Support NeoGAF

[The Mad Draklor]

The part of the policy where inspections must only be done in English already makes Sony such a big dick towards small Japanese developers. If the allegation that developers can't even disclose their games getting censored or complain about Sony's policy publicly is true, Sony lost what little respect I have for them.

For a company that started off this gen being the champion of the little guy, this is pure hypocrisy. Or perhaps Sony only grabbed the indie devs under their wing to get a competitive edge over the Big Bad (Mattrick-era) Microsoft.

 

[WouldYouKindly]

The part of the policy where inspections must only be done in English already makes Sony such a big dick towards small Japanese developers. If the allegation that developers can't even disclose their games getting censored or complain about Sony's policy publicly is true, Sony lost what little respect I have for them.

For a company that started off this gen being the champion of the little guy, this is pure hypocrisy. Or perhaps Sony only grabbed the indie devs under their wing to get a competitive edge over the Big Bad (Mattrick-era) Microsoft.

"This is a strawman. Not only are you claiming that people are only blaming Sony for censorship which is untrue, but you're just throwing that claim out without any supporting evidence. Why is Sony in the limelight regarding this topic? Because it is recent and the story is still ongoing. Sony is being all imperialist on Japanese developers and has yet to make an official statement about their policy."


And yet here you are shit posting on sony but youre not only blaming sony right? Lol again just stop with your bullshit agenda

 

[The Mad Draklor]

"This is a strawman. Not only are you claiming that people are only blaming Sony for censorship which is untrue, but you're just throwing that claim out without any supporting evidence. Why is Sony in the limelight regarding this topic? Because it is recent and the story is still ongoing. Sony is being all imperialist on Japanese developers and has yet to make an official statement about their policy."

And yet here you are shit posting on sony but youre not only blaming sony right? Lol again just stop with your bullshit agenda

Shit posting is where I am posting aggressively, ironically, and trollishly poor quality comments. I have not done such a thing and there's actually more basis of you doing the shitposting considering that you are being overly aggressive for no such reason. All you're doing is attacking the person rather than the argument. That says to me that you're only here to start trouble instead of trying to have a conversation.

But hey, I do not mind if you bring more attention to these threads. Considering how poorly you are arguing your points (if they can even be considered arguments, in the first place), you're doing a great job supporting the anti-censorship crowd. For that, I give you my thanks.

 

[Danjin44]

Shit posting is where I am posting aggressively, ironically, and trollishly poor quality comments. I have not done such a thing and there's actually more basis of you doing the shitposting considering that you are being overly aggressive for no such reason. All you're doing is attacking the person rather than the argument. That says to me that you're only here to start trouble instead of trying to have a conversation.

But hey, I do not mind if you bring more attention to these threads. Considering how poorly you are arguing your points (if they can even be considered arguments, in the first place), you're doing a great job supporting the anti-censorship crowd. For that, I give you my thanks.

I guess that means Sony have to fire him as Sony defender.

 

[Mod of War: Remastered]

Attack the arguments, not the person making them.

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

I realize I haven't included the direct quotes.

국내외 콘솔게임 업계에서는 단순히 소니가 내부 심의기준을 바꾼 것보다 기준 변경으로 게임 콘텐츠가 수정되고 소니의 발매 거부로 게임을 내지 못한다는 사실을 공개하지 못하도록 막고 있는 것이 더 큰 문제라는 의견도 나오는 상황.

Within the industry, opinions are starting to suggest that Sony's prohibition from revealing changes in the game contents with the revised standard, or from announcing the cancellation of game due to Sony's rejection, is more problematic than the changes in Sony's internal regulation standard itself.

Source

The "Western Standard" quote is taken from this video, a special Q&A interview session by the developers of Dies irae (which incidentally went Switch-exclusive recently)

In other news, the Western developers of Sense: A Cyberpunk Ghost Story , a horror game in the same style as Clock Tower recently on Kickstarter that's slated for release on PS4, PS Vita, Switch and PC, are already expecting to be subjected to Sony's new guidelines, and pledging to be transparent about the changes as they occur, and to offer refunds and switching orders to the uncensored Switch and PC versions for whoever asks for them. The developers don't hide their disapproval of the policy either.
However that's exactly the sort of situation that Sony would ensure doesn't happen in a way that exposes their censorship policy in full light, if the former developer statements prove true, so this game's case should prove very interesting, and whether the developers will be able to stand by their word.

 

[A.Romero]

To keep the discussion going.

It is weird Japan being censoring a game like this, since her animated shows have much more 'mature' content. Unless it is a revenge censorship, if that makes sense.

Still did not stopped RDR2 from opening 140.000< copies in the region.

Fuck, this doesn't make sense to me. Japan's anime and games sometimes go way beyond what we have in the west. How are they squimish about dismemberment and then have stuff like Gantz?

I don't get Sony's position. I mean, we have seen worse stuff in God of War 3 for example (both sexual and violence).

