Support NeoGAF

[aznpxdd]

For long term living, the USA might still be better, but for short term living, being in Beijing or Shanghai, while earning enough money, can easily be as much fun or even more than LA or NY. As long as you're not an expat who rather browses on Reddit than goes outside.

Hahahahahaha, no.

 

[miller.skippins]

America is still a much better place to live. China has made a lot of progress, but it does need to make more steps towards democracy because there are still terrible human rights abuses which are frequently swept under the rug.

But, like a lot of things in life, China is an incredibly rich and complex place that I'm incredibly ignorant on. The sex-ed thread from a few days ago made me really happy that steps in the right direction are being taken.

As a singaporeans staying permanently in 'oppressive singapore' and also lived in Mineapolis for 6 months due to work commitments, travelled to New York twice (for work and NY Marathon) and backpacked California (San Francisco, LA, San Diego) for a month......

i don't really want to live in USA. Sorry to break the bubble to you, mate. The 'freedom of speech' rhetorics in America get on my nerves......

Most Americans seems to prefer to live in an idealistic world. I prefer to live in a realistic one.

 

[KonradLaw]

Because it's ruled by ruthless regime? USSR also wasn't percieved as "cool" during Cold War. The modern idiotic fascination with communism some people in USA have started only when the evils of communism started to fade from memory

 

[Erevador]

As a singaporeans staying permanently in 'oppressive singapore' and also lived in Mineapolis for 6 months due to work commitments, travelled to New York twice (for work and NY Marathon) and backpacked California (San Francisco, LA, San Diego) for a month......

i don't really want to live in USA. Sorry to break the bubble to you, mate. The 'freedom of speech' rhetorics in America get on my nerves......

There are plenty of valid reasons not to want to live in the United States, but this seems like an odd one.

What do you dislike so much about freedom of speech?

 

[miller.skippins]

Because it's ruled by ruthless regime? USSR also wasn't percieved as "cool" during Cold War. The modern idiotic fascination with communism some people in USA have started only when the evils of communism started to fade from memory

okay, so tell me which country is Good Ol' Uncle Sam is going to liberate next.....? America stands for truth justice and the american way, amirite?

 

[Ratrat]

I haven't lived in the US, no. But I have lived in Hong Kong which I know is very different to mainland China.

If we include Hong Kong, I would probably choose to live there over the US. But then again, many of the thing the Chinese government has been engaging in there does scare me.

It comes down to culture as well, there are probably many people who choose China over the US. Furthermore, they are both huge places, with varied geography and culture. I'm also a white male, which colours my perspective as well. But it's also worth pointing out, that if a Trump-like figure came into power in China, I think they would probably be able to do a lot more damage there then Trump ever could in the US. (Based on my limited understanding of Chinese politics).

It's not black and white though, and I am incredibly ignorant on many things and willing to learn.

I've only visited China myself, but have heard lot of good things from friends and family that do live there. Same with Singapore. Its a safe country, excellent food, friendly people.
As someone who isnt white and has never been to the US, my perception influnced by media and the news is that I'm likely to get shot.

 

[KonradLaw]

okay, so tell me which country is Good Ol' Uncle Sam is going to liberate next.....? America stands for truth justice and the american way, amirite?

That's how it's percieved. As the beacon of democracy and a good cop for the rest of the world.
That image has faded somewhat in recent decade, but it's soo deeply rooted it will retain power for many more generations.

When people think about america they associeate it with pleseant images. Meanwhile when they think of China the first image that pops to mind still likely is this:

 

[miller.skippins]

There are plenty of valid reasons not to want to live in the United States, but this seems like an odd one.

What do you dislike so much about freedom of speech?

i do not dislike freedom of speech. i only dislike the rheterics of it...to me, it is NOT the most important aspect of a human being's life........i will gladly sacrifice my freedom in exchange for better quality of life.

You guys may prefer to be a freedom fighter living under a bridge as a hobo....i prefer to stay in a penthouse as a conformist.

IMO, there's absolutely no point in having freedom of speech if you can't even put food on the table for yourself and your family.

as i mentioned in my previous post....most asian are pragmatist. we don't dream of an idealistic world like you western people do. we prefer to live our lives based on the cards we were given. we are not in the business of creating an utopia for everyone. that's just how asians (or at least chinese culture) rolls.

