Support NeoGAF

[duckroll]

im all about embracing differences. Asian folk dont do that tho.

It's really hard to have a serious conversation about this when you keep saying shit like that.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

It's really hard to have a serious conversation about this when you keep saying shit like that.

saying shit like what?

 

[Angel_DvA]

Hollywood... Go fuck yourself.

 

[Korey]

The live-action Lion King remake to be about a pride of zebras

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

The live-action Lion King remake to be about a pride of zebras

thats actually funny

 

[duckroll]

saying shit like what?

Shit like that.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Shit like that.

ok? I dont follow so I guess Il just have to shrug that off

 

[Pop-O-Matic]

The live-action Lion King remake to be about a pride of zebras

Nah, it's gonna be about a tribe of people living in the Pride Lands, with the good guys being white (save for Morgan Freeman as Rafiki) and Scar & the hyenas being black or Middle Eastern or some other minority that freaks white people out (which would be all of them).

 

[Izuna]

The difference is that they are different countries and have their own industries and dialect? Mainland Chinese films are in Mandarin, Hong Kong films are in Cantonese, Taiwanese films are either in Mandarin or Hokkien. Written text in Taiwan and Hong Kong use Traditional Chinese, while Mainland China and South-East Asia uses Simplied Chinese. There are lots of differences in the media depending on source of origin. But to people who don't understand these differences or don't care to, it's all the same! I just find that kinda annoying.

This is all fine and well, but he was replying to your comment of how different people would look. If Mulan uses Asian-Americans, how important is it that their parents etc. are from one country or the other?

to clarify, I have an easy time differentiating East Asian groups and seeing Korean American actors play what should be Japanese or Chinese characters is noticeable, but baby steps ~~ actually an all Asian Mulan wouldn't even be baby steps, it would be a giant leap for Hollywood

 

[nelsonroyale]

I've never watched the original, but the strikes me as the usual Disney/Hollywood aversion to risk + a good dose of generic racial preference. It doesn't like something I would use my time to watch. I can understand how others are up in arms about it though.

 

[Izuna]

I've never watched the original, but the strikes me as the usual Disney/Hollywood aversion to risk + a good dose of generic racial preference. It doesn't like something I would use my time to watch. I can understand how others are up in arms about it though.

watch it, it's a great movie

songs are amazing too

 

[breakfuss]

As long as Mushu is still Black I'm okay with this.

 

[duckroll]

This is all fine and well, but he was replying to your comment of how different people would look. If Mulan uses Asian-Americans, how important is it that their parents etc. are from one country or the other?

to clarify, I have an easy time differentiating East Asian groups and seeing Korean American actors play what should be Japanese or Chinese characters is noticeable, but baby steps ~~ actually an all Asian Mulan wouldn't even be baby steps, it would be a giant leap for Hollywood

That wasn't what I was talking about? Go look at what I quoted and what I said. This has... nothing to do with Mulan.

 

[FlammableD]

This is still out in theatres with a 91% Fresh rating on Rotten Tomatoes. Go support it.

I've literally never heard of this film, how does a Disney film come out with no-one knowing

 

[Izuna]

That wasn't what I was talking about? Go look at what I quoted and what I said. This has... nothing to do with Mulan.

oh, whoopsie

 

[BronsonLee]

...

Is it wrong that I'm intrigued by the thought of a Mulan movie starring Nicolas Cage?

"We have to steal the Great Wall..."

Now hang on...there's something to this

#NationalTreasure3

I've literally never heard of this film, how does a Disney film come out with no-one knowing

Disney loves to make small budget films that skew towards the drama side. Usually sports-based but you get the idea

 

[RocknRola]

I'm pretty sure that's not how Mulan is supposed to be. And my only contact with the story has been with with the KH series btw, never actually seen the full movie or anything.

Hollywood gonna Hollywood though.

 

[Mistake]

Wait, it flopped in China? All my older Chinese students knew of the movie, even some of the younger ones.