I really don't know what's going on. I feel we are going backwards. It doesn't make sense. A lot of players that grew up with their products are getting older, content should be created for us, not the opposite. The market has shown that we are willing to pay for sex and guts. Exactly who are they trying to protect?

 

[Madonis]

Console games are subject to CERO ratings, which are more restrictive than the ESRB.

Not anime or movies. Those aren't rated by CERO.

And now Sony is adding another layer of restrictions on top of it.

 

[A.Romero]

Console games are subject to CERO ratings, which are more restrictive than the ESRB.

Not anime or movies. Those aren't rated by CERO.

And now Sony is adding another layer of restrictions on top of it.

Maybe different institutions but the criteria should be similar.

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

Maybe different institutions but the criteria should be similar.

They're very much not the same criteria as CERO (mandatory) or ERSB.

 

[Enygger_Tzu]

Console games are subject to CERO ratings, which are more restrictive than the ESRB.

Not anime or movies. Those aren't rated by CERO.

And now Sony is adding another layer of restrictions on top of it.

According to a source who now eludes me, Sony makes all Asian companies now not go through CERO, but ESBN and AFTER THAT, directly to Sony, so Sony distills the games to their platform, twice if they come from an Asian region.

Well Sony sees that Asia is a lost battle for her and they will try their best to burn it, but the only thing they will do is burn the bridges they made.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

According to a source who now eludes me, Sony makes all Asian companies now not go through CERO, but ESBN and AFTER THAT, directly to Sony, so Sony distills the games to their platform, twice if they come from an Asian region.

Well Sony sees that Asia is a lost battle for her and they will try their best to burn it, but the only thing they will do is burn the bridges they made.

The weirdest thing is that even though the home console market is contracting in Japan, a few years ago, Sony said that the PS4 had significantly better sales in the rest of Asia than the PS2 and PS3. Chinese/English localization in Asia has become way more commonplace this gen which makes Japanese games more accessible and as a result, partially made up the underperformance in Japan.

I can tell you that not only the Japanese are not happy about what Sony is doing, but the Taiwanese, as well.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I don't get Sony's position. I mean, we have seen worse stuff in God of War 3 for example (both sexual and violence).

Of course you see worse stuff in games like God of War and Last of Us. If they want to release a first party porno game, they can do it as it's their platform and their control.

Sony gimping third party games of mature content makes their games much cooler.

 

[Barakov]

I realize I haven't included the direct quotes.


Source

The "Western Standard" quote is taken from this video, a special Q&A interview session by the developers of Dies irae (which incidentally went Switch-exclusive recently)

In other news, the Western developers of Sense: A Cyberpunk Ghost Story , a horror game in the same style as Clock Tower recently on Kickstarter that's slated for release on PS4, PS Vita, Switch and PC, are already expecting to be subjected to Sony's new guidelines, and pledging to be transparent about the changes as they occur, and to offer refunds and switching orders to the uncensored Switch and PC versions for whoever asks for them. The developers don't hide their disapproval of the policy either.
However that's exactly the sort of situation that Sony would ensure doesn't happen in a way that exposes their censorship policy in full light, if the former developer statements prove true, so this game's case should prove very interesting, and whether the developers will be able to stand by their word.

I suspect the Streisand effect will manifest in full force if this starts happening to western developers. Sony could find themselves in quite a pickle.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

An update on the Change.org petition. It went past 7500 signatures a little bit after 12am EST and it has already gained another 1000 signatures. Nice to see that the petition is still getting signatures even though it was made a bit over a month ago.

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

I can tell you that not only the Japanese are not happy about what Sony is doing, but the Taiwanese, as well.

Most developers are already including or planning to include Traditional/Simplified Chinese (either is good enough for the Chinese market since it's still intelligible, both are ideal) in their Steam versions, but maybe this will be the opportunity for Nintendo to finally fix their situation in the Chinese market.

I don't mean by starting to censor their games to be more China-friendly and sold directly in China, as opposed to the current compromise (mostly unchanged games released geographically in HK/TW with language support for HK/TW (Traditional) and China (Simplified) relying on grey market imports) like some analysts from, surprise, resetera, advocate for.
Nintendo tried to do like Sony did in South Korea and Chinese-speaking markets but what really did them in was the 3DS region locking. It went like this:

• Nintendo releases the 3DS in Japan in 2011. It's region locked and a moderate hit in Asian markets. Chinese consumers already start importing devices and games region coded for Japan, considering that's where most of the software support originates.
• Nintendo creates a new region for the 3DS, mainland China, called the iQue 3DS, and sells it there. It's supported for less than a year and only launch titles (by Nintendo) ever released on it. Some of it is due to administrative troubles getting the actual device or further game releases approved in China. The iQue 3DS will only read games marked with the China region code, and because the 3DS is region locked, it won't read Japanese grey imports that fill the Chinese market.
• Nintendo creates a new region for the 3DS, Taiwan/Hong Kong. It can only read TW/HK coded games and receives more support than the Chinese model. They share the same localization team as iQue btw. Nintendo put in actual effort in here, licensing games from Namco and other publishers to either localize (Doraemon) or release unaltered in Japanese but with the TW/HK region code. It's still not enough releases number-wise, and the 3DS OS didn't even receive most of the upgrades the Japanese (or US/EU) models had, like themes, badges and various other additions. Support is discontinued in 2014. (The South Korean region-coded 3DS variant faced very similar problems)
• After a hiatus, Nintendo realizes they want to sell Pokemon among other games for the Chinese market, and then reintroduce what Chinese gamers asked for: a device that can read Japan region games, and still has a localized interface to Chinese. ... except this 3DS version only reads Japanese games, and isn't compatible with the previously existing Chinese game releases. Nintendo simply was too incompetent to release a 3DS variant that could read JP/TW-HK/CH region tagged releases. Newer Chinese localizations were only compatible with Japanese region devices (grey import Japanese 3DSes, new regional TW/HK 3DS) and older Chinese localizations wouldn't work on Japanese region devices either. It was a mess.
• Nintendo drops region locking for Switch, and only then does Chinese success and support skyrocket. Most recent first party games are localized to Chinese (both Simplified and Traditional) and Korean.

Sony got it right already since 2011, providing Chinese and Korean localizations for series like Yakuza, Persona and Sen no Kiseki with no strings attached (unlike Nintendo which would ask for a timed exclusivity for localizations they help fund, but they wised up recently with Monster Hunter Stores and Professor Layton 1 HD) making deals with them more attractive. Nintendo of Korea is already doing their own localizations for second/third party games so if they keep this up, they might actually justify Switch/PC releases for Asian markets for many publishers even after wasting so much time providing botched SK/CH support.

An update on the Change.org petition. It went past 7500 signatures a little bit after 12am EST and it has already gained another 1000 signatures. Nice to see that the petition is still getting signatures even though it was made a bit over a month ago.

Not a very effective petition if it's not targeting Japanese, Chinese and Korean gaming enthusiasts, or marketed there the bare minimum.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Not a very effective petition if it's not targeting Japanese, Chinese and Korean gaming enthusiasts, or marketed there the bare minimum.

Hmm, that's actually a very good point. It does have a Japanese translation, but that's about it so the outreach to Asian gamers is limited. Too bad my Chinese Mandarin is not good enough to be able to translate from English to Chinese effectively.

 

[JunkerWoland]

An update on the Change.org petition. It went past 7500 signatures a little bit after 12am EST and it has already gained another 1000 signatures. Nice to see that the petition is still getting signatures even though it was made a bit over a month ago.

I'm surprised people keep seeming to find this petition, given how little coverage the whole situation has received. As it's become increasingly clear only small outlets are willing to follow this story, if people are legitimately upset by Sony's policy, then it's going to fall on consumers to both continue spreading awareness of the issue and helping it to maintain as high media visibility as possible.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

I'm surprised people keep seeming to find this petition, given how little coverage the whole situation has received. As it's become increasingly clear only small outlets are willing to follow this story, if people are legitimately upset by Sony's policy, then it's going to fall on consumers to both continue spreading awareness of the issue and helping it to maintain as high media visibility as possible.

I was surprised, too. I expected it to take another month to go from 7500 to 10000. When it reached 7500 signatures, it did so limping. And then, all of a sudden, it’s already over 9000 signatures.

 

[JunkerWoland]

IGN Japan just ran an lengthy article on the situation: https://jp.ign.com/sony-playstation/30397/opinion/ps4.

Going by Google's translation, it's only a rundown of things to date, but at least a larger outlet was willing to provide coverage, even if it's understandably only a Japanese subsidiary.

 

[CatCouch]

I'm happy to see that there is more discussion around Sony's censorship policies. the petition keeps moving even if it's slow and it's encouraging to see bigger Japanese outlets cover this. Most articles I read where Sony comes up has somebody mentioning censorship and forums like GameFAQ's are full of fighting over it. It's the new thing to troll.

There's a lot of ignorance along with the trolling which tends to set people off. I saw a discussion last night where someone called 2B from Nier "pedo". Derailed that whole conversation. The "all Japanese art is pedo" argument is in full swing which causes lots of push back.

I'm leaning towards this becoming a PR issue for Sony if they keep censorin things like JRPG's and not just VN's. Negative associations are hard to shake and I doubt being known for censorship is any better than being known for pervy Japanese games. Add double standards along with a sprinkle of the "Streisand Effect" into the mix and it's go time!

People focus almost exclusively on negatives these days and are drawn to fights/controversies and this is a pretty big fight since it affects multiple games/devs/publishers, it has the "us vs them" politics involved and it feeds into console wars. That's a perfect storm!