 

[elrechazado]

> China still isn’t beloved abroad, at least not to the extent that America is


As an asian, i agree China isn't cool going by its past behavior.....but c'mo Americans, you guys are no better.

Many in Asia look at America's policy (lack of gun control, constant ridiculous 'free-speech' rhetoric, imposing their idea of 'freedom' on other countries through the use of military might, wall street and their fucking banking system that affected the world whether we want it or not......on top of their current idiot president) with disdain and ridicule.

You are entitled to criticize other countries, oh Yankees.....but for your own sake, please take a look at the mirror as well.

You are not that 'cool' either.

I can't speak for everyone but despite the pervasiveness of American culture, people in Australia really don't seem to like America or Americans very much. It's like there's movie Americans who are cool, and real life Americans who are loathed.

The article is about cultural influence, not whether people generally like Americans or their official government policies.

 

[miller.skippins]

That's how it's percieved. As the beacon of democracy and a good cop for the rest of the world.
That image has faded somewhat in recent decade, but it's soo deeply rooted it will retain power for many more generations.

When people think about america they associeate it with pleseant images. Meanwhile when they think of China the first image that pops to mind still likely is this:

mate, when's the last time you actually venture outside 'murica?

 

[Einchy]

i do not dislike freedom of speech. i only dislike the rheterics of it...to me, it is NOT the most important aspect of a human being's life........i will gladly sacrifice my freedom in exchange for better quality of life.

You guys may prefer to be a freedom fighter living under a bridge as a hobo....i prefer to stay in a penthouse as a conformist.

IMO, there's absolutely no point in having freedom of speech if you can't even put food on the table for yourself and your family.

as i mentioned in my previous post....most asian are pragmatist. we don't dream of an idealistic world like you western people do. we prefer to live our lives based on the cards we were given. we are not in the business of creating an utopia for everyone. that's just how asians (or at least chinese culture) rolls.

Not really sure what any of that has to do with freedom of speech.

 

[miller.skippins]

Not really sure what any of that has to do with freedom of speech.

my point is....freedom of speech is far down the chain of importance in my life....and alot of asians' lives. it's merely a want, not a need.

unlike the people of the west where they treat freedom of speech like oxygen.

 

[KonradLaw]

i do not dislike freedom of speech. i only dislike the rheterics of it...to me, it is NOT the most important aspect of a human being's life........i will gladly sacrifice my freedom in exchange for better quality of life.

You guys may prefer to be a freedom fighter living under a bridge as a hobo....i prefer to stay in a penthouse as a conformist.

IMO, there's absolutely no point in having freedom of speech if you can't even put food on the table for yourself and your family.

as i mentioned in my previous post....most asian are pragmatist. we don't dream of an idealistic world like you western people do. we prefer to live our lives based on the cards we were given. we are not in the business of creating an utopia for everyone. that's just how asians (or at least chinese culture) rolls.

Yes, but this is also the answer to the question why it's uncool. People in western world do value democracy, freedom of speech etc. Especially since a large part of western world's most recent history has been about fighting opressive regimes. This is now a part of cultural DNA of that segment of humanity.
In Asia the outlook and philosophy is different, but what is there is a lot of history of wars, conquests and most recently bitter rivalries, which make it harder for China to be percieved cool if you're in country that's competing with it and has a lot of not pleseant history between them. It's much easier for say..Europeans to idolize USA when it helped to win WWII and then topple communism. There are only pleseant associeations there.

 

[Kurita]

That's how it's percieved. As the beacon of democracy and a good cop for the rest of the world.
That image has faded somewhat in recent decade, but it's soo deeply rooted it will retain power for many more generations.

When people think about america they associeate it with pleseant images. Meanwhile when they think of China the first image that pops to mind still likely is this:

Not really

 

[KonradLaw]

mate, when's the last time you actually venture outside 'murica?

Dude, I live in Poland. And I'm old enough to remember how it was during communism. A country without democracy will ever be "cool" to me.

 

[elrechazado]

my point is....freedom of speech is far down the chain of importance in my life....and alot of asians' lives. it's merely a want, not a need.

unlike the people of the west where they treat freedom of speech like oxygen.

Your posts repeatedly set up a false dichotomy that implies that one must make a choice between stability and free speech, which is what is making zero sense.

