got the cash luxury to be able to skip the "baby steps"; I mean, Queen of Katwe is proof of that. They don't have to settle for anything that isn't casting perfection from the get-go. Hell, they could go for the 'all-Chinese cast speaking in Chinese the whole movie and singing in Chinese the whole movie, English subtitles the whole movie' Apocalypto-style, if they wanted to.

A quick look at the cast of Queen of Katwe shows that it isn't close to perfect either. Lupita Nyong'o and David Oyelowo aren't from Uganda nor of that descent. The only cultural similarities that they have with their real life counterpoints are being descendant from Africa which is a huge continent with thousands of different cultures.

Doing the same for Mulan, having actors of East Asian descent, seems like the likely option. Expecting Disney to confine roles to one ethnicity is unrealistic.

 

[BronsonLee]

A quick look at the cast of Queen of Katwe shows that it isn't close to perfect either. Lupita Nyong'o and David Oyelowo aren't from Uganda nor of that descent. The only cultural similarities that they have with their real life counterpoints are being descendant from Africa which is a huge continent with thousands of different cultures.

Doing the same for Mulan, having actors of East Asian descent, seems like the likely option. Expecting Disney to confine roles to one ethnicity is unrealistic.

It's also worth pointing out that they cast a complete newcomer as Phiona Mutesi (the main character), Madina Nalwanga. How new? She doesn't even have a goddamn Wikipedia yet.

They also filmed the movie entirely in the slums of Katwe itself.

tldr; they kept things as authentic as they could, but also cast Nyongo/Oyelowo for their talent and name. I'd say that's fair, like you said.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Your whole point was in fighting among Asians. Again, what planet do you live on where that isn't common among all types of people's? Just answer the question. I didn't ask a difficult question.

pretty sure i was only talking about asians, and its you injecting the other stuff. but since you are so intent on bringing it up, imo, non asian races, from my experience, have each others backs alot more, in fact way more than asians do. are there alot if examples of them not? of course, to imply im saying there isnt at all is just silly. im just saying its on a grander scale with asians, from my perspective due to my experiences. also im not saying its factual. its just how ive seen shit, and you cant take that away from me. just like i cant take your perspective away from you due to your experiences

 

[Anko]

pretty sure i was only talking about asians, and its you injecting the other stuff. but since you are so intent on bringing it up, imo, non asian races, from my experience, have each others backs alot more, in fact way more than asians do. are there alot if examples of them not? of course, to imply im saying there isnt at all is just silly. im just saying its on a grander scale with asians, from my perspective due to my experiences. also im not saying its factual. its just how ive seen shit, and you cant take that away from me. just like i cant take your perspective away from you due to your experiences

And that justifies the sweeping statements you make about 4 billion people?

 

[Blargonaut]

the mongo thing was part joke part serious. and after thinking about it, i think its kinda dope. If you dont, ok. Opinions and all that.

wow, ok

Congratulations on expanding your vocabulary

second, you say Im asking for this unrealistic utopia where all asians work together and embrace their differences and say its ridiculous....

but then imagine some utopia where disney and hollywood, will be 100% accurate with Mulan, even down to the language, as if its not ridiculous to expect, especially with the way things have been...

its contradictive. cant do both.

It's the way you asked for it, bruv. Can you not see that? You can pine for world peace, cool, but if you're gonna frame your positive want in sweeping negatives, then what? How are people supposed to take that?

And I didn't say I personally wanted the Apocalypto-level adaptation, I was saying that Disney is totally capable of doing such a thing if they wanted to, probably. But if I did want such a thing, I might say that it'd be a more realistic want than yours? In terms of attainability, I mean.

And... I don't really see how it's contradictory, either; I think we can totally have world peace, and an authentic Mulan movie? I fail to see how a world in which an authentic period-piece Mulan movie exists, is a utopia that is not only on par with but must exclude sustainable pan-Asian cooperation, lol

Also, Your adaption isn't accurate. its like you took what I said then tried to make it sound negative as possible while injecting assumptions of what i meant....
its why we dont adapt what people say, and quote what they actually said....
but maybe you're taking a lesson from hollywood?