 

[JunkerWoland]

Let me first say, THIS IS NOT CONFIRMED, but might be something to watch.

Degica just announced the international release of Game Paradise: CruisinMix Special for the PS4 and Steam. The Japanese version of the game features two new bomb animations for the character Clarice. The international trailer only shows and mentions one new bomb animation, and only a single new bomb is mentioned by the PR copy posted at Gematsu (https://gematsu.com/2018/11/the-game-paradise-cruisinmix-special-launches-november-30-in-the-west).

The bomb animation not featured in the international trailer can be seen in the below Japanese trailer (slightly NSFW) at the 1:24 mark.



I tweeted to Degica, but haven't yet received a reply. For those wondering, Game Paradise: CruisinMix Special is an updated port of a cartoony-arcade shoot-em-up from the mid-1990s.

::edit::
Degica tweeted a response, saying they'd look into things with the game's producer in Tokyo.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

PlayStation Universe has published an article about Sony's censorship policy. To summarize, it is alleged that Sony is enforcing "western standards" instead of relying on the local rating systems.

A Korean writer interviewed with a few Japanese developers at TGS 2017. One anonymous dev said that they wanted to release their games on the PS4 and Switch at the same time, but they had to negotiate with Sony to solve issues they have with a game. The dev also stated that Nintendo has been more generous and there have been cases where Japanese games go Switch/PC only.

The article also mentioned Idea Factory and them making a stand against Sony's policy in a tweet. It also included some tweets from gamers expressing opposition against Sony, including CatCouch

 

[CatCouch]

Oh wow, that's awesome that I'm in that PlayStation Universe article! There's something quite satisfying about my adult art Twitter account being featured in an article about censorship!

I hope this is a good sign. More attention and awareness to the way Sony is treating developers of games they suddenly don't stand by should give this issue a boost!

I applaud Idea Factory and PlayStation Universe for keeping this topic in the public eye.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

PlayStation Universe has published an article about Sony's censorship policy. To summarize, it is alleged that Sony is enforcing "western standards" instead of relying on the local rating systems.

Money talks.

And gaming sales and profits from western countries is multifold more than Japan. So it makes sense it's the western way or the highway.

 

[Senhua]

Money talks.

And gaming sales and profits from western countries is multifold more than Japan. So it makes sense it's the western way or the highway.

There are one more important than money in the business world : Trust.
I doubt Japanese/Asian developer and consumer perception to Sony will back to normal even if Sony do 180. Asian always forgive but do not forget easily.
PS4 will not affected by this cause the developer and consumer already established (engine and library). Sony better hope that PS5 can feature full BC with the ps4 cause if not.....

 

[JunkerWoland]

I received the below reply, regarding my above post on Game Paradise: CruisinMix Special.



The image in questions (which again can be seen in the YouTube video linked in my previous post at the 1:24 mark) is a static image that briefly flashes on screen of a cheerleader jumping; you can see her stomach and the bottom of her breasts. I'm not sure what else to say, other than this situation has gotten absurd.

::edit::
Here's an actual pic of the image/bomb effect.

 

[kunonabi]

I received the below reply, regarding my above post on Game Paradise: CruisinMix Special.



The image in questions (which again can be seen in the YouTube video linked in my previous post at the 1:24 mark) is a static image that briefly flashes on screen of a cheerleader jumping; you can see her stomach and the bottom of her breasts. I'm not sure what else to say, other than this situation has gotten absurd.

::edit::
Here's an actual pic of the image/bomb effect.

This is seriously just insane at this point.

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

Unconfirmed, but Valve pulled from Steam a game called Maomao Discovery Team that's an adult-only JRPG. It might be because of legitimate concerns over lolicon porn content that might not be lawful.

The developers also included all of the necessary information about the game being an Adults Only RPG title, which centered around battling enemies in a labyrinth, and watching a loli pleasure herself or engaging in copulation with the loli named Maomao.

But it begs attention nevertheless, just in case this trend includes more than just legal liabilities.

I saw a discussion last night where someone called 2B from Nier "pedo". Derailed that whole conversation. The "all Japanese art is pedo" argument is in full swing which causes lots of push back.

It seems a certain hate forum is claiming Persona 5 is a pedo game because the player IRL (young adults) play as an underage protagonist (male teen) who can date underage characters (female teens), so the player in real life is having a pedophile relationship with a fictional underage female. Some stuff about Ann, Makoto and Futaba being trauma survivors to further drive the point they can't consent to a relationship even with a guy their same age anyways, to secure all bases. However the adult female teacher is endearing and the lack of homosexual partners is a missed opportunity, despite the previous logic, for reasons.