 

[Jacob]

i do not dislike freedom of speech. i only dislike the rheterics of it...to me, it is NOT the most important aspect of a human being's life........i will gladly sacrifice my freedom in exchange for better quality of life.

You guys may prefer to be a freedom fighter living under a bridge as a hobo....i prefer to stay in a penthouse as a conformist.

IMO, there's absolutely no point in having freedom of speech if you can't even put food on the table for yourself and your family.

as i mentioned in my previous post....most asian are pragmatist. we don't dream of an idealistic world like you western people do. we prefer to live our lives based on the cards we were given. we are not in the business of creating an utopia for everyone. that's just how asians (or at least chinese culture) rolls.

It's not exactly an either/or prospect, considering that most of the richest/highest HDI countries in the world are liberal democracies (though there are obviously exceptions, including Singapore).

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

The perception of American style freedom of speech is that it allows anyone to say anything even if it's offensive shit or outright a lie, with little to no consequences.

 

[darkhunger]

Not really sure what any of that has to do with freedom of speech.

To be fair, even Europeans are appalled by how far Americans take the concept of freedom of speech. We're a culture where fake news and alternative truths are normalized, and stating actual facts and rational thought is not as important as "expressing one's belief" however half-baked and offensive it is.

 

[Syriel]

Lack of protection for IP is one big reason why China suffers on the creative side.

A poster on the first page mentioned Taobao as one of the great companies to come out of China. Yeah, it's great if you want to buy a cheap knockoff of a name brand.

And when it comes to trademarks, China's gov DNGAF, so you get stuff like this.

Chinese companies have been scrambling to add her name to their products since her father won the U.S. presidential election in November. There’s even a new Chinese cosmetic-surgery firm offering the chance to look a little more like her.

An astounding 258 trademark applications were lodged under variations of Ivanka, Ivanka Trump and similar-sounding Chinese characters between Nov. 10 and the end of last year, records at the China Trademark Office show. 

China’s enforcement of trademarks has been brought closer to global standards in recent years, and in January the Supreme People’s Court issued guidelines specifically outlawing use of the names of public figures involved in politics, economy, culture and religion.

In December, the court also revoked the right of sportswear-maker Qiaodan Sports to use Michael Jordan’s last name written in Chinese characters, ruling that Jordan is “well recognized” here and should have the legal right to his name.

Source: http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/mark...ble-to-grab-ivanka-trump-trademark/ar-AAo2JNg

The Trump name is toxic across most of the world, yet Chinese firms are registering her name because she's "famous."

Jordan was fighting for years to get the trademark to his name recognized because a Chinese company registered it and was selling knockoff Air Jordans.

Those are the low hanging fruit.

If a country wants to be "cool" it has to protect the creative class. Because if the folks that make the art, the literature, the films, etc. can't make a living, they why are they going to bother doing it?

China has a rich heritage and is a world power. It could very easily "be cool" if it wanted to be.

 

[hodgy100]

People are just missing out on gold like this

 

[Erevador]

i do not dislike freedom of speech. i only dislike the rheterics of it...to me, it is NOT the most important aspect of a human being's life........i will gladly sacrifice my freedom in exchange for better quality of life.

You guys may prefer to be a freedom fighter living under a bridge as a hobo....i prefer to stay in a penthouse as a conformist.

IMO, there's absolutely no point in having freedom of speech if you can't even put food on the table for yourself and your family.

as i mentioned in my previous post....most asian are pragmatist. we don't dream of an idealistic world like you western people do. we prefer to live our lives based on the cards we were given. we are not in the business of creating an utopia for everyone. that's just how asians (or at least chinese culture) rolls.

Honest post, thanks for actually answering my question.

Many Chinese I've talked to feel similarly, that democracy is generally too unstable and chaotic. They know the Chinese government is repressive and has a dark past, but they have seen so much improvement in the state of their lives that they trust their government without being personally idealistic about it. They are, as you say, very pragmatic about it. It's ironic that Mao tried to eradicate Confucius, thinking that he kept China backwards, because the latent Confucianism in Chinese culture today helps people to feel committed to the party as a way of maintaining stable hierarchy and a kind of social harmony.

I don't identify personally with the worldview you're describing, but I can understand it, and it is coherent.

