MadeInBeats
Banned
Lying to investors about something like that would be found out easily and business suicide. Come on now, let's keep things realistic.
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Wii U Community Thread
- Thread starter Metroid Hunter
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Lying to investors about something like that would be found out easily and business suicide. Come on now, let's keep things realistic.
medicalmidget
Banned
I agree to an extent, you definitely won't see company CEOs go about praising how the competition is better (may acknowledge like they have, but won't outright say it), but then again, with everything we know so far, it just seems like backwards thinking to believe that such a thing is capable on machines we know are going to be weaker when the Wii U releases. I just don't understand why some people are so determined to make the Wii U seem weaker than it really is. I mean don't we all want it to be more powerful than this gen?
It means they might have tried it with a 360, or something similar, and it couldn't handle it.
anchorman128
Member
It takes a ridiculous amount more of processing power to have real-time lighting. IIRC Pre-baked lighting is where a developer can set a lighting source for the scene, and because it is not truly procedural, the lighting doesn't change. You just see different parts of the pre-baked lighting map, rather then having environmental factors effect lighting.
Its far more realistic, far more taxing, and far more expensive to do lighting this way. But as you can probably tell, makes a big difference.
Im not a programmer by any means, but this is how I understood it.
What are you on about?
Was just watching this:
RESIDENT EVIL 6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqc3076Xu6s&feature=g-all-u
For the PS3, and I wonder how you guys think it compares to ZombiU?
Graphics, gameplay, etc.
Considering the unique gameplay that ZombiU brings, Im not even sure
if RE6 will be missed if it doesn't make it to the WiiU. Im starting to already
see the PS3 and 360 and their games as outdated.
RESIDENT EVIL 6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqc3076Xu6s&feature=g-all-u
For the PS3, and I wonder how you guys think it compares to ZombiU?
Graphics, gameplay, etc.
Considering the unique gameplay that ZombiU brings, Im not even sure
if RE6 will be missed if it doesn't make it to the WiiU. Im starting to already
see the PS3 and 360 and their games as outdated.
Apophis2036
Banned
I want to believe it's a powerful system more than anything but Pikmin 3, NSMB U, Nintendo Land, Project P-100, ZombiU and Lego City don't exactly show me anything other than that they have finally caught up with Sony and MS, 7 years late.
I think only Zelda, EAD Mario, Metroid or Retros game will really show what its fully capable off.
You have to remember though that Xbox 360 launch games where not very impressive in graphics, Gears of War was the first game to show true next gen graphics.
We should see at E3 2013 (or earlier) what true graphics the Wii U could do.
medicalmidget
Banned
Yeah but does anyone remember how the launch games were for the 360 and PS3? I mean the PS3 got this for a launch game...
Launch games are not a perfect representation of a console's power. After a year or two, we are going to have our jaws dropped with Nintendo's first party Galaxy equivalent and the Smash Bros game.
At first I was disappointed with Pikmin 3 graphics. I was expecting some kind of super realistic miniature Japanese garden. They could have pushed the system more like using procedural sand like in Uncharted 3 but in the end, when I think about it, it can't think of a more beautiful game of the same style on other systems.
axisofweevils
Holy crap! Today's real megaton is that more than two people can have the same first name.
MadeInBeats
Banned
Saying something stupid, e.g. hyping your new system, isn't lying. Otherwise someone like Ballmer would've been long gone. As far as graphics are concerned you could probably replicate the Zelda demo without problems on high-end PCs, so unless he was referring to the Wii U Gamepad (or e.g. the fact that Zelda is a Nintendo IP), he might've already lied by your/a very strict definition.
It must be horrible to lose ten seconds with something like this. It's sad people have forgotten that he gave us another memorable line of bullshit.
"When you turn on Wii and see the graphics, you will say 'Wow'."
Don't take everything literally and always keep in mind that they're running a business.
I'm sorry but the demo wasn't exactly the ultimate showcase of hardware power (as mentioned by others in this thread), so it's not completely unthinkable to me that capable developers could replicate the tech demo e.g. on PS3. Remember it was just one room, not an entire game (or game demo) with those graphics.