 

[Atraveller]

man thats the problem with asian folk. too much in fighting and to much wanting to differentiate and point out and cling on to the differences instead of embracing similarities and to much clinging on to the past. if asians got together and all worked together, the impact would be great. The history, which I know all about at least with china and japan and koreans and japan, is as I said, to me, the old gaurd. a small example: look what happened when some younger koreans and japanese got together and made a rap record....it created a moment for them in pop culture and had them performing, in their own language, at SOBs in New york city to americans who were eating it up.


and I'm turning this thread into something else so I am gonna get off my soapbox now.

Screw you! Taiwan getting oppressed by China at every international event is real thing that is currently going on. You don't understand our struggle, so don't get all "why don't asians get along"!

 

[Beaniedude]

If this is true I understand his hate towards turning the main character into a white male

What i don't understand is his hatred towards casting a Chinese actress in the role of Mulan instead of an Asian American.

 

[Zoe]

The fact that such a script existed and written by two women no less is very disappointing.

Exactly.

So, has this got a better source since yesterday?

Before I sink in the shit storm - I am fine with giving Disney shit for this if true, but it seems a bit early, only because one guy claimed that in the internet, two weeks after the movie was announced.

It's more than one guy, and that "one guy" isn't exact some random guy on the internet anyway.

 

[andythinkpad]

Wait, it flopped in China? All my older Chinese students knew of the movie, even some of the younger ones.

Because the story is based on a poet Chinese student has to memorize as part of their grade school curriculum?

 

[GAMEPROFF]

It's more than one guy, and that "one guy" isn't exact some random guy on the internet anyway.

OK, then please point me to the other sources. He is the only one who is refered in the OP and when he was asked on twitter, what his sources are, he basicly said nothing. Like I said. When this is true, they deserve that people give them shit, I am also not interested in seeing a movie about a dude from the west accompaning the actual main person of the original movie, but this just doesnt sound from the way it was communitcated a little bit strange.

And no, I wont go through 13 pages if it has been post inbetween..

 

[Zoe]

OK, then please point me to the other sources. He is the only one who is refered in the OP and when he was asked on twitter, what his sources are, he basicly said nothing. Like I said. When this is true, they deserve that people give them shit, I am also not interested in seeing a movie about a dude from the west accompaning the actual main person of the original movie, but this just doesnt sound from the way it was communitcated a little bit strange.

And no, I wont go through 13 pages if it has been post inbetween..

Actor Joel de la Fuente posting from his verified twitter account is the first to backup the claims and verify it's true.

https://twitter.com/joeldelafuente/status/785538815318339584

This Youtube video made by an Asian American comic, actress, and writer pointed out this script in January of this year.

https://youtu.be/UTPbrWsLUcg?t=34

.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

im all about embracing differences. Asian folk dont do that tho.

What planet are you living on where white, black or brown people do that shit? Cause it sure as hell isn't earth. Do you want literally thousands of examples?

and I just have that perspective that we are all the same. the cultural differences are definately there. thai girls are like fucking aliens to me culturally (but I love em) but deep down. we the same.

Man, never thought I was gonna read the equivalent to all lives matter in a Mulan thread.



Anyway, Disney haa said they aren't using this script. I straight up will not see this movie if there is a hint of white washing. I'm tired of appropriating this bullshit, follow the fucking racial make up of the source material or piss off.

 

[lupinko]

Not surprised at all. Look at Dr. Strange and Iron fist as recent examples.

White makes green, brown and yellow don't in their opinion.

Danny Rand has always been a white dude tho?

 

[GAMEPROFF]

.

Thanks. Then its ok. What a super stupid idea from them. Oh man.

 

[BronsonLee]

Exactly.

Eh, not really. It was a script they wrote on their own to try and sell, so they tried to put a spin on it. It was likely written before Disney's live action revival plans started taking fruition

 

[Zoe]

Eh, not really. It was a script they wrote on their own to try and sell, so they tried to put a spin on it. It was likely written before Disney's live action revival plans started taking fruition

It boggles my mind that two women in this climate would take a feminist story and replace the lead with a male savior.