 

[lupinko]

Jackie Chan comes from Hong Kong. Hong Kong culture is completely different because it wasn't wiped out by cultural revolution.

Hong Kong cinema and art is spectacular.

I think the poster is talking about how Jackie is pro-Mainland, he was even pro-Mainland prior to the handoff.

In one of his old movies he makes that comment about how they're one with the handoff. I forget which one tho.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

> China still isn’t beloved abroad, at least not to the extent that America is


As an asian, i agree China isn't cool going by its past behavior.....but c'mo Americans, you guys are no better.

Many in Asia look at America's policy (lack of gun control, constant ridiculous 'free-speech' rhetoric, imposing their idea of 'freedom' on other countries through the use of military might, wall street and their fucking banking system that affected the world whether we want it or not......on top of their current idiot president) with disdain and ridicule.

You are entitled to criticize other countries, oh Yankees.....but for your own sake, please take a look at the mirror as well.

You are not that 'cool' either.

I agree with you that the gun ploy and the way Americans think of themselves for some can be rough.

The issues also being the way they treat one another in schools. Work and family. Also happens on this board with mean ganging of posters and home made gifs to continue the pummeling and celebrating of dog piling.

I get all this and on the flip side you have the pros and cons in china too.

For one, in china they copy too damn much, from tv shoes to merchandise they hardly create. They also choose to just steal sounds, music and incorporate them instead of using thier own.

I do like that chinese are more polite to one another and respectful to not hurt others or to stop fights in school instead of trying to make it happen.

I think the western influence for chinese is actually bad so I can't feel bad if they try to keep a lot of it out myself.

 

[Jacob]

The perception of American style freedom of speech is that it allows anyone to say anything even if it's offensive shit or outright a lie, with little to no consequences.

Would you really trust the American government to decide what kinds of decide what sort of speech should be prohibited on the grounds of being offensive or untrue? I'm an American and I sure as hell don't.

Edit: I mean, we do have libel laws for really blatant untruths, but I definitely don't want them "opened up", as Trump puts it.

 

[Einchy]

People are just missing out on gold like this

Cheap knock off of Japanese weirdness.

 

[miller.skippins]

The perception of American style freedom of speech is that it allows anyone to say anything even if it's offensive shit or outright a lie, with little to no consequences.

wrong....US Freedom of speech is that you can say anything.......unless it's something that somehow doesn't fit the narratives of the mobs..

i.e.

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

 

[elrechazado]

wrong....US Freedom of speech is that you can say anything.......unless it's something that somehow doesn't fit the narratives of the mobs..

i.e.

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

...What?

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

Would you really trust the American government to decide what kinds of decide what sort of speech should be prohibited on the grounds of being offensive or untrue? I'm an American and I sure as hell don't.

But what about basic stuff like not to be openly racist or Climate denial?

 

[andythinkpad]

Interesting topic. Even when the Chinese dynasties were the most healthiest kingdom/empire in the world, China was not exporting much music and literature. Things that actually got picked up by other cultures were philosophy like Zen Buddhism which was originated in China.

The most important Chinese novel is The Dream of Red Chamber. If I tell you foreigners like this novel I would be lying. It's just too complicated of a story. It doesn't translate well to other languages.

Personally, I am more disappointed by HK stop making cool movies after the 90s.

edit: as usual the thread quickly derailed to topics that have nothing to do with Chinese entertainment, no sure what OP expected when he posted such an insider editorial.

 

[Rorschach]

wrong....US Freedom of speech is that you can say anything.......unless it's something that somehow doesn't fit the narratives of the mobs..

i.e.

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

...you just did...

 

[Erevador]

Would you really trust the American government to decide what kinds of decide what sort of speech should be prohibited on the grounds of being offensive or untrue? I'm an American and I sure as hell don't.

The purpose of the first amendment is precisely to radically restrict the ability of the American government to decide anything with regards to speech. It is extremely hard to criminalize any kind of speech in the US because the first amendment is so clear and resilient.

For many of us this is the core American idea because it is the concept that allows for reform of all other concepts. Protection of speech safeguards the protective mechanism that prevents democracy from going off the rails.

 

[Hierophant]

Tbh my mainlander friends have only talked negatively about democracy in regards to america and their crazy gun laws, weird freedom of speech which allows people to broadcast blatantly false facts to the public and the fact donald trump could be elected to the highest office in the land even though he's obviously a gigantic idiot

trump can do more for chinese propaganda than China can ever do

 

[miller.skippins]

...you just did...

oh boy...i think i'm gonna get mobbed and banned for calling out fat people, eh?