That's like staring in the abyss of madness but then again that's where Sony gets its ideas now for what's acceptable, or desirable, and what is taboo. It's only a matter of time if they take this output and tell Atlus they can't include dating in Persona 6 (or they should age up the whole cast beyond high school to appeal to western storytelling tastes uninterested in japanese high school tropes... an interesting can of worms in itself if some kinds of storytelling become off-limits)

 

[CatCouch]

It seems a certain hate forum is claiming Persona 5 is a pedo game because the player IRL (young adults) play as an underage protagonist (male teen) who can date underage characters (female teens), so the player in real life is having a pedophile relationship with a fictional underage female. Some stuff about Ann, Makoto and Futaba being trauma survivors to further drive the point they can't consent to a relationship even with a guy their same age anyways, to secure all bases. However the adult female teacher is endearing and the lack of homosexual partners is a missed opportunity, despite the previous logic, for reasons.

That's like staring in the abyss of madness but then again that's where Sony gets its ideas now for what's acceptable, or desirable, and what is taboo. It's only a matter of time if they take this output and tell Atlus they can't include dating in Persona 6 (or they should age up the whole cast beyond high school to appeal to western storytelling tastes uninterested in japanese high school tropes... an interesting can of worms in itself if some kinds of storytelling become off-limits)

That's the kind of illogical and hypocritical thinking that I just can't stand. I can't express how many times I've been in a debate where someone pulled the most insane logic out to try to "win". You can't win because the longer you debate the more outlandish the claims become until you get headache inducing stuff like the Persona argument above.

One example I have was a woman that criticized my art a few years ago by telling me a pose I used for a piece was "unbelievably painful". I politely disagreed and said it was not that bad. Real quote I received: "If your ideal vision of the world involved women's bodies being agonizingly stretched to the breaking point solely for men's sexual gratification, what would that say about you?" One of her posts in response to me was 12 paragraphs long. 12. She was trying to lecture me about everything from feminism to racism to transphobia. She linked to pornographic gay art on Tumblr as an example of acceptable sexy art. It was all over a pin-up commission I drew of Anna Williams from Tekken.

There's nothing you can do in those situations. It is madness. I'm just heartbroken that this kind of ignorant, selfish world view is increasingly common. Most comments sections, forums and even quite a few game sites themselves traffic in this kind of thinking now. I seriously can't tell what's real and what's trolling on sites like GameFaq's now. Poe's law is real!

As for games like Persona, I think Atlus would have to dump the dating to avoid controversy. Even though many latch onto "underage" as the main argument against Japanese games it's not the end of it. Look at all the fighting over Dahlia in Xenoblade C2, Cindy in FFXV and Quiet in MGSV. None are underage or presented in a manner that suggests so.

The only way to avoid issues is to not do it at all. Western devs are going that way, it's sad to see Bioware dump romance and sex altogether for Anthem. It's the only way to stop people from nit-picking the relationships in the games. It's crazy how this went from asking for more representation in games to creating so much hostility that it's a risk to try. I don't think anyone is optimistic enough to think that adding gay partners into a Persona game will not lead to 10 times as much outrage at however it's handled.

 

[Dr. Claus]

That's the kind of illogical and hypocritical thinking that I just can't stand. I can't express how many times I've been in a debate where someone pulled the most insane logic out to try to "win". You can't win because the longer you debate the more outlandish the claims become until you get headache inducing stuff like the Persona argument above.

One example I have was a woman that criticized my art a few years ago by telling me a pose I used for a piece was "unbelievably painful". I politely disagreed and said it was not that bad. Real quote I received: "If your ideal vision of the world involved women's bodies being agonizingly stretched to the breaking point solely for men's sexual gratification, what would that say about you?" One of her posts in response to me was 12 paragraphs long. 12. She was trying to lecture me about everything from feminism to racism to transphobia. She linked to pornographic gay art on Tumblr as an example of acceptable sexy art. It was all over a pin-up commission I drew of Anna Williams from Tekken.

There's nothing you can do in those situations. It is madness. I'm just heartbroken that this kind of ignorant, selfish world view is increasingly common. Most comments sections, forums and even quite a few game sites themselves traffic in this kind of thinking now. I seriously can't tell what's real and what's trolling on sites like GameFaq's now. Poe's law is real!

As for games like Persona, I think Atlus would have to dump the dating to avoid controversy. Even though many latch onto "underage" as the main argument against Japanese games it's not the end of it. Look at all the fighting over Dahlia in Xenoblade C2, Cindy in FFXV and Quiet in MGSV. None are underage or presented in a manner that suggests so.

The only way to avoid issues is to not do it at all. Western devs are going that way, it's sad to see Bioware dump romance and sex altogether for Anthem. It's the only way to stop people from nit-picking the relationships in the games. It's crazy how this went from asking for more representation in games to creating so much hostility that it's a risk to try. I don't think anyone is optimistic enough to think that adding gay partners into a Persona game will not lead to 10 times as much outrage at however it's handled.