I dunno. Dramatic liberty aside, it resembles what you said rather closely.

That's enough, right?

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

And that justifies the sweeping statements you make about 4 billion people?

what sweeping statement? that japanese chinese and korean share similar dna?

thats true tho.

 

[spookyfish]

I hate the word problematic, but this is problematic.



This summer, Matt Damon and Emma Stone in Mulan.

Almost spit out my drink.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

wow, ok

Congratulations on expanding your vocabulary



It's the way you asked for it, bruv. Can you not see that? You can pine for world peace, cool, but if you're gonna frame your positive want in sweeping negatives, then what? How are people supposed to take that?

And I didn't say I personally wanted the Apocalypto-level adaptation, I was saying that Disney is totally capable of doing such a thing if they wanted to, probably. But if I did want such a thing, I might say that it'd be a more realistic want than yours? In terms of attainability, I mean.

And... I don't really see how it's contradictory, either; I think we can totally have world peace, and an authentic Mulan movie? I fail to see how a world in which an authentic period-piece Mulan movie exists, is a utopia that is not only on par with but must exclude sustainable pan-Asian cooperation, lol



I dunno. Dramatic liberty aside, it resembles what you said rather closely.

That's enough, right?

i respect your opinion, and understand you just may be coming from a different perspective.

are you asian american btw?

I can see how an Asian-Asian may look at things way differently than an Asian-American.

this thread has really enlightened me on that.

But I also find it comical that apparently im not allowed to have my own perspective on it as an american in regards to an american production made by an american company in america, where all my experiences in america is shaping my american opinion on it.

Im headed into work so thats all from me for now

 

[Cybit]

That doesn't say the description of the spec script is false.

It does reiterate that the script was known to be changed over a year and a half ago, and that the person posting would have known as such if they actually had access to updated scripts.

There's no getting around the basic fact that the original blog post writer at best, deliberately obfuscated the truth around what was happening to start outrage, and at worst, flat out lied. See Bronson's comments about how spec scripts are often bought for a single line, or how Cinderella's spec script was so radically changed that someone else got screenwriting credits for it.

Dude posted shit to get people's blood boiling for no reason / the hits and he got his wishes. Modern journalism for the win!

 

[Beerman462]

I'm glad I came into the thread if only to learn about Kenneth Bone.

 

[Zoe]

It does reiterate that the script was known to be changed over a year and a half ago, and that the person posting would have known as such if they actually had access to updated scripts.

There's no getting around the basic fact that the original blog post writer at best, deliberately obfuscated the truth around what was happening to start outrage, and at worst, flat out lied. See Bronson's comments about how spec scripts are often bought for a single line, or how Cinderella's spec script was so radically changed that someone else got screenwriting credits for it.

Dude posted shit to get people's blood boiling for no reason / the hits and he got his wishes. Modern journalism for the win!

I think exposing these kinds of backwards scripts serves a purpose. That it existed at all is a problem.

 

[nukedeggs]

It does reiterate that the script was known to be changed over a year and a half ago, and that the person posting would have known as such if they actually had access to updated scripts.

There's no getting around the basic fact that the original blog post writer at best, deliberately obfuscated the truth around what was happening to start outrage, and at worst, flat out lied. See Bronson's comments about how spec scripts are often bought for a single line, or how Cinderella's spec script was so radically changed that someone else got screenwriting credits for it.

Dude posted shit to get people's blood boiling for no reason / the hits and he got his wishes. Modern journalism for the win!

I personally don't see anything wrong with raising the visibility of the original spec script's white saviorism. The more people who are aware that this is a problem, the better right? It's not like the story was made up wholesale. The script really did exist like that.

 

[Anko]

what sweeping statement? that japanese chinese and korean share similar dna?

thats true tho.

Duckroll already highlighted one to you.

i respect your opinion, and understand you just may be coming from a different perspective.

are you asian american btw?

I can see how an Asian-Asian may look at things way differently than an Asian-American.

this thread has really enlightened me on that.

But I also find it comical that apparently im not allowed to have my own perspective on it as an american in regards to an american production made by an american company in america, where all my experiences in america is shaping my american opinion on it.