I doubt you could achieve such graphics for an entire game on 360/PS3 though, but the demo itself - while really pretty - wasn't shocking.
Obviously, as they lack the Wii U Gamepad.
Something said in investor meetings is very different to things said to the press and public as hype builing marketing. If what he said there is a fib, investor confidence would plummet.
Not to mention they've been brutally honest about most things besides.
In the case of Nintendo fibbing to investors, your reasoning is absolutely unconvincing.
Also it seems those against case in point are finding it extremely difficult finding undeniable evidence from the 2 consoles in question, with more than 10 years collectively on the market between them. If it was the case, you should be picking out dozens and dozens of examples to refute the argument.
wat ?!
Yeah, they definitively are in the "it's more powerful than current gen HD" camp, it was the case a few months ago, it's even more now. Nota Bene: it's not because of a hypothetic recent and sudden boost in hardware (no new dev kits since the one they got roughly 1 month before E3), but just that they get more and more familiar with the machine.
Hey Cyber, i used to love you, don't let your disappointment of this E3 makes you bitter.
And i assume 200% the post you linked (which is just a summary of tons of messages where i tried to present/illustrate an estimation of the Wii U power, considering its asymmetric screen setting). This capabilities estimation, which has been my very first post in GAF and that i detailed further in the following speculation threads with the ongoing conversations, is TOTALLY a part of all the info i relayed here that has been proved right for the most part (or are waiting for further announcements) as you can see in this track record list. Now, as explained many times, if what we saw, mostly, at E3 don't convey a positive impression of the Wii U power, it's because of the choice of games shown, not the hardware itself.
See the point above.
And
((((((((((( for snesfreak ! See you on IRC my love !wat ? you're not the gurl in your avatar ? come onnnnnnn, i had such french romantic fantasy with you
Dreamwriter
Member
No, Iwata said that Japanese developers said it couldn't be done.
yes that is a 100% the case as was mentioned here a few posts ago. the old LAN adapter will continue to be compatible with Wii U for wired internet.
God of War games have the benefit of using a fixed set of camera angles so the devs always know what the player is looking at and the characters move on a very constricted plain. the rest is all scripted stuff and enemies with the intelligence of a grilled cheese sandwich ("gaaargh! must run towards Kratos who will then proceed to murder me violently roaarr!"). So it's not really a surprise that those games (which also benefit from being first party exclusives that are tailored to that hardware and can disregard everything else) look fantastic.
That's why we can especially look forward to what Retro and MonolithSoft are doing visually.
RE6 looks hilariously bad to me even without comparing it to anything.
Ridiculous HUD. Bad textures. Pathetic animation (watch 3:34). Not to mention the shootbang and dudebro pandering. Meanwhile, ZombiU just suffers from poor models but that's understandable given the team and early development kits.
Glorified G
Member
Yeah but does anyone remember how the launch games were for the 360 and PS3? I mean the PS3 got this for a launch game...
MadeInBeats
Banned
Needs a smaller 'keyfob' alternative, like the WiiU Fit Pedometer. I can't be arsed lugging my DS around with me all the time. When I go out, I always take my phone and keys (like 99% of people), so would make sense to combine the function with either of these as alternative options.
medicalmidget
Banned
Sure I'm cherry picking, but it's still a launch game regardless, and look at the games we had a two, three years later. They looked phenomenally better than what most of the PS3 launch games were like.
JordanN
Banned
Why would he need devs to tell him that?
And Japanese developers means alot. Who do you think are the only people more knowledgeable about game development than devs themselves?
I'm happy Tank Tank Tank is a Arcade game getting ported to the Wii U so I didn't expect great graphics from that.
Wow this does not impress me at all and I'd consider myself actually quite the Resident Evil fan. Of course a dark subway tunnel in a shitty youtube video is not really a showcase for anything but I still think ZombiU so far looks nicer than this (I was impressed by the fire and smoke/shadow at the beginning of the demo). Leon's jacket looked very blurry and gameplay wise I'm still annoyed they prompt you to push a button to climb in and out of the train. That scripted scene with the woman at the end also came off totally stupid. I wonder (hope) if there's a chance to save her at that part 'cause just standing there and doing nothing while she opens the gate and gets pulled under it is just plain dumb.