 

[BronsonLee]

It boggles my mind that two women in this climate would take a feminist story and replace the lead with a male savior.

Well, look at it this way. The landscape in 2012 vs now is a bit different. Disney wasn't really in the market for a Mulan script. I think Sony's stuff was in play, but nothing major. They probably didn't think they were going to get away with just sticking to the fable, so they threw in what they thought was a good hook to at least get the script bought. Even a movie like Forbidden Kingdom which had Jackie Chan and Jet Li in it had a white guy in it, but that was very much a part of the story from the jump. Then there's stuff like 21.

Disney bought it (probably because they liked the script in general), have been working on it for a while, put new writers on it, and will probably do at least 3-4 passes on it before locking everything down.

 

[Zoe]

Well, look at it this way. The landscape in 2012 vs now is a bit different. Disney wasn't really in the market for a Mulan script. I think Sony's stuff was in play, but nothing major. They probably didn't think they were going to get away with just sticking to the fable, so they threw in what they thought was a good hook to at least get the script bought. Even a movie like Forbidden Kingdom which had Jackie Chan and Jet Li in it had a white guy in it, but that was very much a part of the story from the jump. Then there's stuff like 21.

I don't know, everything else they do and advocate for seems pretty female-driven.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

I don't know, everything else they do and advocate for seems pretty female-driven.

Feminists gotta eat too

But honestly there could be so many reasons. I don't think it's super important to try and dig into their character or motivations on this. It's a shitty script, it's been thoriughly rejected, the market has spoken?

 

[hodayathink]

Disney loves to make small budget films that skew towards the drama side. Usually sports-based but you get the idea

That movie is sport related. It's just that the sport is chess.

 

[Briarios]

Just to be clear - this was a spec script purchased by Disney, which got it off the market. The project was then turned over to other screenwriters. The male romantic lead will be Chinese ... so, yeah, early script had issues, but that's gone now.

 

[BronsonLee]

That movie is sport related. It's just that the sport is chess.

Chess isn't a sport, don't lie to me
You know what else isn't a sport?
Video games
Pool
Darts
Soccer
Hockey
Pop Warner Football
Taiwanese Basketball

 

[Despera]

It's only a spec script. But if this outrage ensures that Disney works extra hard to not try any bullshit (which I doubt modern disney would) then by all means keep at it.

 

[Trojita]

I think the reasons for asking for Asian American actors has a couple of reasons.

At 5% of the US population Asian Americans also represent a much smaller actor base that usually doesn't get to play main characters.

The author may have friends that are Asian American actors that he wants to see get work.

He might have a problem with overt pandering to the Chinese market.


As an aside but still within the realm of this discussion, are there any well known or minor actresses from China that are fluent in English (HK?)? Really fluent. And before someone asks why the movie can't be in Chinese with English subtitles, most adapted works are translated in the dominant language of the production companies country. Have you not had the pleasure of seeing Japanese Hamlet or Japanese Phantom of the Opera with the male lead played by a woman?

 

[fredrancour]

Now hang on...there's something to this

#NationalTreasure3

Now I'm kind of surprised there's not already an asylum-made series of International Treasure films

 

[captainpat]

Still ridiculous that such a script was even considered.

 

[Pau]

Animation is difficult to bring to life faithfully. Even if it's just minor action scenes or how the character moves, it will generally call for rewrites or new scripts.

Right hence why it's a starting point. Like it just seems mind boggling to me that you'd buy this completely different script to rewrite when you already have the original to work with. I wonder what the original scripts they bought for Cinderella, The Jungle Book, and Beauty and the Beast looked like.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

What planet are you living on where white, black or brown people do that shit? Cause it sure as hell isn't earth. Do you want literally thousands of examples?