Im headed into work so thats all from me for now

Nobody said you couldn't have an opinion of how the production should go. Heck. I think they should go with an Asian American if they're gonna go English speaking. It was tough enough watching crouching tiger hidden dragon with all those different mandarin accents. What I disapprove of are some of your statements about Asians.

 

[Principate]

I dunno, I find this really stupid because you're basically like "ALL HUMAN, ALL SAME, WHO CARES, MAKE LOVE!" or whatever, but diversity and differences don't necessarily divide. There can be unity through diversity. Embracing that people are different doesn't mean we can't accept that we're all people. This isn't a new guard/old guard thing. When I say that I'm not Korean, I'm not hating on Koreans. Trying to say WHO CARES ALL SAME seems like such a lazy and simplistic reduction. What's the point of that?



Well this is a thread about a dumb plot point in a spec script that Disney has already said they are not using in the actual film, so I'm not sure what there is to talk about "on topic" anyway. Seems as good a place as any to talk about Asian diversity and the differences in perception and culture between Asians in Asia and Asian-Americans in America.

People tend not to empathize as much as people they see as "different", that's not to say homogeny is a good thing as human variation exists for a reason and different cultures and they view points they bring have shown time and time again to be a boon to development. But that difference is also and will likely continue to be a source of strife. When push comes to shove there's a tendency to cling closer to those more like you than not.

Nationalism also plays a part, everyone wants their country to be the best it can currently be even at the expense of others, this is fine on low cooperation problems, but personal interest continues to be a massive problem on macro level problems. If Donald Trump were to become president the progress towards dealing with climate change tumbles into the negative a problem that due to divided nature of countries we're barely dealing with the first place.

Ultimately I don't believe clinging so deeply towards individual countries as a good thing. Maintaining cultures and separating yourself out with borders is not an all or nothing game. Diverse countries with lots of cultures but bound together by a common unity tend to be the most successful. I don't feel we need to actively try to separate cultures when human nature does enough of that passively.

 

[PdotMichael]

I think exposing these kinds of backwards scripts serves a purpose. That it existed at all is a problem.

What purpose? That Disney doesn't stop what they are doing right now?

 

[Zoe]

What purpose? That Disney doesn't stop what they are doing right now?

To let the script writers know that these kinds of stories aren't wanted.

 

[Cybit]

I think exposing these kinds of backwards scripts serves a purpose. That it existed at all is a problem.

It's literally fan-fic. It's not Disney who wrote it. Disney's reaction is rightfully going to be "these people know nothing about how this process works", and it makes the people protesting look ignorant about how things work and looking for a reason to get mad. If he had posted this a year and a half ago, when the spec script was originally bought, then that'd be one thing. Or even like a year ago.

But waiting a year and a half, knowing that it got changed, and right as Disney announced it was starting their casting search? (At least he should, if he had access to the spec script legitimately). Come on. The real reason that post was made was for the second half, which is trying to get more Asian-Americans hired (like himself). Which, btw, even as someone who is south asian and sort of removed from this argument in that specific detail, wow, the anti-chinese / nationalist sentiment in that blog post is fuuucked up - but that's a separate issue.

All this does is tell Disney that they can safely ignore us moving forward, and it sets up a "Boy who Cries Wolf" scenario for us in the future. That's the part that I don't like. This feels distinctly like trying to use the very real problem of whitewashing to advocate for specifically an Asian-American to play Mulan / major roles. That bugs the crap out of me.

 

[Chinese Cartoons]

I love how people are voting for a force meme about a guy who asked a normal question to a stupid presidential race, keep forcing them unfunny shit.

 

[strafer]

I voted Chris Pratt.

 

[dramatis]

And... I don't really see how it's contradictory, either; I think we can totally have world peace, and an authentic Mulan movie? I fail to see how a world in which an authentic period-piece Mulan movie exists, is a utopia that is not only on par with but must exclude sustainable pan-Asian cooperation, lol

Not getting into the trenches of your arguments with others here, but

What, exactly, is an "authentic period piece Mulan movie"? Mulan is a fictional story, not historical. Even the Chinese adaptations often fit it into different dynasties lol

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Duckroll already highlighted one to you.