I genuinely don't think Atlus gives two fucks about Sony or whatever random infant has to say about two teenagers having romantic interest in one another in a game about teenagers in a high school.

I would be very surprised if they changed anything in the next Persona game.

 

[kunonabi]

That's the kind of illogical and hypocritical thinking that I just can't stand. I can't express how many times I've been in a debate where someone pulled the most insane logic out to try to "win". You can't win because the longer you debate the more outlandish the claims become until you get headache inducing stuff like the Persona argument above.

One example I have was a woman that criticized my art a few years ago by telling me a pose I used for a piece was "unbelievably painful". I politely disagreed and said it was not that bad. Real quote I received: "If your ideal vision of the world involved women's bodies being agonizingly stretched to the breaking point solely for men's sexual gratification, what would that say about you?" One of her posts in response to me was 12 paragraphs long. 12. She was trying to lecture me about everything from feminism to racism to transphobia. She linked to pornographic gay art on Tumblr as an example of acceptable sexy art. It was all over a pin-up commission I drew of Anna Williams from Tekken.

There's nothing you can do in those situations. It is madness. I'm just heartbroken that this kind of ignorant, selfish world view is increasingly common. Most comments sections, forums and even quite a few game sites themselves traffic in this kind of thinking now. I seriously can't tell what's real and what's trolling on sites like GameFaq's now. Poe's law is real!

As for games like Persona, I think Atlus would have to dump the dating to avoid controversy. Even though many latch onto "underage" as the main argument against Japanese games it's not the end of it. Look at all the fighting over Dahlia in Xenoblade C2, Cindy in FFXV and Quiet in MGSV. None are underage or presented in a manner that suggests so.

The only way to avoid issues is to not do it at all. Western devs are going that way, it's sad to see Bioware dump romance and sex altogether for Anthem. It's the only way to stop people from nit-picking the relationships in the games. It's crazy how this went from asking for more representation in games to creating so much hostility that it's a risk to try. I don't think anyone is optimistic enough to think that adding gay partners into a Persona game will not lead to 10 times as much outrage at however it's handled.

I'm going to need to see this picture of Anna.

 

[Enygger_Tzu]

I'm going to need to see this picture of Anna.

Spoiler

https://www.deviantart.com/catcouch/art/Anna-Tekken-Comm-621756649

Also the dudette that harassed CatCouch in the comments, was projecting her anatomical shortcomings to him.

Read the comments in the above picture and then take a look at the below picture if you wish to have a laugh.

Spoiler

https://www.deviantart.com/liketheisland/art/I-am-so-good-at-art-755210887

 

[Dr. Claus]

Spoiler

https://www.deviantart.com/catcouch/art/Anna-Tekken-Comm-621756649

Also the dudette that harassed CatCouch in the comments, was projecting her anatomical shortcomings to him.

Read the comments in the above picture and then take a look at the below picture if you wish to have a laugh.

Spoiler

https://www.deviantart.com/liketheisland/art/I-am-so-good-at-art-755210887

So, one is a jealous infant who can't draw worth a damn and the other is CatCouch. Makes so much more sense.

 

[kunonabi]

Yeah, I'm going to rule in favor of cat couch.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Something weird is going on with that petition. Earlier today, it was close to getting over 11000, but now it says it has only 10170 or so sigs. Why are there less sigs? Were there duplicates?

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

I genuinely don't think Atlus gives two fucks about Sony or whatever random infant has to say about two teenagers having romantic interest in one another in a game about teenagers in a high school.

I would be very surprised if they changed anything in the next Persona game.

For what it's worth, 13 Sentinels Aegis Rim, the latest Vanillaware Action RPG published by Atlus originally slated for the PS Vita and the PS4, was announced today to have been cancelled on the PS Vita and indefinitely delayed for the PS4. It has scantly-clothed girls piloting mechas featured prominently in the game.

It may have already started with Persona 5, there were a few lines and conversations that were indeed purged from the Sony versions, yet many of them were allowed on the traditionally more restrictive TV format for the anime adaptation. It's not a CERO thing either.

This conversation in particular was to have happened between Makoto and Kaneshiro in the lapse of time after she called her friends but before they arrived.

Kaneshiro: I don't have a thing for teens, you know.
Henchman: She no good, then?
Kaneshiro: Well, prudish ones do sell at a high price...
Kaneshiro: So, what're you after?
Kaneshiro: Where'd you find out about me?
Makoto: Does it matter?
Kaneshiro: *chuckles* Typical of the young ones.
Kaneshiro: They're so worth breaking down...*chuckles*

Kaneshiro: Hey! Make sure you don't damage the goods.

This one was cut from the game, but appeared in the anime:

Shadow Kaneshiro: I'll have you work at an affiliate store with us starting tomorrow. You'll pay it off with your body.
Shadow Kaneshiro: Don't worry, we only take VIP customers from society.
Shadow Kaneshiro: We have many VIPs who desire sister action, you know.