Pretty sure I never said what you are implying, but ok? lmfao

 

[hodayathink]

Right hence why it's a starting point. Like it just seems mind boggling to me that you'd buy this completely different script to rewrite when you already have the original to work with. I wonder what the original scripts they bought for Cinderella, The Jungle Book, and Beauty and the Beast looked like.

Maybe this script has a take on the setting itself (excluding the traveling white man) or the non-Mulan characters that would work better in live action than the animated script. Or, as someone said earlier in this thread, maybe they're moving away from the "rebel against the patriarchy" message of the animated movie in an attempt to cater more to the Chinese market. So you buy this script and mix it with the things that would work from the animated movie (and, you know, remove the white male protagonist).

 

[BronsonLee]

Right hence why it's a starting point. Like it just seems mind boggling to me that you'd buy this completely different script to rewrite when you already have the original to work with. I wonder what the original scripts they bought for Cinderella, The Jungle Book, and Beauty and the Beast looked like.

For Cinderella 2015, Disney paid 7 figures for a pitch from someone which looked wildly different to what we got in the end

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

an aside but still within the realm of this discussion, are there any well known or minor actresses from China that are fluent in English (HK?)? Really fluent. And before someone asks why the movie can't be in Chinese with English subtitles, most adapted works are translated in the dominant language of the production companies country. Have you not had the pleasure of seeing Japanese Hamlet or Japanese Phantom of the Opera with the male lead played by a woman?

I am about 90% sure this will be in English.

For Cinderella 2015, Disney paid 7 figures for a pitch from someone which looked wildly different to what we got in the end

Brb, writing an Aladin and Mulan script

 

[BronsonLee]

Brb, writing an Aladin and Mulan script

It was a pitch by the person who adapted The Devil Wears Prada & eventually co-crated Crazy Ex-Girlfriend, she had cache

Eventually someone came in to rewrite it, Chris Weitz, and he's credited fully as the screenwriter, so he changed significant portions of it.

In a fun little GAF Bacon deal, he also rewrote Gary Whitta's pitch on Rogue One and is credited along with Tony Gilroy as the screenwriters of that film

 

[GoutPatrol]

Right hence why it's a starting point. Like it just seems mind boggling to me that you'd buy this completely different script to rewrite when you already have the original to work with. I wonder what the original scripts they bought for Cinderella, The Jungle Book, and Beauty and the Beast looked like.

I would suggest reading this book:

It explains really well how the Hollywood scriptwriting process works. I read it 5 years ago but Hollywood will buy anything to cover their ass. They like one line from a script, they buy it.

 

[Blargonaut]

saying shit like what?

"It won't matter if Hollywood casts mongoloids a slur against a person with Down syndrome an outdated, unscientific ~300-year-old classification based on appearance, considered derogatory in modern times Asian brothers and sisters mongos in this adaptation of Mulan," said Fixed2BeBroken. "So long as they don't cast a white person, they can cast whoever mongoloids a slur against a person with Down syndrome an outdated, unscientific ~300-year-old classification based on appearance, considered derogatory in modern times Asian brothers and sisters mongos they want in Mulan. Don't be mad, being realistic is my right."

Fixed2BeBroken went on, "Japanese? Chinese? Pacific Islander? Mongos? Man, they all tick the Asian box; tell me, why do they unify on paper but not in real life? Why can't these people who all look the same just reconcile their historical grievances the same way their racial features do, and just get along for the sake of American entertainment like everyone else in Hollywood does? But who am I kidding, it'll never happen, because they're Asians and they're all the same like that; they're all stuck in this petty 'old guard' mentality that keeps them divided, which is strange because they can't tell each other apart until they open their mouths anyway. And if they can't tell each other apart, why should Americans be expected to?"

#NoWhiteLeadInMulan​

So, do you like my adaptation of you?

I tried to make it as entertaining as possible while being accurate to what makes you you, based on what I've seen of you on a surface-level.