You talking about the "Old guard" stuff? From my experience, most asian americans view the historical issues the "old guard" but I acknowledge how it can be seen differently from a asian-asian.

Nobody said you couldn't have an opinion of how the production should go. Heck. I think they should go with an Asian American if they're gonna go English speaking. It was tough enough watching crouching tiger hidden dragon with all those different mandarin accents. What I disapprove of are some of your statements about Asians.

But that's exactly How ALL OF THIS started....by me saying I wouldn't even be mad at the fact that they got a japanese to play a chinese because at the end of the day, it would be great progress compared to how its been done in hollywood at the very least. My point was we need to get asians to actually be asians first. then everything else sparked off of that.

 

[Blargonaut]

i respect your opinion, and understand you just may be coming from a different perspective.

are you asian american btw?

I can see how an Asian-Asian may look at things way differently than an Asian-American.

Asian raised Canadian, studied British, living in Asia

It's made me sarcastic

this thread has really enlightened me on that.

great

But I also find it comical that apparently im not allowed to have my own perspective on it as an american in regards to an american production made by an american company in america, where all my experiences in america is shaping my american opinion on it.

Im headed into work so thats all from me for now

yep, enlightened

I don't think anyone's disallowing you perspective; in fact, I think they're trying to... give more to you?

A quick look at the cast of Queen of Katwe shows that it isn't close to perfect either. Lupita Nyong'o and David Oyelowo aren't from Uganda nor of that descent. The only cultural similarities that they have with their real life counterpoints are being descendant from Africa which is a huge continent with thousands of different cultures.

Doing the same for Mulan, having actors of East Asian descent, seems like the likely option. Expecting Disney to confine roles to one ethnicity is unrealistic.

Sorry, I didn't know that, thanks

And I know, I know, it's an unrealistic expectation. Sacrifices in theatre for the sake of ease of entertainment have gone on since time immemorial, it's the truth that can't be helped totally. I just think that Disney is the one entity out of all entertainment entities that can totally help the most? And all this Mulan spec script shenanigans, has me doubting in them. Is it unfounded doubt? I'd like to think so, but I still can't help being shook.

Not getting into the trenches of your arguments with others here, but

What, exactly, is an "authentic period piece Mulan movie"? Mulan is a fictional story, not historical. Even the Chinese adaptations often fit it into different dynasties lol

...oh

 

[Principate]

It's literally fan-fic. It's not Disney who wrote it. Disney's reaction is rightfully going to be "these people know nothing about how this process works", and it makes the people protesting look ignorant about how things work and looking for a reason to get mad. If he had posted this a year and a half ago, when the spec script was originally bought, then that'd be one thing. Or even like a year ago.

But waiting a year and a half, knowing that it got changed, and right as Disney announced it was starting their casting search? (At least he should, if he had access to the spec script legitimately). Come on. The real reason that post was made was for the second half, which is trying to get more Asian-Americans hired (like himself). Which, btw, even as someone who is south asian and sort of removed from this argument in that specific detail, wow, the anti-chinese / nationalist sentiment in that blog post is fuuucked up - but that's a separate issue.

All this does is tell Disney that they can safely ignore us moving forward, and it sets up a "Boy who Cries Wolf" scenario for us in the future. That's the part that I don't like. This feels distinctly like trying to use the very real problem of whitewashing to advocate for specifically an Asian-American to play Mulan / major roles. That bugs the crap out of me.

That's pretty insulting to script writers. Especially considering Disney liked this one so much they bought it.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Asian raised Canadian, studied British, living in Asia

It's made me sarcastic



great



yep, enlightened

I don't think anyone's disallowing you perspective; in fact, I think they're trying to... give more to you?



Sorry, I didn't know that, thanks

And I know, I know, it's an unrealistic expectation. Sacrifices in theatre for the sake of ease of entertainment have gone on since time immemorial, it's the truth that can't be helped totally. I just think that Disney is the one entity out of all entertainment entities that can totally help the most? And all this Mulan spec script shenanigans, has me doubting in them. Is it unfounded doubt? I'd like to think so, but I still can't help being shook.



...oh

the difference is you are mad at me for seeing things the way i do based on american experiences but i aint mad at your non american experiences.