I find myself really excited for ZombiU on a simple gameplay mechanics level. I hope they don't drop the ball--or even if they do, I hope they get to make their Red Steel 2 that then turns out awesome.
MadeInBeats
Banned
wat ?!
It's alright mate, it's perfectly legal in your country AFAIK lol. If not, Holland's only up the road ;-)
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
Sorry mate. I deeply apologise about the comment I made about what you said.
You know. Outside of this place. In real life. I'm one of the nicest laid back persons you'd could ever meet.
I don't think you can be banned on GAF for something that happens off of GAF. Would probably be something related to activity here, then.
MadeInBeats
Banned
I've never read anywhere anyone saying they were mind blowing.
Yes or no. Nintendo's tech demos have always been conservative and achievable? We're not talking about Sony tech demos here.
medicalmidget
Banned
Agreed, him and burntpork (even if his attitude was uncalled for) both.
Also, when do you guys think Nintendo will have their next Nintendo Direct conference? End of August? Let's hope some Wii U information is released in the next one.
It's nothing and i totally understand your disappointment, no titles demonstrated in a clear manner that the Wii U is a more capable system. But it's the case, really. For starter, the image quality of the games you'll witness at launch will be superior from what you saw in the E3 footages for most of the demos, with the implementation of anti-aliasing, etc.
Like clockwork every two months in the last third of that month. So yes, August 2X.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
I'm really looking forward to the hardware but this years E3 from Nintendo didn't exactly demonstrate that WiiU was any sort of powerhouse.
And the near total lack of information to the contrary since E3 doesn't help.
MadeInBeats
Banned
There you go mate, you see, it doesn't, that's a totally reasonable comment, but taking everything we have so far, and historical data into account you can only draw the logical conclusion; you can only begin to stray from the logical if there's an agenda.
medicalmidget
Banned
As much as we don't want to say it, I now think that E3 isn't the time for hardcore gamers like it was in the past. As other members have been saying, Nintendo has their own conference where they have control of what and when stuff gets out. They also won't have to worry about having their games be drowned out by competition. Unless Nintendo is saving everything for next years E3, I think that E3 as of a couple years ago are leaning towards investors and regular consumers. Maybe I'm wrong, but that is the feeling I'm getting. Or maybe it's the disappointment of this years E3 that is getting to me.
Yes, and the 720 and PS4 will be being announced, to much fanfare, and I guarantee some absolutely stunning tech and/or game demos. There's no way Sony and MS won't want to put their best foot forward. Wii U is likely to get drowned out a bit next year I think.
Also remember that developers weren't really that skilled with shaders before this generation so it took a while to get up to speed. Now however they are used to them so anything with modern tech should be "easy". I expected baseline Wii U games to look just like the good ones of this generation and in fact we are seeing just that in Batman and Ass Creed III. Nintendo's ones I expected more.
For someone like Nintendo, who have known for years what they are aiming at, I would have expected them to have their E3 demos looking very polished, even if they weren't squeezing everything out of them. The problem was that their only real possible showcase (Pikmin) was a Wii game that seems to have been simply ported across and given a fresh coat of paint.
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
I share the pain.
Nintendo could have done two simple things at E3. Reveal the launch date and price. I'm still amazed they didn't.
MadeInBeats
Banned
It's called pessimism. Someone has to keep the expectations low.
And that's your job right? lol... I hope you don't have any kids mate... Jesus, lol.
Surely better to keep expectations 'in check'.
JordanN
Banned
This again? They already said they weren't going to do it.
MadeInBeats
Banned
Your first step in recovery should be to change your avatar.. Go on lad, we're here to support you
I went to the WiiU experience in NYC yesterday. I was late and hot and sweaty, so that part sucked. I also have poor reading comprehension and actually went to Nintendo World first instead of the location where they were having the event.