 

[Einchy]

wrong....US Freedom of speech is that you can say anything.......unless it's something that somehow doesn't fit the narratives of the mobs..

i.e.

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

You're one of those guys who complains about people being PC but instead you call it freedom of speech.

You've honestly have no idea what freedom of speech even means.

 

[Jacob]

But what about basic stuff like not to be openly racist or Climate denial?

Do you really trust the American government to always be on the right side of history when it comes to race relations or climate change? Or let me put it this way: given the power, do you think Trump would be more likely to crack down on speech by the KKK, or speech by BLM activists?

The purpose of the first amendment is precisely to radically restrict the ability of the American government to decide anything with regards to speech. It is extremely hard to criminalize any kind of speech in the US because the first amendment is so clear and resilient.

For many of us this is the core American idea because it is the concept that allows for reform of all other concepts. Protection of speech safeguards the protective mechanism that prevents democracy from going off the rails.

Well said.

 

[Erevador]

wrong....US Freedom of speech is that you can say anything.......unless it's something that somehow doesn't fit the narratives of the mobs..

i.e.

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

oh boy...i think i'm gonna get mobbed and banned for calling out fat people, eh?

In America, people might consider your comment rude, but there would be no punishment or law that could be held against you. It's a cultural etiquette thing, not a free speech thing.

You may get banned on GAF though, because it is a tyrannical one-party dictatorship.

 

[Saya]

oh boy...i think i'm gonna get mobbed and banned for calling out fat people, eh?

I don't think you understand what freedom of speech means? You can insult certain groups of people, but it doesn't protect you from consequences of your said speech.

 

[elrechazado]

oh boy...i think i'm gonna get mobbed and banned for calling out fat people, eh?

This is really calling for the "whoyatalkingto.Gif"

 

[vern]

For long term living, the USA might still be better, but for short term living, being in Beijing or Shanghai, while earning enough money, can easily be as much fun or even more than LA or NY. As long as you're not an expat who rather browses on Reddit than goes outside.

6000 rmb/month though buddy.

I agree china is great for short term living but I'm now at 4.5 years and think I'm here for the long haul, or at least a few more years. Can't imagine any scenario that brings me back to the USA. Quality of life there is so far below shanghai, unless you are rich and live in SF or NYC maybe. If I get crazy loaded somehow then yea, usa probably has more to offer me. But as a middle class or above foreigner, or even Chinese person, china is so much "cooler" and definitely has way more opportunities for success. Exporting their "cool" shit will be a tough sell, but living here and experiencing it is pretty fun.

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

Do you really trust the American government to always be on the right side of history when it comes to race relations or climate change?

Well said.

why is it so complicated to not say racist things or lie about facts?

 

[miller.skippins]

In America, people might consider your comment rude, but there would be no punishment or law that could be held against you. It's a cultural etiquette thing, not a free speech thing.

You may get banned on GAF though, because it is a tyrannical one-party dictatorship.

then how is this different from Asia's tyrannical 'benevolent dictatorship' and censorship laws that America hate so much?

i mean i get that what is defined and clearly conscripted by law on what you can and cannot say and the other is not..but if the consequence is the same (that the person will be punished and suffer the consequences), then what's the difference between censorship and free speech if you are punished all the same?

 

[Syriel]

You are entitled to criticize other countries, oh Yankees.....but for your own sake, please take a look at the mirror as well.

You are not that 'cool' either.

You obviously haven't spent much time in America, as Americans are the first to criticize and make fun of the failings of their own country.

The concept of "face" is a big difference between American and China.

A world leader could call Trump an idiot, and most Americans would nod and go "You're just figuring that out NOW?"

A world leader could call Xi an idiot, and the Chinese press would be calling for an official apology and encouraging citizens to protest said country.

If you can't laugh at yourself (or criticize yourself), you're never going to be viewed as "cool." You're only going to be seen as "thin-skinned."

The perception of American style freedom of speech is that it allows anyone to say anything even if it's offensive shit or outright a lie, with little to no consequences.

That's not true at all. Libel and/or slander has very real consequences.