I stress american, because growing up in america, the asian experience is a very unique one and I'd argue more difficult one (compared to growing up in asia with equal quality of life monitarily speaking), especially if you're an asian that grows up in a non asian american community.

 

[Blargonaut]

This is probably what my dad felt when he found out Sherlock Holmes wasn't real

 

[Gotdatmoney]

pretty sure i was only talking about asians, and its you injecting the other stuff.

Yes, I was making the point that this isn't an Asians only thing. This basically happens everywhere.

but since you are so intent on bringing it up, imo, non asian races, from my experience, have each others backs alot more, in fact way more than asians do. are there alot if examples of them not? of course, to imply im saying there isnt at all is just silly. im just saying its on a grander scale with asians, from my perspective due to my experiences. also im not saying its factual. its just how ive seen shit, and you cant take that away from me. just like i cant take your perspective away from you due to your experiences

If that's just your experience that's fine. The way you stated it gives the vibe that it was more of a truth than an opinion. I'm not gonna tell you you're wrong. I'll just say that the opinion your expressing I have heard expressed from lots of other cultutes.

If you're North American I may understand if your views are skewed by the first generation Asians who still have roots in Asia. But for reference, as a black person whose parents are first gen from Africa what your expressing ia largely similar to what I have heard but swapping Asian with African.

Most of that ahit dies out in second and third generations though.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Yes, I was making the point that this isn't an Asians only thing. This basically happens everywhere.



If that's just your experience that's fine. The way you stated it gives the vibe that it was more of a truth than an opinion. I'm not gonna tell you you're wrong. I'll just say that the opinion your expressing I have heard expressed from lots of other cultutes.

If you're North American I may understand if your views are skewed by the first generation Asians who still have roots in Asia. But for reference, as a black person whose parents are first gen from Africa what your expressing ia largely similar to what I have heard but swapping Asian with African.

Most of that ahit dies out in second and third generations though.

My point was thru my experience ive seen whites support whites, and blacks support blacks a helluva lot more than asians supporting asians in their own ethnicity, let alone other ethnicty of asians. You can argue against that all you want, but its what I experienced. Ive had black people hold me down waaaaaay before any other asian did
.

 

[nukedeggs]

My point was thru my experience ive seen whites support whites, and blacks support blacks a helluva lot more than asians supporting asians in their own ethnicity, let alone other ethnicty of asians.

Yeah as an Asian-American I'd say I felt the same way. Growing up in a majority Hispanic school and then looking at how the Asians I knww went out of their way to downplay their Asianness while my Hispanic friends generally trend towards being really proud of their race and supportive of each other, I definitely got a sense of more division and less solidarity on the Asian side of things.

I do think things are starting to get better now though, because Asian American issues are starting to become more visible.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

I do think things are starting to get better now though, because Asian American issues are starting to become more visible.

yea, I agree with it getting ALOT better. but I attribute it to more to those of us who experienced this getting put into better positions of influence. which is why we need more representation in media.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

My point was thru my experience ive seen whites support whites, and blacks support blacks a helluva lot more than asians supporting asians in their own ethnicity, let alone other ethnicty of asians. You can argue against that all you want, but its what I experienced. Ive had black people hold me down waaaaaay before any other asian did
.

I wasn't arguing with you. I was just explaining my position. Pretty sure I said I wasnt arguong your opinion Not here to tell you your wrong. Just that I have experienced what you escribed but in other cultures.

But I mean it's hard to use personal anecdote on such a general statement. You get how problematic that can come across as right?

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

I wasn't arguing with you. I was just explaining my position. Pretty sure I said I wasnt arguong your opinion Not here to tell you your wrong. Just that I have experienced what you escribed but in other cultures.

But I mean it's hard to use personal anecdote on such a general statement. You get how problematic that can come across as right?

i have reiterated multiple times, from my perspective due to my experiences. It's all I can do. It's how we form most of our opinions as humans you know? Via our experiences and perspective.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

i have reiterated multiple times, from my perspective due to my experiences. It's all I can do. It's how we form most of our opinions as humans you know? Via our experiences and perspective.