While this might be unused content, the content that was used used weirdly roundabout terms to imply the character motivations, background events, and even actual events in the case of a bad end... but around the same period games published on Nintendo consoles made explicit references to prostitution without any problems in Japan (Octopath Traveler and Xenoblade 2 for example) without even bumping the rating beyond the teen equivalent, so it couldn't have been the CERO forcing their hand, neither fucking "SMT developer" Atlus being prudes mindful of the current social climate or whatever bollocks rationalization.

The situation of 13 Sentinels definitively begs more attention, because this is a much higher profile game, and would disprove that "bigger Japanese publishers" are big enough to be safe from this new policy.

Moving on...

A new potential casualty of Sony's new censorship policies: Game Tengoku.
This time it's a shump.

A dual PS4/PC game that has a fanservice-y move completely cut from promotional material for the new release. It's not clear yet if it's because of the change in the art style, but the silence from the Japanese developer is concerning and might line up with the formerly gathered trends.

 

[JunkerWoland]

It should be noted about Game Paradise: CruisinMix Special that the game's Western publisher very recently tweeted the below.



I responded asking if they could provide any further information. As a reminder, the image/bomb is still supposed to remain in the Steam release and, as far as anyone can tell, is featured in the Japanese PS4 release. It's possible there could be some rights issue, as the image is the work of a professional comic artist, but it's still rather odd for it to be absent from only the international PS4 version. Either way, this all unfortunately plays directly into the growing narrative of Sony forcing censorship, and assuming Degica is not being compelled to make alterations, then they really should have been upfront about the omission.

 

[Dr. Claus]

For what it's worth, 13 Sentinels Aegis Rim, the latest Vanillaware Action RPG published by Atlus originally slated for the PS Vita and the PS4, was announced today to have been cancelled on the PS Vita and indefinitely delayed for the PS4. It has scantly-clothed girls piloting mechas featured prominently in the game.

It may have already started with Persona 5, there were a few lines and conversations that were indeed purged from the Sony versions, yet many of them were allowed on the traditionally more restrictive TV format for the anime adaptation. It's not a CERO thing either.

This conversation in particular was to have happened between Makoto and Kaneshiro in the lapse of time after she called her friends but before they arrived.



This one was cut from the game, but appeared in the anime:



While this might be unused content, the content that was used used weirdly roundabout terms to imply the character motivations, background events, and even actual events in the case of a bad end... but around the same period games published on Nintendo consoles made explicit references to prostitution without any problems in Japan (Octopath Traveler and Xenoblade 2 for example) without even bumping the rating beyond the teen equivalent, so it couldn't have been the CERO forcing their hand, neither fucking "SMT developer" Atlus being prudes mindful of the current social climate or whatever bollocks rationalization.

The situation of 13 Sentinels definitively begs more attention, because this is a much higher profile game, and would disprove that "bigger Japanese publishers" are big enough to be safe from this new policy.

Moving on...

A new potential casualty of Sony's new censorship policies: Game Tengoku.
This time it's a shump.

A dual PS4/PC game that has a fanservice-y move completely cut from promotional material for the new release. It's not clear yet if it's because of the change in the art style, but the silence from the Japanese developer is concerning and might line up with the formerly gathered trends.

WHAT. 13th Sentinel has been (basically) cancelled?!

The holy living fuck, Sony. You fuckin' pricks.

 

[petran79]

It should be noted about Game Paradise: CruisinMix Special that the game's Western publisher very recently tweeted the below.



I responded asking if they could provide any further information. As a reminder, the image/bomb is still supposed to remain in the Steam release and, as far as anyone can tell, is featured in the Japanese PS4 release. It's possible there could be some rights issue, as the image is the work of a professional comic artist, but it's still rather odd for it to be absent from only the international PS4 version. Either way, this all unfortunately plays directly into the growing narrative of Sony forcing censorship, and assuming Degica is not being compelled to make alterations, then they really should have been upfront about the omission.

I checked the Steam version and the bomb scenes have 3 different images (bunny girl, sword and swimsuit). It was like that in the beginning as well.

 

[CatCouch]

I guess it should be expected that something would go wrong with a Vanillaware game after the absolute meltdown journalists had over Dragon's Crown. I won't ever be playing 13 Sentinels if it's only on a Sony system. I really hope it makes the move to the Switch or something. George Kamitani is a huge influence for me. Not only does Sony not support games and art like this, it seems they have contempt for it. Disgusting.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

I pray that Dragon’s Crown and Odin Sphere are ported to PC.

 

[petran79]

I pray that Dragon’s Crown and Odin Sphere are ported to PC.

You can play those games via PS3 emulation and they run perfectly.

 

[Endless Fluff]

It wouldn't surprise me if some outfits (and camera angles) in the upcoming Persona Dancing games will get changed. There is some really fanservicey stuff in there and with the characters being all high schoolers, it would only fit Sony's new stance.