Firstly, with the "mongo" thing. Are you serious? It sounds like you're trying to invent an Asian version of "nigga", do you really honestly think we need a word like that? I don't think we need the word "mongoloid" reclaimed in any shape, way or form, okay? We really don't need the word.

Stop using it. It's not fetch.

Let it die.

Secondly, your posts are full of sweeping generalizations about Asians. Shitty ones. Okay, you don't want a white lead in Mulan. Okay, you want the parts in the movie to go to Asians. Cool. But I like to think that there's diversity among the diverse, yeah? What's the point of adapting a uniquely Chinese story if you're not going to strive to cast those of Chinese descent? I mean, you even agree to that as much, yet you're... fighting against that and yourself in such a sidewinding, demeaning way with your use of language and the way you express yourself, and your opinions. It's weird.

And why take "baby steps" with the casting? This is Disney. They got the cash. We know they got the cash. They got the cash luxury to be able to skip the "baby steps"; I mean, Queen of Katwe is proof of that. They don't have to settle for anything that isn't casting perfection from the get-go. Hell, they could go for the 'all-Chinese cast speaking in Chinese the whole movie and singing in Chinese the whole movie, English subtitles the whole movie' Apocalypto-style, if they wanted to.

 

[Pau]

For Cinderella 2015, Disney paid 7 figures for a pitch from someone which looked wildly different to what we got in the end

Okay, thanks. I didn't really pay any attention to the production of those movies at the time and couldn't find anything concrete about how different those scripts were.

I would suggest reading this book:

It explains really well how the Hollywood scriptwriting process works. I read it 5 years ago but Hollywood will buy anything to cover their ass. They like one line from a script, they buy it.

I guess studios do have enough money to do shit like that.

 

[Stormhammer]

I've literally never heard of this film, how does a Disney film come out with no-one knowing

i've definitely seen quite a few commercials for this on tv. it looks pretty interesting

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

So, do you like my adaptation of you?

I tried to make it as entertaining as possible while being accurate to what makes you you, based on what I've seen of you on a surface-level.

Firstly, with the "mongo" thing. Are you serious? It sounds like you're trying to invent an Asian version of "nigga", do you really honestly think we need a word like that? I don't think we need the word "mongoloid" reclaimed in any shape, way or form, okay? We really don't need the word.

Stop using it. It's not fetch.

Let it die.

Secondly, your posts are full of sweeping generalizations about Asians. Shitty ones. Okay, you don't want a white lead in Mulan. Okay, you want the parts in the movie to go to Asians. Cool. But I like to think that there's diversity among the diverse, yeah? What's the point of adapting a uniquely Chinese story if you're not going to strive to cast those of Chinese descent? I mean, you even agree to that as much, yet you're... fighting against that and yourself in such a sidewinding, demeaning way with your use of language and the way you express yourself, and your opinions. It's weird.

And why take "baby steps" with the casting? This is Disney. They got the cash. We know they got the cash. They got the cash luxury to be able to skip the "baby steps"; I mean, Queen of Katwe is proof of that. They don't have to settle for anything that isn't casting perfection from the get-go. Hell, they could go for the 'all-Chinese cast speaking in Chinese the whole movie and singing in Chinese the whole movie, English subtitles the whole movie' Apocalypto-style, if they wanted to.

the mongo thing was part joke part serious. and after thinking about it, i think its kinda dope. If you dont, ok. Opinions and all that.

second, you say Im asking for this unrealistic utopia where all asians work together and embrace their differences and say its ridiculous....

but then imagine some utopia where disney and hollywood, will be 100% accurate with Mulan, even down to the language, as if its not ridiculous to expect, especially with the way things have been...

its contradictive. cant do both.


Also, Your adaption isn't accurate. its like you took what I said then tried to make it sound negative as possible while injecting assumptions of what i meant....
its why we dont adapt what people say, and quote what they actually said....
but maybe you're taking a lesson from hollywood?