I think we as people can also recognize when our opinion is formed from bias and lesser so from facts. Not to be that guy but like, what you're describimg right now is why people clutch their bag when they're in an elevator with me or refuse to sit beside me on a bus. You can't let solely experience guide an opinion when it's so general yet describing such a massive body of peoples.

I'm challenging you to look beyond personal anecdote when you form an opinion on a populace of people in the several billions. I don't think that's entirely unreasonable.

 

[FinaruDensetsu]

i have reiterated multiple times, from my perspective due to my experiences. It's all I can do. It's how we form most of our opinions as humans you know? Via our experiences and perspective.

Yeah I think it definitely depends on where you grew up. Growing up in Los Angeles where the city I grew up in and all of the surrounding cities actually have an equal or sometimes higher Asian population than all other races, there was definitely more solidarity. We had nothing to be ashamed of because we were the majority and all other races were the minorities.

It was actually kind of funny because you'd have some white and hispanic kids who were trying to be Asian.

 

[Prodigal Son]

I love how people are voting for a force meme about a guy who asked a normal question to a stupid presidential race, keep forcing them unfunny shit.

You sound fun.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

I think we as people can also recognize when our opinion is formed from bias and lesser so from facts. Not to be that guy but like, what you're describimg right now is why people clutch their bag when they're in an elevator with me or refuse to sit beside me on a bus. You can't let solely experience guide an opinion when it's so general yet describing such a massive body of peoples.

I'm challenging you to look beyond personal anecdote when you form an opinion on a populace of people in the several billions. I don't think that's entirely unreasonable.

when it came to describing a mass body of people, I said we share the similar dna.

anything else, I was primarily referring to asian americans, except the old guard stuff.

You don't need to challenge me on what I already do for the most part, and I think you are just looking at what I am saying way to deeply.

Yeah I think it definitely depends on where you grew up. Growing up in Los Angeles where the city I grew up in and all of the surrounding cities actually have an equal or sometimes higher Asian population than all other races, there was definitely more solidarity. We had nothing to be ashamed of because we were the majority and all other races were the minorities.

It was actually kind of funny because you'd have some white and hispanic kids who were trying to be Asian.

LA is just completely unique in itself in regards to asians from my understanding. Cause if you goto Nyc, it's the complete opposite to LA in how asians of other ethnicities typically interact with each other even tho their is a large population of them and they are in close proximity of each other in alot of situations.

 

[FinaruDensetsu]

LA is just completely unique in itself in regards to asians from my understanding. Cause if you goto Nyc, it's the complete opposite to LA in how asians of other ethnicities typically interact with each other even tho their is a large population of them and they are in close proximity of each other in alot of situations.

Ah that's really interesting insight. I've been completely in the LA education even going to UCLA which again had a huge Asian population so I've never known anything else really as far as academia goes. I mean even all of our gangs in the area were Asian, requiring the police department to have an "Asian Task Force" or "ATF". Kind of a weird experience.

In the community we always had many Asian events which brought Asians and other races out, and the stores and restaurants are virtually all Asian owned except for big chains of course. But I can definitely imagine how different it would be for another Asian person who didn't grow up in this sort of environment.

The bad thing is that at some point the other races started moving out and the area became even more Asian. The few white neighbors I had all ended up moving further south to OC/SD or to Arizona.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Ah that's really interesting insight. I've been completely in the LA education even going to UCLA which again had a huge Asian population so I've never known anything else really as far as academia goes.

In Nyc (haven't lived there since 2005 and I'm sure it's changed over the years)

Viets roll with the Viets, Chinese roll with the Chinese, Koreans roll with the Koreans, etc...

Of course there was a little overlap, but nowhere to the degree and harmony that I've witnessed in La.

But that can probably also be attributed to how NYC is segregated in a lot of respects and how every ethnicity has their own chunk of NYC they themselves cut out.

 

[WrenchNinja]

It does reiterate that the script was known to be changed over a year and a half ago, and that the person posting would have known as such if they actually had access to updated scripts.

There's no getting around the basic fact that the original blog post writer at best, deliberately obfuscated the truth around what was happening to start outrage, and at worst, flat out lied. See Bronson's comments about how spec scripts are often bought for a single line, or how Cinderella's spec script was so radically changed that someone else got screenwriting credits for it.