I made sure to check everything out visually, and the system looks very nice. It is certainly not going to be able to compete with my gaming PC, but first party Nintendo games in a much higher res then I have ever seen is all I want, and it is what I got.
I got some hands on time with Nintendoland:
Luigi's Mansion - This was TONS of fun. I've never played pac man vs. We did the demo (my friend Ginny and I) with 3 strangers and we all had good fun, taking turns as the ghost. The touch and the visual fidelity of the gamepad impressed me. My friend Ginny doesn't game that much and she really enjoyed it as well. (I might have been playing with Shin John PV)
Link sword thing - Was fun but forgettable. Cant see myself playing it very many times
Donkey Kong - Didn't get to actually play it, but from watching, it looks awesome.
I also got some hands on with NSMBU:
Don't listen to anyone who says this is the same as NSMBWii graphically, they are out of their minds. The game is STUNNING. True Mario in HD and it is awesome. I played the first two available levels and the game retains the mario gameplay that we all know and love... but with a problem...
I'm hoping this is due to it being an early rev, or the TV's not being calibrated properly, but there was MASSIVE input lag while we were playing 3 players (and 1 more on gamepad making platforms). I can't imagine Nintendo EVER shipping a Mario game with an issue like this, but I felt that I should mention it.
The event itself was nice and fun. I think its crazy we live in a world where the sign stuck on to each "cubicle" was an ipad and not a sign, but whatever.
I'm really glad Nintendo did this, it was a great way for me to preview the hardware, and to feel special for being a loyal fan.
I gave my third invite to a gaffer, but we didn't seek each other out or anything.
I made sure to check everything out visually, and the system looks very nice. It is certainly not going to be able to compete with my gaming PC, but first party Nintendo games in a much higher res then I have ever seen is all I want, and it is what I got.
I got some hands on time with Nintendoland:
Luigi's Mansion - This was TONS of fun. I've never played pac man vs. We did the demo (my friend Ginny and I) with 3 strangers and we all had good fun, taking turns as the ghost. The touch and the visual fidelity of the gamepad impressed me. My friend Ginny doesn't game that much and she really enjoyed it as well. (I might have been playing with Shin John PV)
Link sword thing - Was fun but forgettable. Cant see myself playing it very many times
Donkey Kong - Didn't get to actually play it, but from watching, it looks awesome.
I also got some hands on with NSMBU:
Don't listen to anyone who says this is the same as NSMBWii graphically, they are out of their minds. The game is STUNNING. True Mario in HD and it is awesome. I played the first two available levels and the game retains the mario gameplay that we all know and love... but with a problem...
I'm hoping this is due to it being an early rev, or the TV's not being calibrated properly, but there was MASSIVE input lag while we were playing 3 players (and 1 more on gamepad making platforms). I can't imagine Nintendo EVER shipping a Mario game with an issue like this, but I felt that I should mention it.
The event itself was nice and fun. I think its crazy we live in a world where the sign stuck on to each "cubicle" was an ipad and not a sign, but whatever.
I'm really glad Nintendo did this, it was a great way for me to preview the hardware, and to feel special for being a loyal fan.
I gave my third invite to a gaffer, but we didn't seek each other out or anything.
It was a very smart move by Nintendo to not focus on high-end tech demos in the conference. Any high-end tech demo they showed this year would've been easily beatable in a few months or, at the latest, by next E3 by PS480. Going the "look at our tech!" route would've been exceedingly short-sighted by Nintendo. They went the "look at our games! (mainstream-version)" route, which is about the only route they could've gone and stayed relevant with by next E3 and beyond.