 

[JunkerWoland]

I checked the Steam version and the bomb scenes have 3 different images (bunny girl, sword and swimsuit). It was like that in the beginning as well.

Those are the original three bombs from the base game. The update, which should include the two new bomb images on Steam, won't be pushed, until November 30th.

It wouldn't surprise me if some outfits (and camera angles) in the upcoming Persona Dancing games will get changed. There is some really fanservicey stuff in there and with the characters being all high schoolers,

I also remain somewhat concerned. Part of me wants to go along with the notion the brand is too popular and highly visible to touch. At the same time, all the unknowns surrounding this new policy and ATLUS' general lack of transparency has me a bit on edge. On the plus side, I pre-ordered the three-game bundle when it was at $60, and (assuming the price holds) I'm mostly interested in the HD version of P4 Dancing All Night.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

"their games"?

I think people forget gamers don't own games anymore. Technically, all companies can implement near any anti-cpmsumer practice and it'll be legal because you don't own the game.

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

I guess it should be expected that something would go wrong with a Vanillaware game after the absolute meltdown journalists had over Dragon's Crown. I won't ever be playing 13 Sentinels if it's only on a Sony system. I really hope it makes the move to the Switch or something. George Kamitani is a huge influence for me. Not only does Sony not support games and art like this, it seems they have contempt for it. Disgusting.

Don't you just love how modern game journalism "criticism" for these game's existence, vile assumptions about the character of anyone designing or buying said content, makes things better for everyone? I'm sure a studio who would have to cancel a version and take the subsequent financial hit is just doing it out of the goodness of their heart and no unsavory censorship is taking place at Sony or game publishers pressured by them into pressuring creatives and developers to scrap content already designed as part of the creative vision...

In fact had you been upset with the baseless hate crimes leveled (thrice) at Mr. Kamitani during the Dragon's Crown coverage, you're creating echo chambers and repressing freedom of speech by the sheer act of not agreeing with that "criticism".

Expect more things like these to happen in the future with zero "reputable" coverage, and do your part documenting it here or elsewhere after checking it out for yourself or people who were fooled into buying a censored version they didn't approve of.

(I gotta say your deviantart replies to such critics really hit me hard. And you're still a freelancer who is somewhat with enough free reign to go on on their own, not that it kept them from directly threatening places you associate with to actually destroy you. So you can at least speak your mind like a champ.
Other content creators beholden to corporate structures are much more muzzled no matter how hard they feel about their own work, because it would endanger profits, PR image, whatever. That's the whole reason why outrage culture is so powerful since it directly tries to get the individual fired and anyone associating with them tarred, even the wife and kids are subhuman because they didn't abandon him Stalin-style and thus deserve harassment... It is shitty how much pressure these developers have put on them and put with it silently.)

 

[Pot Meet Kettle]

Just in case someone says later "nobody ever said that they want this game censored!" when Jump Force does get censored. You know who to thank for this.
By the way, Kenshin and Shishio aren't offensive on their own like a stray Mara would be in your average Mega Ten, but the meta "context" around it (author got jailed over child porn consumption, served the sentence, and Jump is using his million-seller characters instead of Stalining them out of their history) apparently makes it okay.

Resetera has been trying lately to manufacture outrages like these over meta reasons so this is nothing new, like an r/games thread by a resetera regular claiming with a baseless, later proven fake rumor, that Square Enix is collaborating with ISPs to flag anyone who downloaded the orchestral mod for Dragon Quest XI, with the obligatory tl;dr about how the composer is a horrible person and how he should die already and Square Enix scrub his music from the games. Since it was completely fake, it fizzled out but it was far from the only attempt.

It's entirely possible and Namco has previously censored content from US versions to avoid outrage (some monsters in the latest Digimon from 2018), though to their credit they included it unaltered in European and English Asian versions. So Jump Force might very well get censored like these concern trolls who aren't even interested in the game want it to be.

 

[Senhua]

Resetera has been trying lately to manufacture outrages like these over meta reasons so this is nothing new, like an r/games thread by a resetera regular claiming with a baseless, later proven fake rumor, that Square Enix is collaborating with ISPs to flag anyone who downloaded the orchestral mod for Dragon Quest XI, with the obligatory tl;dr about how the composer is a horrible person and how he should die already and Square Enix scrub his music from the games. Since it was completely fake, it fizzled out but it was far from the only attempt.

Let me make a quick list about recent ResetERA outrage bullshit:
- Jump Force
- SSB Ultimate
- CDPR twitter (2x)
- Valkyria Chronicle
- DQ XI composer & Bunny
- RDR2
- GTA VI

And that just from what I can pick on my head now. Beside GamerGater this is truly hate fueled forum representing all the wrong about the video games internet community.

 

[Danjin44]

- DQ XI composer & Bunny

They seriously complained about the bunny!!?