Dude posted shit to get people's blood boiling for no reason / the hits and he got his wishes. Modern journalism for the win!

Or maybe the issue is the script existed like that at all. It's weird how defensive you are about this when Asians always get dismissal in Hollywood.

 

[nukedeggs]

yea, I agree with it getting ALOT better. but I attribute it to more to those of us who experienced this getting put into better positions of influence. which is why we need more representation in media.

Agree. Asians could definitely use more positive portrayals in media, as opposed to what we've been getting in The Interview or The Hangover etc etc etc, which I'm glad that the fact that this spec script even existed came to light.

 

[FinaruDensetsu]

In Nyc (haven't lived there since 2005 and I'm sure it's changed over the years)

Viets roll with the Viets, Chinese roll with the Chinese, Koreans roll with the Koreans, etc...

Of course there was a little overlap, but nowhere to the degree and harmony that I've witnessed in La.

But that can probably also be attributed to how NYC is segregated in a lot of respects and how every ethnicity has their own chunk of NYC they themselves cut out.

Ah yeah even the Asian gangs here were harmonized. We had gangs that were supposed to be primarily Chinese but yet had members of pretty much every Asian ethnicity.

I think the Chinese population is so large here and outnumbers all other Asian ethnicities probably combined that it's hard not to overlap.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Ah yeah even the Asian gangs here were harmonized. We had gangs that were supposed to be primarily Chinese but yet had members of pretty much every Asian ethnicity.

I think the Chinese population is so large here and outnumbers all other Asian ethnicities probably combined that it's hard not to overlap.

honestly, I wish I grew up in LA, and am jealous.

 

[Feel the Swift]

I personally don't see anything wrong with raising the visibility of the original spec script's white saviorism. The more people who are aware that this is a problem, the better right? It's not like the story was made up wholesale. The script really did exist like that.

That's fine and all, but a lot of people screaming fuck Disney was all based on bullshit.

 

[Akainu]

This to me is a really gross attitude.

"They have enough roles in their country, they should just stick to their kind of people's movies and out of ours."

An Asian role is going to an Asian actress. I'm supposed to be crying because the role is being properly cast with a perfectly diverse option giving an opportunity to an actress to reach outside her country?

Give me a break. As an Asian-American, it's embarrassing watching some of you tripping over yourselves in your own tribalism.

Compared to the person in their own country never given a chance?

 

[hodayathink]

That's pretty insulting to script writers. Especially considering Disney liked this one so much they bought it.

Except that the way scriptwriting works is that you can literally buy a script just to take one line from it. We have no idea what they liked about that script, and there's a decent chance it had nothing to do with the white male character in it.

 

[Cybit]

That's pretty insulting to script writers. Especially considering Disney liked this one so much they bought it.

See: Spec Script, and B) they brought in people to rewrite it completely. Alternatively, see last quoted post.

Or maybe the issue is the script existed like that at all. It's weird how defensive you are about this when Asians always get dismissal in Hollywood.

I'd rather we give a shit about actual issues and actual facts (like say, TV representation, or the Oscars being about positive representation and making jokes about Asians) rather than get all up in arms about something that doesn't exist, and then try to claim it's about the "overriding principle in other films" when we realize we got snookered. This is like complaining to Straight Outta Compton about how other films screw up black representation.

The defensiveness are folks realizing they got snookered. Also, the nationalism and bordering on entitled appropriation the author has about how an Asian-American actor should be used to play a Chinese role in a Chinese myth instead of a Chinese actor is pretty tribal at best. I'm pretty sure the actual goal of the leaker is to get an Asian American cast based on the timing of the leak. As pointed out, others brought this up a while ago minus the casting angle. Now someone tries to go mainstream right as they start casting and then drops the pandering to China accusation? Come on.

Also, enjoying the implication I'm racist from one Asian American to another Asian American.

Except that the way scriptwriting works is that you can literally buy a script just to take one line from it. We have no idea what they liked about that script, and there's a decent chance it had nothing to do with the white male character in it.

Bingo.