I think I've come to realize why I was happy with Nintendo's 2012 E3 press conference, and others were incredibly put out/disappointed. I was pumped for Wii Fit and really enjoyed Wii Sports/Resort on the Wii. Wii Fit U (at the launch window!) got me real happy, and Nintendo Land looked like a fun diversion with characters I enjoy playing with. I went into E3 looking for what the system was going to be like for games, and I think I got a decent view of that from Nintendo. Others went into E3 wanting Nintendo to "prove" to naysayers that the Wii U was "all that and a bag of chips." Nintendo had no intentions of trying to one-up 7 year-old systems on the tech side, though, and knew it would be pure folly to try to measure up technically to PS480. You can harp on third-party support, but Wii U is already in a substantially superior position to Wii in that regard with the *hope* that third-party engines will be able to scale fairly easily from PS480 to Wii U. With that in mind, if the sales come for the titles that are there already (really hopeful for a good, relatively since the install base starts at 0, showing for AC3), I have a lot of confidence that publishers will green light more of the same for Wii U. There was never going to be a total about-face at launch from all third-parties. However if sales are there, most should come around. Therefore, E3 wasn't going to be heavy on third-party support (compared to PS360/PS480) nor heavy on tech (dead-end for Nintendo either gen they compare to). It would've been nice to see a Mario Galaxy-type showing to get people pumped for farther down the road, but, for better or worse, Nintendo is sticking to its guns about the "not really talking about titles way far out", so can't really be too surprised that they're sticking with that plan.
*shrugs*
Dreamwriter
Member
These 5 games are PS3 launch titles too (admittedly, Motorstorm was a month after launch in Japan). Do those look bad to you? Being a launch title is no excuse for poor graphics.
medicalmidget
Banned
Excellent post, and I'd have to agree, once everyone gets their hands on the Wii U I think most will be pleasantly surprised and feel the line up was sufficient enough to hold them off for next years E3. NintendoLand does look like it could be a ton of fun with friends, P-100 looks very interesting, Rayman Legends is going to be great, and even Wii Fit I found to be enjoyable, so the newest version does excite me for the extra features. Then there is the first party games like Pikmin and NSMBU which of course will be awesome. I just think that we hyped ourselves up beyond expectations; E3 2010, rumors of studios working on Wii U, we only have ourselves to blame. No doubt we can expect to have too much hype for next years E3 for Microsoft's and Sony's next console, so I'm going to try and contain my hype (doubtful) for next years E3 and have a more realistic view on it.
Oh totally, and it fits with their "it's all about experience" motto since the DS. BUT, there is a middle ground between a presentation of the concept, an "introduction of the principles our games can have in our new system", and a pure technical/theoretical showcase without any gameplay involved. For example, a lot of demos had some image quality flaws, and after asking about that to my sources, there are reasons for that. And it would have been a smarter move for them to make sure the image would be clean for nearly all the content displayed, even if the complexity of the titles graphics doesn't match what the techies/hardware-enthusiasts expected to see.
Oh fuck, snesfreak is gone? What the hell did he do?
I've seen him on a lot of Nintendo threads, and it'll be a damn shame if he was banned cuz of them. Some people were fucking baiting him I swear.
I'll miss you man
If you really want to talk to him you know where to look.
Thanks for the demo impressions, Glix!
Launch games look much worse in motion than screenshots..Its not really fair to show a screenshot of a launch game, cos most launch games for Ps360 had crippling screen tearing issues or framerate problems and were lacking motion blur. The fact that ACIII on Wii U supposedly looks identical to PS360, and does not have have these issues, suggests that indeed the WiiU is more powerful and has more places to go.
medicalmidget
Banned
These 5 games are PS3 launch titles too (admittedly, Motorstorm was a month after launch in Japan). Do those look bad to you? Being a launch title is no excuse for poor graphics.
Look, sorry if it seems like I'm making out the PS3 launch games as bad as they are (they aren't, Motorstorm was fantastic), but what I'm trying to say is that we can't let launch titles be the deciding factor on a consoles power. We all have seen what games look like a couple years after launch, and there's no doubting that they look significantly better for good reason, more development time and familiarity with the technology. Some launch games may hold up, but others won't. Every console launch has some game that has to under perform. I don't want to divert this thread into something that isn't the Wii U, so I'll agree that maybe I was short-sighted by choosing Gundam Crossfire as the deciding factor for the PS3 launch games. I'll agree to disagree. Sorry 'bout that.
Ease up on the bullshots dudeThese 5 games are PS3 launch titles too (admittedly, Motorstorm was a month after launch in Japan). Do those look bad to you? Being a launch title is no excuse for poor graphics.
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