I do like that chinese are more polite to one another and respectful to not hurt others or to stop fights in school instead of trying to make it happen.

I take it you've never been in line at a Chinese bakery? That'll make a Rugby scrum look polite.

wrong....US Freedom of speech is that you can say anything.......unless it's something that somehow doesn't fit the narratives of the mobs..

i.e.

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

What you are claiming is completely and utterly false.

Offensive speech is protected under freedom of speech. What's not protected are your feelings if you are being offensive.

The remedy to offensive speech is better speech, which is why nasty people like the Westboro Baptist Church can exist, but they can't demonstrate anywhere without counter protestors appearing.

Basically, if you want to say something rude and offensive, you can, but you shouldn't be surprised when you get called out for being a jerk.

Freedom of speech is a fundamental aspect of American democracy and the only people who want to curtail it are right-wing fundamentalists because they are afraid of thoughts and ideals.

 

[ISOM]

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/2014-12/01/c_133826019.htm

What's the point of this when China's censorship still takes precedence over anything they create?

 

[King Tubby]

you can't call people fat or ugly now in this day and age because it 'hurt people's feelings' and is 'offensive'.

I mean...ugly is subjective so maybe that's not the best word to use..

but fat people are fat....fat is not even a subjective POV. But apparently in America, you can't call fat people fat regardless of freedom of speech.

You can absolutely do both of those things. Thing is that other people may then exercise their freedom of speech to call you an asshole.

 

[elrechazado]

then how is this different from singapore's tyrannical 'benevolent dictatorship' and censorship laws?

i mean i get that what is defined and clearly conscripted by law on what you can and cannot say and the other is not..but if the consequence is the same (that the person will be punished and suffer the consequences), then what's the difference between censorship and free speech?

Do you not understand the difference between criminal consequences imposed by the state, which can literally imprison it's citizens, and social consequences of free association?
It seems clear that you don't, which is why there is so much objection to your repeated posts that show you don't know what free speech even means. Especially after repeated explanations.

 

[miller.skippins]

You obviously haven't spent much time in America, as Americans are the first to criticize and make fun of the failings of their own country.

The concept of "face" is a big difference between American and China.

A world leader could call Trump an idiot, and most Americans would nod and go "You're just figuring that out NOW?"

A world leader could call Xi an idiot, and the Chinese press would be calling for an official apology and encouraging citizens to protest said country.

If you can't laugh at yourself (or criticize yourself), you're never going to be viewed as "cool." You're only going to be seen as "thin-skinned."



That's not true at all. Libel and/or slander has very real consequences.



I take it you've never been in line at a Chinese bakery? That'll make a Rugby scrum look polite.



What you are claiming is completely and utterly false.

Offensive speech is protected under freedom of speech. What's not protected are your feelings if you are being offensive.

The remedy to offensive speech is better speech, which is why nasty people like the Westboro Baptist Church can exist, but they can't demonstrate anywhere without counter protestors appearing.

Basically, if you want to say something rude and offensive, you can, but you shouldn't be surprised when you get called out for being a jerk.

Freedom of speech is a fundamental aspect of American democracy and the only people who want to curtail it are right-wing fundamentalists because they are afraid of thoughts and ideals.

ok, i stand corrected then...but then you have to understand why asians like myself ain't particularly thrilled about America's idea of freedom of speech......what with its chaotic nature. We prefer stability than anything else....freedom be damned.

 

[Einchy]

then how is this different from Asia's tyrannical 'benevolent dictatorship' and censorship laws that America hate so much?

i mean i get that what is defined and clearly conscripted by law on what you can and cannot say and the other is not..but if the consequence is the same (that the person will be punished and suffer the consequences), then what's the difference between censorship and free speech if you are punished all the same?

There are countries where you can freely be an asshole and no one will call you out on it?

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

That's not true at all. Libel and/or slander has very real consequences.

You might accidentally become the President.

That's the perception right now. Hell from what I understand, Obama can't even sue for defamation despite everyone knowing he didn't do anything. These are the big, obvious examples that get exposure.

 

[King Tubby]

ok, i stand corrected then...but then you have to understand why asians like myself ain't particularly thrilled about America's idea of freedom of speech......what with its chaotic nature. We prefer stability than anything else....freedom be damned.

That would go a long way to explaining why China is "uncool."